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The House of the Rising Sun
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The learned savant who guards the secrets of the great gods
They gave him the tablet of the gods, a secret of heaven and underworld
They put in his hand the cedar-rod, beloved of the great gods.
Tablet from Nineveh
I want to consider here the basis here of the Enoch tradition and the truth behind it as sourced from Mesopotamia, in particular with regards to the Cult of Šamaš in the E-babbara, which translates as 'The House of the Rising Sun', drawing upon this paper The Learned Savant who guards the Secrets of the Great Gods.
The case is made that Enoch is derivative of the seventh Antediluvian Patriarch of Mesopotamia, namely Enmeduranki, with it's focus at the E-babbara Temple of Samas at the City of Sippar.
Even a brief look at early Enochic booklets such as the Book of the Watchers and the Astronomical Book demonstrates that already in these early Enochic writings the seventh antediluvian patriarch appears to have a set of highly developed roles: a sage, a visionary, a diviner, and a scribe.
In my judgment, the Enmeduranki tradition provides sharp illustration of the fact that the celestial roles of this Mesopotamian hero served as a decisive pattern for the future heavenly roles of his Jewish counterpart, the patriarch Enoch,whose symbolical age of 365 years reflects the link between the patriarch and the solar cult of Shamash
Enmeduranki is translated into the Celestial company of the Great Gods and is there given a Throne amongst them, upon his return through the gift of the Cedar-rod of rule he distributes Kingship among the Cities of Mesopotamnia.
Šamaš in E-babbara appointed Enmeduranki king of Sippar.
The beloved of Anu, Enli and Ea
Šamaš and Adad brought him in to their assembly
Šamaš and Adad honored him
Šamaš and Adad set him on a large throne of gold,they put in his hand the cedar-rod, beloved of the great gods.
Then he, in accordance with their word brought the men of Nippur, Sippar and Babylon into his presence, and he honored them.
He set them on thrones before him.
From this Celestial authority is established the Priestly line;
The learned savant, who guards the secrets of the great gods, will bind his son whom he loves with an oath before Šamaš and Adad by tablet and stylus and will instruct him. When a diviner, an expert in oil, of abiding descent, offspring of Enmeduranki, king of Sippar, who set up the pure bowl and held the cedar-rod, a benediction priest of the king, a long-haired priest of Šamaš as fashioned by Ninhursagga. a nîðakku-priest of pure descent. if he is without blemish in body and limb
The Ninevah Tablet will itself be derivative of earlier Sumerian traditions of the En Priesthood, there is more emphasis on Divination in the later period whereas in Sumeria the only attested usage was that a candidate into the En Priesthood had to present an animal for internal examination in order to discover possible internal blemish of character by association, in later periods there is also more concern with external perfection and purity.
The Enochic tradition probably gives good indication of the nature of the secrets involved;
Another important detail of the tradition about the tablet that might point to the content of this esoteric knowledge is the juxtaposition of the term s«secrets»and«mysteries» with the phrases«heaven and underworld» or «heaven and earth». Kvanvig points out that both phrases possibly have cosmological meaning Intended to describe the totality of creation, this terminology can also be related to cosmogonic and creational concepts. The identification of the secrets with cosmological knowledge recalls Enoch, where the notion of secrets is applied solely to the mysteries of God’s creation
The major task of the En Priests at the dawn of civilization would have been in distributing the Cultic centres of the Divne Powers amongst the various City States such that these were in accordance with natural association and potential for development, for example Deities of water and marshlands in the most Southern coastal regions, shepherd cults of the Edin grasslands, the Cattle Gods of the North in connection with bullish Deities, and to create the literary tradition to establish this.
The dissemination of esoteric information will remain one of the major functions of the seventh patriarchs in the Merkabah tradition where he will be responsible for transmitting the highest secrets to the Princes under him, as well as to humankind
The text therefore makes explicit that one of the most important functions of the initiated Enmeduranki is transmission of the knowledge that he received from the deities to inhabitants of the terrestrial realm
The end result then is to establish the ways of Heaven upon the Earth;
The text shows that Enmeduranki’s mediation is multifaceted and executed not only through a set of oral and written communication, but also through the establishment of distinct social and religious structures. It is noteworthy that Enmeduranki’s instructions in the divinatory rituals to the people were preceded by the establishment of social settings that mirror the social structure of the divine assembly
From my own studies of Sumeria i would conclude that this vision was carried out with great effect by the En Priests and Priestesses and that it's success led to it's own downfall in that neighbouring peoples from all directions invaded the lands to plunder and spoil the riches derived, and to carry away into slavery the En Priests in order to establish such principles in their own lands, a harsh means of dissemination of knowledge, this practise is attested in various laments for Sumer.
The city of Nanše, Niĝin, was delivered to the foreigners. Sirara, her beloved dwelling, was handed over to the evil ones. "Alas, the destroyed city, my destroyed house," she cried bitterly. Its sacred Ĝipar of En priesthood was defiled. Its En priest was snatched from the Ĝipar and carried off to enemy territory.
Looking at the current state of Iraq it is perhaps time for the Sun to rise again preceded by the storm of Iškur
edit on Kam731184vAmerica/ChicagoFriday0431 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
Very thought provoking. I am always glad to see your post here at ATS they are a breath of fresh air and give me hope for the site. I don't have
anything else to add at this time as I am still processing the information but will keep an eye on the thread as it progresses. Keep up the good work
Kantzveldt. Truly a boon to ATS to have your threads here many of which could be book worthy.
originally posted by: Kantzveldt
The incorrect notion resides in receiving ancient knowledge as historical events.
The correct notion resides in applying ancient knowledge as teachings of self.
The key of understanding resides in applying the fundamental principal of recording information, that is, the application of this knowledge to ones self.
What implications does this information have upon your own psyche?
What implications does this information have upon enriching your own life?
External information has internal ramifications.
Consider for your own well being what information you have desired to share.
Consider the reasons that motivated you to research such information.
Consider the circumstances that have directed you to discovering such information.
You will learn more about yourself and the underlying factors that attract you to this knowledge.
The Ancients knew what we are just now rediscovering.
The times since the Ancients have given rise to collective amnesia.
There is more to this than meets the eye, seek and you shall find.
a reply to: Zadok
There is a balance here between an enlightened individual (of the cult of the Sun God) being transformed not only in himself but projecting this vision onto society, such that civilization was the result, creating the institutions and socio-economic infra-structure that would facilitate this vision, this was the making of history.
Peace of mind and hearts content then are made possible through this transformation of society, this is not individual escapism but application of sound methodology and practise, involving the digging of ditches the construction of roads and other great social works in order to construct a framework for the ideological model, 5,500 years ago this was achieved.
a reply to: NihilistSanta
Well thank you, i've been happy enough to share what i've been researching, maybe most don't make much of it though and maybe i could have explained things more clearly, but anyway i did my best
There is a balance here between an enlightened individual (of the cult of the Sun God) being transformed not only in himself but projecting this vision onto society, such that civilization was the result, creating the institutions and socio-economic infra-structure that would facilitate this vision, this was the making of history.
Peace of mind and hearts content then are made possible through this transformation of society, this is not individual escapism but application of sound methodology and practise, involving the digging of ditches the construction of roads and other great social works in order to construct a framework for the ideological model, 5,500 years ago this was achieved.
a reply to: NihilistSanta
Well thank you, i've been happy enough to share what i've been researching, maybe most don't make much of it though and maybe i could have explained things more clearly, but anyway i did my best
edit on Kpm731184vAmerica/ChicagoFriday0431 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Kantzveldt
How does the knowledge of this individuals enlightenment pertain to you?
How does this individuals use of said enlightenment in establishing his vision pertain to your own psychological understanding of life?
What gave rise to this ideological framework 5,500 years ago and how can that be implemented into the ideological framework of today?
How does this knowledge affect your views of the world, how does it affect your pursuits and actions?
Implications are essential to comprehend.
To share knowledge without understanding what it implies is to share deaf words upon deaf ears.
How does the knowledge of this individuals enlightenment pertain to you?
How does this individuals use of said enlightenment in establishing his vision pertain to your own psychological understanding of life?
What gave rise to this ideological framework 5,500 years ago and how can that be implemented into the ideological framework of today?
How does this knowledge affect your views of the world, how does it affect your pursuits and actions?
Implications are essential to comprehend.
To share knowledge without understanding what it implies is to share deaf words upon deaf ears.
a reply to: Zadok
The vision that created Sumerian civilization is in accordance with my own understandings of life and so naturally i look to what they made of it and how they established a society based upon it in terms of applied systemics, what gave rise in both instances is direct inter-relationship between humanity and spiritual presence and the determination of the multi-faceted nature of such.
Obviously many claim such relationships and understandings and one can only look to the societies that their visions have created in order to see the general short-comings of such, so the real proof is always the application, everything though is of one form of spiritual inspiration or another, it is just that this takes many forms and many far from positive, a question of metaphysical dynamics.
The implications are that it has been done before and can therefore be done again, in the mythological context it was a case of out with the old and in with the new, the eradication of former ways, but i doubt there is any case for re-constitution of the Sumerian Pantheon and En Priesthood, but rather application of the same knowledge base toward a new sociological and spiritual model
The vision that created Sumerian civilization is in accordance with my own understandings of life and so naturally i look to what they made of it and how they established a society based upon it in terms of applied systemics, what gave rise in both instances is direct inter-relationship between humanity and spiritual presence and the determination of the multi-faceted nature of such.
Obviously many claim such relationships and understandings and one can only look to the societies that their visions have created in order to see the general short-comings of such, so the real proof is always the application, everything though is of one form of spiritual inspiration or another, it is just that this takes many forms and many far from positive, a question of metaphysical dynamics.
The implications are that it has been done before and can therefore be done again, in the mythological context it was a case of out with the old and in with the new, the eradication of former ways, but i doubt there is any case for re-constitution of the Sumerian Pantheon and En Priesthood, but rather application of the same knowledge base toward a new sociological and spiritual model
edit on Kpm731184vAmerica/ChicagoFriday0431 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Kantzveldt
WOw thank you for posting this.
Stars and Flags to you!
It makes you think that if this is what Ninebah was doing. and God in the Bible destroyed Nionevah be3cause they did not change there ways. Is the hous eof the rising sun a good thing or is it worship of the demons and nephlim which are also mentioned in the book of Enoch and the Book of Watchers.
WOw thank you for posting this.
Stars and Flags to you!
It makes you think that if this is what Ninebah was doing. and God in the Bible destroyed Nionevah be3cause they did not change there ways. Is the hous eof the rising sun a good thing or is it worship of the demons and nephlim which are also mentioned in the book of Enoch and the Book of Watchers.
originally posted by: Kantzveldt
The case is made that Enoch is derivative of the seventh Antediluvian Patriarch of Mesopotamia, namely Enmeduranki, with it's focus at the E-babbara Temple of Samas at the City of Sippar.
Even a brief look at early Enochic booklets such as the Book of the Watchers and the Astronomical Book demonstrates that already in these early Enochic writings the seventh antediluvian patriarch appears to have a set of highly developed roles: a sage, a visionary, a diviner, and a scribe.
In my judgment, the Enmeduranki tradition provides sharp illustration of the fact that the celestial roles of this Mesopotamian hero served as a decisive pattern for the future heavenly roles of his Jewish counterpart, the patriarch Enoch,whose symbolical age of 365 years reflects the link between the patriarch and the solar cult of Shamash
With respect to the idea there may be some relation even if derivative, Enoch even the biblical Enoch, the one in Seth's line, is said to be antediluvian. His teachings and history survived the flood somehow. So he was not really Jewish per say but part of the line of true prophets who's teachings were preserved by the Hebrews.
The only patterns, if indeed Enmeduranki was patterned after this man, were based off the real man. Both the Hebrews and others in the area would have had knowledge of Enoch from the outset. When the flood was over and man started to populated and build Enmeduranki was probably simply the Sippar version of that old priest line which sounds very corrupted by them at that point. The Hebrews didn't need to make a later pattern of Enoch based on Enmeduranki as they had the original teachings of Enoch himself.
a reply to: Kantzveldt
I find your threads interesting although I feel we probably draw different conclusions from the information you present. I feel your threads often present the case for the biblical narrative and the antediluvian world whether you intend to or not. This is just my perspective. They always bring forth sources and information unfamiliar to me but which seem to pertain to much of my own research. I kind of fall into the school of thought Logarock has presented above.
I have often seen claims relating the Egyptian Thoth to Enoch and I feel that Enoch was represented post-flood as an archetype that was represented in many pantheons and tales. Thank you for bringing more information forth about Enmeduranki whom I believe to be a post Enoch archetype or recreation.
The Jewish version related from Abraham would be of a lineage from Enoch himself thru Methuselah down to Terah to Abram in Ur. I find most of the ancient pantheons and tales to be primitive from a theological point amalgamations of Nephilhim and pre flood patriarchs and such who were deified and this tale seems to fit that as well.
At the very least Kantzveldt I say your threads illustrate that there is much more similarity in ancient cultures than we are lead to believe by the mainstream and they appear to be relating the same or similar tales about events and practices that were witnessed in the antediluvian world.
I find your threads interesting although I feel we probably draw different conclusions from the information you present. I feel your threads often present the case for the biblical narrative and the antediluvian world whether you intend to or not. This is just my perspective. They always bring forth sources and information unfamiliar to me but which seem to pertain to much of my own research. I kind of fall into the school of thought Logarock has presented above.
I have often seen claims relating the Egyptian Thoth to Enoch and I feel that Enoch was represented post-flood as an archetype that was represented in many pantheons and tales. Thank you for bringing more information forth about Enmeduranki whom I believe to be a post Enoch archetype or recreation.
The Jewish version related from Abraham would be of a lineage from Enoch himself thru Methuselah down to Terah to Abram in Ur. I find most of the ancient pantheons and tales to be primitive from a theological point amalgamations of Nephilhim and pre flood patriarchs and such who were deified and this tale seems to fit that as well.
At the very least Kantzveldt I say your threads illustrate that there is much more similarity in ancient cultures than we are lead to believe by the mainstream and they appear to be relating the same or similar tales about events and practices that were witnessed in the antediluvian world.
a reply to: Onion88
The Tablet was found at Nineveh but the tradition relates to Sippar and the Temple there 'House of the Rising Sun', sacred to Samas the Sun God, the Sumerian name of the city was 'zimbri' which meant 'City of Birds', which possibly could relate to the curious bird like figurines from the region of Northern Mesopotamia that some consider Nephilim.
a reply to: Logarock
But a quick glance reveals that both names En-och and En-mer-dur-an-ki share the same prefix which is 'En' generally translated to 'Lord' as in En-ki and En-lil and both are likely to be derivative of the En Priesthood tradition, the solar year numerology in the lifespan of Enoch does suggest some correlation to the Sippar tradition.
It is interesting that in the Genesis narrative reference to Enoch is sketchy, yet in the Hellenistic period the full blown literature emerges, suggesting that the tradition was well known but generally not mentioned, that it was indeed secret.
a reply to: NihilistSanta
The Ante-Diluvian aspect in both cases does suggest that was understood in terms of wiping out the former ways in order to clear the ground for the vision given to the seventh Patriarch, that the two are directly related and that the flood would have been caused by Adad or Iskur the storm God who has as much involvement in the narrative as Samas or Utu, accounts do differ as to whose idea that actually was, in Sumeria, En-lil as Lord of fate and destinies generally taking the overall responsibility, but certainly they always wished to draw a line between the former times and the rise of the City states, and the Flood tradition was perhaps largely metaphorical.
I do think it likely that the Hebrew tradition is based upon inherited Priestly lineage from Southern Mesopotamia, but it's worth bearing in mind the accounts of other peoples bearing off the En Priests from Sumeria in order to translate their knowledge into their own cultures, that you would be looking at parallel development within a Semitic group derivative of Sumeria.
The Tablet was found at Nineveh but the tradition relates to Sippar and the Temple there 'House of the Rising Sun', sacred to Samas the Sun God, the Sumerian name of the city was 'zimbri' which meant 'City of Birds', which possibly could relate to the curious bird like figurines from the region of Northern Mesopotamia that some consider Nephilim.
a reply to: Logarock
But a quick glance reveals that both names En-och and En-mer-dur-an-ki share the same prefix which is 'En' generally translated to 'Lord' as in En-ki and En-lil and both are likely to be derivative of the En Priesthood tradition, the solar year numerology in the lifespan of Enoch does suggest some correlation to the Sippar tradition.
It is interesting that in the Genesis narrative reference to Enoch is sketchy, yet in the Hellenistic period the full blown literature emerges, suggesting that the tradition was well known but generally not mentioned, that it was indeed secret.
a reply to: NihilistSanta
The Ante-Diluvian aspect in both cases does suggest that was understood in terms of wiping out the former ways in order to clear the ground for the vision given to the seventh Patriarch, that the two are directly related and that the flood would have been caused by Adad or Iskur the storm God who has as much involvement in the narrative as Samas or Utu, accounts do differ as to whose idea that actually was, in Sumeria, En-lil as Lord of fate and destinies generally taking the overall responsibility, but certainly they always wished to draw a line between the former times and the rise of the City states, and the Flood tradition was perhaps largely metaphorical.
I do think it likely that the Hebrew tradition is based upon inherited Priestly lineage from Southern Mesopotamia, but it's worth bearing in mind the accounts of other peoples bearing off the En Priests from Sumeria in order to translate their knowledge into their own cultures, that you would be looking at parallel development within a Semitic group derivative of Sumeria.
edit on Kam731185vAmerica/ChicagoSaturday0531 by Kantzveldt
because: (no reason given)
Looking at the connection of Sippar to the Flood from the Babylonian account;
Berrosus account
This accords with the suggestion that the plans for a Post-Diluvian fresh start were seen as instigated from Sippar/Zimbir, there is also an interesting connection to birds from which the City took it's name, the first Law code is thought to have been erected in Sippar so there is some good background to the claims and this later Babylonian account provides good context and continuity between the seventh Patriarch and the Flood.
Cronus appeared to Xisuthrus in a dream and revealed that on the fifteenth of the month Daisios mankind would be destroyed by a great flood. He then ordered him to bury together all the tablets, the first, the middle, and the last, and hide them in Sippar, the city of the sun
After the waters of the Great Flood had come and quickly left, Xisuthrus freed several birds. They found neither food nor a place to rest, and they returned to the ship. After a few days, he again set free some other birds, and they too came back to the they ship, but they returned with claws covered with mud. Then later for a third time he set free some other birds, but they did not return to the ship. Then Xisuthrus knew that the earth had once again appeared.
The voice then instructed them to return to Babylonia to go to the city of Sippar, as it was fated for them to do, to dig up the tablets that were buried there and to turn them over to mankind
And those who had arrived in Babylonia dug up the tablets in the city of Sippar and brought them out. They built many cities and erected temples to the gods and again renewed Babylonia.
Berrosus account
This accords with the suggestion that the plans for a Post-Diluvian fresh start were seen as instigated from Sippar/Zimbir, there is also an interesting connection to birds from which the City took it's name, the first Law code is thought to have been erected in Sippar so there is some good background to the claims and this later Babylonian account provides good context and continuity between the seventh Patriarch and the Flood.
edit on Kam731185vAmerica/ChicagoSaturday0531 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
edit on
Kam731185vAmerica/ChicagoSaturday0531 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Kantzveldt
Very very good thread !
I have read your thread and article, The Learned Savant who guards the Secrets of the Great Gods.
Thanks so much for sharing as I am deeply interested in divination & astrology and the history behind it as well. I found this article easier to read than some I have encountered and now I will do some more research of my own too. Thanks for pointing the way.
& the music was an extra special bonus to start my day
:-)
leolady
Very very good thread !
I have read your thread and article, The Learned Savant who guards the Secrets of the Great Gods.
Thanks so much for sharing as I am deeply interested in divination & astrology and the history behind it as well. I found this article easier to read than some I have encountered and now I will do some more research of my own too. Thanks for pointing the way.
& the music was an extra special bonus to start my day
:-)
leolady
edit on 5-7-2014 by leolady because: sp
a reply to: leolady
Thanks and you're welcome. Academia.edu is certainly the best source for contemporary interesting academic articles and papers on the ancient world, of course as you say some are more readable than others, an expert on Mesopotamian Divination and astrology for example is Ulla Koch and some interesting papers there, if you do a search on say Magic and Divination in the ancient world it will show those actively interested in such and this allows to see if they are contributing new papers, so it's a good way of finding the latest research on very specific interests, Andrei Orlov has written some other papers i will need to look at
Thanks and you're welcome. Academia.edu is certainly the best source for contemporary interesting academic articles and papers on the ancient world, of course as you say some are more readable than others, an expert on Mesopotamian Divination and astrology for example is Ulla Koch and some interesting papers there, if you do a search on say Magic and Divination in the ancient world it will show those actively interested in such and this allows to see if they are contributing new papers, so it's a good way of finding the latest research on very specific interests, Andrei Orlov has written some other papers i will need to look at
edit on Kam731185vAmerica/ChicagoSaturday0531 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)
a reply to: Kantzveldt
This is all well and good but it must be considered here, but rarely ever is, that the Hebrew tradition has it that their patriarch was told to leave Mesopotamia, the area had become religiously corrupted. They were always warned about sun and moon worship, divination and just about everything coming out of that area.
This is all well and good but it must be considered here, but rarely ever is, that the Hebrew tradition has it that their patriarch was told to leave Mesopotamia, the area had become religiously corrupted. They were always warned about sun and moon worship, divination and just about everything coming out of that area.
a reply to: Logarock
There was doubt with regards to the nature of the source of the Heavenly knowledge and those who were descended from the early teachers of humanity, the Mesopotamian Rulers, but to some extent this was shared also in Mesopotamia, generally the Hebrews did reject all such teachings and thus rejected the source.
The Ante-Diluvian origin of evil
It's a question of interpretation long after the event and also a general distancing from Mesopotamian culture on the basis of moral superiority, but many of the Hebrew understandings are quite contradictory and convoluted, here for example is how they equate Istar with the Pleiades...
There was doubt with regards to the nature of the source of the Heavenly knowledge and those who were descended from the early teachers of humanity, the Mesopotamian Rulers, but to some extent this was shared also in Mesopotamia, generally the Hebrews did reject all such teachings and thus rejected the source.
The Jewish tradition concerning Watchers was not uniform. There are variant stories that depict their motives and activities more positively. The Book of Jubilees preserves a tradition relating that God originally dispatched the Watchers to earth for the purpose of instructing humanity in proper ritual and ethical conduct. There is a fair amount of texts, according to which the Watchers were sent by God for the purpose of positively instructing and looking after humanity. For example, the Watchers are treated in Sibylline Oracles as human beings, the culture-bringers in its second generation. They are portrayed as wise and noble, and their innovations are judged positively as follows: “They practiced skills of all kinds, discovering inventions by their needs. One discovered how to till the earth with ploughs, another, carpentry, another was concerned with sailing, another, astronomy and divination by birds, another medicine, again another, magic
The Ante-Diluvian origin of evil
It's a question of interpretation long after the event and also a general distancing from Mesopotamian culture on the basis of moral superiority, but many of the Hebrew understandings are quite contradictory and convoluted, here for example is how they equate Istar with the Pleiades...
“When the genera-tion of the deluge arose and served idols, the Holy One blessed be He, was grieved.Immediately two angels arose, Shemhazai and Azael … They said (to the Lord of the Universe): “Give us leave, let us dwell with the creatures and Thou wilt see how we shal lsanctify Thy name.” He said “Descend and dwell with them.” At once they corruptedthemselves with the daughters of man who were beautiful, and were unable to subdue their desire. Immediately Shemhazai saw one girl, whose name was Istahar. He set hiseyes on her and said: “Grant my desire!” She replied: “I will not grant it until thou teachme the Shem Hammeforash, by means of which thou ascendest to heaven, at the moment thou pronouncest it.” He taught her that name, she pronounced it, ascended to heaven,without having sinned. The Holy One blessed be He, said: “Because she has kept herself far from sin, go ye and fix her among the seven stars in order that she may be mentioned among them for ever””
a reply to: Kantzveldt
Samson is Samas. I noticed in the op it mentions Long hair which was a nazirite vow. Nazirites were allowed into the holy place and possibly the most holy place without being Levites priests. They are a different kind of priest. Seeing as the second temple was a corruption of the former ways after exile and the deuteronomist purge, this might be what the story of Samson is about. Not tearing down the temple of the philistines but of the Levites. Symbolically. I believe the Nazirites were Melchizedek priests which have a strong link to the Enoch tradition.
Also the sons of god are men IMO. Teachers civilisers as you say.
On my phone sorry about the poor grammar.
Samson is Samas. I noticed in the op it mentions Long hair which was a nazirite vow. Nazirites were allowed into the holy place and possibly the most holy place without being Levites priests. They are a different kind of priest. Seeing as the second temple was a corruption of the former ways after exile and the deuteronomist purge, this might be what the story of Samson is about. Not tearing down the temple of the philistines but of the Levites. Symbolically. I believe the Nazirites were Melchizedek priests which have a strong link to the Enoch tradition.
Also the sons of god are men IMO. Teachers civilisers as you say.
On my phone sorry about the poor grammar.
a reply to: zardust
Yes Samson and the Nazirite Priesthood is interesting, there is solar symbolism involved and the long hair and doctrine of purity, particularly in that it is set closely within nature and the way of the individual, i look for development of this from the Sumerian cult of Utu the Sun God, particularly were he sets out with his sister Inanna into the mountains in order for her to develop self knowledge through tasting of things within nature;
"Whatever exists in the mountains, let us eat that. Whatever exists in the hills, let us eat that. In the mountains of herbs, in the mountains of cedars, in the mountains of cedars, the mountains of cypresses, whatever exists in the mountains, let us eat that."
This is how i think of Utu, as walking beside oneself through nature, illuminating and guiding, a stroll through the countryside on a lovely summers day.
For those who venture forth single-handed, who venture forth from a man's house, for those who venture forth from a man's house, who venture forth single-handed, Utu: you are their mother, Utu, you are their father.
Utu F
Yes Samson and the Nazirite Priesthood is interesting, there is solar symbolism involved and the long hair and doctrine of purity, particularly in that it is set closely within nature and the way of the individual, i look for development of this from the Sumerian cult of Utu the Sun God, particularly were he sets out with his sister Inanna into the mountains in order for her to develop self knowledge through tasting of things within nature;
"Whatever exists in the mountains, let us eat that. Whatever exists in the hills, let us eat that. In the mountains of herbs, in the mountains of cedars, in the mountains of cedars, the mountains of cypresses, whatever exists in the mountains, let us eat that."
This is how i think of Utu, as walking beside oneself through nature, illuminating and guiding, a stroll through the countryside on a lovely summers day.
For those who venture forth single-handed, who venture forth from a man's house, for those who venture forth from a man's house, who venture forth single-handed, Utu: you are their mother, Utu, you are their father.
Utu F
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Final jobs report before Nov 5th is a bad one lowest since Dec 2020
US Political Madness: 5 hours ago, 15 flags -
President BIDEN Approved Omitting from the Transcript That He Called Trump Supporters GARBAGE.
2024 Elections: 15 hours ago, 11 flags -
CNN now has a pay wall
Other Current Events: 2 hours ago, 9 flags -
Pentagon announces new military aid package for Ukraine
World War Three: 2 hours ago, 9 flags -
Early voting results
2024 Elections: 8 hours ago, 8 flags -
Tucker Carlson Shares Amazing Story: "I Was Mauled By a Demon"
Paranormal Studies: 3 hours ago, 8 flags -
Strong and Intelligent women
2024 Elections: 17 hours ago, 4 flags -
Project Redsun: NASA's Secret Manned Missions to Mars The Why Files
Space Exploration: 14 hours ago, 4 flags -
Maetaquest 3S
Video Games: 5 hours ago, 3 flags
active topics
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CNN now has a pay wall
Other Current Events • 16 • : onestonemonkey -
Tucker Carlson Shares Amazing Story: "I Was Mauled By a Demon"
Paranormal Studies • 24 • : JadedGhost -
Maetaquest 3S
Video Games • 3 • : Kurokage -
Pentagon announces new military aid package for Ukraine
World War Three • 13 • : BeyondKnowledge3 -
Tommy Robinson jailed again.
Mainstream News • 89 • : SprocketUK -
Remember when Iraq invaded Kuwait
History • 20 • : fringeofthefringe -
The Acronym Game .. Pt.4
General Chit Chat • 874 • : tinkerbell99 -
-@TH3WH17ERABB17- -Q- ---TIME TO SHOW THE WORLD--- -Part- --44--
Dissecting Disinformation • 3073 • : Thoughtful3 -
Steal the vote alive and well
2024 Elections • 23 • : tjack -
ABC Broadcasts Election results on "Accident"
2024 Elections • 42 • : Lazy88
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