God is the true DEVIL. Lucifer, not so much...

Why is it that god (christian god of the old testament) commits such evils while lucifer/satan does nothing but "tempt"?

lets see a few examples of the horrible things god does and see if anyone can find something the devil did that is even on par.


Isaiah 13:15-18: Anyone who is captured will be run through with a sword. Their little children will be dashed to death right before their eyes. Their homes will be sacked and their wives raped by the attacking hordes. For I will stir up the Medes against Babylon, and no amount of silver or gold will buy them off. The attacking armies will shoot down the young people with arrows. They will have no mercy on helpless babies and will show no compassion for the children

wow! pretty sick and twisted for a divine being!!!


2 Kings 2:23-24: The prophet Elisha, was being picked on by some young boys from the city because of his bald head. The prophet turned around and cursed them in the Lords name. Then, two female bears came out of the woods and killed forty-two of them. You would think that God could understand that sometimes the youthful make childish jokes. Calling someone “bald head” is far from being worthy of death.


Exodus 12:29: God killed, intentionally, every first-born child of every family in Egypt, simply because he was upset at the Pharaoh. And god caused the Pharaoh’s actions in the first place. Since when is it appropriate to murder children for their ruler’s forced action?

Scholars estimate this would account for tens of thousands based on the population of Egyptians that were not Jewish.

1 Kings 20:35-36: Meanwhile, the LORD instructed one of the group of prophets to say to another man, "Strike me!" But the man refused to strike the prophet. Then the prophet told him, "Because you have not obeyed the voice of the LORD, a lion will kill you as soon as you leave me." And sure enough, when he had gone, a lion attacked and killed him.

What did God get bored or something?



Well now does anybody have any scripture showing lucifer running around committing such evils?

If so post them below.


How can you people worship such an evil entity? Obviously the threat of eternal hellfire is enough to keep you from seeing the evil your god is all about.

Kind of like how a certain dictator started committing horrid evils and the population just cosigned it. Letting a large amount of their population get sent to a dark place to be tortured and gassed. Just because they were of jewish descent and had different beliefs.

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare
The entity In the OT was not God... Nor are the OT books Christian...

the people of the OT did not know God until his son arrived on the scene...

Don't you find it a little ironic that "God" had a sudden change of heart once someone who actually knew him came to us?

Suddenly God required mercy not sacrifice...

Its pretty obvious IF one actually reads the book

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

This idea has been an increasingly popular one that reoccurs on ATS fairly often. It never ends well.

The premise is simple when I point this out to others. If you read the bible without any 3rd-party input about who the "good guy" is supposed to be, you would come to the conclusion that the OT god was a god of war, fear, and hate. Satan (who's identity is hard to consolidate as one being to begin with) is the one who tests the god and pushes to show the world how far he'll go to fulfill his own jealous rage.

With his interaction with Jesus, he seems to try to save him from his father by providing him some alluring ways out of his impending doom.

It's not nearly as black and white as the church would have people think.

a reply to: Akragon

Perhaps Jesus was sent to ask us to forgive his father's sins, not the other way round.

Let's not forget what he ordered his people to do to the the Amalekites.

1 Samuel 15
3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

The OT god showed no mercy when it came to his enemies. This flies in the face of what Jesus teaches us.

Matthew 5
7 Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.

Matthew 5
44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you

How Christians can possibly believe Jesus prayed to Yahweh is beyond me. All evidence points toward Jesus' Father and Yahweh being different entities.

a reply to: Akragon

Wait what?

The books of Old Testament (Genesis, Exodus and so on) is not Christian?
Then what on Earth are they doing in the Bible?

And yes, I know the scriptures were Jewish, but so was Jesus ...

a reply to: Cuervo

I see this as a good thing, it shows that people are starting to wake up to the deception.

originally posted by: igloo
a reply to: Akragon

Perhaps Jesus was sent to ask us to forgive his father's sins, not the other way round.

No...

he was sent to reveal the true God... and relieve man of his false beliefs, such as animal sacrifices... the idea of revenge taught in the OT ( an eye for an eye) and many other things...

God is NOT a tyrant... he is merciful and kind...

Unless you believe the words of God are in the OT... Then God is a maniac, bent on making life complicated and literally a living hell on earth

originally posted by: DupontDeux
a reply to: Akragon

Wait what?

The books of Old Testament (Genesis, Exodus and so on) is not Christian?
Then what on Earth are they doing in the Bible?

And yes, I know the scriptures were Jewish, but so was Jesus ...

Jesus was born into Judaism but he was hardly a good practicing Jew... IF you're of that faith you follow the rules set down by Moses... Jesus did not, he changed them... broke them... and gave the real rules that have always been in place..

I was born into Christianity... but I am no Christian...

Just because all these books are under one cover does not mean they belong there...

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

Someone posted this same thing the other day, and as was already said, it comes up here fairly often. Ultimately, the premise requires faith, and even then it is still unproveable either way.

Personally I find the idea of gods devils and religions irrelevant. But, if I had to buy into an idea, I think I like the situation posed by Anne Rice in the novel Memnoch the Devil. I thought it was entertaining at least.

To add to the topic, I'd argue that Jesus is in fact Lucifer, or the "light bearer". He calls himself the light of the world which literally means he bears the light.

Funny enough, we are also light bearers ourselves, so we could be considered Lucifer as well, meaning we are equal ground with Jesus.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
To add to the topic, I'd argue that Jesus is in fact Lucifer, or the "light bearer". He calls himself the light of the world which literally means he bears the light.

Funny enough, we are also light bearers ourselves, so we could be considered Lucifer as well, meaning we are equal ground with Jesus.

That would totally make sense if you didn't have to explain the conversation between him and Satan on that hilltop. If not for that one scene, Jesus being Satan would totally fit. He certainly has more in common with Lucifer than the OT god, especially if you believe that the serpent who liberated Adam and Eve is the same being as Satan.

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

Maybe you should read the verses before the one you quoted. Like these ones

"I will punish the world for it's evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; I will halt the arrogance of the proud, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible - Isaiah 13;11

God is willing to punish evil with evil. But you know whats also funny? Just before that verse Isaiah makes a reference to something which is also revealed in revelation so how can the God of the old Testament not be the God of the New Testament?

For the stars of heaven and their constellations will not give their light; the sun will be darkened in it's going forth, and the moon will not cause it's light to shine - Isaiah 13;10

a reply to: Cuervo

Lucifer isn't called Satan until after his fall. Satan and Lucifer are the same entity in the same way that hot and cold are opposite ends of one spectrum in my opinion. Lucifer represents harmony and balance, Satan represents greed and tipping the scale in his favor.

Those who do their best to live in harmony with nature can be considered Lucifer, those who take more than they need based on greed can be considered to be Satan. Humans do not live in harmony with nature any longer, this is the fall that Genesis speaks of where Lucifer is transformed (fallen) into Satan.

Jesus (Lucifer) being tempted by Satan is a metaphor for the struggle we all go through, that is the ego trying to take control.

Hope that makes sense.

a reply to: DarknStormy

how hypocritical of the OT God... he will punish the world for its evil... and yet in the same book


Isaiah 45:7

King James Version (KJV)


7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.

Ain't that nifty...

originally posted by: Cuervo

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
To add to the topic, I'd argue that Jesus is in fact Lucifer, or the "light bearer". He calls himself the light of the world which literally means he bears the light.

Funny enough, we are also light bearers ourselves, so we could be considered Lucifer as well, meaning we are equal ground with Jesus.

That would totally make sense if you didn't have to explain the conversation between him and Satan on that hilltop. If not for that one scene, Jesus being Satan would totally fit. He certainly has more in common with Lucifer than the OT god, especially if you believe that the serpent who liberated Adam and Eve is the same being as Satan.

Just to add flavor born out of nothing but a thought on this moment, maybe SATAN and JESUS, are one entity battling itself, and Satan is the EGO that Jesus overcomes on that mountaintop. A moment where he truly accomplishes divinity because he defeats in him the desire for the "material wealth" which he knew was "evil." The conversation happening, none the less, but not in the way it is envisioned when written. Thoughts?

**Ah, yes, I see Enligtened One presented this same idea several posts above mine, as I was writing, and I completely agree with what they said.

The biggest serial killing by god was the flood that killed every human and animal and plant on earth, except for a few members of one family. Satan, if there is such a cat, must have been shaking his head at the hideousness of this deed. Drowning everything that lived on land, I'm surprised he didn't have it in for the ocean life as well.

originally posted by: TheSparrowSings

originally posted by: Cuervo

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
To add to the topic, I'd argue that Jesus is in fact Lucifer, or the "light bearer". He calls himself the light of the world which literally means he bears the light.

Funny enough, we are also light bearers ourselves, so we could be considered Lucifer as well, meaning we are equal ground with Jesus.

That would totally make sense if you didn't have to explain the conversation between him and Satan on that hilltop. If not for that one scene, Jesus being Satan would totally fit. He certainly has more in common with Lucifer than the OT god, especially if you believe that the serpent who liberated Adam and Eve is the same being as Satan.

Just to add flavor born out of nothing but a thought on this moment, maybe SATAN and JESUS, are one entity battling itself, and Satan is the EGO that Jesus overcomes on that mountaintop. A moment where he truly accomplishes divinity because he defeats in him the desire for the "material wealth" which he knew was "evil." The conversation happening, none the less, but not in the way it is envisioned when written. Thoughts?

So Satan is Jesus's Tyler Durden?

a reply to: TheSparrowSings

My thoughts exactly. Jesus rejecting Satan's offers are him denying his own ego, something we must all face at one point or another. Those who embrace the light follow in Jesus' (Lucifer's) footsteps, those who embrace the darkness follow in Satan's (ego's) footsteps.

originally posted by: Cuervo

originally posted by: TheSparrowSings

originally posted by: Cuervo

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
To add to the topic, I'd argue that Jesus is in fact Lucifer, or the "light bearer". He calls himself the light of the world which literally means he bears the light.

Funny enough, we are also light bearers ourselves, so we could be considered Lucifer as well, meaning we are equal ground with Jesus.

That would totally make sense if you didn't have to explain the conversation between him and Satan on that hilltop. If not for that one scene, Jesus being Satan would totally fit. He certainly has more in common with Lucifer than the OT god, especially if you believe that the serpent who liberated Adam and Eve is the same being as Satan.

Just to add flavor born out of nothing but a thought on this moment, maybe SATAN and JESUS, are one entity battling itself, and Satan is the EGO that Jesus overcomes on that mountaintop. A moment where he truly accomplishes divinity because he defeats in him the desire for the "material wealth" which he knew was "evil." The conversation happening, none the less, but not in the way it is envisioned when written. Thoughts?

So Satan is Jesus's Tyler Durden?

Then Marla must be Mary Magdalene