Very unusual object photographed in Arizona sky

Okay, result of my poll at scouts tonight after showing them the picture. No video, as that violates the youth protection policy (I could have edited to blur faces, but that's a lot more effort than I'm willing to do right now):

First poll, involved 9 boys, ages 9 and 10. This was our Webelos group, they have been through a lot of camping at this point, and have earned their activity badges in Woodsman, Outdoorsman and Naturalist.

How I did the poll: I gave each a piece of paper and a pencil, separated them, and instructed them to not say their answer out loud. I asked them to turn their paper face down after they wrote their answer.
I then showed them the first picture of the entire scene, and then showed them the picture zoomed in on the object, and asked:

"What do you think this is?"

Seven (7) of the boys answered: "Bird"

One answered: Pine cone in the air (that's a good one, actually, hehehe!).

And one answered: I don't know.

Next, I went down the hall and asked 14 Boy Scouts, ages 11 to 16. These are boy scouts ranging from brand new scouts (rank of: Scout), to two Eagle Scouts that we have.

I was allowed to give them the same test (I'd called ahead and asked the troop master, and he thought it would be a good exercise), that I had done with the Webelos, the same way.

The results:

All 14 answered "Bird". Three of them suggested that it might be a buzzard or a vulture.

I then walked around and asked 12 different adult leaders and parents that I was able to get to.

The adult's results:

out of 12 adults, 9 said it looked like a bird of some kind.
2 said that they thought it was something someone had thrown into the air.
and one person said: I have no idea.

So there you have it, 30 people said "Bird"
3 said something that was thrown.
2 said that they did not know.

Take it with a grain of salt if you will, but it was interesting to do and see the results.

At no point did anyone call it a UFO.......even though, technically, sense we can not absolutely say with 100% that it is a Bird or anything else, then it IS "Unidentified", heh.

a reply to: eriktheawful

You and a few others certainly have put in the extra effort in your quest to declare that the object is a bird. I've already said enough as far as my take on what the object is and isn't. I'm not going to keep repeating myself. I don't post on this forum very often, and I'll definitely think twice before creating any future threads.

I still want to thank everyone who participated in this pseudo circus, especially the posters who have been polite.

Much love and grace.

path

originally posted by: htapath
a reply to: eriktheawful

You and a few others certainly have put in the extra effort in your quest to declare that the object is a bird. I've already said enough as far as my take on what the object is and isn't. I'm not going to keep repeating myself. I don't post on this forum very often, and I'll definitely think twice before creating any future threads.

I still want to thank everyone who participated in this pseudo circus, especially the posters who have been polite.

Much love and grace.

path

Emphasis in your quote mine.

That was the problem. I never, ever, in one single post in this thread "insisted" that the object is a bird. I never once in this thread said: "This has to be a bird and can not be anything else."

What I, and some others here took exception to was your statement of absoluteness that it could in no way at all be a bird.

If you go back and look over all 14 pages of this thread, you'll noticed that most people that said it was a bird, did not say that it must absolutely be a bird, and could not be anything else.

We gave an opinion. You gave an absolute.

This forum, the subject of Ufology and speculation on Alien life, should never have absolutes, unless those absolutes can be proven.

Time and time again, people like me put up with a lot of insults, badgering, flaming, and other rude behavior simply because we're skeptical and ask questions, and offer possible other mundane reasons or explanations.

I'm fully open to the possibility that what you captured in your image might not be a bird, or other mundane object. I feel strongly it's most likely a bird, but I won't say that it MUST BE one.

Simply because I can not prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that it is one.

However, if you're going to make statements like that (that there is no way it could be a certain thing), then you should be ready to back yourself up on that statement, and keep in mind that absolute statements, especially is this forum, opens you up for a deluge of people like me (and people not quite so nice as me).

I believe that there is life out there. I also believe that there are UFOs that defy any type of explanation at all. I believe that some things are captured on film or video that can not be explained away.

But I also believe that sometimes people are mistaken. That some times people see things that are not really there, or see them differently than other people.

We're human. We make mistakes. I've been wrong many times here on ATS.....and when someone points it out to me, I check and if they are right, I admit it, in public here.

I've even had my mind changed about something on here, because I felt the evidence the person I debated with was enough to change my mind.

I try to be flexible as possible. Question everything. And most importantly:

I read and listen to everyone, and always consider what they are saying.

My exercise with the scouts tonight wasn't to prove to you that your image is of a bird.

It was to show you that you can't go around insulting people because they don't agree with you, and to keep your mind open to all possibilities.

Even the mundane and normal ones.

a reply to: htapath

Well for what it's worth it doesn't look like a bird to me. That and the anomaly on the ground, plus there are others if you look.
I have no idea why, but the fact the op didn't notice the object in the viewfinder is a very common scenario when it comes to anomalous aerial objects, and anyone interested in getting to the bottom of some of these mysteries might do well to keep that in mind when assessing the sincerity of the reporter.

I will admit I do believe there are things around us we cannot ordinarily see. My own photos bear this out.

So from my perspective - just more high strangeness, and a very interesting photo.
Thanks for sharing.

originally posted by: htapath
Everything is explained away as something mundane,....

That's because 99.999999999% of what happens to 99.9999999999% of us is (wait for it...) mundane.

Safe bet.

originally posted by: MrPenny

originally posted by: htapath
Everything is explained away as something mundane,....

That's because 99.999999999% of what happens to 99.9999999999% of us is (wait for it...) mundane.

Safe bet.

You "skeptics" really love to get in one last jab, don't you? Be careful. You could break your arm patting yourself on the back! I often wonder how it would feel to be on "the team". Then I remember the greasy haired group of bullies in junior high school who used to think they had the world by the balls.

a reply to: htapath

I often wonder how it would feel to be on "the team".

First you have be able to identify birds. And then balloons. I used to be a member of alien club but got kicked out when I identified my first bird. Team skeptic sucks.

a reply to: htapath

Why would someone ask for people's opinions about something, offer nothing of their own opinions except for what appear to be vague suppositions, and then refuse to accept what many posters have agreed as the most likely object in the photo?

How you label people skeptics for suggesting the object is probably a bird, and not accepting the amorphous non-defined object of your own musings is suggestive of an elitist and close-minded attitude that only really wants reinforcement (of what, I am unsure).

originally posted by: htapath
a reply to: eriktheawful

You and a few others certainly have put in the extra effort in your quest to declare that the object is a bird. I've already said enough as far as my take on what the object is and isn't. I'm not going to keep repeating myself. I don't post on this forum very often, and I'll definitely think twice before creating any future threads.

I still want to thank everyone who participated in this pseudo circus, especially the posters who have been polite.

Much love and grace.

path

Should have thought twice before posting a bird.... They are easy to spot. Juuuuuuust sayin lol

a reply to: cuckooold

It's a hobby of mine. I like to argue with people I don't know about something that doesn't really matter to the point of regurgitation. I'm just sadistic like that.

originally posted by: htapath
a reply to: cuckooold

It's a hobby of mine. I like to argue with people I don't know about something that doesn't really matter to the point of regurgitation. I'm just sadistic like that.

I think there's a word for people who do that. Starts with a T.

originally posted by: korkythecat
I will admit I do believe there are things around us we cannot ordinarily see. My own photos bear this out.

Well, that's the thing. After the incoming light has passed through a Bayer filter of red, green and blue microlenses, and passed through an IR filter, they actually see LESS than the eye can see. If something can be photographed, it can be seen (unless the sensor has been specially modified).

originally posted by: Rob48

originally posted by: htapath
a reply to: cuckooold

It's a hobby of mine. I like to argue with people I don't know about something that doesn't really matter to the point of regurgitation. I'm just sadistic like that.

I think there's a word for people who do that. Starts with a T.

wat?

originally posted by: eriktheawful


That was the problem. I never, ever, in one single post in this thread "insisted" that the object is a bird. I never once in this thread said: "This has to be a bird and can not be anything else."

What I, and some others here took exception to was your statement of absoluteness that it could in no way at all be a bird.

Exactly:

originally posted by: draknoir2

The road sign isn't "huge", and I don't see any reason why the object can't be closer than the sign. Might be a vulture, which could be larger than the sign.

Anyway, THIS, or TH IS is kind of the position I was thinking of.

Can't zoom in close enough to say for sure it's a large bird, but it certainly could be.

Here is a video of a turkey vulture in flight: www.youtube.com...

Here I have taken a frame grab from that video and pasted it into the OP's photograph. Is the angle identical? No - I don't have hours to waste finding one that is. But anyone who argues that these two objects can't be the same thing (ie a bird), viewed from slightly different angles, is deluding themselves.

a reply to: Rob48

That's awesome. Well done!

a reply to: Rob48

I honestly can't believe this thread is still going. It should be moved to a new area and labeled "ignorance Example"

I am sure, however, that the OP will come back to say again that it can't be a bird because hundreds of people have been asked by him, his friends never saw it in the sky, and the "feeling" that it can't be a bird.....that and orbs....

And nice job on the side by side.....

a reply to: Rob48

Pretty obvious.

Bird, it is.

originally posted by: Rob48
Here is a video of a turkey vulture in flight: www.youtube.com...

Here I have taken a frame grab from that video and pasted it into the OP's photograph. Is the angle identical? No - I don't have hours to waste finding one that is. But anyone who argues that these two objects can't be the same thing (ie a bird), viewed from slightly different angles, is deluding themselves.

That makes it a lot clearer....it's a rock.

originally posted by: Rob48
Here is a video of a turkey vulture in flight: www.youtube.com...

Here I have taken a frame grab from that video and pasted it into the OP's photograph. Is the angle identical? No - I don't have hours to waste finding one that is. But anyone who argues that these two objects can't be the same thing (ie a bird), viewed from slightly different angles, is deluding themselves.

Wow, that's really cool - two gigantic 747 size UFOs!

How were you able to summon two of them?