CA pastor orders Christians to ‘isolate’ LGBT kids and then ‘turn them over to Satan’

a reply to: Blaine91555
Agreed.
Let the market decide.
I will be sad if the market allows & rewards such attitudes...but, I will also be enlightened to the depressing reality of who/what I am surrounded by.

a reply to: olaru12

Jesus would not ignore sinners and turn them over to satan. Here is what Jesus said when The Scribes and Pharisees saw Jesus eating with tax collecters (publicans) and sinners (those considered evil):

Mark 2:16-17
And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: ProfessorChaos



I don't know anything abut this John Macarthur person, but I"m going to have to agree with Murgatroid on this one.

15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

The method described above is the exact method that my family and Pentecostal church, back in the 1970s, used to coerce and threaten my older sister into an abortion when she got pregnant.

It's also the exact same method they used on me, 4 years later, when they "ex-communicated" me for NOT having an abortion.

Critical thinking and a little empathy goes a lot further than scripture when emulating "Christ".

saaaaaaayyyyyyywwwwwwhhhhhh@aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?
They coerced you to get an abortion using scripture? Whhhhaaaaaaaaaaat? Sorry, I never heard of this before. Can't we take their cross lapel pins away or something? That's just so wrong

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: rupertg
I don't have enough hate in my heart to ever be a true Christian.

Hate is not at all required to be a true Christian; the opposite is, however.

Then someone needs to tell the "Hell-fire and damnation" extreme rightwing style Christians because from my perspective; they have taken over the GOP and are going to institute an corporate theocracy ala "1984" with "Big Brother" as the new GOD.

Reality often mimics art....

Believe me, we've been telling them. I used to believe in Hell myself, but have come to realize there is no scripture supporting the existence of the place. It is nothing but archaic traditional teaching. It is passed down; people are led to believe in it when they are kids. When they later read the scriptures, they read it with that preconceived belief in mind. So their view is slanted.

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I must say that I do agree that these legalist Christians are a threat; unfortunately, there is not much anyone can do about it.

originally posted by: Blaine91555
I'm seeing the exact opposite. Christians are becoming more tolerant, far more tolerant than they were when I was young. I know my views have evolved over the years.

What troubles me the most is that some want to silence speech they don't agree with. I'm far more scared by that than anything else. Those who engage in silencing peoples speech or religion are truly dangerous. Sadly they pretend to be tolerant themselves and even worse pretend to believe in free speech, when in fact they don't.

This person is wrong, but he has a right to say and believe as he wishes.

Just because being intolerant was the way Christian life was in the past, does not mean that is the right way. Don't get me wrong, i'm not tolerant of everything, but I am tolerant of many things.

For example, I am tolerant of homosexuals; hell, i'm a homosexual myself. However, I am not very tolerant of any lewd and vulgar gay parades. I think the very notion of pride for a sexuality is ridiculous. Whatever sexuality you are, you should accept it, and just be you. That's all that needs to happen.

Unfortunately, there will be Christians who even have a problem with that. The best thing to do? Either ignore them or argue with them using sound arguments.

Anyway, my point is, just because something seems new (tolerance of homosexuality, for example) doesn't mean it's bad.

And I don't say this out of bias for being homosexual myself; as there was a time I tried "praying the gay away" when I was more insecure. Guess what? It didn't work. A person's sexuality will hardly ever change; most times it cant. And why should it? The only options you have, are to either be intolerant regardless of the ramifications; or you can accept them as people.

Being raised in a Christian environment and being gay for as long as I can remember, I can understand. I understand both sides.

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: rupertg
I don't have enough hate in my heart to ever be a true Christian.

Hate is not at all required to be a true Christian; the opposite is, however.

Then someone needs to tell the "Hell-fire and damnation" extreme rightwing style Christians because from my perspective; they have taken over the GOP and are going to institute an corporate theocracy ala "1984" with "Big Brother" as the new GOD.

Reality often mimics art....

Believe me, we've been telling them. I used to believe in Hell myself, but have come to realize there is no scripture supporting the existence of the place. It is nothing but archaic traditional teaching. It is passed down; people are led to believe in it when they are kids. When they later read the scriptures, they read it with that preconceived belief in mind. So their view is slanted.

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I am very sorry.

You are very fortunate you were freed from the bondage of that perverse religious doctrine.The logical conclusion is since the doctrine of the eternal punishment of hell is the most pervasive and perverted doctrine that could ever be that there are "many many many"more doctrines of Christianity that are also incorrect.The doctrine of hell is a LOT of leaven that has leavened the whole loaf.

a reply to: Rex282

The doctrine of hell is a LOT of leaven that has leavened the whole loaf.

It was the "doctrine" of Jesus, so I don't know what you are talking about unless you invented your own "Jesus" that bears no resemblance to the real one.

a reply to: Rex282

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I am very sorry.

Unless you created you own Bible you are way off because it clearly says that there is, repeatedly.
You are probably just listening to wolves in sheep's clothing (pretending to be helpful, saying don't worry) rather than reading the Bible yourself.

A right wing preacher wants to make a law based on his belief is just as wrong when a left wing one does.

a reply to: NavyDoc

How about we make laws that are not based on belief? Laws that work for everyone?

It's easy to confuse motives - and sometimes the absence of belief looks like belief. To believers

:-)

It's not like I don't get what you're saying - but this battle to keep life all secular like is not about belief - left, right - Krishna, Mohammed, Christ...

People can practice their beliefs - that is their right. They don't get to insist that we all practice what they preach

I guess it's easy to make this about left versus right - I sometimes wonder if people wouldn't see the sense of things if it weren't as much about trying to foil opponents and instead was about what works for the greater good - what works for all of us

As much as that is ever possible anyway here on this god forsaken planet - it's not heaven after all

Am I right?

:-)

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis




I guess it's easy to make this about left versus right - I sometimes wonder if people wouldn't see the sense of things if it weren't as much about trying to foil opponents and instead was about what works for the greater good - what works for all of us

greater good

Are you insane? That's commie talk and not to be tolerated as we slide into a hot mess of a theocratic corporate oligarchy; where the Hobby Lobby and Chic fillet model of corporate government will take care of all lefty malcontents in taxpayer funded reeducation centers.

a reply to: olaru12

:-)

Yes - commie talk for sure - and more than good enough reason for me to be handed directly over to satan

Us greater good folk are unsalvageable

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: olaru12

:-)

Yes - commie talk for sure - and more than good enough reason for me to be handed directly over to satan

Us greater good folk are unsalvageable

I'm a greater good person.

Interesting how its always about "communism" and never about the greater good.

a reply to: olaru12

Wait. What? You're being sarcastic. Right?

I sure hope so.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: olaru12

Wait. What? You're being sarcastic. Right?

I sure hope so.

Sarcasm is like a good guitar to Mr. Olaru

:-)

originally posted by: jmdewey60
a reply to: Rex282

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I am very sorry.

Unless you created you own Bible you are way off because it clearly says that there is, repeatedly.
You are probably just listening to wolves in sheep's clothing (pretending to be helpful, saying don't worry) rather than reading the Bible yourself.

Hmm, do you really want me to debunk Hell right here and now? I assure you I have read the Bible for myself and did near constant study over the period of five years. I'm more than capable of doing it, it just takes a lot of time as I have a lot to type.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: olaru12

:-)

Yes - commie talk for sure - and more than good enough reason for me to be handed directly over to satan

Us greater good folk are unsalvageable

the greater good...the greater good...the greater good...the greater good...the greater good...
come on, it must be chanted alltogether for it to sink in...the greater good...the greater good........

a reply to: manna2

Words...mean things

So, you're in favor - I assume - of the lesser good?

:-)

Life can be pretty exhausting I think when we spend most of our time just trying not to be fooled

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis

A right wing preacher wants to make a law based on his belief is just as wrong when a left wing one does.

a reply to: NavyDoc

How about we make laws that are not based on belief? Laws that work for everyone?

It's easy to confuse motives - and sometimes the absence of belief looks like belief. To believers

:-)

It's not like I don't get what you're saying - but this battle to keep life all secular like is not about belief - left, right - Krishna, Mohammed, Christ...

People can practice their beliefs - that is their right. They don't get to insist that we all practice what they preach

I guess it's easy to make this about left versus right - I sometimes wonder if people wouldn't see the sense of things if it weren't as much about trying to foil opponents and instead was about what works for the greater good - what works for all of us

As much as that is ever possible anyway here on this god forsaken planet - it's not heaven after all

Am I right?

:-)

Certainly one should be able to believe what they want. I just worry about pressure to ban "hate speech" or speech they don't like. One aspect of living in a free society it that one must tolerate some people whom one does not like.

As for the "greater good," what is considered "the greater good" can vary from person to person to person--which is why one must be wary about suggestions to restrict someone's civil liberties "for the greater good." I think one can look into history and see a great number of truly awful things done to people in the name of "the greater good."

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: jmdewey60
a reply to: Rex282

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I am very sorry.

Unless you created you own Bible you are way off because it clearly says that there is, repeatedly.
You are probably just listening to wolves in sheep's clothing (pretending to be helpful, saying don't worry) rather than reading the Bible yourself.

Hmm, do you really want me to debunk Hell right here and now? I assure you I have read the Bible for myself and did near constant study over the period of five years. I'm more than capable of doing it, it just takes a lot of time as I have a lot to type.

My suggestion is don't waste your time.I've posted what the scriptures say so many times here at ATS and It is always the SOS with him and others.They revel in hell and death and fear.Nothing could convince them the eternal punishment of hell doesn't exist..Unfortunately the religious carnal mind(the adversary) will believe anything it wants to because it is it's nature and character.

The scriptures clearly testify that Yahoshua is the savor of ALL mankind even those that believe otherwise.It is the proud and fearful that believe they are "special" and have the creator Gods favor and the rest be damned.

originally posted by: jmdewey60
a reply to: Rex282

Unfortunately, these types of Christians don't listen. I am very sorry.

Unless you created you own Bible you are way off because it clearly says that there is, repeatedly.
You are probably just listening to wolves in sheep's clothing (pretending to be helpful, saying don't worry) rather than reading the Bible yourself.

Jim you should first learn how to read a simple quote......I did not say this.