Women, Not Students, Are The Target Of Most Gun Murder

I found this in an article at Alternet and it taught me something new about gun violence that I didn't know. It is part of a larger article on the subject but I didn't want to muddy the water with other issues as I found the statistics cited (with links to sources) very distrubing.

As headline-grabbing as school shootings are, the under-reported daily target and toll from gun violence involves women. More American women have been murdered by their intimate partners using guns since 2001 (6,410) than U.S. troops have been killed in combat (5,315) in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars , the Center for American Progress reports. Guns are involved in at least 34 percent of all murders of women commited by their partners, an average of five a day , CAP found from crime statistics.

www.www.alternet.org...

And this just lists the deaths - I wonder about the horrible non-lethal shootings as well.

The Center for American Progress, refered to above. lists it's recommendations for remedies to this frightening trend:

Bar all convicted abusers, stalkers, and people subject to domestic violence restraining orders from gun possession.


Provide all records of prohibited abusers to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System, or NICS.

Require a background check for all gun sales.

Provide law enforcement with the tools necessary to ensure that domestic abusers surrender guns in their possession.

americanprogress.org...

I have trouble imagining how the fourth recommendation could be actualized, but it is worth thinking about.

I know that a lot of violence towards women is drug and alcohol fueled (most crime of all types). These suggestions about KNOWN abusers could save a lot of people. Partner abuse is personal and these people probably are not as dangerous to the public at large but it is time to stop turning a blind eye to domestic violence. Domestic violence of all types costs our society in ways that are not easily quantified. Poverty, Substance Abuse, Health Care, Ecomonic Loss... Across the board, it needs to be address - and it's getting worse as people become more afraid for their survial in these austerity times.

Here are the things you are about to hear.

1. Why you tryna take our guns or limit my second amendment right..even though you never mention taking them or limiting them.

2. They will bring stats of a different nature in attempt to change the OP from Guns violence against women to something else against women..cuz they hate facts about guns.

3. Someone without a doubt will mention well did the gun just get up and shoot itself...because those are type of small minds these gun threads bring...not too bright, so they are bound to mention something idiotic.

And whatever else they can talk about...everything is open except guns..don't mention guns kills..etc...they hate that..

Your OP was interesting but alas..now they will talk about everything but the topic.

Usually that tends to happen to people when they get caught cheating .. the only difference is the method used in different parts of the world. Human nature ..

a reply to: FyreByrd

As headline-grabbing as school shootings are, the under-reported daily target and toll from gun violence involves women.

Whats more under-reported is the fact that the majority of gun related violence occurs in lower income urban environments. But the media doesnt want you to focus on the fact that cities with the strictest gun laws experience the most "gun" crime, that doesnt fit the gun grabbing agenda.

...the overwhelming majority of people who die in gun-related homicides are not murdered by crazed strangers in schools, malls, and movie theaters. Most of the nonsuicide gun deaths in this country happen in densely populated, lower-income urban environments like New Orleans, Detroit, and Washington, D.C.

Source

Furthermore, whats the point of demonizing poor, urban minorities? They dont really present a problem for the establishment. Its the "White, Christian male", "prepper" or "sovereign citizen" which the establishment fears, people who object to government "tyranny" or a "police state".

With regards to women being victims of violence, the only prudent, thoughtful, caring and loving thing to do is to ensure that they (being the weaker sex) are capable of protecting themselves.

edit on 21-6-2014 by gladtobehere because: wording

a reply to: FyreByrd



How many of those deaths were a result of illegally obtained weapons?

a reply to: FyreByrd

Good post. Would world studies show that murder happens regardless of weapons available and should we focus on murder or the weapon?

how many of these shooters were on anti depressants?

Should we call it gun violence or human violence? I was actually surprise that only 34% were gun related, one would think if person really wanted to kill they would get the best tool, but as always the good old hand and random blunt weapon wins out over guns every time.

We also never quite understand the pool of people in each mix...do we really want to go down the path of comparing 100k people, with maybe less than 1/2 of them in the more dangerous areas, to the violence of 315 million?

originally posted by: gladtobehere

Whats more under-reported is the fact that the majority of gun related violence occurs in lower income urban environments. But the media doesnt want you to focus on the fact that cities with the strictest gun laws experience the most "gun" crime, that doesnt fit the gun grabbing agenda.

This is an inaccurate and unsupported statement that you are stating as fact.

From the original article referenced:

States With The Laxest Gun Laws Have The Most Violence. America has so many guns that not a week goes by without something stupid or deadly occurring. It’s easy to smirk at the Virginia man who shot his penis while strapping on a holster. It’s more serious as federal airport screeners report that states with the fewest gun controls see the most people “forgetting” they’re carrying a gun as try to board planes. It gets deadly when a gun owner takes the law into his own hands and sets up an ambush in his home killing the young intruder—as happened in Montana. Study after study finds that states with the laxest gun laws have the most gun-related violence—including murder .

Here is a link to mutliple reports: www.bradycampaign.org...

With regards to women being victims of violence, the only prudent, thoughtful, caring and loving thing to do is to ensure that they (being the weaker sex) are capable of protecting themselves.

That's your solution - more violence - more guns. When the only tool you have is a gun - that is the only solution that you will think of.

There are many non-violent tools that can be used to defuse tense situations.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: FyreByrd



How many of those deaths were a result of illegally obtained weapons?

While I agree that illegally obtained weapons are an ongoing problem, I do think that reducing the number of weapons in society would help that situation as well.

But that is just a general opinion of mine. And your question is distracting from the actual subject of the thread - which was:

Domestic Gun Violence. Not legal vs illegal purchases of said guns.

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: FyreByrd



How many of those deaths were a result of illegally obtained weapons?

While I agree that illegally obtained weapons are an ongoing problem, I do think that reducing the number of weapons in society would help that situation as well.

But that is just a general opinion of mine. And your question is distracting from the actual subject of the thread - which was:

Domestic Gun Violence. Not legal vs illegal purchases of said guns.

Your solutions would only impact legally obtained firearms.

So I think my question is valid.

The law fails many women who report domestic violence.

Violent men don't just pop up overnight. There is normally a long pattern of aggressive behavior toward women that eventually culminates into homicide especially in the presence of alcohol induced aggression.

Instead of focusing on the gun part since a violent and angry man will find a way to harm these women regardless. Focus on catching the early signs and having more efficient means of dealing with abusive men.

This also means potential programs for the women themselves, especially if children are involved. By programs I mean that if a woman is being beat by a husband in front of kids, regardless of whether she wants to file charges there needs to be more efficient ways of putting her through care. Mostly putting her into a "detox" since many domestic abuse victims mental health can be likened to someone with stockholm syndrome.

Domestic abuse is something that changes even the strongest willed of people. To say "well she should just shoot him" means that the person stating such things has never seen the dynamics of these types of relationships. These men tend to be very controlling and very manipulative toward the women in their lives. When that falls apart or when they believe they are losing control the violence sometimes turns into homicide.

Creating more laws in regard to gun control does nothing to address the root causes of this type of violence toward women.

A gun is an expression of control, murder is the ultimate escalation of control. When the media primes you to believe you need to be in control your instinctual mind justifiably seeks out the most effective way to achieve this, buy a gun.

Fear, chaos and crISIS in the suburbs is a form of control justified by those who live in absolute, comfort, security and stability. It is meant to distract you. Just like the continuous streams of drugs, alcohol and consumer wants, verry effective in most of the Western World.

Every little girl wants one of these.
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a reply to: FyreByrd

Sounds to me like more women need to join the shooting sports (a traditionally male area) and become both proficient and confident in their abilities.

They may find they not only have a rip roaring good time in competitive or action shooting, but they'll know beyond question that the only way they'll ever go down alone is if they are physically separated from their means of defense.

I can say if my wife ever needed to defend herself against a male, even in her compromised physical condition these days? It would come down to training and endless hours she spent learning to make the actions instinctual and automatic. She may cry for an hour from the pain her hands suffer after just a few rounds...but I have no doubt in my mind, she'd never feel a bit of that while firing to save herself or others.

a reply to: FyreByrd

I know that a lot of violence towards women is drug and alcohol fueled (most crime of all types). These suggestions about KNOWN abusers could save a lot of people. Partner abuse is personal and these people probably are not as dangerous to the public at large but it is time to stop turning a blind eye to domestic violence. Domestic violence of all types costs our society in ways that are not easily quantified. Poverty, Substance Abuse, Health Care, Ecomonic Loss... Across the board, it needs to be address - and it's getting worse as people become more afraid for their survial in these austerity times.

A bit dated, but for comparison;

Between 1993 and 2007 the overall rate of murders of women fell 43%, from 4.18 to 2.38 homicides per 100,000 female U.S. residents.13

About 1/3 of female murder victims aged 12 or older are killed by an intimate partner, vs. roughly 3% of male victims


in 2007: Intimate partners committed 14% of all homicides in the U.S., killing an estimated 1,640 women and 700 men.


Intimate Partner Homicide

^^^ lots of data to see ^^^


The stats cited include many factors.

But the one lump sum seems to be alcohol & drugs.

Take away guns and perhaps the murders and injuries become "non-gun".

What kind of super-authoritarian measures would it take to eliminate this problem? Would there be "casualties" unrelated to the original intent?

Are "solutions" more like "mitigation" rather than genuine solutions?


one more question....

and it's getting worse as people become more afraid for their survial in these austerity times.

Are you suggesting spending more $$ will solve the problem?

Or are you relating more violence because of $$ scarcities in general? Scarcities like less wages less hours less jobs as well as individual and family financial losses?

So there you go...unless your gonna praise guns your not gonna get anywhere.

To them, the gun can solve any problem. Got a cold..get a gun..

Leave facts out of it. Make up imaginary scenarios as for the reason you need guns.

Never mention guns harm or kill..it's a big no no on here..

a reply to: Onslaught2996

When a man pulls a gun on you with intent to use it...you have two choices and only two choices.

#1. You can try and fit your prayers in before the shot comes....

#2. You can go down fighting like the hounds of hell themselves, and hope it's enough to kill them before you take fatal injury.

When it's a gun one faces ...a gun to see #2 is done is the best method with the highest success rate, IMO. Anything else is...second best in a contest of life and death. 2nd place isn't honorable in that situation. It's just..deceased.

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

That isn't the issue with domestic abuse victims.

Women who are strong and go to shooting ranges are not the ones who are being attacked and stalked.

Domestic violence victims have emotional and mental issues(sometimes as a result of the relationship but usually from childhood experiences).

The issue runs far deeper and isn't simply a case of "she needs to just defend herself".

The men in these relationships tend to start out very nice for the first six months to a year and then slowly ease their way into manipulation and abuse. The women also tend to be ones from similar households in their childhoods and so it's a nasty vicious cycle that their children will probably repeat as well. Also note that I am only including women in this explanation because the topic is about homicide of women by intimate partners. No doubt manipulative and abusive women exist as well, I am simply just addressing the group of the OP.

Level headed and strong women tend to be able to pick out the creeps(not always) and while those women can also fall into these types of relationships it's usually the women stated above.

Also sometimes it's a case of being with someone who gets into drugs and alcohol after the relationship has already been in full swing for a long time. Both of those substances can change a person's personality and level of aggression.

originally posted by: Onslaught2996
So there you go...unless your gonna praise guns your not gonna get anywhere.

To them, the gun can solve any problem. Got a cold..get a gun..

Leave facts out of it. Make up imaginary scenarios as for the reason you need guns.

Never mention guns harm or kill..it's a big no no on here..

I simply asked a question.

I think it's a valid question. Most are pretty much cemented in their positions on firearms.

There will be those that are for the 2nd Amendment and there will be those that try to weaken/negate the 2nd Amendment.

I would be greatly impressed by the post/thread that actually changed minds either one way or another.