Trying to find balance with the immigration issue.

originally posted by: Diderot
a reply to: tridentblue
This is really a matter of what defines the United States of America as being exceptional. These are mainly children and mothers who have a serious claim to refugee status. If you disagree, then you must agree with Pres. Obama who has already stated that most will be returned to their respective countries. What we must do in the meanwhile is to care for these children at our doorstep.

Watch all the vids and look at all the pics that are out there and you will see they are not just women and children, there are plenty of men with them. Many of the kids are border line adults.

For many years their Countries had violence and what-not. Why do you suppose that only now they are coming in droves? Many of these illegals have said that in their Country, they were told if they came here, they would be taken care of and would not be deported.

originally posted by: twohawks
s reply to: interupt42

I digress, you say prosecuted the law breakers. I have to ask, how is that any different than trying to pass New gun legislation in the wake of terrible tragedies? To me it's nothing more than a band aid!

I'm not sure what these gun anologies and illegal immigrants are coming from and I'm not exactly sure what you mean by the gun comparison. However, I think you may be trying to ask me why if gun legislation doesn't work why would it work with illegals?

Simply, guns are much easier to transport , undocument and hide than people . Corporations and business have documentation and are registered, so if their is an offense and the blame goes to the top its pretty easy to catch.

Lets say that if a company gets caught hiring an illegal they get fine 10K per illegal. If they get caught 3 times within a span of a year the CEO and executive staff get directly fined and a 1 year prison term. In addition, the violations follow you so it wouldn't matter if you create a new company.

Now, its pretty apparent that people in the US hate illegals. So how long before you think that people are going to be willing to call into the police to report some illegals picking whatever or other job sites.

My questions:
1. So if you faced a 10K fine per illegal and possible jail time would you hire them?

2. If you were an illegal immigrant would you risk your life and give what little money you have to a stranger to get you to a country that you can't work at and provide for yourself?

3. Why isn't the Canadian border an issue? Is it because they are white or is it because Canadians don't have an incentive to come here illegally that is worth them risking their live for or being marked a criminal?

4. Do the majority of illegal immigrant come from nations that are prosperous or from nations that are or could be considered third world nations with little or no hope of providing for their families?

a reply to: interupt42

Exactly! You don't have to feed, educate, house, provide medical care for a gun. Just put it in a locked gun safe...end of problem.

Des

originally posted by: interupt42

originally posted by: twohawks
s reply to: interupt42

I digress, you say prosecuted the law breakers. I have to ask, how is that any different than trying to pass New gun legislation in the wake of terrible tragedies? To me it's nothing more than a band aid!

I'm not sure what these gun anologies and illegal immigrants are coming from and I'm not exactly sure what you mean by the gun comparison. However, I think you may be trying to ask me why if gun legislation doesn't work why would it work with illegals?

Simply, guns are much easier to transport , undocument and hide than people . Corporations and business have documentation and are registered, so if their is an offense and the blame goes to the top its pretty easy to catch.

Lets say that if a company gets caught hiring an illegal they get fine 10K per illegal. If they get caught 3 times within a span of a year the CEO and executive staff get directly fined and a 1 year prison term. In addition, the violations follow you so it wouldn't matter if you create a new company.

Now, its pretty apparent that people in the US hate illegals. So how long before you think that people are going to be willing to call into the police to report some illegals picking whatever or other job sites.

My questions:
1. So if you faced a 10K fine per illegal and possible jail time would you hire them?

2. If you were an illegal immigrant would you risk your life and give what little money you have to a stranger to get you to a country that you can't work at and provide for yourself?

3. Why isn't the Canadian border an issue? Is it because they are white or is it because Canadians don't have an incentive to come here illegally that is worth them risking their live for or being marked a criminal?

That would be great you just need a verification process, and the one they have now is a joke. It only tells if the SS# is good not who it belongs to. Bet you didn't think you could make an extra 20K a year and not know it.

a reply to: MarlinGrace

Agreed the verification process is a joke because again the DNC,RNC and the lobbyist who are the real profiteers of illegal aliens don't wan't to fix the issue.

I have actually seen a SS number of an employee that was basically all 0 and one 1 if I recall correctly that was called in for verification and it passed. I found out later that number is used by several people.

Again they really don't wan't to fix the issue.

Instead they are using immigration as a diversion to keep the Dems and Reps arguing back and forth like blind chickens.

The funnier thing is that they have such little respect for the political cheerleaders that not only are they distracting them from the real issue but they are planing to make more money from their proposed solutions.

Building the great wall of the US and adding more people to the front lines will equate to more money in their pockets when they get the contracts to provide those services.

And now comes word that Border Patrol agents in the most heavily-trafficked area of the surge, the Rio Grande Valley sector of Texas, recently questioned 230 illegal immigrants about why they came. The results showed overwhelmingly that the immigrants, including those classified as UACs, or unaccompanied children, were motivated by the belief that they would be allowed to stay in the United States -- and not by conditions in their homelands. From a report written by the agents, quoting from the interviews:


The main reason the subjects chose this particular time to migrate to the United States was to take advantage of the "new" U.S. "law" that grants a "free pass" or permit (referred to as "permisos") being issued by the U.S. government to female adult OTMs traveling with minors and to UACs. (Comments: The "permisos" are the Notice to Appear documents issued to undocumented aliens, when they are released on their own recognizance pending a hearing before an immigration judge.) The information is apparently common knowledge in Central America and is spread by word of mouth, and international and local media. A high percentage of the subjects interviewed stated their family members in the U.S. urged them to travel immediately, because the United States government was only issuing immigration "permisos" until the end of June 2014…The issue of "permisos" was the main reason provided by 95% of the interviewed subjects.

Gah, I just closed out the window where I needed a link to this. The link is in another thread here.

I have read this from other places as well. These are not just refugees.

We have laws, use them!
If we are not able to enforce them find a way to do so, build a wall.
But this does not seem to really be the problem is it?
Just why do officials not follow the law??
Hint: follow the money.

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: MarlinGrace

Agreed the verification process is a joke because again the DNC,RNC and the lobbyist who are the real profiteers of illegal aliens don't wan't to fix the issue.

In fact they have never had the desire to fix it. When I was 17 years old I worked for a plumber that was a coyote as well he said they (the government) knew where they came in the country, and where most were going and never did anything. He stopped because it was getting too dangerous. That was 39 years ago. The only thing that has changed is the numbers.

a reply to: Diderot

Yeah, I agree with that, kids are kids are kids. Kindness and respect are key to maintaining our dignity as a nation in situations like this. These are our nighbors, local people.

originally posted by: tridentblue
a reply to: Diderot

Yeah, I agree with that, kids are kids are kids. Kindness and respect are key to maintaining our dignity as a nation in situations like this. These are our nighbors, local people.

I don't know about your neighbors but mine are not 1500 plus miles away.

originally posted by: twohawks
a reply to: interupt42

Let's say I agree with you on all points, what is the actual answer, cause correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't read the answer....

I too was born in the SFV, and spent years slamming 16's with a framing hammer under the desert sun, while watching a tide of illegals rise faster and faster. Wages continuously fell as the cost of living climbed. I knew damn well that I'd never be able to afford one of the homes that I was breaking my back to build for others.

Never did get to buy one, and I'm okay with that. But what I'm not okay with is the greed and corruption that tries to impose its will on our lives.

I'm trying to forget the past, and now transform anger and frustration into positive energy; thinking way outside-of-the-box as an entrepreneur, brainstorming and developing micro-business models that are capable of empowering myself and my fellow man, while at the same time undermining self-serving corporate monopolies.

interupt42 is correct.

If you imagine the corporate status quo as a conventional army, then your only hope is to take them on as a guerrilla entrepreneur. Think about reverse engineering anything and everything, think about building better mousetraps, think about simplifying and decentralizing businesses. Everyday there are guerrilla entrepreneurs out there, experiencing the adrenaline rush of success.

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: tridentblue
a reply to: Diderot

Yeah, I agree with that, kids are kids are kids. Kindness and respect are key to maintaining our dignity as a nation in situations like this. These are our nighbors, local people.

I don't know about your neighbors but mine are not 1500 plus miles away.

Same here MG. I live in the South, rural mountain area. As you understand the South, there is a church on about every corner in the small towns that dot the landscape up here. And all Churches up here have food banks to help the community when times are tough for some families.

Starting last year, the local food banks started running out of food, and fast. What the problem was, truckloads of illegals from down the mountain near Atlanta, would caravan up here, and wipe out the food banks every month.

It got so bad, they had to make new rules that you had to be a resident of the County to come for the free food. Otherwise there would be none for our own local families with young kids.

This is only a microcosm of what is happening to our whole Country now.

Des

I say get rid of ALL the illegal immigrants and DO IT NOW!

Of course, my perspective is skewed when I say that. I am
Native American...

originally posted by: rival
I say get rid of ALL the illegal immigrants and DO IT NOW!

Of course, my perspective is skewed when I say that. I am
Native American...

Let me personally apologize to you. For what my ancestors did to your ancestors. I'm truly sorry that is part of my past history.

But, these are different times, different situations. We have Laws of the Land, we all abide by. The laws are blatantly being broken and ignored to further the agenda of a political party. To the detriment of both you, and I.

Des

Benswann.com called Crittenton FFA, which is located in Orange County and provides services for Los Angeles County Department of Children and Family Services, and found that for those willing to a take in a child under the age of 16, you can receive up to $854.00 tax free per month. For those taking in a child over 16, the total is $1,008.00 per month in reimbursement. If you have a 5 bedroom house and can take in as many as 6 children, you can receive reimbursement of up to $6,054.00 per month tax free.

As for who is paying for all of this? We were told that for normal foster services, the reimbursement is provided by a series of state and local grants but in the case of the “unaccompanied refugee minors”, 100% of the reimbursement will come from the federal government.

benswann.com...

Outrageous! More catering to illegals while our own citizens get shoved aside.

a reply to: Night Star

Outrageous is too mild a word, NS.

Obama is following his same old pattern of throwing OUR tax money at any problem he wants to go away.

I bet you a million bucks, the line of people already on welfare scrambling to take in illegals, stretches out with no end in sight.

Just when I thought it couldn't get any worse...it did.

I already figured out why he turned to Catholic Churches as the first stopping place for placement of illegals. Most Hispanics are Catholic. If he gets the Church on board with his agenda...he'll have the Pope begging all Catholics to take in the poor children. And get paid taxpayer money to do it.

I hate the man right now. I don't use that word often...it's appropriate for this situation.

Des

Night Star...the plot thickens....

God, when are people going to wake up. This just in my email.

EXCLUSIVE: HHS Bankrolled Catholic and Baptist Church from 2010 to 2013 to Prepare for Obama’s 2014 Invasion!

Between Dec 2010 and Nov 2013, the Catholic Charities Diocese of Galveston received $15,549,078 in federal grants from Health & Human Services for “Unaccompanied Alien Children Project” with a program description of “Refugee and Entry Assistance.”

Last year, the Catholic Charities Diocese of Fort Worth received $350,000 from Department of Homeland Security for “citizenship and education training” with a program description of “citizenship and immigration services.”

Between September 2010 and September 2013, the Catholic Charities of Dallas received $823,658 from the Department of Homeland Security for “Citizenship Education Training” for “refugee and entrant assistance.”

From Dec 2012 to January 2014, Baptist Child & Family Services received $62,111,126 in federal grants from Health & Human Services for “Unaccompanied Alien Children Program.”
- See more at: www.libertynews.com... FfsHTKrv.dpuf

This pretty much tosses his mantra of *it's the fault of the Republicans* out the window. This is his agenda, to bring America to her knees. Well planned out and orchestrated, with evil intent.

Someone has to stop this madness.

Des

a reply to: Destinyone

Forget where I saw it, but a Christian woman and her husband were approached by their priest asking them to home one or more of the illegal kids saying they would be reimbursed money. Like what the hell? We have citizens living on the damned streets and in flimsy tents in the woods and that's ok, but if you are illegal you will get everything your little heart desires. Makes me sick to see double standards all the time and citizens being slapped in the face so to speak. They are always on some kind of pedestal above all others!

a reply to: Destinyone

LOL, we were posting about the same time. Madness it is! Such insanity. I have been saying for years that this illegal thing will keep getting worse. I kept pointing out the negative impact on us and I was called a racist and all kinds of things.

I mean we have had amnesties and pretty much an open door for anyone to waltz in for too long. So much so that it is changing America. Press one for English. speak Spanish to get a job in some places. WTH???? I wouldn't dream of going to a foreign country and expect and demand that they speak my language! I am just so sick of it all. I have seen citizens turned away from jobs and an illegal hired instead. I was told by the illegals themselves how they get away with things and steal from the system through deceit. Over and over again we see how they are catered to and our own people ignored.

a reply to: Night Star
Yes there are some adult males among them, but the great majority are children, and a lesser number of women/mothers. I fully agree that most of them are lied to about staying in the USA once they get here. My main point is that some, if not many of them, have a legitimate claim to refugee status. Many, if not most, will be sent back. Obama has clearly said this. Meanwhile we have a humanitarian crisis and we need to live up to our claim of being an exceptional country.