Global Warming ? Not convinced.

Good that you brought creationism up two posts above...because your "logic" ('scuse me) seems to be similar.

So you say you don't believe in global warming, rejecting a scientific theory (which may well be incorrect)....but counter with an even more abstruse theory instead that climate change is produced by metal structures, buildings and exhausts/condensation from planes.

This is the same logic as denying science, saying that the theory of evolution is "not correct" and then counter with a 1000x more abstruse theory based on the bible or what a preacher tells you.

I have nothing against a constructive debate WHY perhaps the theory of man-made global warming/climate change may not be correct..but you'd have a HELL of a bad time selling me that weather is created by skyscrapers/lightning rods...in the same way as you'd have a VERY tough time making me accept what most creationists have to counter when they try to disprove the scientific method/evolution.

a reply to: Grimpachi

After Lois Lerner, I don't trust computers. PERIOD.

Dr. Franklin's lightning bells, and other active experimentation, is another matter..Just my opinion, however, the computer is only as good as the person running it, as my own typos proove..

learn.fi.edu...

a reply to: NoRulesAllowed

The religous point was a back at the scientists who, on one hand say, we can define something on 100 years of records, then turn around and say we don't have enough data at this time.
It's merely a time scale reference, don't go reading any more into it than that, you'll strain yourself...
Either Or people. NOT both. Make up your minds.

My logic is: computer models are as arcane to me as bats wing and eye of Newt soup...show me something by way of SOLID proof, not invisible electrons in somebody's Black Box of gadgets...

5 bucks says you can't...in responding to this post, you even referred back to a model..fact is nobody on earth was old enough to remember the weather 500 years ago..

Quite frankly, it just get old trying to convince people we're in trouble after so many threads. Life is short, and I'd like to enjoy it - talking to brick walls ain't doing it for me.

It won't matter anyway if they decide to believe in the truth or frolic in ignorance. Keep an eye on the calender, and remember we told you we're screwed, if you live to 2030.

a reply to: Greywolf13A

Im not gonna get a scientific here but will just say, ice ages, castastrophic floods, hurrincanes, earthquakes, years and years of darkness worldwide, volcanic eruptions, typhoons, tornados and monsoons, tsunamis and all else?

Its what the Earth does periodically over and over and over and over...

Do we honestly think people got together around a fire during the last ice age and grunted "Ugh! It getting cold! What happening?"

We need to realize it is getting warmer, colder, brighter, more windy, rainy etc...and it will keep doing that as long as there is an Earth.

We need to treat it as such: NORMAL.

originally posted by: amazing
Well stated thread op. I politely disagree with you on the basis that scientists are studying this and are taking into account all of the natural cycles going back as far as they can see. In some cases that is millions and billions of years or 100s of thousands of years, taking into account everything they can find since the earth was formed billions of years ago all they way up through the ice records and fossil records and sediment layers. All the sciences go into this from physics to astrophysics, to astronomy to geology...everything.

They then take this total view of everything and can see that man is having an effect outside of any of the natural cycles they have observed. They also take into account volcanic activity etc.

If there were only a handful of scientists, lets say a few hundred and only at certain universities, I may be more skeptical but it's thousands of reports, research articles and mountains of data and thousands of scientists and dozens if not hundreds of scientific organizations.

Global warming is happening. well we know that global temp records don't lie..they earth is warming, there is no debate on that.....man made global warming is happening. a theory like gravity but still pretty strong...almost as strong as the theory of gravity and you guys believe in that theory, yes? You can't cherry pick science, right?

Plenty of debate about what we can do, but we're, again pretty sure that we can have a big effect on mitigating some of this man made global warming and pollution. 2nd to that we have rising sea levels, drought and refugee situations that need to be addressed as well.

So still a big issue with lots of work left to do, what we can't do however is put our heads in the sand and pretend that there isn't a problem. We also can't let ourselves we brainwashed by propaganda.

Take a look at all of those reports..those thousands ...then read interviews with all of those climate scientists and really every scientist and see what they are really saying.

Build a Sphere 800 meters in diameter. EVERY LIVING HUMAN on Earth will fit in it. So all of you that believe our infinitesimal presence on the planet is changing the weather are smoking some serious dope. We may be polluting with chemicals, but having any effect on the climate is totally and completely absurd. It is the Sun that drives the weather and the idiot "climate scientists" used a constant factor for it not taking into account changes in Sunspot activity. We are headed into an ice age due to the lack of Sunspots and their protection of the Earth from cosmic rays which interact with moisture in the atmosphere to form clouds. The "scientists" like to be funded and the funding goes to those who say what the politicians want to hear.

a reply to: mysterioustranger

yee-up.
point-set-match..

a reply to: SubSea
yup.

a reply to: Greywolf13A

Got a few friends who live by a really pretty river. They get upset every year during flood season because their 1st level gets flooded out... "But...its so PRETTY here!"

Kinda like folks living in "tornado alley" or somewhere where there is a yearly hurricane season. "IT DOES THIS EVERY YEAR! ITS WHAT THE EARTH DOES!!!"

Climate change? Really....its normal in the scheme of things and the cycles of the Earth..........

a reply to: Greven



they said that about 1995....and 98....2000 was THE BIG ONE...then it was 2005...then 2010...frankly . after 52 years of false predictions I'm tired of it myself. when ya get some hard proof, come talk to me. So long as it's a mathematical equasion in a 'puter...no thanks, I'd rather to play in the traffic...it'd be safer.

a reply to: mysterioustranger

Got a cousin in Xenia Ohio who wontleave for love nor money....despite surviving twisters in '72, the 80's and 90's...Know RIGHT where you're commin' from..

I don't supposed any of you geniuses have noticed the massive increase in destructive and record setting weather in the last ten years? Species changing their ranges, flowers and plants are blooming weeks earlier in some places than they did a century or two ago.

Just the amount of concrete we've laid is enough to change the climate by itself (it soaks up sun releases heat at night), when you add all the deforestation, pollution, and heat from every motor and device on the planet it's moronic to think we have no effect.

originally posted by: CB328
I don't supposed any of you geniuses have noticed the massive increase in destructive and record setting weather in the last ten years? Species changing their ranges, flowers and plants are blooming weeks earlier in some places than they did a century or two ago.

Just the amount of concrete we've laid is enough to change the climate by itself (it soaks up sun releases heat at night), when you add all the deforestation, pollution, and heat from every motor and device on the planet it's moronic to think we have no effect.

Nope.....

haven't noticed because there's -zero- proof.

Therefore:

a reply to: CB328

like i said earlier...
no base line for comparison, theory, not fact.
show me tangible proof, you may convince me.

a reply to: CB328

never seems to trap heat come time to shovel snow...

The Earth goes thru changes...its how the world is formed...through changes. They are all natural reoccurring processes.

For us to think "Its getting COLDER man!"...or "Its gettin' HOTTER dude!" like its something special is crazy.

Its not. Its normal throughout the course of Mother Earths kabillion years of constant change.

Deal with it...its extreme, its constant, its ever changing, and will not stop.

Everyone know that weather is completely normal and have it's cycles, nothing weird in that.

What is not normal is deforestation, urbanization and clearing of land for agriculture and on top added co2 from human and natural causes.

Nature has been able to balance things out back in the days, but the changes above has offset that balance so that nature no longer absorbs the added co2.

It really isn't that complicated to understand, just look away from the TAX for a moment.

Her are 10 or so pages explaining some of those changes.

The Effect of Localized Man-Made Heat and Moisture Sources in Mesoscale Weather Modification

A couple of hard questions.

1. I believe in basically the same view as Neil D. Tyson on Cosmos. That is that we are causing Man Made Global Warming with our pollution and green house gasses and deforestation etc. This Global Warming trend is outside of any natural cycle via earths tilt, Solar cycles, sun spots, geo thermal activity etc. So the first question is...What if I'm wrong? What's the harm in my view, if I'm wrong?

2. I only stated one Scientist out of thousands that believe Man is causing global warming. Let's just take Tyson for one example then. Is he in on some kind of conspiracy?

3. Either Tyson is in on a conspiracy or he's not. If he's not...and he is a really, really smart guy with lots of research and lab time under his belt. Is he wrong? If he is just plain wrong, how can someone as smart as he is not understand what's really going on here?

4. If I am wrong and Tyson is wrong and he is a world renowned credible scientist with very strong credentials, If we're both wrong and he is really really wrong on this, then who should I believe? Who is a better authority? Not just some skeptical blog or talking head, but a real scientist with real credentials who is well respected in the scientific community. Who can I believe? Who is that person?

5. You guys also say follow the money. Sure there is some benefit to lying about man made global warming and there are definitly interests that want it to be false and would pay good money for this perception to be made public, but...and it's a big but really...there is actually more money at stake for the opposing view. If man made global warming is real, then big oil, big coal, auto manufacturers...and there is a lot of money at stake here...those companies and corporations and interests have far more at stake. So the last question is,....if I follow the money...and it leads me to fossil fuel and auto industry interests where does that leave me? Meaning the money trail doesn't all lead to grants and funding to prove man made global warming is real but to prove the opposite. The question is...what am I to think of that?

originally posted by: xuenchen


There's not enough CO2 being "manufactured" to make any difference.

Complete ignorant conjecture that statement is. We have elevated the CO2 levels from 280ppm to 400pm as a direct result of our addiction to burning fossil fuels.

This is a scientific FACT. Welcome to reality. We can do better.

a reply to: jrod

Complete ignorant conjecture that statement is. We have elevated the CO2 levels from 280ppm to 400pm as a direct result of our addiction to burning fossil fuels.

This is a scientific FACT. Welcome to reality. We can do better.

One lie leads to 1000 more.

No way I believe the measurements. I think it's all fake.

All BeeEss to get the carbon money rolling.

If there was a *REAL* problem, they wouldn't be pushing the money agenda.

Besides, they *are* doing something long term right?

Obama EPA just announced all those new regulations that will take years to accomplish.

All at a big money cost too !! How sweet and luscious.

What's everybody so worried about?