Gas prices!!! and Enbridge Northern Gateway

Dumb question here but...

Why the hell are we paying a buck and a half for a liter of gas when we've got the Alberta tar sands and the green light to sell our oil to China ??

Something doesn't compute. Where are Canadians getting their oil from? Since the ISIS have created havoc in the middle east gas prices have shot up. But we've got oil here (derpy face). I just don't get it...

a reply to: FlySolo

Good luck trying to compute the prices of gas/fuel! Here in America we are getting our own effing oil from the ground and we are paying damn near close to $4 a gallon everywhere around me!! Just insanity, I want to choke someone every time I fill up my tank!

a reply to: FlySolo

it's a SCAM. any excuse to raise the price, it doesn't matter if whatever happens, happens to our sources or not the price goes up. when you think of all the gas stocks in North America, any price hike should not even hit for months, but they make more profit when they sell gas based on the new high price and not on what they actually paid for it.

a reply to: FlySolo

Speculators, money manipulators, wall street, NAFTA. ......

Our gas prices are stupidly high for an oil/gas producing country.
Even our home heating natural gas doubles in price in the winter months when we need it most.

We need more refineries too. My husband drives truck, natural gas products, and about once every month or two, the co-ops where the big trucks fill up, run out of gas, and they get stuck waiting for a day.

Another silly thing is, they're producing so much product right now, that there aren't enough trucks to keep up.
I think they're boosting production of all (oil, gas, natural gas) for the next few months..

and the prices just keep going up up up......

This is what I figure the gas prices are based on.

"hhmmmm, I need a new, mansion, boat, island."
"Oh look, something going on in the middle east, a perfect excuse to raise prices"


And for some reason, here in MI, we've been gouged more than the other states lately.

a reply to: FlySolo
To my knowledge it has nothing to do with how much oil there is, or where it comes from. For example, OPEC met a few years ago to set the price of oil at $80/barrel, and that price is fixed no matter what happens until the next OPEC meeting. (You might recall this was in the news because several of the OPEC members wanted to drive up the price in an attempt at economic warfare on the west).

The reason for both the fluctuations, and the prices being so high, is speculators. This is also why the prices go up seasonally during traditionally high vacation months. Nothing more then the rich wanting their cut of your vacation dollar every year.

originally posted by: FlySolo
Dumb question here but...

Why the hell are we paying a buck and a half for a liter of gas when we've got the Alberta tar sands and the green light to sell our oil to China ??

I think you ought to check out Dan McTeague's website "Tomorrow's Gas Price Today". He pretty much lays it out, and I know him personally as a stand-up guy.

tomorrowsgaspricetoday.com...

a reply to: defcon5

Well here's a load of crap explanation.
ca.news.yahoo.com...

Canada imports 40% of our crude....but then we pump our own out of the ground and ship it to China? That's like borrowing from peter to pay paul. SMH. Something is really messed up in the oil cartel business.

People saying, "scam" are ignorant, plain and simple. The price must stay high in order to make it worth the capital investment to keep supply steady. It's lower in the west than the east, because we're not willing to pay for it over ~120 a barrel. At that price, people start using substantially less, which translates into a decline in GDP growth, ie recession.

It's mostly a way we've set up our infrastructure. It wasn't meant for triple digit prices per barrel, and yet it's an absolute necessity post peak crude. The major energy companies have invested 2.5T, that's trillion, in capital to keep the supply so high, since 2005. That's less than a decade.

The EROI is very, very low for those tar sands. You shouldn't expect cheaper prices from it. It's just playing a small role in keeping the supply from declining, but in reality that already happened if you take into consideration NET energy to the economy, and what truly constitutes oil, vs what's being lumped into the category.

To put it bluntly, there is so little left of easy sweet crude, that in order to keep the economy from heading back into a recession, the price of oil needs to be between about $110-125. Too high and people consume much less. Too low and investment slows, inevitably causing a spike over $125. Very tricky, and essentially unsustainable situation, though the current policies make way for a somewhat gradual decline, and shift of energy from the west to east. This isn't conspiracy, it's economics.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Sure, but wouldn't lower prices = more spending? If we can't afford bread after we fill the tank, then how is that sustainable?

Haha I thought $4/ gallon was bad but that was before I realised that there are 3.785 litres to a gallon and we're paying 1.9USD/L in NZ, so over 7 USD/ gallon and then I laughcried

Reply to: FlySolo

It is because the koch brothers own 80% of fhe tar sands. Its not canadians that own that oil it is the american billionares that do therefore we get no say in our gas prices.

We should be mad at the fact that canada is being bought and sold to the highest bidder.. Thats what happens when you vote harper and his conservatives into power.

As long as we have I know you can dance, America's got talent, Kardashian's marriage, Lindsay Lohan's DUI scandals, other celebrities half naked pictures, the sales of their huge properties and the amount of money they make...etc, etc, etc no one is going to ask the question of who is profiting from the high gas prices, why the price goes up and who is running the whole speculation. What luck for rulers that masses don't think

Its a bear market. We are charged the maximum we van bear. Thats the cost of being number 1 in the G8 i guess.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Ok well why is gas so much cheaper in the usa? I live in canada right along the boarder, if I travell five mins and cross the border i can get gas at almost half the price that i would here in canada..

Your theory only makes sence if everyone on the planet was charged the same price for fuel. Even when canadas dollar is worth more then the states dollar we still pay 2-3 times the amount for gas the americans.

To solve this problem the world needs to back away from using USD as the global currency. That is the only way to make tbings fair and even as americans would be for ed to pay the same levies and surcharges as the rest of the world.

a reply to: FlySolo

Of course it would... for a short period of time. Then, after the lack of investment due to projections of sustained, lower prices, it would spike, and you'd be even more scrooged.

It's not. You have to change your lifestyle to adapt. There's no easy way out of this one.

a reply to: snypwsd

When you say "gas" are you referring to natural gas, or petroleum gas? If the latter, that would be taxes, but ultimately you're right, it's because we have the dominant military power to enforce the petrodollar. We are able to keep prices lower (less tax), due to a stronger dollar, due to it's reserve status.

This is a good video. It makes a good case for supply driven economics being the most apt model to consider at this stage of the game:

originally posted by: snypwsd
a reply to: pl3bscheese

Ok well why is gas so much cheaper in the usa? I live in canada right along the boarder, if I travell five mins and cross the border i can get gas at almost half the price that i would here in canada..

Your theory only makes sence if everyone on the planet was charged the same price for fuel. Even when canadas dollar is worth more then the states dollar we still pay 2-3 times the amount for gas the americans.

To solve this problem the world needs to back away from using USD as the global currency. That is the only way to make tbings fair and even as americans would be for ed to pay the same levies and surcharges as the rest of the world.

Your beer costs twice as much to.
It's called taxes. That's prolly how they pay for your free healthcare.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Then, after the lack of investment due to projections of sustained, lower prices, it would spike, and you'd be even more scrooged.

So what you're saying is, it's perpetual bullcrap. Raise prices to attract investors to raise prices again. Na na na, somethings got to change.

a reply to: FlySolo

I'm saying the EROI has declines from about 100:1 to perhaps 12:1 in the last 80 or so years. We were at ~30:1 when the first energy crisis hit in the 70's. That something which needs to change is a new energy source being implemented that provides a higher EROI.

Until we find and transition to that, it's the same story, with progressively worse chapters.

My two outs are thorium, and H3. I like thorium, because there's little R & D, and we already have a lot of plants that could be fitted for it with minimal capital. I like H3 because it helps to develop tech which will one day push our species off this rock, which has more problems coming our way than mere energy decline.

actually...you guys don't know how good you have it...


2$ per liter here...and it's been that way for the last 10 years I think....