Federal Judge to Women Lawyers: "Tone Down" How You Dress

Daughter2

Rosha
We don't exist in a vacuum of sterile proportions. Outside of what is covered by law, there is no such thing as a 'right' not to be offended in life, offense happens and ppl need to grow up learn to cope with it and let go of pettiness and sentimentalism of this low degree. What is it to you anyway what they wear? You're not wearing it!

Actually, it does matter what people wear.

You should dress in Court in a conservative manner.

It's not a male or female issue. Like I said if a man wore his pants too low and it showed his crack or a too tight shirt with his beer belly hanging out - it wouldn't be appropriate.

The "If you don't let me dress they way I want - it's discrimination" is a silly excuse. It's the same dress code for men and women. Only you would see very few men exposing their chests and legs.

And as why it should matter - it's because inappropriate dress DOES create a distraction. Courts deal with matters of life and death - the focus should be in the proceedings.

And men who wear "wife beaters"....like that isn't as discriminatory.

People who wear these things make a joke about domestic abuse, but it's their right to wear "wife beaters", I suppose the other poster might agree that is ok. Oh, just call it sleeveless t-shirts, except for those who still call it "wife beater". Should we say that a lawyer defending a man or woman who just killed their spouse for domestic abuse, can that lawyer wear a "Wife beater" knowing that is the slang term for it?

Yes, presentation is everything.

Daughter2

Rosha
We don't exist in a vacuum of sterile proportions. Outside of what is covered by law, there is no such thing as a 'right' not to be offended in life, offense happens and ppl need to grow up learn to cope with it and let go of pettiness and sentimentalism of this low degree. What is it to you anyway what they wear? You're not wearing it!

Actually, it does matter what people wear.

You should dress in Court in a conservative manner.

It's not a male or female issue. Like I said if a man wore his pants too low and it showed his crack or a too tight shirt with his beer belly hanging out - it wouldn't be appropriate.

The "If you don't let me dress they way I want - it's discrimination" is a silly excuse. It's the same dress code for men and women. Only you would see very few men exposing their chests and legs.

And as why it should matter - it's because inappropriate dress DOES create a distraction. Courts deal with matters of life and death - the focus should be in the proceedings.

That post was responding to a person who posted a 'people of walmart' video, not the court room issue, even so, this is about distractions you say? Hmm. Well there are millions of distractions every day in a court room and as far as I am concerned, if you cant do your job because of them then get out of there and let someone who can be adult in their focus do it.

I suggest others stop trying to bend the universe to please their sense of order control and 'standard' and learn to accept people are different and will think act and wear clothes differently to them, clothing ultimately has no bearing on what or who a person is. Time to get over it. Its specious reasoning to think that a person in a suit is better prepared more focused and 'of a standard' morally or otherwise that is higher or better than anyone else. It lends itself to a false sense of security and covers too many lies.

My attorney is a mad genius who wears mis-matching socks with Yosemite Sam on one leg and Tweety on the other and a tie that says 'parole parole' in bright blue with matching died hair. Not one word has ever been said to him to stop distracting the court. Distracting, by language manipulation, by attire, by misrepresentation of evidence, these are legitimate TACTICS in courts used ALL the time especially by men in suits!

This woman was harassed because the judge had a sexual response to what she was wearing. That response, is HIS problem..not hers.


Ro

Rosha

Daughter2

Rosha
We don't exist in a vacuum of sterile proportions. Outside of what is covered by law, there is no such thing as a 'right' not to be offended in life, offense happens and ppl need to grow up learn to cope with it and let go of pettiness and sentimentalism of this low degree. What is it to you anyway what they wear? You're not wearing it!

Actually, it does matter what people wear.

You should dress in Court in a conservative manner.

It's not a male or female issue. Like I said if a man wore his pants too low and it showed his crack or a too tight shirt with his beer belly hanging out - it wouldn't be appropriate.

The "If you don't let me dress they way I want - it's discrimination" is a silly excuse. It's the same dress code for men and women. Only you would see very few men exposing their chests and legs.

And as why it should matter - it's because inappropriate dress DOES create a distraction. Courts deal with matters of life and death - the focus should be in the proceedings.

That post was responding to a person who posted a 'people of walmart' video, not the court room issue, even so, this is about distractions you say? Hmm. Well there are millions of distractions every day in a court room and as far as I am concerned, if you cant do your job because of them then get out of there and let someone who can be adult in their focus do it.

I suggest others stop trying to bend the universe to please their sense of order control and 'standard' and learn to accept people are different and will think act and wear clothes differently to them, clothing ultimately has no bearing on what or who a person is. Time to get over it. Its specious reasoning to think that a person in a suit is better prepared more focused and 'of a standard' morally or otherwise that is higher or better than anyone else. It lends itself to a false sense of security and covers too many lies.

My attorney is a mad genius who wears mis-matching socks with Yosemite Sam on one leg and Tweety on the other and a tie that says 'parole parole' in bright blue with matching died hair. Not one word has ever been said to him to stop distracting the court. Distracting, by language manipulation, by attire, by misrepresentation of evidence, these are legitimate TACTICS in courts used ALL the time especially by men in suits!

This woman was harassed because the judge had a sexual response to what she was wearing. That response, is HIS problem..not hers.

rickynews reply: I'm not sure if I would be confident in my Attorney's ability knowing that he wears Yosemite Sam and Tweety Bird socks. However, if he wore matching Bugs Bunny socks, my confidence would be immediately restored. .
What's up Doc ?

Nephalim
Hmmph, we had one of our state legislators take off her shoes and put on sneakers during a filibuster.

far as Im concerned, at least in Texas, people can wear what they're comfortable in. That includes government. Boots, jeans, sweats, skirts, sweaters, t shirts.. doesn't bother me. Work gets done, respect is earned.

so long as if you're police officer, you're badge is visible

heh

edit on 11-4-2014 by Nephalim because: (no reason given)

as a Texan, I have had this conversation with others around here in the past.

In Dallas, as a male businessman, you attire should be slacks, black shoes, and a pastel linen button up shirt. They all wear the same things.

If you are in a more artistic business, you may opt instead for a striped linen shirt to show some flair. LOL. Uptown/downtown Dallas is as pretentious as you can get.

San Antonio and Austin is a little different.

Where I am, in the west, a polo is considered dressed up. Polo and jeans, and clean sneakers is "dressed up" for most. I typically wear a polo, slacks, and some black wingtips to work on most days. Maybe a short sleeve, button up Cuban or Island shirt. From time to time I will put on the jacket/tie. But that is less typical these days.

bigfatfurrytexan

Nephalim
Hmmph, we had one of our state legislators take off her shoes and put on sneakers during a filibuster.

far as Im concerned, at least in Texas, people can wear what they're comfortable in. That includes government. Boots, jeans, sweats, skirts, sweaters, t shirts.. doesn't bother me. Work gets done, respect is earned.

so long as if you're police officer, you're badge is visible

heh

edit on 11-4-2014 by Nephalim because: (no reason given)

as a Texan, I have had this conversation with others around here in the past.

In Dallas, as a male businessman, you attire should be slacks, black shoes, and a pastel linen button up shirt. They all wear the same things.

If you are in a more artistic business, you may opt instead for a striped linen shirt to show some flair. LOL. Uptown/downtown Dallas is as pretentious as you can get.

San Antonio and Austin is a little different.

Where I am, in the west, a polo is considered dressed up. Polo and jeans, and clean sneakers is "dressed up" for most. I typically wear a polo, slacks, and some black wingtips to work on most days. Maybe a short sleeve, button up Cuban or Island shirt. From time to time I will put on the jacket/tie. But that is less typical these days.

Yeah, but you live in a fricken hot state...lol.

I know the more Texas business presentation means also the Stetson and bolo. I would assume it also means the type of business. In this thread it is about what is appropriate in court. Men can't wear those Stetsons in court though.

Last night I hosted a Seder and people asked me what to wear, when I told them to dress up, they asked me how. I had to explain they needed to wear what they would to church. I was the only one wearing a dress. This was a formal dinner with tradition, but I was the hostess, what would it have looked like if I, the hostess, would wear something not respectful of the formality and tradition?

I don't have family members living close by, except two brothers, and so this dinner was presented to the people in my building, because we are a community here. One of my brothers did come and this guy who does not like to dress up, at least wore a tie and dress slacks. He made an attempt to dress up though, because even he, who dresses like a bum all the rest of the time, recognized the formality and the tradition.

Rosha

Daughter2

Rosha
We don't exist in a vacuum of sterile proportions. Outside of what is covered by law, there is no such thing as a 'right' not to be offended in life, offense happens and ppl need to grow up learn to cope with it and let go of pettiness and sentimentalism of this low degree. What is it to you anyway what they wear? You're not wearing it!

Actually, it does matter what people wear.

You should dress in Court in a conservative manner.

It's not a male or female issue. Like I said if a man wore his pants too low and it showed his crack or a too tight shirt with his beer belly hanging out - it wouldn't be appropriate.

The "If you don't let me dress they way I want - it's discrimination" is a silly excuse. It's the same dress code for men and women. Only you would see very few men exposing their chests and legs.

And as why it should matter - it's because inappropriate dress DOES create a distraction. Courts deal with matters of life and death - the focus should be in the proceedings.

That post was responding to a person who posted a 'people of walmart' video, not the court room issue, even so, this is about distractions you say? Hmm. Well there are millions of distractions every day in a court room and as far as I am concerned, if you cant do your job because of them then get out of there and let someone who can be adult in their focus do it.

I suggest others stop trying to bend the universe to please their sense of order control and 'standard' and learn to accept people are different and will think act and wear clothes differently to them, clothing ultimately has no bearing on what or who a person is. Time to get over it. Its specious reasoning to think that a person in a suit is better prepared more focused and 'of a standard' morally or otherwise that is higher or better than anyone else. It lends itself to a false sense of security and covers too many lies.

My attorney is a mad genius who wears mis-matching socks with Yosemite Sam on one leg and Tweety on the other and a tie that says 'parole parole' in bright blue with matching died hair. Not one word has ever been said to him to stop distracting the court. Distracting, by language manipulation, by attire, by misrepresentation of evidence, these are legitimate TACTICS in courts used ALL the time especially by men in suits!

This woman was harassed because the judge had a sexual response to what she was wearing. That response, is HIS problem..not hers.


Ro

edit on 14-4-2014 by Rosha because: typo gremlins

So he dresses like a clown?

And that's supposed to make everyone have confidence in him? As a juror, I would be too distracted and have to be excused because I couldn't look at the facts presented. I'm sorry, but if someone chooses to dress like a clown, I am going to have to presume they are a clown.

WarminIndy

Rosha

Daughter2

Rosha
We don't exist in a vacuum of sterile proportions. Outside of what is covered by law, there is no such thing as a 'right' not to be offended in life, offense happens and ppl need to grow up learn to cope with it and let go of pettiness and sentimentalism of this low degree. What is it to you anyway what they wear? You're not wearing it!

Actually, it does matter what people wear.

You should dress in Court in a conservative manner.

It's not a male or female issue. Like I said if a man wore his pants too low and it showed his crack or a too tight shirt with his beer belly hanging out - it wouldn't be appropriate.

The "If you don't let me dress they way I want - it's discrimination" is a silly excuse. It's the same dress code for men and women. Only you would see very few men exposing their chests and legs.

And as why it should matter - it's because inappropriate dress DOES create a distraction. Courts deal with matters of life and death - the focus should be in the proceedings.

That post was responding to a person who posted a 'people of walmart' video, not the court room issue, even so, this is about distractions you say? Hmm. Well there are millions of distractions every day in a court room and as far as I am concerned, if you cant do your job because of them then get out of there and let someone who can be adult in their focus do it.

I suggest others stop trying to bend the universe to please their sense of order control and 'standard' and learn to accept people are different and will think act and wear clothes differently to them, clothing ultimately has no bearing on what or who a person is. Time to get over it. Its specious reasoning to think that a person in a suit is better prepared more focused and 'of a standard' morally or otherwise that is higher or better than anyone else. It lends itself to a false sense of security and covers too many lies.

My attorney is a mad genius who wears mis-matching socks with Yosemite Sam on one leg and Tweety on the other and a tie that says 'parole parole' in bright blue with matching died hair. Not one word has ever been said to him to stop distracting the court. Distracting, by language manipulation, by attire, by misrepresentation of evidence, these are legitimate TACTICS in courts used ALL the time especially by men in suits!

This woman was harassed because the judge had a sexual response to what she was wearing. That response, is HIS problem..not hers.


Ro

edit on 14-4-2014 by Rosha because: typo gremlins

So he dresses like a clown?

And that's supposed to make everyone have confidence in him? As a juror, I would be too distracted and have to be excused because I couldn't look at the facts presented. I'm sorry, but if someone chooses to dress like a clown, I am going to have to presume they are a clown.

All too often Perception, whether good or bad, becomes reality.

reply to post by WarminIndy


I work in an industry of suits. My boss wears suits that costs so far beyond what I would consider paying for a suit. I am a $750 suit kind of guy. He wears the $30k suits that one keeps for his entire lifetime.

Then again, my boss and I worked for 2 years together in jeans and tshirts while developing the property for this business. He'll be the first to tell you its all about image. When he thinks image matters, he has the diamond cuff links and all that nonsense. Anymore, image matters less and less to him. Perhaps that is the result of him living in Austin the last 15 years. He has taken on the local culture a little more.

There is pretentiousness to be found here in Texas. Even in West Texas. Ol' Claytie Williams swings through on a quarterly "swoop and poop", and the suits all dress up in their nicest finery to pucker his posterior.

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

I work in an industry of suits. My boss wears suits that costs so far beyond what I would consider paying for a suit. I am a $750 suit kind of guy. He wears the $30k suits that one keeps for his entire lifetime.

Then again, my boss and I worked for 2 years together in jeans and tshirts while developing the property for this business. He'll be the first to tell you its all about image. When he thinks image matters, he has the diamond cuff links and all that nonsense. Anymore, image matters less and less to him. Perhaps that is the result of him living in Austin the last 15 years. He has taken on the local culture a little more.

There is pretentiousness to be found here in Texas. Even in West Texas. Ol' Claytie Williams swings through on a quarterly "swoop and poop", and the suits all dress up in their nicest finery to pucker his posterior.

Wow, I can't imagine paying that much for a suit (but then again I don't have to) but paying $30k for a suit? As much as a car? That's a little overboard I think, but if you have the money then why not.

I think that as long as the suit is nice, then it can still look professional.

Really? $30k for a suit? Wow.

Pretentious.

reply to post by WarminIndy


that is what i said. He had a few made back in the early 80's. He said, "I was given the tailor for free, but paid for materials. So i ended up out of pocket 30k total for 90k worth of suits. The tailor told me, 'Im going to make you a suit you will wear the rest of your life'".

He was right. Those suits still look stunning. Fashionable, in good repair.

I don't own 30k worth of stuff if you remove my house/car. So i totally get what you are saying. I wouldn't dream of spending more than 1k on a suit, and even then it better be amazing. My spend on a jacket/pants is no more than $750. I am happy to find a blazer or sportcoat on sale for $50-$100. I am most happy not wearing any of that, and just in polo, slacks, and wingtips. I usually wear a desert digital camo jacket to work in the winter, actually.

originally posted by: Nephalim
Maybe the way people dress is up to the people wearing the clothes.

Ill stick with my original statement.