THOUSANDS of MILES on just ONE TANK of GAS...WELL ATS...

a reply to: Grimpachi

I watched the video...I can say that is pretty cool, but highly impractical for everyday use. 1 passenger and a vehicle that is basically a motorcycle.

I do like the design though. I wonder if one could use that as a motorcycle type vehicle with a few modifications? Seems very likely.

a reply to: bbracken677

A few more videos in and there is a video of the SGT01 from wikispeed that one is a two seater and if you go to their site they originally designed a 4 seater to get 100mpg. I am just saying if a small group of guys working on a shoestring budget compared to the major manufacturers can design a road certified 5 star crash rated vehicle that can get 100MPG then I think there is something seriously wrong with the multi-billion dollar car industry to where they offer vehicles with milage below 50 and expect that to be good.

BTW their plans are to offer a vehicle very soon in the 17 range with a goal of offering one at under 10K. The car seems kinda rough ATM but they are working with limited materials and I think the most expensive piece of machinery is a cnc. Overall what they have done is very impressive for being a garage based company. (they may have expanded more now)

a reply to: Treespeaker

Actually all you need to do is shut off the fuel injection relay. I really hope to get my Jeep to do this. But here is a video of I believe a 2006 Buick Rendezvous running on the vapors. Guy claims 100+mpg on one test then redesigns and claims 200+ mpg. Guy says he is getting followed by unmarked, tinted etc... Says they been messing with his jeep that he has set up to do the same.

Enjoy!

a reply to: supergravity

What you would need is a butterfly valve on the out port hose or tube leading from the tank to the air intake. A simple cable leading to the accelerator or if you knew what you were doing directly to the throttle body. Cheers here is someone talking about your exact problem here

a reply to: alomaha

Mind giving a review of the video I mean just posting a video without any information or opinion on it would be against t&c right.

a reply to: bbracken677

And just what is the second law of thermodynamics for those not smart enough to understand you. I love a good argument. And btw comment on a previous post, liquid gasoline never burns brother its the vapors, always the vapors. You said something about fuel injectors misting...misting is a waste of gas I am talking about totally vaporizing the gas. People have been shot and killed over this stuff, the internet is just too big for people to keep up.

a reply to: supergravity

I would also look into ultrasonic transducers lots of interesting things those things can do.

originally posted by: Grimpachi

originally posted by: nrd101
the evidence is who is making these videos, but I am becoming attuned to them. I think 200 mpg is possible in the near future, but with technology not fumes.

You are a little behind the times there, but that is because there are those out there that do not want you to know.

VW is already selling a car that gets 200-300mpg, but is banned in the good ole USA. They will not even let them bring one over to show off.

200 to 300 Miles Per Gallon for a car is to good to import to America ?

Murica!!

False. Maybe you want to actually research before posting garbage. The car does not meet US safety standards. If they were to alter the car to meet them, it would no longer be high MPG. It attains high MPG by sacrificing safety.

a reply to: dlbott



This guys only problem is that he did not add a butterfly valve. Cheers homie I was going to post about VW already having a car that gets 200+...but its too good for AMERICA.

a reply to: bbracken677

Not one person on this page has claimed anything close to 1000mpg. I did however claim thousands of miles to the TANK. Know if you could confirm your accusations with proof???

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: Grimpachi

originally posted by: nrd101
the evidence is who is making these videos, but I am becoming attuned to them. I think 200 mpg is possible in the near future, but with technology not fumes.

You are a little behind the times there, but that is because there are those out there that do not want you to know.

VW is already selling a car that gets 200-300mpg, but is banned in the good ole USA. They will not even let them bring one over to show off.

200 to 300 Miles Per Gallon for a car is to good to import to America ?

Murica!!

False. Maybe you want to actually research before posting garbage. The car does not meet US safety standards. If they were to alter the car to meet them, it would no longer be high MPG. It attains high MPG by sacrificing safety.

Maybe you could read the responses before posting unless your goal is simply to repeat what others said. I thanked the person who provided info disputing what was in the other article, but I don't thank those who just parrot what others say almost verbatim.

It isn't that they cant alter the vehicle and still maintain that gas milage it just doesn't make sense to redesign the vehicle for American or german markets when they only planned to produce a limited quantity. That information was in the link to the article disputing the link I provided.

100 MPG is doable with high safety ratings which Wikispeed has already proven.

For all the doubters out there, why not just make one and try it yourself???? I mean all you're talking about is basically making a bong for your (car, mower, etc.) to pull the fuel vapor rather than the liquid. Should take you all of about 1 hr. to do it yourself and that would include time needed for any safety valves or whatever you wanted to include. My advice is start simple like your mower. Don't start off with your Wife's new BMW.

Then you'll know for sure.

originally posted by: Grimpachi

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: Grimpachi

originally posted by: nrd101
the evidence is who is making these videos, but I am becoming attuned to them. I think 200 mpg is possible in the near future, but with technology not fumes.

You are a little behind the times there, but that is because there are those out there that do not want you to know.

VW is already selling a car that gets 200-300mpg, but is banned in the good ole USA. They will not even let them bring one over to show off.

200 to 300 Miles Per Gallon for a car is to good to import to America ?

Murica!!

False. Maybe you want to actually research before posting garbage. The car does not meet US safety standards. If they were to alter the car to meet them, it would no longer be high MPG. It attains high MPG by sacrificing safety.

Maybe you could read the responses before posting unless your goal is simply to repeat what others said. I thanked the person who provided info disputing what was in the other article, but I don't thank those who just parrot what others say almost verbatim.

It isn't that they cant alter the vehicle and still maintain that gas milage it just doesn't make sense to redesign the vehicle for American or german markets when they only planned to produce a limited quantity. That information was in the link to the article disputing the link I provided.

100 MPG is doable with high safety ratings which Wikispeed has already proven.

I did not parrot anything, I just know facts.

I went to the website, the car does not exist.

At the 2011 Detroit Auto Show, we finally saw that car. It’s called the Wikispeed SGT01, a racing prototype that was displayed at Cobb Hall in body/chassis/interior/suspension form. The car didn’t have a powertrain on it so we can easily figure out just how far the project needs to go to become production ready.

www.topspeed.com...

When the car is done it can be revisited, right now, it does not exist. It looks like something to keep an eye out for though. Although part of the MPG is due to the "muscle" of the car being pretty weak. It's usually a mainstay of high MPG cars .. small engines, very low HP.

Edit, covered.

Line 2

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Doesn't exist. Hmm.. I wonder what he is driving. 0-60 in 5 seconds it may not be a crazy sportscar but a top speed of 149MPH with a combined MPG of 109 (US EPA cycle simulation) which is the same system use for MSRP stickers on new cars.

on.aol.com...

All of that with a cnc machine and 3 D printer as some of the mainstays to produce. Actually they have sold a few cars and have a novel approach to designing the guts of the vehicle. Your link looks like it is from 2012 if so they have come a long way. Here is their website.wikispeed.org...

I spent a few hours watching youtube vids today or at least listening to them give various lectures on the design and how they have progressed. It is worth listening to just to understand how they have gone about the design. If something down the road is worth upgrading it could easily be done.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Can't listen to videos here. From their website, some pieces of note ..

This is how they achieve some of that performance.

They are road legal, but comfort and convenience stop there. Developed for the ultimate in speed and efficiency, they skip every amenity except a smartphone dock in the dash panel.

Maybe they can, and it's a logical assumption, but right now its a 70mpg car on it's very best run.
[exWe have tested the car internally, while campaigning in the Progressive Insurance Automotive X Prize, and with Roush Industries where it scored 69.01 highway on it’s best run

Definitely impressive.

It’s the lightest car ever to achieve a five-star equivalency rating for front, side, and rear-impact tests.

This part is worrying.

We have built to NHTSA and IIHS specifications and prepare for official test and rankings. The car has been impact tested at CAPE in Indiana, where the driver’s seat broke loose, allowing us to discover faulty MIG weld seams. The seat mounts have been replaced by bolt-in plates, and we are iterating to replace all welded joins with bolt-in gusset plates. The car has a driver’s air bag option but does not yet have an airbag sensor strategy and airbag computer.

So it has not been officially tested yet.

Overall it's impressive but some of their claims have not been achieved. One thing that would improve MPG would be dimpling. Why no car has this I will never understand.

originally posted by: bbracken677
a reply to: eso322

So...we have a vehicle that has a gas pump, that then pumps the gas to fuel injectors that atomize the gas into a mist....and if your injectors aren't doing that correctly the engine either will run poorly, or will not run at all.

And running bubbles through the gas before the injectors is going to produce a much more efficient delivery of power?

ummm..*cough, cough* BS.

P.T. Barnum had it right....

I think you answered your own question.

A fine mist produced from modern injectors is not the same as a vapour.

Like comparing rain to fog.

I'd imagine the extra efficiency is in the size of the droplet..a fine mist has a larger droplet size of fuel than a heavy fuel vapour.

As we all know, a fuel vapour is much more explosive and more easily combustable than an entire can full of liquid fuel.

The reason for this extra volatility is a higher oxygen to fuel mix ratio, the more oxygen surrounding the hydrocarbon to be burnt, the higher the volatility and the easier and more readily explosive the mixture.

Same as with natural gas during a gas leak for example...a concentration of 80% natural gas in air has less of a chance of explosion, than 20% natural gas in air does. In fact, the extra oxygen and lower natural gas figures mean the lower gas / higher oxygen mix is FAR more explosive and volatile than the other.

This seems to be what is happening with this guys fuel vapour technique. Turn the gas into a vapour, allows a high volatility of the mix and makes it more explosive...more power for much less fuel essentially.

originally posted by: teslahowitzer
one thing you cannot do is fake physics, for an internal combustion engine to produce power at the levels it is designed for, you must run approx 14:1 air fuel ratio, there is no faking this with this design, and if progress is made to the level of 100+ MPG on gasoline alone, design changes must be made to the engine itself, or a level of combustability, equal to this 14:1 ratio.

Honda has engines that run 23:1 and even leaner.

One of my uncles helped develop solid fuel rockets, did engineering at Bose labs and quite a few projects for DARPA. He just recently passed away and I had a look over his list of patents and it was in the hundreds, he was an amazing man. The last time we talked about engineering-nerd stuff he was working on ceramic engines for the military that had the potential to run at 50:1


Most of this you-tube science is BS, but there are a few people out there over the years who have made some amazing machines. Smokey Yunnick is one of them. He was a massive mind in the world of racing, always coming up with clever new ways to chea...ahem, innovate in Nascar. He designed soft movable barriers for Nascar tracks in the 60's before deciding to walk away from Nascar because of the politics and careless attitude toward safety. Fast forward to 2005 and Nascar finally implemented a movable barrier instead of racing next to concrete walls..

During the late 70's Smokey started developing the adiabatic engine concept which focused on getting the fuel charge to be truly a vapor when ingested (as opposed to the tiny droplets that fuel injectors spray).

50 years later we are finally getting close with highly stratified injection techniques, but by the 80's Smokey had a 250hp Fiero that was getting 51mpg.

Toward the end of his life he was working with some oil companies and I wonder if they didn't hire him as an engineer or consultant just to take his time away from his personal interest with the adiabatic engine...

I think ATS needs to pool resources and build one of these cars. Sure do got a lot of brains. I personally was going to do it on one of my old push mowers but my armature coil is bad and have to wait till pay day to get another one. But when I do I will be eliminating the blade and fitting it to an alternator and a battery grid connecting to a converter. Cant wait to dive into this waste deep. I can ramble brother, that's just who I am, love me hate me IDGAF.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Maybe they can, and it's a logical assumption, but right now its a 70mpg car on it's very best run.
[exWe have tested the car internally, while campaigning in the Progressive Insurance Automotive X Prize, and with Roush Industries where it scored 69.01 highway on it’s best run

That was at the competition here is the rest of it.

We have tested the car internally, while campaigning in the Progressive Insurance Automotive X Prize, and with Roush Industries where it scored 69.01 highway on it’s best run before we found the wheels were dragging on the dynamometer and their dynamometer fan was not blowing on our cooling system, meaning we are confident we can score much higher.

One thing that would improve MPG would be dimpling. Why no car has this I will never understand.

I think it is easy to understand. It is ugly.

I think you are missing the whole point which is they are a non-profit company on a shoestring budget that have achieved better results than major manufacturers. I have already said my piece on that in previous posts.

They are a licensed manufacturer which I have listened to videos talking about the hoops they have gone through. To poo poo a company because they have yet to sacrifice several cars in actual crash tests is ignoring the realities of start-ups such as these. In fact, they have achieved better speeds and milage however you can't watch the videos ATM. When you can you should go to their youtube channel. They have achieved so much with so little yet major manufacturers think we should jump for joy if a car gets over 40MPG on the highway.

When these guys start offering kits for 10K I may buy a new toy. After watching how they are designed and thought out it looks far simpler than replacing the trainey on my 4X4 truck.

I expect this company to take off and if they branch into manufacturing quantity and trading shares I will probably invest. ATM they are still developing and fine tuning the car. Most of the specs are open source.