B2 Bomber to get massive upgrade

originally posted by: boomer135

originally posted by: JimTSpock
The cold war thinking for the B-2 Spirit was probably after it launches it's nuclear payload communications are not important, it just flies back to base.

I was waiting for someone to say that. What difference does it make if it can't communicate after dropping its bombs? It will have two nukes it drops on primary and secondary targets.

B-61 bomb is about 700 lbs.

B-2A payload is about 40,000 lbs. That's bunch more than 2 weapons.

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Think about this:

Who uses VLF?

Submarines and TACAMO transmitting to them

Why is VLF used?

Because long wavelengths penetrate and propagate long distances, but carry low bandwidth.

Why would you need to only receive?

Because transmitting gives away a position of a stealth platform like a sub or B-2, and it may be technologically infeasible to transmit without a very large antenna system which increases detection cross section.

en.wikipedia.org...

Transmitting would occur on an entirely different channel/frequency/system.

Maybe sometimes it's better to listen...

Maybe they aren't listening to something, but listening for something.

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Maybe sometimes it's better to listen...

Maybe they aren't listening to something, but listening for something.

Detection and Imaging of Underground Structures by Exploiting ELF/VLF radiowaves

sincedutch.files.wordpress.com...

A B-2 doesn't seem like the right platform for this though.

And of course power-line analytics for detection & characterization of, ahem, clandestine rotating machinery.

a reply to: mbkennel

And we have a winner! Without being able to communicate, the B-2 has to do its own hunting.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I knew he'd get it with a little nudge...

originally posted by: amkia
Sounds more like «REVEALING» the capabilities of this 30 years old ugly bird rather than «UPGRADING» as the military technologies are always half a century ahead of public knowledge.

Wow I did not know that there were strategic nuclear bombers in WWI. Seriously though.

a reply to: Vovin

You mean, WWII...?

a reply to: Vovin

Bit hard to nuke something when nukes weren't invented yet lol

Sorry I meant that it will have a primary and secondary target, not just two nukes. Worded that wrong.

originally posted by: B2StealthBomber
a reply to: Vovin

Bit hard to nuke something when nukes weren't invented yet lol

And that's the point of my post in response to this claim: "military technologies are always half a century ahead of public knowledge".

I absolutely detest this statement when people make it because it has no logic to it, nor do these people have any evidence to support it. But I'm really not trying to derail the thread (my original post was impulsive) so I'll leave it at that.

a reply to: Vovin

Now they probably are, back then they weren't, the manhattan project was huge and had many leaks, they've gotten better at hiding though that's for sure.

originally posted by: B2StealthBomber
a reply to: Vovin

Now they probably are, back then they weren't, the manhattan project was huge and had many leaks, they've gotten better at hiding though that's for sure.

While I don't think we are 50 years ahead yet the US definitely can get there with the lessons learned with current programs. If they can hide a program from concept to retirement now and can keep that trend going, there's no telling how far we can get. That is as long as the R&D money keeps flowing into them.
Maybe in 50 years we'll be 100 years ahead?

a reply to: Zaphod58

What I don't get is why all of this specific intel is open and available. I remember when our B2 fleet was groung and in the news. Why is that not helpful.

a reply to: whywhynot

It's not a big deal that they're getting a VLF antenna, and most people will buy the reason they're giving. I haven't seen anyone else stop and go, "what?" yet.

a reply to: Zaphod58

Well I didn't, until somebody said to lol

Well the real reason they are getting the VLF is a stop gap measure until the MUOS is online. Its five satellites and four ground stations that will eventually get rid of the VLF reliance if I remember correctly.

Cant wait to see it.

Lots of derailing going on here! :-)

If you were to pick up on the good points raised and suggested you would see the wood through the trees!

- The original B2 mission purpose was to deliver it's nuclear weapons and return to base undetected following receipt of it's targeting data from various methods including EAM via VLF.

- The designers would have known that a VLF receiver would be required to receive EAM until weapons are released but after weapons release there is no need for EAM messages to be received as all bombs would have been dropped on primary and secondary target.

- Therefore this new requirement which is apparently to allow the B2 to receive VLF after weapons release is nonsense. The real reason may be that the mission profile has changed to require the 'hunting' of VLF transmissions from a low observable platform before targeting the source with strategic weapons. They might be retasking the B2 from a pre-designated target strike platform to a dynamic mission hunter/killer.

Just thought a quick summary might help

Cheers
Rob

a reply to: stratsys-sws

Your on the right track that's for sure, I think once ICBM's start flying it's game over anyway and I don't think there will be enough B2's to bomb all the sites at launch.

I watch a documentary about the guys down at the missile sites, one of them said that if they ever gave the order to launch a nuclear ICBM his life would then be measured in minutes.