It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Russian Orthodox Church is just a smokescreen
page: 2share:
I really wish that people would learn how to read.
Catholics cannot be Masons. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying to you.
There's your proof -- anyone who says that a Jesuit or other Catholic is a Freemason is lying, because the act of joining the Masons automatically excommunicates them from the church, so they are no longer a Jesuit or Catholic.
Catholics cannot be Masons. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying to you.
In the 1917 Canon Law, it explicitly says:
Therefore the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic association remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who enrol in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion. (Vatican.va)
Canon 2335 reads as follows:
Persons joining associations of the Masonic sect or any others of the same kind which plot against the Church and legitimate civil authorities contract ipso facto excommunication simply reserved to the Apostolic See. (Source)
There's your proof -- anyone who says that a Jesuit or other Catholic is a Freemason is lying, because the act of joining the Masons automatically excommunicates them from the church, so they are no longer a Jesuit or Catholic.
a reply to: adjensen
Isn´t everything related Secret societies within secret sociaties and what is common to all of these societies is to achieve power and control ?
Adam Weishaupt had jesuit schooling.. founder of Illuminati and also a member of masonic lodge in munich.
Isn´t everything related Secret societies within secret sociaties and what is common to all of these societies is to achieve power and control ?
Adam Weishaupt had jesuit schooling.. founder of Illuminati and also a member of masonic lodge in munich.
a reply to: dollukka
I have no idea.
I am merely pointing out that a Catholic cannot be a Mason, because Canon Law says that if a Catholic joins the Masons, they are kicked out of the church and, thus, are no longer a Catholic. Canon Law applies to everyone, whether Benedictine, Jesuit, Carmelite or the Pope himself.
And since the Jesuits run a lot of schools, merely making a connection between someone to them because they went to such an institution doesn't really mean anything. Someone pointed out that President Obama had a Jesuit influence his life at some point, but that sure doesn't mean that the President is a friend of the Catholic Church (if he was, they wouldn't have to sue his administration over the health care mandate.)
Isn´t everything related Secret societies within secret sociaties and what is common to all of these societies is to achieve power and control ?
I have no idea.
I am merely pointing out that a Catholic cannot be a Mason, because Canon Law says that if a Catholic joins the Masons, they are kicked out of the church and, thus, are no longer a Catholic. Canon Law applies to everyone, whether Benedictine, Jesuit, Carmelite or the Pope himself.
And since the Jesuits run a lot of schools, merely making a connection between someone to them because they went to such an institution doesn't really mean anything. Someone pointed out that President Obama had a Jesuit influence his life at some point, but that sure doesn't mean that the President is a friend of the Catholic Church (if he was, they wouldn't have to sue his administration over the health care mandate.)
a reply to: adjensen
This very church beats the legal system of USA by protecting pedofile priests by saying that what is spoken between priests and bishops is considered as confession ( confession has no base on bible and was created for controlling people in about 300 ad ) .
What Catholic church has been good at is cover ups
This very church beats the legal system of USA by protecting pedofile priests by saying that what is spoken between priests and bishops is considered as confession ( confession has no base on bible and was created for controlling people in about 300 ad ) .
What Catholic church has been good at is cover ups
originally posted by: adjensen
a reply to: dollukka
That's not really relevant to the question of whether Jesuits can be Freemasons, or whether Jesuits have infiltrated the Russian Orthodox Church, is it?
How predictable can you get?
Whenever someone gets too close to the truth, it's always either not relevant or it's off topic.
The only ones arguing the fact that Jesuits have infiltrated everything are those in total complete denial.
a reply to: adjensen Well I thought the Jesuits were kind of a missionary group which means they were probably trained how to
learn languages .I know for a fact that some Jesuits don't excel within the group and some will have a expertise depending on the field of work . I
had asked if they had been disbanded .Have you any knowledge of this?
a reply to: the2ofusr1
They were suppressed by Pope Clement XIV in 1773 and restored in 1814. No, they have not been disbanded, though, like all religious orders of the Catholic Church, their numbers are in decline -- there are about 2,500 Jesuits in the United States, and less than 20,000 in the world, today. Hardly a force of global domination, no matter what the paranoid delusional types will tell you.
Yes, though from your question I don't think that you understand what indulgences are -- they are based on the belief that holy acts in this life (like spending an hour in prayer, or following the Stations of the Cross during Lent) aid oneself or others with the temporal penalty in the afterlife. Anti-Catholics claim that indulgences amount to "selling salvation", but that is not, nor has it ever been, the case.
I had asked if they had been disbanded .Have you any knowledge of this?
They were suppressed by Pope Clement XIV in 1773 and restored in 1814. No, they have not been disbanded, though, like all religious orders of the Catholic Church, their numbers are in decline -- there are about 2,500 Jesuits in the United States, and less than 20,000 in the world, today. Hardly a force of global domination, no matter what the paranoid delusional types will tell you.
What is to say that maybe they pay a indulgence fee ? The RC do allow for indulgences don't they ?
Yes, though from your question I don't think that you understand what indulgences are -- they are based on the belief that holy acts in this life (like spending an hour in prayer, or following the Stations of the Cross during Lent) aid oneself or others with the temporal penalty in the afterlife. Anti-Catholics claim that indulgences amount to "selling salvation", but that is not, nor has it ever been, the case.
a reply to: the2ofusr1
Are you unfamiliar with google? There are plenty of sources of information on what happened 300 years ago, here's one: Why were the Jesuits suppressed?
Why did the RCC supress the Jesuits ?
Are you unfamiliar with google? There are plenty of sources of information on what happened 300 years ago, here's one: Why were the Jesuits suppressed?
a reply to: adjensen I will use quotes from your article " In 1773, they were suppressed across the world by Pope Clement
XIV" How did he suppress them here in North America at that time ? " Happily, 41 years later, another pope Pius VII undid the suppression" So
in 1814 the Jesuits were no longer suppressed in NA and what did they do next ?
Your article goes into a prior history of the RC and the pope that does nothing to clarify the reason for the creation of the Jesuit order but it's safe to say it wasn't to protect the popes image but to destroy the truth the Protestant reformation had brought to light .
" A hundred years after their foundation, the Jesuits were influential in every court in Catholic Europe. They were confessors to the king, his confidential advisers. Their books and catechisms were read everywhere. Their preaching and spiritual teaching had changed the face of popular religiosity. Their schools introduced the young to the humanities and the new sciences, and trained them in opera and theater.
The newly discovered regions of Asia and the Americas offered even greater opportunities for innovation. In Brazil, Paraguay and Argentina, the Jesuits set up enclaves (‘reductions’) where the native peoples could live in security and autonomy, away from the aggression of European colonialists. This the Spanish and Portuguese governments bitterly resented." So you can see that the Jesuits occupied most institutions of influence and were not just a European base .Russia would not have been a side note to the whole world as that seems to have been what they had in mind .
" In China, Jesuit missionaries had the ear of the emperor, and strove to reinterpret Catholic doctrine to an ancient and sophisticated culture (‘the Chinese Rites’). In India, they attempted unsuccessfully to convert the Mughal emperor himself. Scholars like DeNobili made inroads into Hindu philosophy and theology (‘the Malabar Rites’) trying to adapt Christian doctrine to the patterns of another civilization." Yea all in the name of Christ right .But you will notice that they were skilled in language and other religions .They were chosen out of their schools to infiltrate and put themselves inside and on both sides .
"To support the missions which they had started, the Jesuits also invested heavily in trade, in China and Japan as well as in the Caribbean. Their earnings made them the rivals of other traders and of government officials, and the envy of other religious orders" Tell me that is not like modern day bankers and Corporations if you can.
"For behind the antagonism towards the Jesuits lay a greater hostility to the Roman papacy. The Protestant states of Europe had shaken off papal control; the Catholic monarchies of France, Spain, Portugal, Naples and Sicily longed to do the same. So the Society not only faced the hatred of governments hostile to the papacy, who saw the Jesuits as the Pope’s ‘sword arm’, but also of a weak papacy under Clement XIV, who finally capitulated to the demands of the monarchies of Spain, France and Portugal to suppress the Jesuits." So plan "B" was to not be outwardly a Jesuit but one inwardly .
"The Society was first banned in Portugal in 1759. In 1773 the ban was extended to all Catholic countries. In fact, the only two places where the suppressed Society continued, and even flourished untouched by papal sanction, were Protestant Prussia and Orthodox Russia!" Well hello . My first guess may have been closer to the mark then I thought .
"In 1776, the American War of Independence created the first non-monarchical government in the Western world " You would think that despite the founding fathers borrowing from a non Monarchical Govt already in existence on the continent they would know seeing the Jesuits had been studying the different forms of Governance the different Indian tribes had in use at the time .But the world revolves around Rome and so we can understand that statement .
And the final "As one historian put it: “The very moment when the world was in motion was the moment they, the Jesuits, chose to stand still.” No they did not .they simple took off the black garb and put on suit and tie .
Your article goes into a prior history of the RC and the pope that does nothing to clarify the reason for the creation of the Jesuit order but it's safe to say it wasn't to protect the popes image but to destroy the truth the Protestant reformation had brought to light .
" A hundred years after their foundation, the Jesuits were influential in every court in Catholic Europe. They were confessors to the king, his confidential advisers. Their books and catechisms were read everywhere. Their preaching and spiritual teaching had changed the face of popular religiosity. Their schools introduced the young to the humanities and the new sciences, and trained them in opera and theater.
The newly discovered regions of Asia and the Americas offered even greater opportunities for innovation. In Brazil, Paraguay and Argentina, the Jesuits set up enclaves (‘reductions’) where the native peoples could live in security and autonomy, away from the aggression of European colonialists. This the Spanish and Portuguese governments bitterly resented." So you can see that the Jesuits occupied most institutions of influence and were not just a European base .Russia would not have been a side note to the whole world as that seems to have been what they had in mind .
" In China, Jesuit missionaries had the ear of the emperor, and strove to reinterpret Catholic doctrine to an ancient and sophisticated culture (‘the Chinese Rites’). In India, they attempted unsuccessfully to convert the Mughal emperor himself. Scholars like DeNobili made inroads into Hindu philosophy and theology (‘the Malabar Rites’) trying to adapt Christian doctrine to the patterns of another civilization." Yea all in the name of Christ right .But you will notice that they were skilled in language and other religions .They were chosen out of their schools to infiltrate and put themselves inside and on both sides .
"To support the missions which they had started, the Jesuits also invested heavily in trade, in China and Japan as well as in the Caribbean. Their earnings made them the rivals of other traders and of government officials, and the envy of other religious orders" Tell me that is not like modern day bankers and Corporations if you can.
"For behind the antagonism towards the Jesuits lay a greater hostility to the Roman papacy. The Protestant states of Europe had shaken off papal control; the Catholic monarchies of France, Spain, Portugal, Naples and Sicily longed to do the same. So the Society not only faced the hatred of governments hostile to the papacy, who saw the Jesuits as the Pope’s ‘sword arm’, but also of a weak papacy under Clement XIV, who finally capitulated to the demands of the monarchies of Spain, France and Portugal to suppress the Jesuits." So plan "B" was to not be outwardly a Jesuit but one inwardly .
"The Society was first banned in Portugal in 1759. In 1773 the ban was extended to all Catholic countries. In fact, the only two places where the suppressed Society continued, and even flourished untouched by papal sanction, were Protestant Prussia and Orthodox Russia!" Well hello . My first guess may have been closer to the mark then I thought .
"In 1776, the American War of Independence created the first non-monarchical government in the Western world " You would think that despite the founding fathers borrowing from a non Monarchical Govt already in existence on the continent they would know seeing the Jesuits had been studying the different forms of Governance the different Indian tribes had in use at the time .But the world revolves around Rome and so we can understand that statement .
And the final "As one historian put it: “The very moment when the world was in motion was the moment they, the Jesuits, chose to stand still.” No they did not .they simple took off the black garb and put on suit and tie .
a reply to: the2ofusr1
Of course that's why they were created -- defense of Catholic theology was one of their stated goals.
What's your point? Catholics aren't entitled to defend their beliefs?
And what does any of this have to do with the Russian Orthodox Church? If you have evidence that it's a smokescreen for Jesuit duplicity in Russia, present it.
it's safe to say it wasn't to protect the popes image but to destroy the truth the Protestant reformation had brought to light
Of course that's why they were created -- defense of Catholic theology was one of their stated goals.
What's your point? Catholics aren't entitled to defend their beliefs?
And what does any of this have to do with the Russian Orthodox Church? If you have evidence that it's a smokescreen for Jesuit duplicity in Russia, present it.
a reply to: adjensen Attacking a opponent is not the same as defending ones self .The Jesuits were created to attack and destroy
the Protestant reformation and they couldn't so they went fifth coloum and work at doing so from the inside . As for this thread and the topic I gave
my opinion and that is all it was . I could provide plenty of sources to suggest that this might be the case but I don't have a document by them
stating it .
a reply to: the2ofusr1
There is no need for shadowy Jesuit conspiracies to account for the decline of Protestant churches -- they're doing it to themselves by adopting liberal policies and catering to the desires of the world. I left the Methodist church in 2012, largely because it had become nothing more than a social club whose stands on moral issues were decided by Conference elections every four years, not on sound theology. And, as the Jesuits were founded about 500 years ago and the self-destruction of mainline Protestantism is just in the last 30 years or so, either they have nothing to do with it, or they're the least effective "fifth column" in history.
The Jesuits were created to attack and destroy the Protestant reformation and they couldn't so they went fifth coloum and work at doing so from the inside
There is no need for shadowy Jesuit conspiracies to account for the decline of Protestant churches -- they're doing it to themselves by adopting liberal policies and catering to the desires of the world. I left the Methodist church in 2012, largely because it had become nothing more than a social club whose stands on moral issues were decided by Conference elections every four years, not on sound theology. And, as the Jesuits were founded about 500 years ago and the self-destruction of mainline Protestantism is just in the last 30 years or so, either they have nothing to do with it, or they're the least effective "fifth column" in history.
People of ATS should know, there is an organized effort in the west to
now paint everything Russian as evil, monstrous, bad, worth attacking etc.
Don't just jump onto bandwagons without considering if it really is true.
now paint everything Russian as evil, monstrous, bad, worth attacking etc.
Don't just jump onto bandwagons without considering if it really is true.
edit on 24-4-2014 by RadiationAndCancer because: (no reason
given)
originally posted by: beansidhe
a reply to: evilcommunist
This is a really interesting post, and it's a complicated area that I don't know much about. What do you think their (Old Believers) agenda is, and what would be the outcome of their gaining increased control in Russia?
Don't believe a word of it, there is complete separation between church and state in Russia.
Everything else is just fluff for the sake of presenting Russians as even MORE evil than they are usually presented.
a reply to: Murgatroid
I don't like your views but I really like your avatar, that's basically my face, except I am on the side of truth
I don't like your views but I really like your avatar, that's basically my face, except I am on the side of truth
originally posted by: RadiationAndCancer
a reply to: Murgatroid
I don't like your views but I really like your avatar, that's basically my face, except I am on the side of truth
Thanks R&C...
RIP George C. Scott.
This is a quote from the film that pic was borrowed from:
"Now, truth is not always a pleasant thing." ~ General "Buck" Turgidson
Is it too far fetched to believe that BOTH of us are perhaps on the side of truth?
new topics
-
Federal law trumps state and local law every time
Social Issues and Civil Unrest: 5 hours ago
top topics
-
Federal law trumps state and local law every time
Social Issues and Civil Unrest: 5 hours ago, 13 flags
active topics
-
Federal law trumps state and local law every time
Social Issues and Civil Unrest • 17 • : fringeofthefringe -
Elon Says It’s ‘Likely’ He Buys Tanking MSNBC
Political Ideology • 79 • : WeMustCare -
Nancy Pelosi Flips on Kamala Harris - says Election ‘Would Have Been Different’ if...
2024 Elections • 47 • : WeMustCare -
The Reactionary Conspiracy 13. The plot’s theology.
General Conspiracies • 313 • : andy06shake -
Comcast dumping MSNBC
Mainstream News • 32 • : WeMustCare -
Petition Calling for General Election at 564,016 and rising Fast
Political Issues • 93 • : Oldcarpy2 -
Anyone like the Scorpions?
Music • 19 • : gortex -
The Acronym Game .. Pt.4
General Chit Chat • 992 • : Moon68 -
Interesting Video-UFO?
Aliens and UFOs • 14 • : BeyondKnowledge3 -
Ed Dowd some good news
Medical Issues & Conspiracies • 39 • : chr0naut