The Fall of Iraq - What You Aren't Being Told

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Euphem


I prefer this solution:

That Islam institutes a separation of church and state instead.

Not going to happen. Islamic law is the only law in their eyes regardless of whether we like it or not.

Since their religious, and political beliefs is a marriage made in hell of death,destruction, and fascism.

But invading sovereign countries under democracy isn't? The only difference is our governments aren't killing our people, yet.

a reply to: neo96


Your right! The US is not behind everything. Unfortunately they play a major part including transporting Terrorists and Arming them. The UK does exactly the same!

Your Government controlled Wikipedia references mean nothing by the way!

The people of the US have been fooled by their Government many times. Luckily with Obama and Co wanting to attack Syria the people of the US were not being fooled again and they refused. This is where the renamed Al-Qaeda ISIS comes in. To try to fool the US people again.

Are you fooled into believing your puppet Government again?

a reply to: galadofwarthethird

tribal groups have been internal fighting for decades there.

They have been internal fighting for CENTURIES. Since Muhammad's death. In the 7th century.
It will never end. Ever.

The US has played a big part in it, and I am opposed to the US government playing "world police." The other day I watched a vid on Amanpour (CNN) where she interviewed the Iraqi Ambassador. He said that "the US is our ONLY strategic ally, by choice" and insisted that the US is bound by that alliance to step in.

This is not looking "good" at all. I've been following this chaotic travesty since the "Arab Spring" 3 years ago. It will not get better. It will get worse. I know many say it is geopolitics, and I see that, and raise those who say so by religion.

US needs to become a truly insular country. NO military bases ANYWHERE except our own coastlines. Use our OWN resources for the benefit of our OWN citizens. MAKE. IT. WORK.

I also learned yesterday that there is a big push to bring manufacturing back here from overseas. Wages are going up in 3rd world areas, and even Walmart (gag) is now pushing for "Made in USA" for 80% of it's products.

As we say sarcastically: IT'S ABOUT TIME. (Also, Petco has decided to no longer sell made-in-China pet chews and treats. I know my husband refuses to buy them - and I agree with him. We shop-hop for those made in USA, or at LEAST in Mexico, Brazil, etc. Oh it's made in CHINA? No. We don't need it. Americans need JOBS, not Chinese junk.)

The rest of the world will carry on without us. And finally, there's a glimmer of hope. Break all ties - mind our own problems, and let others sort out their differences.

a reply to: RocksFromSpace

good post. wathcing now thanks.

#7

The overall problem with this assessment is that it barely makes any mention of the real source of trouble in Iraq, Libya and Syria, and that is Saudi Arabia. The Sauds are the biggest backers of ISIS/ISIL.

The claim near the end of the video that it was the US that 'toppled Libya' is nonsense, Libya was already toppling from internal forces, and those forces were controlled by S.A.

What is playing out in Iraq is the split between Sunnis and Shiites, between Iran and Saudi Arabia. IF the USA decides to repulse the ISIS forces and becomes friendly toward Iran to support such an objective, you can bet 'Al Qaeda' (as directed by Bandahar/Saudi Arabia) will resurface with renewed attacks on the us.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I agree 100%. Unfortunately, as the US withdraws from global engagement and the world moves to a "Multi-Polar" type system, the push to quit the US Dollar as the world trade and reserve currency gains strength. That's probably inevitable anyway but the economic impact on the US is likely to be quite severe.

All that being true, I agree with your sentiments. Sectarian, (Religious war) violence in Iraq is of far less threat to US national interests than the crushing debt this gov't has racked up since 2001. Its past time the US tend to its own problems and more effectively.

originally posted by: Blackmarketeer
The overall problem with this assessment is that it barely makes any mention of the real source of trouble in Iraq, Libya and Syria, and that is Saudi Arabia. The Sauds are the biggest backers of ISIS/ISIL.

The claim near the end of the video that it was the US that 'toppled Libya' is nonsense, Libya was already toppling from internal forces, and those forces were controlled by S.A.

What is playing out in Iraq is the split between Sunnis and Shiites, between Iran and Saudi Arabia. IF the USA decides to repulse the ISIS forces and becomes friendly toward Iran to support such an objective, you can bet 'Al Qaeda' (as directed by Bandahar/Saudi Arabia) will resurface with renewed attacks on the us.

Thank freaking christ for sanity. So many people who can't read history books and thus make out that everything is the "wests" fault. Sure the west are no saints and they most definitely prop up some very unsavoury regimes in order to secure fuel supplies but the underlying problems have been there for centuries. Long before "the west" existed as a power block.

The middle east is a centuries old conflict between two flavours of Islam exactly the same as the protestant-catholic divide. The problem with the Islamic split is that they have machine guns, anti aircraft missiles and possibly nukes. The Christians had swords and muskets.

Now when one side takes power and starts to fail (as all forced occupations do) they look for a scapegoat and this is where the West is naive as they are used as the excuse. I understand the humanitarian argument BUT intervention almost always makes things worse since it tends to prolong the underlying hatreds.

What I get from the video isn't a blanket condemnation of all mainstream news... just the very true fact that news sources matter.

FOX and 99% of the blogs/online sources are slanted crap... The New York Times and similar organizations vet their info and are trustworthy. Their existence depends upon being reliable... the trouble is most folks don't read the more detailed articles that provide context to events.

Notice how the video keeps quoting the NYT? This is because people are using "fast food" news more now, and missing the smart, context rich, mostly unbiased reporting that one has to take some effort to find... or subscribe to the NYTs for.

eta: So it isn't "hidden news" it's simply that most people aren't looking for it.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
These wars in the Middle East have all had the blessings of the Saudi Royal family too. It seems they benefit from the chaos around them by interrupting oil production of other nations making their own more valuable.

I love my country but I despise our foreign policy and the lying pack of jackals that have led us in to these endless wars and created so much suffering. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria - all in ruins. Pakistan, Egypt, Somalia, Yemen and the Sudan are all in varying states of chaos thanks to our "help".

The US is responsible for creating the conditions for Muslims worldwide to join in Jihad. We have kicked off a holy war against - ourselves! It keeps the military industrial/spying complex chugging right along and oil prices high.

It's time for an intervention at home to restore sanity, decency and some sense of morality to our national character. Sooner or later these birds will come home to roost and America will be a smoldering ruin.

Best post on this thread IMHO, thanks to the poster on page one who put up the transcript of the video.
And a S&F to the OP for putting this up front and center where it should be!

Regards, Iwinder

S&F great post and the truth that's all i can say.

a reply to: RocksFromSpace

While looking at the video and comparing that to the topic title "the fall of Iraq - what you aren't being told".

Nice looking video and well spoken, but every bit of the information in this video is based on quotes from information already available to everyone. So what are we not being told?

originally posted by: onequestion
More info on the material present in be video please.

Thanks, what happened to you are supposed to explain what video says for those who can't watch.

So I am gonna say BS lol. I hear folks comparing our actions to communist lol. What a joke.

Look, we left this country and let them govern themselves. Communist, uh, Russia would not.

Again, crock oh bull chit. Another civil war here helps no one. In fact it could usher in world wide economic recession. At a time when economy's around the world are getting healthy again.

It would have been nice to talk about the video but I bet I got it spot on. Lol

The Bot

8:55-10:00 my jaw was literally on the floor. I knew tha US went in without permission, but hearing it played out just dumbfounded me.

Slowly, i am starting to have sympathy for Assad, and the late Gaddafi and Hussein because they are/were being played as pawns in some global takeover scheme and all they happened to be on oil. The babies thrown from incubators could brobably be one of the heinous lies of the century...followed by the WMD that got us into this mess.

Those that believe the MSM hype are fools and should be ashamed, we created, paid, and supporting these beastly, subhuman scum that is literally destroying the Cradle of Civilization.

I am too disgusted to go on. I wish to revoke my citizenship here for a less dirty country.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

They have been internal fighting for CENTURIES. Since Muhammad's death. In the 7th century. It will never end. Ever.

That is kind of incorrect they have been fighting before that. In fact this Isis one of its mission is to drive off or kill of the sons of Jacob, and that is still going on all over a split in the tribes of Abraham, there still sour over that split in marriage and the any grievance may have been wrought upon Ishmael. How do I know, easy...They kept saying that and repeating that in a few videos. And even before that when they were just hundred men tribes killing each-other over hills in the stone age.

And if you watched some of the vids you would see that the answer will it end is likely not. Such things generally go on and on, and are cylindrical. I mean what was the first thing on group did to another when they got power after the US pulled out, they tried to cut off the other group. Now you have another group under issis cutting off the other group, and if given a chance it will happen again. But the same can be said here in the states, if some groups got power what do you think will happen.

As for there hatred of America, well they had little before all this started. And if you watched the isis propaganda vid which you didn't, then you will see it there. Even in the way they raid the houses before killing of the victims they do it in a very familiar fashion, even have the same equipment on. They even ask them weird questions like are you an apostate, and interview them before the camera on there crimes. Lets just say that if you ever saw a vid or movie of an American unit storming a house and capturing those withing then asking them were the insurgents are, you would get a very good picture of what there doing. There mocking and using the same things against there enemies more as a spite that have been likely used on them. Its like if I were to so sarcastically diss somebody on this site, what would be there response, and what would be my response, and so on it shall go. Its just human nature, and nature period. The whole propaganda video is like a mock on some of the things we have been doing, lets just say there doing it just to sarcastically mock certain things. Round and round we go.

So yes it will go on, but now one of the groups or tribes on there poop list is well the great satan as well. And if you would have seen some of the vids I seen, one even of a helicopter using infra red mowing hundreds of these so called insurgents which there people would likely call heroes down, because you know one mans freedom fighter is anothers terrorist. You would get a better picture of why they hate you all now, when before America was bubble gum and magical tv. # in that vid alone of the helicopter taking them out from miles away they killed a few hundreds of them and even with snipers from miles away. And in there propaganda vid they probably killed about 200 of the so called apostates. So yes insurgents and apostates, red versus blue, shia and sunny, the war will go on because its a self feeding machine and its cylindrical it will always come back to haunt you when you least expect it and your guard is down.

This is not looking "good" at all. I've been following this chaotic travesty since the "Arab Spring" 3 years ago. It will not get better. It will get worse. I know many say it is geopolitics, and I see that, and raise those who say so by religion. US needs to become a truly insular country. NO military bases ANYWHERE except our own coastlines. Use our OWN resources for the benefit of our OWN citizens. MAKE. IT. WORK. I also learned yesterday that there is a big push to bring manufacturing back here from overseas. Wages are going up in 3rd world areas, and even Walmart (gag) is now pushing for "Made in USA" for 80% of it's products.

You know my current job is at the airport, and this morning. I saw what was three of those large bussed full of soldiers getting on a 747, I watched as they climbed up the stairs into the plane on my way out. All were kids, all were carying guns with them though not loaded into the plane, by there uniforms which was brown camo and brown bags I would asume there are going someplace with more of a brown motif and less foliage. But yes all were kids, and all had different looks on there faces, some looked like they did not want to be there, others were smiling, others had a cocky look, others really looked like they were in thought, some you can tell they just did not fully agree with being there, and a lot more.

What I am saying is. It may just be to late for all that, sure some things may come back to American soil but even that will take a long time and many hoops to jump through, I would not trust any of those companies on anything they say. But hey we will see. However I do not see any end to the basses around the world, you would be surprised how fast some people change when some pressure leave.

And considering that Isis alone in there grabs from what I heard took over a few oil fields and are now billionaires, well they got a lot to work with then what there sponsors have given them in the past and some can give them things like surface to air missiles and the gadgets to take them down, after all there is on a quest now to make a one world caliphate as deemed by there new sponsors in the area, so there going to need some pretty hefty gadgets, and now they can afford even to buy them.

Basically there may have not been any nuclear bombs in Saddam basement, but thanks to all we in the west have been doing and wrought and all other powers across the world who were there to join in all that fun, now and in the future there is a pretty good change that there will be some, and as they say were there is a will there is a way. Who knows what the centuries might bring, do you think some may look wrought on what has been happening these past few 20 to 100 years in that region. After all there still fighting over what some group who stole a hill did thousands and thousands of years ago, and in America were still bickering over donkeys and elephants and blue states and red states.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Euphem

The only difference the US can make with the fighting that has been going on in the middle east for thousands of years would be to just completely wipe them all out

I prefer this solution:

That Islam institutes a separation of church and state instead.

Since their religious, and political beliefs is a marriage made in hell of death,destruction, and fascism.

And finally come out of the dark ages.

Sounds a lot like Israel, doesn't it?

I think it boils down to muslims vs jews and they use everybody else and that's why everyone is caught in the middle. Oil, diamonds, natural gas, banks, news medias,.......the muslims do not control most of these things....
One is just as bad as the other.

a reply to: BlubberyConspiracy

originally posted by: BlubberyConspiracy
a reply to: irak33
How does raised oil prices benefit the consumer?

You’ll have to forgive me--my hearing ain’t that great these days. I blame the canons.

Since I didn’t make any reference to oil or prices or raising anything, except the truth, I’m going to have to ask your angle, your slant? Could you flesh out your question a bit more so I understand the relationship to what I’d written?

Also, please define consumers in this context, because I surely hope you aren’t referring to human beings. I don’t know of any human beings, except nutty oil tycoons, who consume oil. Humans purchase oil, but they surely don’t consume oil. Generations have been programmed (through advertising and media) into thinking they’re “consumers.” Ticks are also good consumers. Humans are not parasites in my eyes. Please define “consumer,” as I’ve probably drifted on a tangent.

Those triple seven’s are loud, I’ll tell ya’.

Cheers,--I picked that up from the Brits in Basra. They were some generous and funny cats.

originally posted by: Famouszor
a reply to: RocksFromSpace

While looking at the video and comparing that to the topic title "the fall of Iraq - what you aren't being told".

Nice looking video and well spoken, but every bit of the information in this video is based on quotes from information already available to everyone. So what are we not being told?

This is typical actions of Storm Clouds Gathering. The New York Times is hardly outside MSM, in fact it is pretty much the definition of MSM.

Once again, he has read a couple of articles and watched a few YouTube videos and thinks he has a revelation. He is that sort of arrogant that presumes if HE hasn't heard of something then surely nobody else has either. Be careful of using him as a reliable source of information, he is wildly inconsistent and more focused on video production values than he is in truth.

a reply to: galadofwarthethird

And if you watched the isis propaganda vid which you didn't, then you will see it there.

Which vid is that? You haven't posted any vids, and I did watch the entire vid in the OP.

a reply to: irak33

When we see middle eastern conflicts, the price of oil always raises due to supply and demand changes caused by disruption. What I'm asking is how does this benefit the consumer when prices raise? (Users of gasoline, petro-products, electricity etc)

When you referred to neo-colonialism I took it as if you mean that Americans are extracting Iraq to benefit themselves. It didn't make any sense to me, we are all losers when it comes to war, the only one who benefits here are the Oil Elite who get the payout.

a reply to: BlubberyConspiracy

Thank you for your clarification and I am in agreement with your sentiments. War is a racket, to that I'd most assuredly attest. Your tone is ringing more clearly now.

I reference Neocolonialism from the perspective of the indigenous cultures upon which we [Americans and by larger diffuzion the West] feast and fish with our monetary scheme. Specifically in relation to the book, "Decolonizing Methodologies: Research and Indigenous Peoples" by Linda Tuhiwai Smith (2008). And what a heroic work it is! If you're interested in her text, I highly recommend seeing if it's available at your local library.

Ultimately this Iraq situation is much deeper and more complex than just oil: since the petro-dollar has become the American soul, her life-blood. Many are hypnotized into buying the religions of money. It's marketed to the masses quite cleverly.

Each word has been deliberately selected. There is code embedded in all of my posts to help us deprogram. We must remain mindful of the words we choose.

"Parry with the dexter, repulse with the sinister," I say.

I make no pretension to patriotism. So long as my voice can be heard on this or the other side of the Atlantic, I will hold up America to the lightning scorn of moral indignation. In doing this, I shall feel myself discharging the duty of a true patriot; for he is a lover of his country who rebukes and does not excuse its sins. It is righteousness that exalteth a nation while sin is a reproach to any people.

Frederick Douglass (African American abolitionist, orator, author, editor, reformer, women's rights advocate, and statesman who was born a slave), Speech, "Love of God, Love of Man, Love of Country", Syracuse, New York (24 September 1847)

I thank you for your time, B's and Cheers,

--

P.S. I offer you one more gem because I initially suspected you were trolling for the loilololoil'erz. They're nothin' but noise, I'll tell ya. This is one of my favorites.

"Don't forget, son, no matter how far ya get from these mountains, they're in yer soul now! No tongue will ever tell how it feels to be a part of these mountains. You'll be back!" His voice quivered.

From: A Walk Across America, Peter Jenkins, 1979, Chapter 7: The Code.