New Findings Connect Puma Punku To Every Known Alien Species

I have always found the idea of the reality of AA, based on that THEY HAD TO HAVE BUILT THESE STRUCTURES, kind of myopic in the light of the fact that ancient humans themselves weren’t idiots and very well may have had attributes far and beyond today’s science irrespective of the existence of AA or not.

reply to post by Willtell


I agree, and to prove the point that human beings can indeed move tremendously large stones, I think folks need to learn about "the Thunder Stone".

The Thunder Stone is sometimes claimed to be the "largest stone ever moved by man". This stone was large and heavy; it was effectively moved 6 km (3.7 mi) overland to the Gulf of Finland by manpower alone; no animals or machines were used. Transported by barge up the Neva River, it reached St. Petersburg. The entire effort is considered an historic engineering feat.

Due to the large size of the rock, the easiest way to measure its mass is to calculate it. According to the fall 1882 edition of La Nature, its dimensions before being cut were 7 × 14 × 9 m. Based on the density of granite, its mass was determined to be around 1500 tonnes.[8] Falconet had some of this cut away to make a wave-like shape, so the finished pedestal weighed slightly less. It is still the largest when compared to other large, sculpted stones...

You can learn more about it here: en.wikipedia.org...

I think this stone proves, once and for all, that human beings are very capable of moving very large stones, and also proves that the idea that "only aliens could do it" is based on bunk.

reply to post by DazDaKing


I'm back.

Since you agree to what is at least a rudimentary translation of the term Anunnaki, I suppose your other wrong-headed ideas (belief in the various - which one? - King's lists, transposing Berossus' Oannes onto Adapa [they are the same, but Oannes was the Assyrian version a thousand years later] and your odd belief in a "pre flood" civilization, when the archaeological record prior to Sumer is somewhat well-established) are slightly less annoying to me.

At any rate, can we agree that a figurine that appears to be from the Ubaidic period depicting some sort of snake demon (though identified as Pakistani, which would put it in the Indus Valley civilization timeframe) is not an "Anunnaki figurine?"

That was the point, after all. The OP's claims are utterly unsustainable.

Harte

speculativeoptimist
What's up with this guy on the bottom left? It looks terrified compared to the others.

That was the look on his face when they cut his head off lol....

The tall whites, forget if they call them something else, are missing. They look the most like us. They are not depicted, nor are the dreaded Reptilians.

Hey capt what is the tiger on the bag.....

The Bot

P. S. I see a lot of boo how whiney negative folks here who don't believe. The time is coming quickly where there will be disclosure. It won't come from ET but from our military. The triangle ships are ours and the cat is almost out of the bag.

For me i just don't get those who just refuse to believe. Thousands of sitings world wide every year, not mentioning going back in our history forever.

Recent scientific discoveries make it impossible for us to be alone. Yep, impossible. We now know there are literally billions of planets out there and it is mathematically impossible for there not to be other life. Loosen up, take a zanax, we are not alone lol.

dlbott

P. S. I see a lot of boo how whiney negative folks here who don't believe. The time is coming quickly where there will be disclosure. It won't come from ET but from our military. The triangle ships are ours and the cat is almost out of the bag.

For me i just don't get those who just refuse to believe. Thousands of sitings world wide every year, not mentioning going back in our history forever.

Recent scientific discoveries make it impossible for us to be alone. Yep, impossible. We now know there are literally billions of planets out there and it is mathematically impossible for there not to be other life. Loosen up, take a zanax, we are not alone lol.

edit on 5-4-2014 by dlbott because: (no reason given)

Well said dlbott, well said.

KanuTruth

dlbott

P. S. I see a lot of boo how whiney negative folks here who don't believe. The time is coming quickly where there will be disclosure. It won't come from ET but from our military. The triangle ships are ours and the cat is almost out of the bag.

For me i just don't get those who just refuse to believe. Thousands of sitings world wide every year, not mentioning going back in our history forever.

Recent scientific discoveries make it impossible for us to be alone. Yep, impossible. We now know there are literally billions of planets out there and it is mathematically impossible for there not to be other life. Loosen up, take a zanax, we are not alone lol.

edit on 5-4-2014 by dlbott because: (no reason given)

Well said dlbott, well said.

It isn't that I refuse to believe. Cripes, I've seen a UFO and have been researching the phenomenon for well over 50 years.

What bothers me is that these days, it's apparently in vogue to believe that human beings have accomplished absolutely nothing. Evidently our human ancestors never built a dang thing. It doesn't matter where I turn, or what ancient site is being discussed, somebody is always claiming "the aliens did it."

Truly, I have to wonder what sort of legacy we intend to leave our children. That human beings are nothing? That for all our inventiveness we have built nothing? Accomplished nothing?

Think about it, people. What you are teaching is that all the wonders of the world were accomplished by aliens, and we human peons amount to zilch.

Honestly, I think you've got to leave people with some sense of human pride, or the will to strive to do better, and to rise against all odds is simply dashed.

I think my HUMAN ancestors built places like Gobekli Tepi, and as long as I think that, I feel a sense of human awe and even pride. If I were a child again, to think that my ancestors could create something so remarkable would fill me with the ambition to create something that is equally as awe-inspiring.

Why take that away from people?

reply to post by KanuTruth


I will have to go with Riddles on this one.

I have also seen inexplicable phenomenon in the sky that was clearly an intelligent manifestation of some sorts. By whom I don't know, but it felt otherworldy.

It makes me less arrogant towards people that describe 'mystical' experiences, but it does not mean that I have to ascribe every mystical experience to the intervention of aliens.

Let me give you a few more tidbits of information on Tiwanaku/Puma Punku, to give you an idea of what was going on there.



Take a look at these two pictures. You see the hat or headdress on the middle head in the first picture (courtesy of speculativeoptimist) and on the stone statue in the second picture?

That headdress and a few other things allows us to identify them as shamans. We find the same headdresses depicted in shamanic rituals in the area of Titicaca and the Altiplano, it's a traditional outfit.

You see the things our stone statue shaman is holding in his hands? No, it's not a voodoo doll in one hand and a double cappuccino from Starbucks in the other. It's what we call snuff tablets. There are also inhaling tubes, spatulas, small mortars and pestles, and snuff powder containers. We find them in tombs and religious structures all the way down to Chile. One archaeologist reported recovering 614 snuff kits from a single excavation.

Snuff paraphernalia



It's what the shaman used to inhale or distribute certain type of substances prepared from leaves, resin, and seeds of various plants, what modern science calls hallucinogenics, and what shamans call power plants. Chemical analysis of samples of archaeological snuff powders from such kits has shown the presence of bufotenine, dimethyltryptamine, and 5-MeO-D.M.T. The presence of bufotenine suggests that the source of the powder was any of several D.M.T-rich plants in the genus Anadenanthera. Small pouches containing Anadenanthera tree seeds have also been found in several burials. CAT scans of Tiwanakuan skulls have shown signs of chronic perinasal damage in some cases, likely caused by frequent sniffing of Anadenanthera bark powder.

So there you have it. The religion or shamanic practices in Tiwanaku and Puma Punku turned around the use of dimethyltryptamine (D.M.T), a powerful substance that according to modern science provoke hallucinations, and according to shamans allow you to connect with worlds beyond our own.
I have myself gone into the Peruvian jungle to drink Ayahuasca, a D.M.T-based brew, with contemporary shamans, and I continue to do so (it is a legal practice in Peru, no laws have been transgressed). The worlds and the entities that you encounter while you are under the influence of the plant spirit is enough for me to explain some of the odd looking heads and distorted faces in the so called Wall of Humanity. I believe they express what they experienced during the shamanic ceremonies.

This is not a way for me to say that you're wrong. I don't know who is right, and I believe we could both be right, or wrong. Some people with more experience in drinking Ayahuasca have told me that during ceremonies they've met small, gray entities with big heads and large, almond shaped eyes, and who am I to tell them that they're wrong? I've experienced some crazy stuff myself.

reply to post by KanuTruth


Star and Flag 4U!! Well laid out Post. Love the graphic You made to illustrate the similarities of these heads. I too, a while back thought maybe those were there to show, whoever found them in the future, who all had resided at , or at least visited, Puma Punku. Well done! Syx.

There are other possibilities when it comes to the idea of ET visitation to our planet.

Maybe instead of being all Startrekish, it is more like our Appollo missions.

They have interstellar travel capability, but they can't bring large ships with vast amounts of resources.

It is a very expensive, dangerous crossing, and then of course they also have to deal with politics, and minds who think such expeditions are a waste of time.

It is a science expedition of exploration, with scientists from several planets. There are territory disputes and treaties, and all kinds of other problems.

So this multi-species group of scientists arrive, and set up a remote base camp, far away from the evolving hominid species.

They build shelters from materials available here on Earth.

Maybe they have a carving contest, and all the scientist contribute a piece.

They hope that eventually the hominids will develop into an advanced species, and so they leave small clues, to let us know we are not alone.

Harte
reply to post by DazDaKing

 

I'm back.

Since you agree to what is at least a rudimentary translation of the term Anunnaki, I suppose your other wrong-headed ideas (belief in the various - which one? - King's lists, transposing Berossus' Oannes onto Adapa [they are the same, but Oannes was the Assyrian version a thousand years later] and your odd belief in a "pre flood" civilization, when the archaeological record prior to Sumer is somewhat well-established) are slightly less annoying to me.

At any rate, can we agree that a figurine that appears to be from the Ubaidic period depicting some sort of snake demon (though identified as Pakistani, which would put it in the Indus Valley civilization timeframe) is not an "Anunnaki figurine?"

That was the point, after all. The OP's claims are utterly unsustainable.

Harte

Hey Harte,

In regards to your previous post - no, you still don't quite understand what I'm saying. My point really is, if we take the whole collection of stories, the 'Anunnaki' are no where near as important as characters such as Enki, who is well depicted and documented in these ancient beliefs.

In the past I have probably incorrectly applied the word Anunnaki as to include Gods such as Enki and Enlil, where as now I understand that the group is never directly identified.

Which is why, I believe it MAY be the group of entities that Adapa formed. They are the 7 wise sages in some stories, and the Anunnaki are the 7 Judges of the Underworld in the Epic of Gilgamesh - coincidence?

The story of Adapa is clearly one of a Hybrid creation of the 'Gods' and an Earthly creature. Back to the 'rudimentary' meaning of Anunnaki - since no one actually knows EXACTLY what it means, the general theme seems to be a linking word between the Sky and the Earth.

I've heard princely offspring of the Sky and the Earth and I've heard 'that which came from the Sky to Earth'.

If we take the first meaning, from the context of the stories, with the Sky representing the home of the Gods and the Earth representing our home, wouldn't that make it a fine reference to the Seven Judges/Sages, who are within the same texts described as a union of the Gods and the Earth?

I'm just speculating here, but honestly I'm not putting my hopes into any 'real', mainstream historian figuring this out any time soon.

Moving on...My 'wrong-headed' beliefs in the Sumerian Kings List?! Look Harte, I DONT BELIEVE the SKL is an actual calendar of mans history, because we need more evidence.

That being said, if we want to analyse this from the AA POV, we can then take this SKL to be accurate, since we are assuming the ancient Sumerian civilisation had such knowledge of things. It all depends on what 'angle' we are taking. There's more than one Devil to advocate in this world.

Once again, where did I say I had a BELIEF in a pre-flood civilisation? What I actually said was, looking at the Sumeian texts and the SKL - they both CLEARLY suggest a pre-flood civilisation. Whether this was a global flood or local flood really doesn't matter.

What's your problem with the idea of a pre-flood civilisation? There's been multiple floods throughout our history that have probably reset parts of civilisation and caused a rupture between what was then a pre-flood civilisation and what became the post-flood civilisation. This will happen for as long as man is plagued by the natural disasters of the Earth - it is NOT a conspiracy.

Also, why are you SO CONVINCED of our archaeological record? We only found the majority of these Sumerian/Babylonian clay tablets in the 1900s lol. I'm sure in the late 1800s and early 1900s you had people smugly stating that there is a clear archaeological record showing that there was no signicant civilisation prior to the ancient Egyptians! We are discovering temples 12,000 or so years old that we didn't account for before.

We are finding small flashes of artistic expression from 40,000 BC and NOTHING ELSE around that time. Doesn't that strike you as odd? We've obviously lost a significant part of our past, whether due to natural reasons or events such as the destruction of ancient libraries and scholarly archives.

Harte, I don't for one second believe we have a CLEAR record of our history. No chance. For crying out loud when I was a child we were taught that there were only two advanced humanoids over the last 300,000 years - Neanderthals and Homo Sapiens. Now we have FOUR advanced humanoids who all roamed the Earth collectively.

We are shattering our knowledge of the past all the time.

Yes, we can agree that the figurine you speak of isn't Anunnaki as far as we can conclude. Though its interesting that I believe that figurine is reminiscent of a Naga from Ancient Indian mythology - which was a part human part sea serpent like divine creature - much like Adapa - who can be linked to the Anunnaki.

That's just speculation however.

Ultimately, I truly couldn't care less what anyone else believes - I personally see the POSSIBILITY and therefore try to make both sides see that this endless debate isn't really worth it.

Do you see where I stand, Harte? I see the possibility of it all coming together under an AA type scenario, and you don't. There's no other difference between us, and at the end of the day I believe we both actually follow the 'mainstream view' of our history and conception - believe it or not.

Except, I feel that paradigm breaking apart personally for me, slowly but surely.

On another note; what interests me about all of this (regarding the early Sumerian beliefs) possibly more than any AA aspect is the fact that as far as we know these are our FIRST TRUE STORIES. The ORIGINAL story!

That's a #ing beautiful thing man! Yeah, sure, someone can link me random myths maybe predating this or that - but the first collection of stories around one overlapping theme comes from these guys!

And almost EVERY MAIN BELIEF prevalent today in someway originates from these stories. They ARE the source.

If we overlap the stories into the most coherent version, this is what we'd probably get:

Gods descend on Earth, establish Kingship (over 250,000 years ago if we include the SKL). They 'toil' the Earth. After 6 generations of 'Younger Gods', the Igigi rebel to Enlil about their labour. The Igigi are in one text (can't remember name) referenced as being 300.

I believe this is where the 300 rebelling 'watchers', led by Samyaza, appear from in the Book of Enoch - who rebel against 'God' (Enlil effectively becomes God in the Bible while stealing many good aspects of Enki's actions as well)

Enki's suggestion is to make a creation to do the work of the Gods. It is never clear if we were made as well as Adapa, or we were used to make Adapa, or we are the offspring of Adapa - from the context of the stories.

Either way, these 'creations' are set as advisors to the Kings at the time (who ruled for stupid numbers of years according to the SKL and hence were of 'them' and not 'us').

Some texts say we overpopulated and were sent disease and famine by Enlil, while others speak of some of the Gods breeding with us (source of Nephilim).

The Eridu Genesis (~2800-3000 BC) picks up from here (we were created to serve the Gods and eventually became too 'noisy').

The Gods learn of a impeding flood that will surely destroy us. Enlil/They (Anu, Enlil and Ninhursaga) decide to allow it be. Enki disagrees but is bound to silence.

He goes against the wishes of the Gods however, and warns/instructs a man (and his family presumably) on how to survive. (All repeated in the Bible - 3000 years later)

Enlil learns of this after the flood and is enraged. Enki explains that they cannot punish the guiltless and that we were their creation and therefore they had brought us into this state and had to take responsibility for it now.

Enlil and the other Gods agree and the decision to leave Earth to us seems to be established.

Enki begins to teach us the basics like domestication of animals and agriculture, and various Gods during this 'post-flood' period hand us 'Me's, which are different gifts of the Gods in the Sumerian beliefs, such as Civilization itself, or knowledge of medicine for example. There's great lists to be found of these "Me's".

At that point, humans are granted 'Kingship' (pretty sure I've seen that in a text somewhere) which corresponds to our SKL. The SKL has the post-flood Kings ruling much more human like lengths, with a few crazy ones who were supposedly 'Demi-Gods', like Gilgamesh.

At one point all of man is said to speak to Enlil in ONE VOICE. Enki decides to confuse the tongue of man. A lot of historians are confused by this, because Enki is 99% of the time seen as being the good guy in these texts. However, it makes perfect sense.

Enlil never had good intentions for us from the stories, but Enki did. If we all spoke to Enlil in one voice - it meant he had established total rule of us, and received complete worship in return. Enki, understanding the dangers of this, literally gives us our 'free will' back, and allows us to think for ourselves and against the thoughts of others.

This runs parallel to not only the Serpent in the garden of Eden but more obviously the story of the Tower of Babel.

Or the story where Enki accidentally prevents the post-flood hero the gift of immortality, by telling him not to eat the food of Anu (who had summoned him to 'Heaven') because it is the food of death.

Anu actually offers him the food of immortality, and is offended when he refuses it, cursing him and all humans to mere mortal life spans. This mirrors the punishment of short life stories from the Bible and such.

And then ALL of our modern history comes about. Egyptian, Ancient Greek, Ancient Hindu, Gnostic, Christian, Islamic etc beliefs pretty much all arise from these sets of stories in one way or another - but we don't have the actual source for the story of Enlil/Enki/Anu etc other than 'primitive humans' and localised floods.

It's flipping fascinating. All these stories of angels, demons, watchers, naga, archons, and stories of God and the Devil/Satan and so forth all trace back to these stories in their core. Why aren't more people amazed by that!

Why does it just have to be: 'oh well, another primitive human race rambling about sky wizards because they can't explain anything'. It's just a cop out card for people to kill all imagination and investigation into our ancient history. We should all be open minded about it.

These original stories are ironically some of the most complex and paint the 'Gods' in a more human way than any other text I've read.

All the human emotions and abstract concepts are conveyed and yet they hold consistent personalities and sometimes fall into gray areas of morality. For example, I've read in some texts that Enki had a huge 'liking' for Earthly women, despite generally being shown as this noble and wise figure.

I believe the closest parallel we find is that of Zeus and his gang. It is blisteringly obvious that there was a HUGE influence on Ancient Egyptian and Greek culture from these Sumerian stories that we are only now just truly learning.

Why did Ancient Egypt generally start 'advanced' and decline over centuries? The GP and Sphinx demonstrate an engineering and mathematical knowledge that isn't rivalled for possibly over 1000 years.

I know the general theme in school is that history is linearly progressive. Therefore if you plot 3000BC to 2014 AD on a graph against our 'knowledge and intellect' you should have a diagonal line from bottom left to top right. However, that's complete BS.

It's more a 'U' shape in fact. We have a great explosion of Civilization from 3000 BC to 2500 BC where we are writing some of the most important stories known to man and creating the most fascinating structures to this day.

Then we have a bit of a decline until the Greeks figured out a lot from the Egyptians and continued the knowledge crusade. Remember that Egypt was pretty much a dictatorship run Civilization at the time that was hindered scientific growth beyond the mystery schools who kept the stories of the Sumerians alive.

Then we have a massive dark period after the Greeks where really and truly we decline in EVERY SENSE up until about 1950 lol (possibly excluding the Rennaisence and the individual efforts of great scientists/thinkers).

Seriously. If these original stories are just primitive ramblings, let me tell you what Harte - the Civilization that reigned from ~3500-2500 BC was smarter than any other civilization to follow it until our modern day technological accomplishments.

The concepts covered in those stories - as opposed to the beliefs that mankind would later force (Heaven/Hell - Worship or Suffer) and just the relative complexity of them for being the FIRST TRUE STORIES, and the relative impressiveness of their structures at the time (considering mostly everyone else was running around in fur coats and spearing animals) means that SOMETHING DOESN'T QUITE ADD UP.

The fact we have Amazonian tribes who have not adopted everything they see as a God, who attack planes on sight rather than worship them as a snake sky god, and who have never tried to build a pyramid let alone to have a complex system of worship and sacrifice.

These people aren't stupid lol. They see the universe in more detail and observe it with more focus than you or I do on a daily basis.

They would've realised by now that weather will act independent of their actions as will nature. Why would they waste their energy to build a pyramid?

If someone attempted to claim Kingship over them, they will just kill him lol. If someone randomly said 'hey lads, did you know a guy called Enki created us and I am his son so you should worship me' he would have a few spears through his body in a jiffy.

Why is it that one set of us humans got sent on this ridiculous path of scientific knowledge and technological progression while hundreds of tribes across the world who have formed complex social systems do not have one such desire?

The only way to find out is to follow the history of our timeline to our original stories - which happen to tell us in detail what happened and why we are on this pathway.

Yet, how do you prove to anyone that its not just primitive ramblings? Or that it is an earlier civilization? Or it is aliens? All cases can be argued with the 'evidence' at hand in their unique ways lol - it all becomes a moot argument.

Which is why I won't take a stance. I'd rather just keep absorbing knowledge for now. Its sad that less than 1% of people I meet even know who the Sumerians are.

But in reality, people will look back at our artefacts in 6,000 years and either think we were complete idiots or that we were ancient aliens lol.

This will never stop! It's the beauty of it I guess. The universe - the platform, the advanced humanoid body - the tool, consciousness/free-will - the controller.

As long as this beautiful combination is possible, thousands of races will fare the stars and travel the planets. Thousands of races will have been observed and interacted with without even realising it - whether in their past or present.

Races have been made and races have been destroyed. Kings have been claimed and Kings have been slain.

It doesn't really matter if anyone believes in AA theories or not, because one day we will be crusading space and #ing up the timelines of whatever poor bastards. One way or another we will continue to create AA theories lol.

So, it's almost comical to attempt to claim it definitely (like some do) hasn't happened to us in our past - when you then have our earliest stories basically telling us this is the case. Who flipping knows?

But once again, it doesn't matter. Long after we are deceased, our own race will end up disturbing the spiritual path of a primitive race out there.

Mark my words - we are a nasty creation because of the means we have come about. All we know is survival of the fittest and establishing hierarchies. The medieval era sums up the true human character the best.

When the free will of the few affects the free will of the many, and those few encompass these exact negative human aspects - you can be sure we will come to encompass everything that Enlil represented in those stories.

We are already trying to create AI to do our work for us lol. People want to 'download' consciousness into machines. I'm sure biologists out there want to create intelligent life artificially. We don't know what the hell we're playing with but we're going to do all these things anyway given the chance.

It is no different. We are repeating the exact prophecy of those stories, and becoming Gods like we were apparently allowed to do.

So, what does it matter if we were disturbed in our past or not, when the more important matter is what we will do to other races out there.

Isn't it funny/a big coincidence that ever since we detonated a nuclear bomb UFO sightings began and NUMEROUS militaries have officially reported objects invading airspace and stopping right above nuclear storage units then accelerating from motionless to over Mach 6-7 in seconds. This is not a joke.

Something is going on. I believe we are part of a much bigger game that we are only just beginning to truly comprehend. I honestly can't put my finger on what it is, but my gut instinct is telling me we are missing critical knowledge of our past and present. Neither do I know how many 'layers' there truly are to this reality.

I guess that's why I tend to give so much thought to some of these things.

Sorry - I rambled again. But it's some insight into my opinion on the whole thing. I wish you'd stop seeing me as some rival in the world of AA theories and just as an open minded individual who's open to alternative theories to some of the stuff we have been spoon-fed our whole lives.

You don't need to checkmate me into accepting this or that is or isn't Anunnaki lol. But please do point out to me if I'm wrong about something. I don't want to argue but rather learn.

Not hard to connect Puma Punku (or any other location) to every known alien species, since there are zero known alien species.

reply to post by vexati0n


Maybe?

Maybe not?

The truth is out there.

Did I pass out and miss the disclosure? Because the last time I Checked, there are no " known" alien species.

DazDaKing
Hey Harte,

In regards to your previous post - no, you still don't quite understand what I'm saying. My point really is, if we take the whole collection of stories, the 'Anunnaki' are no where near as important as characters such as Enki, who is well depicted and documented in these ancient beliefs.

No one could disagree with that. Not even someone as disagreeable as myself.

DazDaKingIn the past I have probably incorrectly applied the word Anunnaki as to include Gods such as Enki and Enlil, where as now I understand that the group is never directly identified.

Which is why, I believe it MAY be the group of entities that Adapa formed. They are the 7 wise sages in some stories, and the Anunnaki are the 7 Judges of the Underworld in the Epic of Gilgamesh - coincidence?

Hardly.

Consider the obsession with what we today call astrology, but what to them was divine science.

5 moving stars (planets) and the Sun and the Moon. That makes seven. All the other little lights up there stayed in the same position with respect to each other, and when looked at with respect to their position on our horizon, they only slightly move - imperceptably unless observed over a period of ten lifetimes.

7 is a holy number and a "lucky" number, and not coincidentally at all.

DazDaKing The story of Adapa is clearly one of a Hybrid creation of the 'Gods' and an Earthly creature. Back to the 'rudimentary' meaning of Anunnaki - since no one actually knows EXACTLY what it means, the general theme seems to be a linking word between the Sky and the Earth.

Like I said, the "ki" was added later so there's no doubt that, in the original, the Earth was not part of the name. And anyway, "ki" actually meant Mesopotamia. Almost early nationalism, that. More like when someone today refers to the place they grew up calling it "God's country."

Annunaki means the Annuna of ki. Ki being Mesopotamia. Similar to what was in the link I provided you which mentioned the "Anunna of Eridu or the Anunna of Lagaš."

DazDaKingI've heard princely offspring of the Sky and the Earth and I've heard 'that which came from the Sky to Earth'.

If we take the first meaning, from the context of the stories, with the Sky representing the home of the Gods and the Earth representing our home, wouldn't that make it a fine reference to the Seven Judges/Sages, who are within the same texts described as a union of the Gods and the Earth?

The Seven Sages (the Abgal) were messengers sent from the Gods. Depending on the era of the version of the stories you read, they were created by Enki, they were sent by An, or they were originally mortal but were made divine or demigods by the Gods for their deeds.

On the other hand, the Seven Judges of the Underworld are referred to as Anunnaki, and (IIRC) sometimes as Igigi.

Not likely that they existed, much less that they were one and the same.

DazDaKingMoving on...My 'wrong-headed' beliefs in the Sumerian Kings List?! Look Harte, I DONT BELIEVE the SKL is an actual calendar of mans history, because we need more evidence.

That being said, if we want to analyse this from the AA POV, we can then take this SKL to be accurate, since we are assuming the ancient Sumerian civilisation had such knowledge of things. It all depends on what 'angle' we are taking. There's more than one Devil to advocate in this world.

I've seen a fairly convincing argument that the numbers of years for the reigns of those kings are inflated because of their use of the sexidecimal number system. Though I've not made the calculations myself, I've read that, once translated into base ten, they are reasonable.

DazDaKing Once again, where did I say I had a BELIEF in a pre-flood civilisation? What I actually said was, looking at the Sumeian texts and the SKL - they both CLEARLY suggest a pre-flood civilisation. Whether this was a global flood or local flood really doesn't matter.

What's your problem with the idea of a pre-flood civilisation? There's been multiple floods throughout our history that have probably reset parts of civilisation and caused a rupture between what was then a pre-flood civilisation and what became the post-flood civilisation. This will happen for as long as man is plagued by the natural disasters of the Earth - it is NOT a conspiracy.

I would posit a pre-flood culture, prior to the inundation of the Persian Gulf. You misuse the word "civilization" here because you are using it in an anthropological argument, not a social one.

DazDaKing Also, why are you SO CONVINCED of our archaeological record? We only found the majority of these Sumerian/Babylonian clay tablets in the 1900s lol. I'm sure in the late 1800s and early 1900s you had people smugly stating that there is a clear archaeological record showing that there was no signicant civilisation prior to the ancient Egyptians! We are discovering temples 12,000 or so years old that we didn't account for before.

If you look, you'll see that I merely said this or that has 'never been found," not that this or that "doesn't exist.

DazDaKingWe are finding small flashes of artistic expression from 40,000 BC and NOTHING ELSE around that time. Doesn't that strike you as odd? We've obviously lost a significant part of our past, whether due to natural reasons or events such as the destruction of ancient libraries and scholarly archives.

If you mean cave paintings or small totem-like carvings, no, it doesn't seem odd to find them and it doesn't seem odd that we don't find many. Why would that seem odd?

DazDaKingHarte, I don't for one second believe we have a CLEAR record of our history. No chance. For crying out loud when I was a child we were taught that there were only two advanced humanoids over the last 300,000 years - Neanderthals and Homo Sapiens. Now we have FOUR advanced humanoids who all roamed the Earth collectively.

The fact that you remember it that way doesn't mean it was taught to you that way. I've never seen an educational text that made absolute claims like that. Especially for schoolchildren, it is important that a text discuss what is known, not what might be out there that no one has found yet. After all, the latter constitutes a literal infinity of possibilities. A student is there to learn not about what might be, but what is.

If other species were entirely unknown when a book was published, we could not expect that book to contain information about those species.

DazDaKingYes, we can agree that the figurine you speak of isn't Anunnaki as far as we can conclude. Though its interesting that I believe that figurine is reminiscent of a Naga from Ancient Indian mythology - which was a part human part sea serpent like divine creature - much like Adapa - who can be linked to the Anunnaki.

You need to read more about Adapa. Pay attention and find some stuff about how he morphed into Berossus' Oannes.

Harte

Ran out of characters.

You did ramble. The rest of your post, and this whole conversation, is off topic for this thread.

My advice to you is - look into the Canaanite religion (Ugaritic texts and Pantheon.)

That's the main connection that made all these stories take over the religious world.

Regarding your claim about the religion of Ancient Egypt and it's ties to the Akkadian religion, some cross-cultural borrowing is inevitable. I'd like to see any evidence of real dependance you may have come up with regarding the Egyoptians adopting the religion of Sumer.

Harte

reply to post by Harte


I have to say, I think the influence of Sumeria is over exaggerated.

We now know that far more ancient civilizations thrived in the Middle East.

poet1b
reply to post by Harte

 

I have to say, I think the influence of Sumeria is over exaggerated.

We now know that far more ancient civilizations thrived in the Middle East.

Again, misuse of the term "civilization."

Using the term correctly, Sumer is the earliest we have found.

Harte

reply to post by KanuTruth


Lol good post! I've wondered about those darn faces. Just so interesting, I think the whole site is amazing. And isn't there UFOs seen around lake Titicaca? Funny name for such a sacred lake.