The Ravages of Feminism

To quote one of the funniest movies I have seen in a long time in reference to the traditional family......
"the man may be the head of the household but the woman is the neck and she can turn the head any way she wants."

Why is it, that if I go down the street and knock my neighbor up aside the head, it's considered assault? But, if I knock my husband up aside the head, or him me, it's something different?

I understand why it began this way......male judges, male cops, male authorities really didn't think that wacking your wife around was the same as physical assualt in the bars or on the streets....and well, they might want to protect their buddies....but, well, if you want to go on asking why there's such an outrage over women being abused, and silence when concerning the men, well.....you need to ask yourself why it should be considered any different that someone on the streets walking up to you out of the blue and knocking your lights out!

Originally posted by dawnstar
Why is it, that if I go down the street and knock my neighbor up aside the head, it's considered assault? But, if I knock my husband up aside the head, or him me, it's something different?

As far as i know it's called spousal abuse... Perhaps it's not considered just an assault because your neighbour isn't your spouse??

There is also battered wife's syndroms, and now there's a battered husband's sydrome to be, although many cases go unreported because i'm assuming the man would feel "wimpy"... But if I was a man, i'd clam bhs and get the bitch in as much trouble as possible since usually cops and judges side with the wife.

back in early America, it was legal to beat a woman with a stick if she wasn't compliant... So glad that's changed, my poor husband would of woken up with no balls or his stick...

Originally posted by dawnstar
Why is it, that if I go down the street and knock my neighbor up aside the head, it's considered assault? But, if I knock my husband up aside the head, or him me, it's something different?

Well don't forget there's emotional abuse as well, something I've certainly endured from women and something I believe is far worse than pyshical abuse, and probably much more common.

How does one legislate that?

Originally posted by Joe Manco
Well don't forget there's emotional abuse as well, something I've certainly endured from women and something I believe is far worse than pyshical abuse, and probably much more common.

How does one legislate that?

go see a counsellor or a psychologist who is knowledgeable in battered husband's syndrome.... This includes physical and mental abuse... Both are painfully enduring... This will help your case much more, you can file a police report and don't worry about being unmanly or anything, it takes alot of man to go forward and try and clear your conscience while at the same time slamming the biatch for being such a dirtbag...

Well, there's some common sense solutions that come to mind that would solve the problem without any legislations....get as far away from the one emotionally abusing you as you can. Oh...but that's the problem, isn't it, married people are getting as far as way from their abusive partners as they can possibly get, and people don't like it.

Another suggestion would be for people to GROW UP!!! A marriage isn't about one person giving, and another taking.....Both have to give and take a little....but, that will probably fall on alot of deaf ears also.
It's much easier to just slap women into that age old placement where she's totally dependent and thus subjugated to her husbands. That way, he only has to give what he wants....and she's more willing to give everything that he desires.....

Why should the children be in daycare when well, there are two parents in the home, and they could be working different shifts, plus each taking their turn looking after the kids? Not to mention, helping out with the household chores.

Originally posted by TrueLies
go see a counsellor or a psychologist who is knowledgeable in battered husband's syndrome.... This includes physical and mental abuse... Both are painfully enduring... This will help your case much more, you can file a police report and don't worry about being unmanly or anything, it takes alot of man to go forward and try and clear your conscience while at the same time slamming the biatch for being such a dirtbag...

Well as for whether I need counselling is errr debatable.

I don't know if I'm going off topic but whilst abuse is being brought up my question was how do you go the police, saying that your loved one is screwing with you head when there's no proof? My point being that this form of abuse is much worse as it's longer lasting.

Originally posted by Joe Manco
Well as for whether I need counselling is errr debatable.

I don't know if I'm going off topic but whilst abuse is being brought up my question was how do you go the police, saying that your loved one is screwing with you head when there's no proof? My point being that this form of abuse is much worse as it's longer lasting.

The proof would lie within your psychologists or counsellor's documents...
While your visiting him/her and talking about your problems notes would be taken, and so when you go to the police you have a much stronger case and a witness to back you up...

Originally posted by dawnstar
Well, there's some common sense solutions that come to mind that would solve the problem without any legislations....get as far away from the one emotionally abusing you as you can. Oh...but that's the problem, isn't it, married people are getting as far as way from their abusive partners as they can possibly get, and people don't like it.

Well I was never married, and it's hard to leave someone you're in love with. Logic is so easy from the outside and believe me I look at many friends relationships e.t.c thinking "she/he's no good for you", but once you're on the inside it's different.

Another suggestion would be for people to GROW UP!!! A marriage isn't about one person giving, and another taking.....Both have to give and take a little....but, that will probably fall on alot of deaf ears also.

Well it's not just marriage that's about that, it's any relationship of any kind that should be like that, if it's going to work. However you are right.

Originally posted by parrhesia
Why is that sad?
So long as a child has a stable, loving environment, which is not guaranteed by marriage, they should be fine. If anything, parents staying married when they are clearly unhappy together can have bad effects on children involved to. Sometimes it's best for the children for the parents to separate so there can be some stability and happiness with both parents still in their lives.

I could be wrong so don't take this the wrong way, but the tone of the post suggested to me that you see marriage as some kind of entrapment. Once done, you're somehow owned. If that's the case, why do you see it that way?

I'm not religious so I don't see marriage as something that HAS to be done, many couples can happily last without ever needing it being 'official'. However, if two people are very much in love and would like to do it as a symbol of commitment to each other, saying in a very loving way that you're the only one for each other then I don't see why the dogma of what marriage stands for in certain sectors should scare certain feminists off.

There seems to be a mindset amongst certain feminists that marriage is like "oh no, he thinks he owns me" which I think is very sad.

Just like any relationship you can walk out of a marriage anytime you want, it's just a symbol of love and trust between two people, although no doubt it is a sign of ownership for many men and women, but it shouldn't be seen that way.

Well, just think how much harder it would be if there were a few kids involved?

Sorry, but well.....



Okay, you love her, so you really would like to make the relationship work. Well, you cant force her to change, although you might be able to patiently try to convince her to change herself. Quite frankly, I don't see how the gov't legislating anything would help anyways....what, they throw her in jail, order her counseling, or whatever, but still,,,,,,,it's her who has to change.
My advice would be to understand that real love doesn't always equate to giving the other person what they want. Sometimes, you might just have to refuse her some things....what, would you give a dying achohlic another beer "because you love them" after the doctor told you both it was killing them? If she's being abusive to you, well, then there is probably something about her personality that is causing her to be abusive with other people also. This, more than likely is harming her other relationships also. and, well, it's not healthy for her either. SO, if you loved her, I think you would want to do whatever you can to help her end a self-destructive habit. It might mean leaving the relationship, at least for awhile, or it might mean just developing enough of a backbone to say enough is enough, you hurt me when you do that, and I don't want you hurting me any longer. It has to stop. I am talking about real spousal abuse, be it emotional or physical.....sometimes, in today's age, it seems that gee, coming home in a bad mood is being abusive. To me, that's just being human.
Weather you a man or a women really doesn't matter. Healthy relationships are built on honesty and trust. And, well, maybe you need to be honest with her and tell her just how hard it is to trust her when she isn't being that nice to you.

By the way, some men DO think they own the women after the marriage certificate is official.....I just shared part of my strategy as to how to get alone with one of them.
To me, both the marriage and the divorce are just peices of paper, many have the marriage certificate, but their relationships wouldn't really meet my description of what a marriage is, and well, there are many divorced couples out there still playing the same power games that broke their marriage apart, so, I wouldn't actually call that a divorce.

[edit on 29-11-2004 by dawnstar]

Wow, did this topic ever take off overnight. This is directed at no single person but can we post without circumventing the censors please?

Originally posted by intrepid
This is directed at no single person but can we post without circumventing the censors please?

If you f@#king say so...

*it's not big, it's not clever*

Originally posted by dawnstar
Quite frankly, I don't see how the gov't legislating anything would help anyways....what, they throw her in jail, order her counseling, or whatever, but still,,,,,,,it's her who has to change.

Well that's what I was saying, my point was that you can't legislate something like that.
You can go to the police with physical abuse, but you can't really with emotional abuse, even though it can be much more crippling.

My advice would be to understand that real love doesn't always equate to giving the other person what they want. Sometimes, you might just have to refuse her some things....what, would you give a dying achohlic another beer "because you love them" after the doctor told you both it was killing them?

I never gave in to any of her emotional abuse, that was the problem evidently.

SO, if you loved her, I think you would want to do whatever you can to help her end a self-destructive habit. It might mean leaving the relationship, at least for awhile, or it might mean just developing enough of a backbone to say enough is enough, you hurt me when you do that, and I don't want you hurting me any longer.

Well I'm not in the relationship anymore, and I'm certainly not a victim. People can be very good at manipulating the situation though.

sometimes, in today's age, it seems that gee, coming home in a bad mood is being abusive. To me, that's just being human.

I couldn't agree more with that.

Weather you a man or a women really doesn't matter. Healthy relationships are built on honesty and trust. And, well, maybe you need to be honest with her and tell her just how hard it is to trust her when she isn't being that nice to you.

Again I couldn't agree more, and like I said I'm not a victim and was honest with them, but like I said some people are very good at manipulating the situation.

By the way, some men DO think they own the women after the marriage certificate is official

Well as I said I know many do see it that way, and I think it's very sad. No one should be with an a$$hole like that in the first place.

To me, both the marriage and the divorce are just peices of paper, many have the marriage certificate, but their relationships wouldn't really meet my description of what a marriage is, and well, there are many divorced couples out there still playing the same power games that broke their marriage apart, so, I wouldn't actually call that a divorce.

Agreed and agreed, marriage doesn't mean anything other than what it should mean, which is a celebration and symbol of love and trust for one another. And yes, people do carry on playing them games long after a divorce, I've seen it happen with family members. They might as well have stayed together the way they still go at each other.

Originally posted by Joe Manco
[Well as for whether I need counselling is errr debatable.

I don't know if I'm going off topic but whilst abuse is being brought up my question was how do you go the police, saying that your loved one is screwing with you head when there's no proof? My point being that this form of abuse is much worse as it's longer lasting.

Been there. Did that with former husband (not the one I'm currently married to.) Yes, it will really mess you up.

If your partner is depressive or has other mental problems then you need to talk to a counselor. The counselor can help you get them to treatment -or- if the differences are irreconcilable, help you figure out the best ways to move on with your individual lives so BOTH of you can find someone more compatable. The point of relationships isn't to hang in there and suffer forever without resolution. Marriages are for companionship and committment and a lot of other things; not for abuse.

Like I said... been there. Did that. Got the tee shirt. Take the advice, eh, and don't do like I did and wait till it got physically abusive.

Originally posted by Byrd
Like I said... been there. Did that. Got the tee shirt. Take the advice, eh, and don't do like I did and wait till it got physically abusive.

Well I think the over-riding theme of your post is that they take alot of hard work, it ain't all just rainbows and daisys. If so then I couldn't agree more. I'll keep your advice in mind for next time, although hopefully there wont be one.

I am generally a strong supporter of the feminist movement. Women's liberation is a large component of various left wing movements, and I feel proud and honoured to be in the struggle alongside women. However, when radical feminists who want complete seperation from males, the whole 'having a penis makes you a rapist' crowd pipe up, I tend to get a little bothered.

This article is BS. I think thats all that I have to say on the subject.

Originally posted by Joe Manco
I could be wrong so don't take this the wrong way, but the tone of the post suggested to me that you see marriage as some kind of entrapment. Once done, you're somehow owned. If that's the case, why do you see it that way?

No, I don't see marriage as an entrapment, but I also don't see it as absolutely necessary for a child to be happy and stable home.

What I was getting at was that some people seem to assume that marriage equals an instant stable, happy and loving home, which is certainly not the case. In the cases where there are obvious tensions between parents, or deep unhappiness in the relationship, this can affect the children.
Divorce does not have to mean instability, but unfortanately some couples let their anger and indignation for eachother come between them and that harms the child. But it doesn't have to be like that.

However, if two people are very much in love and would like to do it as a symbol of commitment to each other, saying in a very loving way that you're the only one for each other then I don't see why the dogma of what marriage stands for in certain sectors should scare certain feminists off.

I fully agree with that.

About what Amethyst was saying on page 2... there's something we agree on. Small kids spending time in daycare simply doesn't cut it. That's not responsible parenting.

... which is why when I get married and my wife has our first child, she'll be going back to work when the child is one year old. And I'll be the one staying home. I can see it now... doing just enough consultant work (I'm a writer/translator/projects manager) to round up our income, and the rest of the time, bonding with my son/daughter...

Amethyst,

There are stay at home dads. Do you agree with this practice? Also, if you have no way of making an income, how will you survive if your husband decides to leave you? Also, do you believe that it is also the man's responsibility to raise the children?

Also, married men live longer than single men, and married women have a higher rate of mental illness, and have a shorter life span than single women. There are many married women who live long because they don't live the stereotypical view that is placed on them. Married women who stand up for their rights, live longer because they don't assume all responsibility of housework, raising the children, etc.. which in the end promotes stress. Stress causes people to die earlier, and experience emotional disturbances.

I think couples do what is best suited for them because some men want to take care of the children as the women works, and women are 100% capable of working because we are intelligent.

I play the drums, does this make me less feminine?