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NATO.. Do Something!!!
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SubTruth
I agree OP NATO needs to grow a set and get off the pot. Weakness will lead to all out war as 2nd rate powers around the world try and become bigger powers. The weaker we are the harder they will push.
The current 'first rate power' came into existence because the previous first rate powers pretty much destroyed each other in the last great war; that is how the new 'first' rate power will probably come into existence as well especially considering how imperialistic and nakedly aggressive the current incumbent have been and continues to be.
If I lived in Poland I would be very nervous they should change the gun laws and arm every single person and form militias. Poland has ever reason to be looking east because looking west all they see is weakness and apathy.
The last time Poland had a 'strong' independent neighbor to the west it ate Poland for breakfast and killed several millions. One would think that that memory would be stronger than the memory of the completely hamstrung and mismanaged recovery one of it's other victims ( Russia) attempted when it took over Poland from it's Nazi occupiers thus ensuring that western powers could not just march in whenever they liked to threaten the Russian peoples of the Ukraine and Baltic states.
Stellar
reply to post by GargIndia
I think the people should look at the idiots and miscreants that are the current "leaders" of NATO - and send them in to "fix" whatever they had their little thugs out doing to create the problems that are now making nucliar annihalation in the world possible.
Let those idiots sacrifice themselves for their own misdeeds and leave the rest of the world - who does not want to fight their bankster wars for them - alone, to live in peace and security.
I think the people should look at the idiots and miscreants that are the current "leaders" of NATO - and send them in to "fix" whatever they had their little thugs out doing to create the problems that are now making nucliar annihalation in the world possible.
Let those idiots sacrifice themselves for their own misdeeds and leave the rest of the world - who does not want to fight their bankster wars for them - alone, to live in peace and security.
reply to post by CALGARIAN
Isn't this the same NATO that brought destruction to Libya and Afghanistan? what you want NATO to do? occupy Russia?
Isn't this the same NATO that brought destruction to Libya and Afghanistan? what you want NATO to do? occupy Russia?
I sense humor in OP with bitter sarcasm..
But after all this I came to this conclusion that Ukraine is just an excuse to shake up the situation around Russia, which is also sponsored by someone (we all know who).
Main culprit is the OIL as usual.
USA had a boom of shale gas development in past few years and almost ready to export the crap but where? New market to sell is Europe, but in order to do that they need to create another monster to stop European countries from buying Russian gas.
Shrinking Eastern pact and vastly expanding NATO pact along with another dirty Oil war well planned by the American blood suckers and well received by the European retards.
That’s all about it..
www.washingtonpost.com...[edit by]edit on 28-3-2014 by amkia because: adding the link
But after all this I came to this conclusion that Ukraine is just an excuse to shake up the situation around Russia, which is also sponsored by someone (we all know who).
Main culprit is the OIL as usual.
USA had a boom of shale gas development in past few years and almost ready to export the crap but where? New market to sell is Europe, but in order to do that they need to create another monster to stop European countries from buying Russian gas.
Shrinking Eastern pact and vastly expanding NATO pact along with another dirty Oil war well planned by the American blood suckers and well received by the European retards.
That’s all about it..
www.washingtonpost.com...[edit by]edit on 28-3-2014 by amkia because: adding the link
Merinda
If I remember correctly, the first half of the century wasnt a good place to be an caucasian in Europe, or to be anywhere near Europe period. Wed like to keep it war free.
Caucasian in Europe?
and what about others who happened to be in Europe in first half of the century?
they were doing pretty good I assume?
reply to post by grayghost
I'll say that I agree with you, when it's put that way. In being willing to say "in a world unlike the one we live in..politically.." to war game scenarios? THERE, I lose most hesitancy and absolutely no question about outcome and winner, if it didn't go nuclear with megaton class weapons. (nukes will deploy on a NATO/Russia war. The question is only...small battlefield type in very isolated events or megaton city killers?).
Sans nuclear weapons tho...and if leadership in NATO and the United States could drop politicking to the next stump speech long enough to focus singularly on this? If they had conviction that said 'Win...at any cost but losing the people it's for'? Then yes. In a total war commitment, the U.S. and Combined NATO forces would clean Russia's clock, send them a bill and the break the damn thing in front of them with a sledgehammer for an object lesson.
The problem is...I think Reagan was the last with the intestinal fortitude to stand eye to eye with a man who knows killing as a personal experience, and not blink. No way I believe Obama is even in the same class or level. Same with current EU and NATO Leadership.
We have a "New World" in the west, full of warm, fuzzy, caring and feeling leaders. That's dandy...in Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. Unfortunately, in this neighborhood, the other side is "Old World" where a thousand, 10 thousand or a million deaths to achieve an end result is measured by the impact of the loss to national productivity afterward, not in terms of humanity. Thats Vladimir Putin, KGB Colonel ret. ...and we're in trouble.
I'll say that I agree with you, when it's put that way. In being willing to say "in a world unlike the one we live in..politically.." to war game scenarios? THERE, I lose most hesitancy and absolutely no question about outcome and winner, if it didn't go nuclear with megaton class weapons. (nukes will deploy on a NATO/Russia war. The question is only...small battlefield type in very isolated events or megaton city killers?).
Sans nuclear weapons tho...and if leadership in NATO and the United States could drop politicking to the next stump speech long enough to focus singularly on this? If they had conviction that said 'Win...at any cost but losing the people it's for'? Then yes. In a total war commitment, the U.S. and Combined NATO forces would clean Russia's clock, send them a bill and the break the damn thing in front of them with a sledgehammer for an object lesson.
The problem is...I think Reagan was the last with the intestinal fortitude to stand eye to eye with a man who knows killing as a personal experience, and not blink. No way I believe Obama is even in the same class or level. Same with current EU and NATO Leadership.
We have a "New World" in the west, full of warm, fuzzy, caring and feeling leaders. That's dandy...in Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. Unfortunately, in this neighborhood, the other side is "Old World" where a thousand, 10 thousand or a million deaths to achieve an end result is measured by the impact of the loss to national productivity afterward, not in terms of humanity. Thats Vladimir Putin, KGB Colonel ret. ...and we're in trouble.
Wrabbit2000
reply to post by grayghost
I'll say that I agree with you, when it's put that way. In being willing to say "in a world unlike the one we live in..politically.." to war game scenarios? THERE, I lose most hesitancy and absolutely no question about outcome and winner, if it didn't go nuclear with megaton class weapons. (nukes will deploy on a NATO/Russia war. The question is only...small battlefield type in very isolated events or megaton city killers?).
Sans nuclear weapons tho...and if leadership in NATO and the United States could drop politicking to the next stump speech long enough to focus singularly on this? If they had conviction that said 'Win...at any cost but losing the people it's for'? Then yes. In a total war commitment, the U.S. and Combined NATO forces would clean Russia's clock, send them a bill and the break the damn thing in front of them with a sledgehammer for an object lesson.
The problem is...I think Reagan was the last with the intestinal fortitude to stand eye to eye with a man who knows killing as a personal experience, and not blink. No way I believe Obama is even in the same class or level. Same with current EU and NATO Leadership.
We have a "New World" in the west, full of warm, fuzzy, caring and feeling leaders. That's dandy...in Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. Unfortunately, in this neighborhood, the other side is "Old World" where a thousand, 10 thousand or a million deaths to achieve an end result is measured by the impact of the loss to national productivity afterward, not in terms of humanity. Thats Vladimir Putin, KGB Colonel ret. ...and we're in trouble.
I agree with you here and would add the UK perspective too, much as I disliked the woman, Margaret Thatcher wouldn't have been a pushover either, Gorbachev knew what the score was in the late 80's when faced with the "special relationship".
UK and US have lost a lot of face over the past 20 years with the messy wars we've become involved in , the public on both sides of the pond are unlikely to back a war against Russia and Putin knows this (along with all the intel he's picked up from Snowden).
The only way I could see UK/US getting involved directly is if a NATO member is attacked, even then it would take an attack on one or other directly to lead to troop deployment IMHO (Much like it took Pearl Harbour bring the US into WWII)
I wonder where my post went about them all working together being the reason NATO wasn't doing jack #...
CALGARIAN
We fought the world 50 years ago and with help of Russia we won, now we have an obligation to the free world.
You've got that bit completely ass-backwards old son.....But they did appreciate all the trucks!
Picking a fight with Russia, especially on their home ground, is historically a very, very bad move.
BlueJacket
reply to post by CALGARIAN
Don't forget Israel fired missiles at Syria...equally against International law I am sure. I do agree that NATO is no more than a boys club with zero credibility any more.
Don't forget they were RESPONDING to another blatant attack.
Back to the OP. If we did not have a weak traitor of a leader in the White House this would have never happened or at least not with Russia posturing for another invasion anyway of Ukraine. Reagan would have scared Putin and his army back into Russia and all would be right with the world. Libya would not have been destroyed Syria would not be on the brink nor would have Egypt. Pakistan, North Korea would be a smoldering ruin and AQ and the Teliban would be wiped from history. Putin would be crying in a corner with his little football and China would be keeping to himself.
Obama is a TRAITOR!!!
squarehead666
CALGARIAN
We fought the world 50 years ago and with help of Russia we won, now we have an obligation to the free world.
You've got that bit completely ass-backwards old son.....But they did appreciate all the trucks!
Picking a fight with Russia, especially on their home ground, is historically a very, very bad move.
We do not have to fight Russia. Peace through strength. Obama does not have a clue or if he does he is just trying to make us look like weak idiots. He should be drug out in the streets for what he is doing to this country let alone our military.
NATO and The EU did do something they backed these newly expendable fascist groups the regime in Kiev are now cracking down on. The IMF may have
gotten the country but Crimea which when ya look at a map would be the main port if you are going to build a pipeline in that part of the world.
Patriotsrevenge
squarehead666
CALGARIAN
We fought the world 50 years ago and with help of Russia we won, now we have an obligation to the free world.
You've got that bit completely ass-backwards old son.....But they did appreciate all the trucks!
Picking a fight with Russia, especially on their home ground, is historically a very, very bad move.
We do not have to fight Russia. Peace through strength. Obama does not have a clue or if he does he is just trying to make us look like weak idiots. He should be drug out in the streets for what he is doing to this country let alone our military.
the truth is USA brought it on itself.
now if they react and engage militarily even not directly world will have even less respect for USA because of the resulting casualties.
if they don't react world will have even less respect for USA but at least USA will save it's dignity.
in the future, people will say: USA power has declined and they went through it stoically, choosing to stand by their ideals and not to desperately fight to preserve it's status.
don't take it 100% serious but I think any choice USA make now will be wrong.
why?
because of the lost credibility.