Cliven Bundy, The BLM, And the Idiocracy of America

America is trillions in debt, holding on for dear life to sustain itself. How can people can pick and choose sides/standpoints in something that is literally doing nothing but increasing the debt. Spend 100 million to collect a dollar, only in America.

I only agree with the militias because of Government incompetence. Bundy is a crook to say the least and owes money. We can freeze assets of entire nations, but we can't collect a million bucks from a millionaire rancher with a bank account?

Good ol' Murica just spent probably 5-10 Million dollars to collect a 1 million dollar debt....and successfully collected ZERO

Don't think about the rancher or the situation in general, think about how the government is so much in debt yet can afford to waste literally millions of dollars for NOTHING. That alone makes me want to form a damn militia.

The out of control spending needs to stop, and people need to start "protesting" more like they did with dead-beat Bundy

Zero debt, go for it gubment, we can afford it

17 trillion debt, please stop WASTING money, we CAN'T afford it

thats all, sorry for ranting

a reply to: KnowledgeSeeker81

Great point regarding using millions to "collect" one million. I guess it goes to show you, it's not the money, but the land that is at stake. I'm not sure it wells up a great desire to start a militia, it does however drive home the point that something needs to be done on the popular level to enforce term limits in congress and throw out lobbyists.

We have allowed the Robber Barons to go behind the scenes and continue their effort at economic domination, and it worked, better than any of us could imagine...all while bickering over a supposed 2 party system, racism, whatever...just as long as they kept us staring at the TV, movies and now computer driven devices, they were left to continue their power play until now...perhaps nigh to late to do anything.

Points in the OP are all valid. But it's missing one thing:

TPTB are actively TRYING to bankrupt and destroy the country. America must collapse before the NWO can rise, so that's exactly why the government is constantly willing to spend, spend, spend without a single concern over the debt they're racking up.

The people of America are under attack on all fronts. There's an agenda at work here--to dumb down and distract the population while accelerating the collapse of this once-great nation. And sadly, it appears to be working.

a reply to: BlueJacket

it's not the money, but the land that is at stake.

That is rubbish talking points from Faux News. He has a $1M tax bill delinquent. If the USG had a claim to his property they would take it. But what happened? They told him they would confiscate the cattle on the BLM land if he didn't remove them. It wasn't even about his property. Why are people so screwed up in their information? It's got to be Faux News. When are people going to wake up and stop watching that garbage?

The approach by the USG in this case was restrained and it cost the tax payers even more. No big deal for an entitled big shot like Cliven Bundy. The Bundy's had already threatened the federal agents with lethal force. That's why they showed up armed. WTF do you expect? A bunch of lemmings on this site are just going along with the anti-government narrative. Doesn't match the facts though.

A heavy handed approach would be to raid him in the middle of the night and arrest him for tax fraud and destruction of property.

a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

You are screwed up...it's not HIS land but land the state said he could use, its "federal" land, yours and mine. Grasping much?

and by the way, I am apolitical. I dont subscribe to the obvious duping that the two parties enact on the people.

a reply to: JonButtonIII

The people of America are under attack on all fronts. There's an agenda at work here--to dumb down and distract the population while accelerating the collapse of this once-great nation. And sadly, it appears to be working. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Is that how you see things? I see things differently. I see the US losing all credibility as a democracy on Nov. 22 1963. The US is a Fascist state with shadow government controlling everything. The goal is world domination so corporations can feed. It's all about the US and their political appendages. The people were stupid enough to get snowed on JFK, RFK and MLK. The Deep State doesn't want a collapse or bankruptcy. They want more wars and people to stay as stupid as they were in the 60's.

originally posted by: InverseLookingGlass

Is that how you see things? I see things differently. I see the US losing all credibility as a democracy on Nov. 22 1963. The US is a Fascist state with shadow government controlling everything. The goal is world domination so corporations can feed. It's all about the US and their political appendages. The people were stupid enough to get snowed on JFK, RFK and MLK. The Deep State doesn't want a collapse or bankruptcy. They want more wars and people to stay as stupid as they were in the 60's.

Starred you--that's a fair perspective, and either of us could be right.

It all depends on where the real Dr. Evil (the puppetmaster(s) on the throne pulling the strings) has his lair. If it's in the bowels of the US, then your theory is likely correct. I on the other hand believe the true shot-callers are international oligarchs like the Rothschilds, who owe allegiance to no state and only want to collapse economies to enslave nations, the old "Order out of Chaos" shtick.

I think that while the US has long been a willing puppet of this cabal, TPTRB (the powers that REALLY be) have long seen the economic independence of the US as a threat to true global government. They're bringing the whole house of cards down in order to rebuild it in a darker image, and the deep state within the US that loves wars and control and domination is just playing right into their hands.

It's all schemes within schemes. Where does the rabbithole end? We'll all find out eventually.

With our economic system Zero debt is impossible simply because there isn't enough money in circulation to pay off our debt. The government needs to take over the Federal Reserve and just erase the debt. Because the debt is just make believe anyway the Fed Reserve just creates the money out of thin air we can erase the debt the same way.

a reply to: KnowledgeSeeker81
you ignore 1 major point..these guys,the gov't guys,get paid to either do nothing,or to go to the bundy ranch! Really,they get paid to do nothing,or go on an operation! I'm glad you realize that Bundy is a major squatter on BLM land,and all his friends and other ranchers pay the fee's,what made him SPECIAL!!?? He believes that its state land..what if he paid the state,and they turn it over to the BLM?? ISSUE SOLVED!! Being a racist is not illegal,using public property for personal gain is

This guy here explains it pretty dern well.
In fact I seem to agree with at least 99 percent of what this guy has to say in all of his videos.
You see, when I see someone who I perceive to be an old soul, I listen to what they have to say.
Here is his take on the whole thing.
Long vid but well worth the time spent.

a reply to: blkcwbyhat

Here's the fun thing about the Bundy case that nearly everyone overlooks.

In one camp you've got a group of pro-Constitutionlist libertarians who argue Bundy is right and should have to pay nothing.

In the other you've got statists (admittedly a broad generalization, but bear with me--it won't vitiate my real point) who argue that Bundy should have to cough up the cash.

To the latter I ask: Why do you care? That money Bundy allegedly owes isn't going to you. It isn't going to your kids. It isn't going to your communities, schools, or neighbors. Nope, not one dime.

Instead, it's going into the coffers of a war-hungry government that can ALREADY (and already does!) print all the money it wants. That money would just be going to fund war, killing, death, destruction, and further encroachment upon your few remaining liberties.

Do you want that? Really?

What you're actually arguing is that because the government robbed you (and you consented to it!), the government should be allowed to rob everyone. You're just evidencing anger and frustration because Bundy did what you didn't have the courage to do--stand up, exert sovereignty, and refuse to be trampled underfoot.

You want to punish someone for that? Hell, I want to applaud it.

Many people have offered to pay the fees for bundy. They are not allowed to pay on his account without first getting bundy to sign some papers. This is not about money because the feds have spent millions to collect grazing fees that amount to less than three hundred thousand and only grew to around a million days before the raid. One reason he never paid the fees is because he saw that the feds were not holding up to their end. A very simular feeling to what you have posted but he has made more than a statement. He brings up a few good points and that is why in the first place was the feds able to out bid him for the tract of land when up for auction. It serves no purpose to we the people such as defined by the spirit of the law allowing the feds to own land anywhere and that is hospitals and such. Yes they legally have done this in the sense that they are able to make up the rules along the way. So then any attempt to stand against this is seen as stealing and such to the point that many would turn a blind eye to murder of him or supporters. We have to understand that anyony attempt to stand against out of control gov. will be met with spin and riddicule to the point of unbelief. It is possible to spin any personality in the world to be someone worthy of hate and non support.

a reply to: KnowledgeSeeker81

This is not about Bundy owing money. This is about the endgame of the government with respect to that property. What they want to use PUBLIC land for, without the PUBLIC being able to decide. Bundy is standing up to the government encroachment. He is saying "NO" when all the other ranchers rolled over and let the government run them out of business.

Yet you and people like you will use a broad brush to paint Bundy as a "crook", essentially parroting the MSM. There need to be more Cliven Bundys to stand up to the tyranny, quite frankly. And he got some, didn't he? There are people that will stand with him with regard to the BIG PICTURE.

originally posted by: buster2010
With our economic system Zero debt is impossible simply because there isn't enough money in circulation to pay off our debt. The government needs to take over the Federal Reserve and just erase the debt. Because the debt is just make believe anyway the Fed Reserve just creates the money out of thin air we can erase the debt the same way.

Ah this is the first time I have noticed that someone gets it, when the fed loans the USA money for the sake of ease, lets just say $100.00 add the interest of again for ease in understanding the interest is 3%. Now the USA owes the fed $103.00 where is that $3.00 going to come from? Now we start paying interest on that %3.00 You are brilliant my friend I have the hardest time trying to explain the evil of this to people all the time.

They always talk about the fix being in amongst the rich this is the real fix, we are screwed, blued, and tattooed. It never will be paid back. Cha Ching How many people even know the FED is a private concern. Sneaky tards they are.

Now imagine the Fed loans money to banks through the discount window at less than 1%, the bank gives you a credit card and the latest news is the interest rate is about 21%. They are worse than the mob.

The whole non-backed money is another very large discussion, but if you can type you to can create money for the FED.

originally posted by: ScientiaFortisDefendit
a reply to: KnowledgeSeeker81

This is not about Bundy owing money. This is about the endgame of the government with respect to that property. What they want to use PUBLIC land for, without the PUBLIC being able to decide. Bundy is standing up to the government encroachment. He is saying "NO" when all the other ranchers rolled over and let the government run them out of business.

Yet you and people like you will use a broad brush to paint Bundy as a "crook", essentially parroting the MSM. There need to be more Cliven Bundys to stand up to the tyranny, quite frankly. And he got some, didn't he? There are people that will stand with him with regard to the BIG PICTURE.

I really REALLY could care less about Bundy TBH. The way I compare that is to me driving a car, I go get a license, register my car, and get insurance. Those are FEES I must pay to legally drive. I can choose NOT to pay them and drive illegally but then I must face any consequences for that action. Bundy was making money and didn't want to pay the FEES associated with making that money.

As far as the public land issue, couldn't agree more. Any actions regarding public land should be voted on and decided by the public.

I'm just saying that I have yet to see the billed amount.

The number thrown around seems like it is just hearsay.

If anyone has the actual bill amount and not some propaganda article stating he owes this because someone says so, can you please provide me a link.

Thank you.

a reply to: liejunkie01

The 1990's court orders set the amount per head, per day for violation. $200 I believe. That's with BLM actively watching and recording his herd since 1993 and when the grazing fees stopped being paid, so I'd guess they have a pretty decent count.

IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that Plaintiff UnitedStates shall be entitled to trespass damages from Bundy in the amount of $200.00 per day per head for any livestock belonging to Bundy remaining on the Bunkerville Allotment after November 30, 1998.

Source

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Thank you for that info wrabbit.

It seems like it is a pretty big chunk owed.

I haven't seen that before.