The pope condemns personal relationship with Christ

a reply to: masqua

Wake up people! You do not need shamans, witch doctors, reverends, priests, popes, mullahs, or rabbis to stand as an intermediary between you and your creator. God will listen to you the same as he listens to them. Stop feeding organized religion. Do you really believe that any organization with more gold and treasure than most countries is representative of Christ? If they really believed the words of Christ, they would give all the money and treasure away to help the poor. Did Jesus drive a fancy car and dress in fine clothes? Anyone who gets rich on the word of God is not doing the work of God. Jesus drove the money changers out of the temple. He did not offer to sell them a franchise. Jesus gave the words of his father freely. He did not charge for them. Anyone who tries to sell you Bibles, tracts, religious videos and music, religious artifacts and other things that are supposedly related to the word of God is a charlatan and a fraud! ANYONE WHO CHARGES YOU MONEY FOR THE WORD OF GOD IS A FRAUD!!! I am not just talking about the Catholics here. This applies to anyone who earns a living on the word of God.

a reply to: masqua

Why do you need a seminary degree in order to read the Gospel and understand it? That basically means that I need to put a trained priest between myself and God which is what the Pope is saying and flies in the face of 1 Timothy.

The early church had no seminary trained priests and in many countries with underground churches, they have no seminary trained priests. Also, many people go on mission trips all the time and are not seminary trained, and yet they go to spread the Word. Oh the HORROR!

I can see both sides of it. On one hand, mythology performs functions for society. It always has, since primordial shamanism. He is trying to keep the Christian mythos functional. That's part of his responsibility, as I see it.

On the other hand, myth transforms over time. A new mythos comes along and takes over the functions of the old; grows from the corpse of the old. Christianity did it, and so too will a modern mythos. It's a life-cycle. Science has taken over some of the functions of Christianity for many people. For example, the cosmological function.

That doesn't impede The Christ. He just switches costumes.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Wifibrains

Well...

He would say that, because his is a position which tops a hierarchy, whose entire existence is a heresy against Christ, and counter to his instructions to his people, and furthermore ignores the fundamental manner in which Christ comported himself.

Jesus Christ said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. None cometh unto the Father, but through me.".

He did NOT say ANYTHING about a cadre of be-robed old men, nor about those men presiding over his people as conduits for worship, nor about those men holding sway over a massive amount of wealth, despite vows of poverty, and the needs of the people they are supposed to protect, NOR did He mention anything about creating a government like system, let alone a nation state, based on a corrupted version of His message to his people.

All of those things are inventions of Roman power brokers, who were desperately trying to cobble together a dirty version of Christianity, which would allow people to take up the new order, and none the less be controlled, their afterlives held for ransom by a disgusting, tyrannical and power hungry organisation, which ended up being little different to any other vast power structure in the world, ancient or modern.

Christ broke bread and taught people His message in the street, in their homes, and forged personal bonds with those he preached his message to. He was not a politician, nor a councilman, nor a tyrant, and therefore no tyranny which sprung up from his footsteps is of Him, but is either of man, or of Satan.

No man of mortal construction, nor any cabal of mortal beings, may stand between a person and Christ, without inciting his ire, without risking an eternity in the damned, black pit of Hell.

So it makes sense that the Pope would make such a statement as this, because as people realise the error of following the Roman method, he and his compatriots loose power in the world, which is all to the good, and the benefit of the entire Christian population in my humble opinion.

Exact perfection and truth in every word. I have nothing to add.

a reply to: ketsuko

You don't need a seminary degree to read the Gospel and understand it. You can apply those teachings to your own life.

But if you want to go forth and teach others, then it would be good if you did get that education first.

When you are among others of the same faith, there's always the possibility of good discussion, but when you see yourself as a promotor of that faith among strangers of varying faiths, that's another level altogether and a good education might be a sensible requirement.

I've no religious affiliation with any sect at all... do you feel yourself to be knowledgeable enough of your faith to adequately teach me or would you prefer I talk to someone who has completed seminary school? I know who I'd rather talk to and that is no slam against you as a caring human being.

a reply to: Wifibrains

The video speaker is a bit shrill but . . . with just cause.

The WHOLE PURPOSE of Christ's death on The Cross was to re-establish

one on one RELATIONSHIP between all who accepted His Blood as cleansing, covering and Salvation--WITH THE FATHER.

What a hideous travesty from hell is right.

The globalist collectivist side of him is coming to the fore.

May God have mercy.

a reply to: Wifibrains

The Pope only fears what he doesnt understand.

The Pope is afraid for a num ber of things:

People are doing far more research about their religion than in the past when his congregations all around the world simply sat in front of a priest and hung onto every repetitative word he said. No one ever seemed to think of questioning any of it because they were all conditioned to believe it from babyhood.

The finding of the Nag Hammadi scrolls has opened up the debate as to whether Christ was a Gnostic, which the early church saw gave a personal relationship direct to Christ. Christ supposedly taught that anyh man who loved God and followed the law was an equal to him and he would call them 'Brother'.

The Pagans had personal relationships with their different Gods. They paid no one for that privilege but the early church fathers wanted financially secure and safe seats for themselves and importantly authority given to them by the Emporer or Head of State which allowed them to persecute and murder anyon e who disagreed with them. This megalomania is often forgotten by people today, but many at the height of their power were terrified of the various hoards of monks, particularly the Jesuits. These men were especially cruel and totally unChrist like.

When Christianity was being formed into a religion it was done in conjunction with the Emporer and the early fathers and everyone at Nicea and their other meetings benefitted from the deal decided upon. All the documents that went against the political and religious agreed dogma was hunted out from the monasteries and destroyed. What wasn't, the Vatican decided to keep in its hujge depositories - but not one Catholic or scholar has ever been able to see any of the ancient scrolls or indeed the many artefacts they deemed to be dangerous to their cherished position regardless of the rights of the people and governments they stole them from.

I am glad the Pope has exposed himself for the power broker he actually is and not the Christian we were sujpposed to think he was.

It boils down very simply to, if you go direct to Christ then you don't need the church or pay their intermediary. Catholicism has screwed up so many people it should have a health warning, both mental and physical. We are also witnessing and very aptly demonstrated, exactly what making men live an unacceptable and unhealthy celibate life can produce.

a reply to: masqua

Who said that I set myself up as a teacher? I surely never did. You made that assumption on your own.

I only said that I talk freely about it. That is a much different thing.

This forum has threads on religion and I never saw that there was any requirement for those of us who post there to have seminary degrees before we speak up. If that is a requirement, then it should be made clear.

Of course, this idea that the only ones who are qualified to teach a subject are those who have a university degree on it is one we see all over the place these days. I crochet a lot. Do I need a degree in it before I teach others how to do it? I also bred and kept many different species of African cichlid, some of them quite rare, even endangered, prior to the birth of my son. During that time, I was a resident expert in Lake Tanganyika cichlids at a popular Internet forum. I surely never had a degree in that, either. Was I unqualified to teach newcomers?

The idea that you must have a degree in a subject before you can speak on it is highly over rated these days, but the universities love it because it fills their pockets and lets them create degree programs for the stupidest things. Huh, look at the subject we are discussing ... looks like the Pope wants you to believe that you can't approach God without a degreed professional telling you how ... how coincidental.

a reply to: Wifibrains

That SOB...

I bet he is just fine with a "personal" relationship with Mary and Ann.

Typical heathen Jesuit marian worshiping satanic scum.

This makes him an enemy. He is an outright declared enemy of Christians.

End the pope. Restore the papacy.

The throne of peter is not empty. It has been usurped.

As a former Catholic I say this to fellow Catholics. Leave the church. Find your own way.

The church is a den of snakes. Evil has been drilled into the foundation. The corner stone has been replaced.

Be your own priest. The world is now your church. The fellowship of men is your bond and covenant with God.

Serve God as your heart says to. Look for God inside yourself and others.

Beware of holy men. Their image and vestments are cloaks and smoke meant to deceive you.

a reply to: tadaman

Wow, that is certainly a strong reaction. What was it exactly that the Pope said that prompted your post?

Thanks,

Eric

a reply to: EricD

The source for my sentiment is the heart of a true Catholic.

I know the mentality. I have seen the devils grin.

I am not fooled. My eyes see clearly. I hear all I must.

My heart is pure.

We are not alone.

I AM

They may reject Jesus, but they won't reject his more forgiving mother.

And the church calls it self a her...

originally posted by: FlyersFan

I agree and disagree with his statement.

The Church brought us scripture which brings us Jesus. The Church also brought us the great writings of the saints and the awesome prayers and mediations that bring us closer to God. But the legalities of the Church, as helpful as they can be, can also be a hinderance to many.

I can see what he is getting at. First off, when you take the man himself, he is very humble, he has done a lot of clearing out of things he sees as unneeded. He has no posh car, he wears only basic regalia, he is prepared to close the Vatican bank if they don't get their house in order, in fact he will be lucky to survive all these changes, the way he has been, 'KA'
His church is the community, all the people, and any community needs to work together.

a reply to: tadaman

So, just to make sure that I understand this correctly, you are responding to a thread that purports to be discussing or commenting on what the Pope said without actually reading what the Pope said.

And you feel comfortable doing this because you have some preternatural knowledge of what is within the heart of a true Catholic.

This is validated by the fact that your heart is pure.

And for a reason that I don't quite fathom, the fact that we aren't alone is germane.

Is that accurate?

Eric

Christ is your Super Consciousness, so that whole argument kind of flies out the window, I'd say

From the sect of the Nazarenes, an important clue.

www.biblicalarchaeology.org...

Josephus on the Essenes.

firstnewtestament.com...

Answer for yourself: Did you notice the sly mention of being "alive from the dead" as well? These people were already alive to whom Paul preached (THINK)! Paul was referring to their spiritual awakening (being now alive spiritually to their true nature [that they are vessels for God living in and thorough them in the physical realm] yet dead before in trespasses and sins prior to receiving this spirit initiation). Once they were baptized and immersed and initiated into Gnosis and the knowledge that within in dwells the Christ of God then they were no longer expected to live in submission to their lower self but unto their higher self (pneumatics). For Christians Gnostics this was their "Spiritual resurrection". We just saw in this "death, baptism, and spiritual resurrection" the Exodus allegory replayed through New Testament eyes where "the Christ" had accomplished for these believers the same benefit as Moses had done for Israel in the Old Testament. Arriving at this understanding only reinforced the idea that since they are all a part of God's Divine Consciousness within living flesh and matter then how dare they live unrighteously in light of the new knowledge of their true identity (that the Divine Spark of God lived within them).

Later Christian Literalists and proto-Catholics like Justin and Irenaeus rejected this Inner Mystery of Gnostic Christianity. They promoted the Outer Mysteries or the literal interpretation of the Joshua-Jesus allegory. They taught that an historical person called Jesus literally died and resurrected for us, and that if we believe this we will go to Heaven when we die, while if we disbelieve we will be condemned to torment in Hell. This has nothing to do with the understanding of the original Christians, however. They taught that we each need to resurrect for ourselves, because we are all dead and in Hell right now (in a symbolic sense).....

With characteristic irony, the Gnostics also describe the state of being identified with the physical body, which we normally think of as being awake, as falling asleep. Our "normal" state is not being alive and awake - it is being asleep and dreaming we are in Hell. Plotinus explains that to incarnate (be born) "is to descend into Hades and there fall asleep" (Plotinus, Enn., 1.8, quoted in T. Taylor, Oracles and Mysteries, 1995, p 60). The theme that this world was the Underworld was widely held, but rarely explicitly stated, by philosophers and poets in the ancient world. Taylor supplies passages from Empedocles, Heracitus, Plato, Philolaus and Clement of Alexandria that testify to the importance of this theme in the Pagan Mysteries. The Christian Secret Book of John urges, "Be wakeful so that you come out of heavy sleep and take off the clothes of Hades." "I am the Pronoia of the pure light; I am the thinking of the virginal Spirit, who raised you up to the honoured place. Arise and remember that it is you who hearkened, and follow your root, which is I, the merciful one, and guard yourself against the angels of poverty and the demons of chaos and all those who ensnare you, and beware of the deep sleep and the enclosure of the inside of Hades" (The Apocryphon of John, NRC, 2.1.31; in J.M. Robinson, 1978, p. 122; B. Layton, 1987, p. 141). The Christian text The Concept of our Great Power urges, "You are asleep and dreaming. Wake up" ("Yet you are sleeping, dreaming dreams. Wake up and return" (The Concept of our Great Power, NRC, 6.4.40, in Robinson, op. cit., p. 314).

We think we are alive, but really we are dead. We think we are awake, but really we are asleep and dreaming. We think we know who we are and what life is, but really we are lost in illusion. We need to resurrect. We need to wake up. We need Gnosis and knowledge concerning our true self...that we are one with Christ living in and through our earthly existence. Quoting a pre-existing hymn, Paul writes:

Eph 5:14 14 Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. (KJV)

By what was just said, the pope just became the antichrist indeed.

The Essenes weren't a branch of later renegade Christians, this was the Christians and if Yehoshua was real, he was the elected leader of the Essenes, the Equality and the Way.

www.gnosis.org...

... your light, give me your mercy! My Redeemer, redeem me, for I am yours; the one who has come forth from you. You are my mind; bring me forth! You are my treasure house; open for me! You are my fullness; take me to you! You are (my) repose; give me the perfect thing that cannot be grasped!

This from the nag hammadi, the prayer of the apostle paul, in which Christ, is Your Consciusness, Higher Mind, and this prayer is giving permission to your Higher Self to unlock you soul skills basically.

Point being, this pope is the anti christ if he says anything like this.

Its idolatry to have a structural church and authorities, and tithing.

a reply to: masqua

But if you want to go forth and teach others, then it would be good if you did get that education first.

Well it seems to me that in seminary they teach the errors and contradictions in the bible, yet some preachers still insist the bible is perfect and inerrant...

Thus said education means nothing when one simply ignores what they're taught...

People should be smart enough to read the bible and teach themselves before attempting to teach others

Schooling is not necessary... unless that person can't read in the first place

a reply to: EricD

No that is not accurate.

I will thank you to not judge me. You asked. Next time dont ask if you cant accept what people have to say.

I was born and raised Catholic. TRADITIONAL. I went to Catholic school my entire academic life. I am no expert on the subject, but I know what the hell I am talking about.

FYI

The church is solely in existence as per the mandate of Jesus FOR THE SALVATION OF SOULS. No humanist crap. No worldly political affairs. No Marian worship of a MORTAL WOMAN. No. None of it. Just the salvation of souls through Christ. He could have been born to a whore or a freaking monkey. Even a whore monkey. She is irrelevant.

The salvation of souls. How the hell is that supposed to happen WITHOUT JESUS CHRIST!?!?

HE is the message. He is the vessel. He is the cup of eternal life. God is the essence of what it is filled with. Mary is simply the cup bearer.

The entire dynamic of Marian worship is a pagan left over of fertility worship and Isis adoration. Sacred prostitution and pleasures of flesh over sacrifice of spirit.

This nonsense has usurped the church. Jesus was not born to validate some random mortal woman. He was born to save souls from perdition.
You could say mass, I am not swayed and many more are not everyday.

There MUST be a personal relationship with Jesus in order to be Catholic or even christian. PERIOD.

We would sooner worship each other or the sacred marriage of every harlot we can find in scripture in an act of sacrilege and unholy defiance. (again) instead of following the simple message.

Serve God. BE clean. Do good.

You can eat novus ordo and choke on it.

EDIT TO ADD:
Undo the entirety of Paul, Constantine, the Gnostics, and especially the Vatican counsels.

Read and think for yourself. There is no need for mortal men or intermediaries. JESUS was the high priest to end all high priests. There is no need for any mortal man or woman´s intervention on our behalf to God... Pope, Rabbi or otherwise.

No more sacrifices. JESUS was the ultimate and final sacrifice. No more priests. He was the final and lasting priest. He is the path to God. Not mortal men or women or their organizations. Not buildings or orders. None of it.

If you eat, sleep, crap, bleed and die, you are just like me...UNDER GOD.

EVERYONE: YOU DONT NEED THE CHURCH. WE sanctify it, not the other way around. Make no mistake. Jesus blessed US not the physical church or its mortal servants. That is why WE are the church. Jesus made it so. If you are considering yourself even slightly christian and ESPECIALLY Catholic in any measure, this is self evident.

If not you are not. You are then something else.

Is that good for you Eric?

Have any of you read The Mists of Avalon? A great book which tells the King Arthur saga from the perspective of the women, such as Morgan Le Fay, Igraine, The Lady of the Lake, etc. Christianity vs the Old Ways is a major theme.

Shortly after Arthur is crowned, he takes the Merlin and Archbishop Patricius as his advisers. There is a scene (page 259-260) in which Arthur introduces the Archbishop to his mother Igraine, and a brief theological discussion ensues (one of many throughout the book). I will present that short scene for your entertainment and philosophical consideration:

[...]

"Lady, I do not know, but I do know that the Mother Superior wanted to forbid one of them because" - her eyes grew wide - "he is a wizard and a sorcerer, so she said, and a Druid!”

Igraine rose. "It is the Merlin of Britain, for he is my father, and he is no wizard, child, but a scholar trained in the crafts of the wise. Even the church fathers say that the Druids are good and noble men, and worship with them in harmony, since they acknowledge God in all things, and Christ as one of the many prophets of God."

The little girl dropped a small curtsey, acknowledging the correction, as Igraine put away the embroidery work and adjusted her veil smoothly around her face.

When she came into the outer room, she saw not only the Merlin and a strange, austere man in the dark dress which churchmen were beginning to adopt to set them off from seculars, but a third man she hardly recognized, even when he was turned; for a moment it was as if she looked into Uther's face.

"Gwydion!" she exclaimed, then, quickly amending, "Arthur. Forgive me; I forgot." She would have knelt before the High King but he reached out quickly and prevented her.

"Mother, never kneel in my presence. I forbid it."

Igraine bowed to the Merlin and to the dour, austere-looking Archbishop.

"This is my mother, Uther's queen," Arthur said, and the Archbishop responded, stretching his lips in what Igraine supposed was meant for a smile. "But now she has a higher honor than royalty, in that she is a bride of Christ."

Hardly a bride, Igraine thought, simply a widow who has taken refuge in his house. But she did not say so, and bowed her head.

Arthur said, "Lady, this is Patricius, Archbishop of the Isle of the Priests, now called Glastonbury, who has newly come there."

"Aye, by God's will," the Archbishop said, "having lately driven out the evil magicians from Ireland, I am come to drive them forth from all Christian lands. I found in Glastonbury a corrupt lot of priests, tolerating among them even the common worship of the Druids, at which our Lord who died for us would have wept tears of blood!"

Taliesin the Merlin said in his soft voice, "Why, then, you would be harsher than Christ himself, brother? For he, I seem to remember, was greatly chided that he consorted with outcasts and sinners and even tax collectors, and such ladies as the Magdalen, when they would have had him a Nazarite like to John the Baptizer. And at last, even when he hung dying on his cross, he did promise the thief that that same night he would join him in paradise - no?"

"I think too many presume to read the divine Scriptures, and fall into just such errors as this," said Patricius sternly. "Those who presume on their learning will learn, I trust, to listen to their priests for the true interpretations."

The Merlin smiled gently. "I cannot join you in that wish, brother. I am dedicated to the belief that it is God's will that all men should strive for wisdom in themselves, not look to it from some other. Babes, perhaps, must have their food chewed for them by a nurse, but men may drink and eat of wisdom for themselves."

"Come, come!" Arthur interrupted with a smile. "I will have no controversies between my two dearest councilors. Lord Merlin's wisdom is indispensable to me; he set me on my throne."

"Sir," said the Archbishop, "God set you there."

"With the help of the Merlin," said Arthur, "and I pledged to him that I would listen to his council always. Would you have me forsworn, Father Patricius?"

[...]

a reply to: masqua

What we don't need are millions of 'pseudo' Jesus characters. imho.

If they did a real good job of emulating him, this would be a good thing for the world the more the better.