Five Chinese Weapons of War America Should Fear

I wouldn't call "anti-satellite" a threat more like a protection for Earth from being bombarded by destructive space weapons.

a reply to: Maxatoria

How well did all our military defenses pick up all those meteors that crashed to earth over the last year?

We're talking about objects smaller than those meteors sometimes on the order of 100 times. AS well, these objects are traveling faster than meteorites in some cases, and are infinitely more deadly.

I don't care what you think about the US military, no body anywhere has had to track an object at mach ten with out knowing it was there. Next time you see a bird flying, immediately close your eyes, spin in a circle and count out loud "one, one thousand, two one thousand" Stop and before you open your eyes point where you think the bird will be then open your eyes. How wrong were you ? That's not even close to dealing with an object going, that fast. Not to mention this object is about 1, 6th the size of a stealth jet and shaped in a way radar may never know it was there.

It would take you ten times longer to hear the sound of this object coming after it has impacted... (of course at this time all you will hear is the explosion of the ordinance)

a reply to: SonOfTheLawOfOne

The only notable armory on there are Tridents, and nuclear missiles. AC-130 can be brought down by a number of current Chinese SAMS as well as cold war era SAMS/ Do you really want to bring your mortar crew with your howitzer to china.... Do I really need to pull up videos of the largest standing army in the #ing world. They also deploy howitzers... In fact I bet the chinese out number the US 100,000 to 1 in almost all land force based weapons.... Maybe not in tanks.... but most everything else.

MOAB is not that impressive, and the aircraft that has to deliver it has to get past some pretty #ing scary SAMS and chinese jets of their own, and the B2 doesn't carry MOAB's. I'd be pretty terrified to drive any land based vehicle in china... so the M1A1 I dunno man.

If you can't beat china in the air and at sea, some serious # is going to go down. That is one #ing retardedly enormous land force.

LOL

I see its that time again.

The DEATH-TO-MERICA fantasy.

So cute.


Be sure to clean off your keyboards gentlemen.

China is hardly a military threat to the US. For all their shiny new toys and well drilled soldiers there's one thing they're missing -- experience. The US military is battle hardened, our weapons of war have been tirelessly tested in real combat situations. While the US has been living in a perpetual state of war for more than a decade, all the Chinese have done is play war games and march. Sure they look impressive performing during the Olympics, but how do they look with people shooting at them. Not that great I bet.

This is not to say that I don't vehemently oppose US foreign policy, I do, just stating that our military is a well proven fighting machine, the best on the planet. For all of you saying that the US hasn't won a war since WW2, I ask when was the last time China had a meaningful military victory? They sure did get their asses handed to them by the Japanese.

Also, I'm of the mind that we didn't lose in Iraq or Afganistan -- the objectives weren't to win in a conventional sense, but to destabilize and make war inevitable for the long term. In that case, we can claim victory on both fronts.

Yeah. They don't need most of those traditional weapons either. Maybe as backup. And what they build they steal from others. In the mid-90s I was on a contract where we flat out caught them stealing intellectual property, and not a thing was done about it. And at the same time we were providing them schematics for a proprietary product we were having them build for us because it saved money. Our government gave them a wide open back door to all our DoD satellites, and more. Their products are in all our homes and they are hyper-focused on satellites...perhaps to mess with the chips they put in all these products?

Check this out. Made me really think in the 90s and makes me really think today: Unrestricted Warfare.

a reply to: SonOfTheLawOfOne

Yep.

Those Nuclear Subs with MIRV's Trident Missiles....

They can hit anywhere in the world, more than once.
If they say America has 15 of them, I feel they have 50+.

I feel safe in Canada from outside threat, because of the US Military.
Edit: Until they occupy our streets in case of major North America disaster.

a reply to: Bilky

Was it the same group that said we would die in the beginning of Desert Storm?
Or is there another all seeing eye that doesn't guess correctly EITHER.

a reply to: spy66
If WE say they fire first and CONGRESS declares war GUESS HOW MUCH WE OWE THEM BY INTERNATIONAL TREATY?

originally posted by: johnb
a reply to: KawRider9

Actually america is probably more vulnerable than any other nation due to its reliance on technology.

Hack a cple satellites detonate an emp or 2 and the most advanced military complex in the world wouldn't know what was happening anywhere and most of it's hardware would be inoperable.

Remember what happened in Vietnam with all the USA's technological superiority and what has been happening in Afghan and Iraq against relatively unorganised and untrained volunteers.

'pride comes before a fall' happened again and again throughout history to the dominating cultures of their time usually through internal corruption to start then all those countries/groups/tribes..... see the weakness and take their revenge.

the thing about the web is it is one big octopus now. It is impossible to disconnect the u. S. Without taking down and effecting the whole world. Just the way it is now. Same with economy, you can't drag one down without dragging many down. We are all connected whether we like it or not.

The Bot

a reply to: SonOfTheLawOfOne

There is no way that China, or any other military on the planet, could come close without flat out nuking every asset we have. There is a reason our military is the most feared and envied in the world.

I am not so sure about that. Think for example about the manufacturing infrastructure the chinesse have. How many drones could china pump out a day if they so wished...?

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

You make solid points. I don't doubt that China is in "China First" mode.

To be honest neither the US or China "needs" each other. The effort to break free of each others economic grasp on the other would be very painful to either, which is why it's unlike the Cold War era and unlikely to occur anytime soon.

China needs access to the US Market and can't have us default on the debt that they have bought up. Plus who would the Chinese steal technology from if not the US? Europe but that about it. China is good at manufacturing cheap goods not inventing and researching new and better technologies. Even China's economy is sputtering, and thats with now decades of currency manipulation.

The US needs cheap goods and someone to buy our debt. China is unwilling or unable to step up to the role of "Policeman of the World" so it stays by default to the US. Till the US gets off its Debt addiction (HA) we will have to sell our Treasury notes to those willing to buy them.

The pain of breaking free from the other nation will cause both China and the US to have a much different relationship than the US and USSR in the Cold War.

It will be a much different relationship than the Cold War IMO.
I have no illusions that China is acting only in it's own best interest, in fact, I would expect them to do so.

That all being said, China still is feeling out it's way to Superpower Status, they don't have the real political connections around the world like the US/West has. That limits them to exercising their power close to China.

China doesn't become a real superpower till it starts projecting it's power around the globe. It's time will come, but it's still a few generations away and a LOT could happen that would derail them or us for that matter.

a reply to: pavil

I agree with much of what you've said, but I do hang up on one point. In some settings it could be called a "Captain America Syndrome". In others..simply Hubris.

What the issue is with China specifically though is with statements like suggesting they don't invent and innovate. We can skip the deep history for how much the world has by Chinese innovation overall, and focus on just the here and now for how there is absolutely no way to determine what they do or do not have without human intelligence inside their highest levels. All our gizmos and all are techno-trash is of highly limited value with them, and there is a very good and tangible reason for that.

We look at the surface. We count hangars and airplanes in revetments. Ever counted or tried to count with Chinese bases? I have..and it's a wonder to see how TINY their very respectable air force appears for how little is actually parked above ground on a tarmac or literal hangar space exists to account for. Sites like Cryptome have full photo index directories of every military airfield or facility within the PRC though, so you can physically try your hand at counting. It's a disturbing experience, and very quickly at that.

The D.O.D came out with an evaluation this year for Chinese military priorities, capabilities and future planning. To say China and Russia are different is like pointing out they have different languages. It's that stark a thing...and even I didn't realize how gimped Russia actually appears to be until recently.

China however...is focused in a WHOLE different direction and they have a very clear and very real plan for any military conflict with a technologically superior enemy. (Russia will just throw nukes everywhere, to include Anti-Air Missiles CURRENTLY deployed for the purpose) China has been digging...and digging...and digging.

The Pentagon's estimates say their top priority isn't a retaliatory strike capability, as we've always held as a priority in total war ..but 3rd and 4th strike capability without serious interruption to C&C across their forces. The only way to DO that is to be elsewhere. To literally be ANYWHERE ELSE from where bombs can reach ...and they are. A good % of their military, by reports, seems to be under what we can visually see and count.

It's something we should never sell short or forget as a factor. I believe it was a Princeton group that finally got them to admit to 3,000 miles of tunnels (much for their nuclear weapons testing, to be fair) already existed years ago. That was before the latest Pentagon reports suggesting they've spent 20 years digging down and in their Army, Air Force AND NAVY....and yes..Navy was specifically and especially mentioned as buried assets...which gave me a real bad feeling.

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Good points as well. China would be very scary if they had political skills to match their economic prowess.

China hasn't shown me the level of technological innovation necessary for me to take them as a real threat on that front. Most everything they do is a copy of someone else's tech.
Their production is shoddy, I know of that first had and from Quality Control friends that always have to go over there to get them to actually make things to spec.

To be sure their military focus is on the right foe for them as China. The US is in their backyard and support Taiwan. Their effort is to make the whole Pacific Rim their "Sphere of Influence" the only way to do that is to be able to take on the USN with a legitimate threat. I don't fault them for that, nations do what nations have to do for their own best interests.

It will be interesting to see how China emerges as a real World Power in every sense, Political, Militarily, and Economically.

I'm not an "America's Best" kinda of person but in military assets, ie; Bases, weapon systems, command and control, training, combat testedness ect...... I'd pretty much take the US over pretty much everyone. No offense to the UK and other NATO allies and Israel. It's not chest thumping, it's hard data pulled from the last 20 to 30 years.

a reply to: pavil

I'll agree with the US first and it's so obvious and self evident in the world today......I don't accept it by that alone, at face value.

We're TOO far above everyone else. By that I mean, we're far enough to where no intelligent nation would attempt a tail chase to catch us in techno wizardry. The Soviets attempted that, and look where they ended in 1989. Not pretty...and we barely glanced back to notice.

So..it is with real misgivings I gaze upon the world we see and realize, no one in this world seems to have ability to challenge or..OR IS EVEN TRYING TO GAIN IT. Which is really the point i stop cold on and get a little chill from. History shows as sure as the sky is blue, that last sentiment is impossible unless human nature just changed to bow to American might ..and fat chance that's happened, eh?

So..when we see nothing capable of challenging us ..but know by nature and history those who are rivals to our power DO want to achieve that very thing ..I can't help but say to myself 'It's quiet out there .... TOO quiet..'

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

North Korea does that too. We do that. I'm sure even though its a real problem to destroy deep underground bunkers. We are working hard at ways to do just that. Who knows maybe we've found a way to cook them alive using directed energy way deep down there in them bunkers. Maybe in a bunker is the worst place to be now a days. Let them build bunkers its a trap. That could be a real possibility too. You don't always need bombs to destroy something. Doesn't help if you can't deploy you weapons either by having them all holed up in some deep bunker.

Besides it's not like we don't have similar things too. It's not like we are going "what are these deep bunker things of which you speak of? We've never heard of anyone doing anything like that."

And the millions and millions of troops. Like I said we have a new weed wacker coming out that they won't be able to stop easily that will take out ground troops wholesale.

originally posted by: Wrabbit2000
a reply to: pavil
So..it is with real misgivings I gaze upon the world we see and realize, no one in this world seems to have ability to challenge or..OR IS EVEN TRYING TO GAIN IT. Which is really the point i stop cold on and get a little chill from. History shows as sure as the sky is blue, that last sentiment is impossible unless human nature just changed to bow to American might ..and fat chance that's happened, eh?

So..when we see nothing capable of challenging us ..but know by nature and history those who are rivals to our power DO want to achieve that very thing ..I can't help but say to myself 'It's quiet out there .... TOO quiet..'

I agree a state of complacency is never a good thing. For example, without a threat to the MIA2, where is the need to develop next Gen of Tanks? Same for Aircraft or our Carriers for that matter. And that's just the Military side of Complacency.

Hopefully we are always on the lookout for ways for our Military to be defeated or else you end up like the French at the Maginot Line.

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: MALBOSIA
Chinese cannot think on their own. To teach them to do so would be to erase thousands of years of red and gold. They need a program to follow which is why they can never lead. Sometimes logic can't figure out what your gut can.

They need to start kicking their kids out of the house at 18.

What a very narrow minded xenophobic generalization of 1.3 billion people.

Thats like saying all Americans are dumb hill billies with only guns for brains and know nothing of the outside world.

It was not meant to be rude, it was an observation. I am a minority living around majority Chinese . Married to one too. They are very good at following programs. better than most. But original ideas is not their strong point. They learned modern capitalism from westerners, they did not develop their own economy. They were exploited.

a reply to: johnb

Actually america is probably more vulnerable than any other nation due to its reliance on technology.

That is a lesson that we're going to be relearning all too soon, I fear. Had to learn it the hard way in Vietnam. Forgot it, and are relearning it in the deserts and mountains of the ME, again.

I'm sure there are folks a whole lot smarter than I am studying this problem. ...and make no mistake, it's a very real problem now, not in some nebulous future.

Tech is all very well and good, but it's the troops on the ground, and in the air, that matter. We'll forget that to our cost, if we're not careful.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

With all due respect..We don't have anything (publicly known on any level, anyway) to remotely match what China seems to have and is aiming to make. In fairness, it isn't because China is somehow super-special in digging or the ability to innovate new ways of doing it. It's simply that we haven't made it a true national priority to bury our defense and offense capabilities as a primary defense strategy. We went that way in some ways during the Cold War (Omaha and Cheyenne Mountain come to mind as two examples) and for all I know, we did and DO have entire bases underground...tho I've never bought into that whole theory myself. Not to that extent anyway. (Do they just shoot everyone in the head at the end of their contract or is that the one example where secrecy is 100% effective, for instance?)

China on the other hand...IS making digging a national and societal priority. I've written articles about their plans to tunnel through and under Kasmir. Not simply a few tunnels to augment the high pass route that exists now ...but UNDER for a high speed link out to the new Chinese Naval Facilities at Gwadar, Pakistan. That isn't simply making a tunnel..that is changing geography as the world has known it to date if you look at an Asian relief map to full take in what that will mean and change when complete.

Likewise, China has their planning for a tunnel to close the circle around their little bay, East of Beijing to form the largest metro commercial zone on Earth. (Their stated goal for that, actually) as well as planning for tunneling across to North Korea (in what on rough maps looks like Industrial free trade zone the North/South share at the DMZ if I had to guess) as well as branching out in other ..far more ambitious directions.

Add to that, they are working to reopen their land border crossing into Afghanistan for actual commercial use for the first time in something like forever with modern times ..and a picture forms.

China is after China's best interests and heck with us or anyone else unless we get in the way.