A mysterious object found on beach Maldives Baarah

reply to post by Realtruth


Halon is bad stuff but there is so much more volume in a plane that it would take more than one or even two of the bottles in the hold to kill everyone on board.

I could not identify which halon Boeing uses. But Halon 1301 is a common fire extinguishing agent.

The percent used to suppress isn't really high. Matches up with Zapoid's statement.

Fire suppression.
Current specifications for the fire- suppression system in each Class C compartment require a minimum initial concentration of 5 percent Halon throughout the compartment to suppress any combustion to controllable levels. Thereafter, the system must sustain a minimum concentration of 3 percent Halon for 60 min to prevent reignition or spreading of the combustion. For airplanes certified for extended-range twin-engine operations (ETOPS), the fire-suppression system must be able to sustain a 3 percent concentration of Halon within the compartment for a maximum of 180 min.

Boeing link

Halon 1301

It is considered good practice to avoid all unnecessary exposure to Halon 1301, and to limit exposures to concentrations of 7 percent and below to 15 minutes. Exposure to Halon 1301 in the 5 to 7 percent range produces little, if any, noticeable effect. At levels between 7 and 10 percent, mild central nervous system effects such as dizziness and tingling in the extremities have been reported.

Wiki link

So once again they have revised the possible route, pushing it back northward a little, for reasons of higher engine speed and less economy. It makes you wonder when the next revision will be. Who knows, it could end on a possible course, far north enough to be a possible route for the Maldives after all...I'm beginning to be 'possibly' conspiratorial myself with all these possibilities.

reply to post by smurfy


There is an update on this object in the Maldive online news paper.

Maldives National Defence Force (MNDF) reported on Wednesday that the unknown object found in Baarah in Haa Alif Atoll beach is not dangerous.

According to a statement issued by MNDF, the suspicious object found on the beach had been assessed by a special MNDF team and they had found that it was not an explosive or dangerous.

However, MNDF had still not identified what it exactly is.

The unknown object discovered is now under inspection at MNDF Northern Area.
www.haveeru.com.mv...

At this link on their online news they say it's a fire suppression bottle They also mention the missing plane in this article.
www.haveeru.com.mv...

Who knows what it really is, I think it's a fire suppression bottle, and if anyone with any knowledge will ever check it for a serial number.

Des

championoftruth

Vasa Croe

championoftruth

tommyjo
reply to post by championoftruth

 

The Japanese currently operate the most rugged and proven search and rescue flying boat. Even they wouldn't consider operating it in such an unpredictable area. The conditions are far too variable and the risks too great. That is why the Japanese sent their P-3 Orions rather than their flying boats and the Chinese sent their IL-76s rather than their flying boats.

See section on following link on rough water operations.

Flying Boat link

Japanese flying boats

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Chinese

en.wikipedia.org...

if you are that scared you should never go near the water.i mean you might drown or get wet.

seriously the excuses are just ridiculous.i mean you have hundreds of boat in this DANGEROUS WEATHER there but for some strange reason a flying boat is so fragile it must stay in its hanger.

i mean as soon as you see a storm coming you take off.takes 30 seconds to be airborne.


so simple so easy.

Have you ever been on a boat in really open ocean? Flying planes would not be able to handle this area. Not sure why this is so tough to understand.

The ships they have searching here are much larger than a flying boat and are made for this type of open ocean. It isn't about just a storm coming, these flying boats are not made to motor around for any extended period of time and definitely could not handle the swells this area sees on a regular basis. What are they supposed to do....take off and land in between each swell? Because I guarantee the first swell that was at least the height of the wings would sink a flying boat as it would crash on top of the wing and pull the flying boat to a watery grave. The reason REAL boats can handle it is because they have no wings protruding to be caught by a wave or swell. They simply roll with the swell or turn into it. good luck doing that on a flying boat.

The idea is a bad one and will not happen.

so what you saying is that the entire southern indian ocean is a raging torrent day and night without a single instant of calmness?

which is totally ridiculous.

you are saying a seaplane cannot fly above the ocean just like a plane and when it spots debris it cannot land on the water to examine that debris because the entire ocean is a raging cataclysmic storm 24/7 and the pilot is blind and cannot see a flat calm ocean and will willy nilly into a raging 50 foot wave which appears instantly without warning.

i don't believe you.

its more likely you are just jealous of the idea and you feel compelled to tear it down for that reason because you did not think it yourself so you have to come up with spurious excuses.

how do you explain live pictures on tv reports showing a flat calm ocean surface with nary a gigantic humongous wave in sight?

Even the presenters hair did not move.

What I am saying is I am speaking from experience on a 78' sailboat in the open ocean and seeing waves big enough first hand, and winds strong enough to make the tip of the mast touch the water because we couldn't get the sails down quick enough. If a sailboat can't get the sails down quick enough for that kind of wind, I guarantee you a plane won't take off.

The idea is not being used because it is a horrible idea. No jealousy here, just glad you are not in charge of anything related to the search as we would have more planes and bodies to search for if that was the case.

Seas change in seconds, and yes I speak from experience, not on a sea plane, but on a very large sailboat made to handle the elements.

cado angelus
reply to post by championoftruth

 

My friend - it's clear that you have no understanding of the changeable nature and the sheer force of the open ocean. Especially the area being searched. The famed 'Roaring 40's.'

A seaplane is all well and good, but it could be happily sat on calm seas and then, within minutes, a serious swell brews up and it plummets into a trough. All the pilot would see would be a tower of water all around him and next thing - crash. One sunken seaplane.

There was a comment in one of your previous posts that made me chuckle - you comment that yachts and sailboats can go in this area. Yes - you are correct - that's because they are boats and designed differently to seaplanes - we work the waves in an intelligent manner, based on the type of boat you're sailing.

I'd love to head off down in that area on a yacht - it would be such a challenge. Then again, my two real ambitions in life would be to race in the Vendee Globe and do the Sydney - Hobart. Alas, I'm not a hot enough sailor for the former and my wife won't let me do the latter - says it's too dangerous.

Anyway, I suppose what I'm saying is that please - if you don't understand the ocean and its volatility and unpredictability, please don't comment upon it in a way that demonstrates ignorance of it's power.

It's like another world out there. A wonderful, awe-inspiring, terrifying, spiritual wilderness.

I don't mean any offence - if I could, I'd love to take you on a transatlantic rally and introduce to you mother nature.

Cado

edit on 27-3-2014 by cado angelus because: Pinot Noir

I completely agree. Very different BEING in it versus LOOKING at it.

reply to post by Destinyone


It's either a Halon bottle, or a liquid oxygen bottle, probably from a B-1 that crashed a few years ago in the area. That has been in the water far too long to be from MH370.

The unknown object discovered is now under inspection at MNDF Northern Area.

I can see the MNDF men sitting around a table with this object on it, drinking coffee, smoking cigarettes and poking it with a stick.

Zapoid is most likely right about it as it does look like it has seen some time out in the ocean. Even the universe it getting into the "Where is 370 conspiracy" by throwing in a possible aircraft part to add a bit more uncertainty.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Destinyone

 

It's either a Halon bottle, or a liquid oxygen bottle, probably from a B-1 that crashed a few years ago in the area. That has been in the water far too long to be from MH370.

I not so sure about a long time period, saltwater corrosion and pitting can start after only a few days, and add to that any surface that sustained damage to the protective layer it would start corroding and pitting right away, add to that any of the area underwater would hinder the protective layer's operation, add to that any temperature rises would make the rate of corrosion increase exponentially, then you could just be looking at something that came out of a plane two to three weeks ago. Anything from the B1 would at least be entirely pitted all over.

It seems that they have spotted something in the new search area map and picture

earthling42
It seems that they have spotted something in the new search area map and picture

Is that both objects, OMG another Halon tank... is the round shiny thing a marker buoy?

reply to post by smurfy


I can't tell, looks to me as if the picture is marked which means we only see a part of the whole picture.

reply to post by smurfy


To me, the round circle object looks like a marker set by the image capturing software, such as a cursor would leave. It doesn't look like it's in the water...JMHO.

Des

earthling42
reply to post by smurfy

 

I can't tell, looks to me as if the picture is marked which means we only see a part of the whole picture.

Yes I saw it on sky in real time from the moving aircraft, it's something static on the monitor screen, maybe a cursor.

Looks like to me it's a titanium tank used in probably a satellite which fell out of orbit. The titanium is not going to show much in the way of burning from re entry but I bet if examined closely, they will see some scoring. That's what it looks like to me anyway. And, most sats are steered into the South Pacific, Indian oceans to end their careers.

wrkn4livn
Looks like to me it's a titanium tank used in probably a satellite which fell out of orbit. The titanium is not going to show much in the way of burning from re entry but I bet if examined closely, they will see some scoring. That's what it looks like to me anyway. And, most sats are steered into the South Pacific, Indian oceans to end their careers.

Absolutely not Ti, and absolutely didn't fall out of orbit.
The part is certainly stainless steel, Ti has a distinctive color and the photos are of good enough quality for me to be able to tell the difference.
And I'd like to add this to the conversation, only a small handfull of "stainless" steels are actually rust proof. In fact, depending on which alloy of which series, some will rust in a heart beat, in the right environment.
The austinitic alloys, 300 series, have the best overall corrosion resistance with t304 being the go to stainless alloy. The martensitic alloys, the 400 series, have slightly better mechanical properties and can be hardened, stainless knives are made from a 400 series alloy because they have enough carbon to harden. But that extra carbon allows for corrosion, these steels will absolutley rust.
I dont know which alloy the fire bottles are made from, but I can tell you that unless it was T304 or
T316, the other alloys are too hard to work with , even a few days in the ocean would cause severe corrosion. Chloride corrosion is one of the main corrosion modes for most stainless steels.

punkinworks10

Absolutely not Ti, and absolutely didn't fall out of orbit.
The part is certainly stainless steel, Ti has a distinctive color and the photos are of good enough quality for me to be able to tell the difference.
And I'd like to add this to the conversation, only a small handfull of "stainless" steels are actually rust proof. In fact, depending on which alloy of which series, some will rust in a heart beat, in the right environment.
The austinitic alloys, 300 series, have the best overall corrosion resistance with t304 being the go to stainless alloy. The martensitic alloys, the 400 series, have slightly better mechanical properties and can be hardened, stainless knives are made from a 400 series alloy because they have enough carbon to harden. But that extra carbon allows for corrosion, these steels will absolutley rust.
I dont know which alloy the fire bottles are made from, but I can tell you that unless it was T304 or
T316, the other alloys are too hard to work with , even a few days in the ocean would cause severe corrosion. Chloride corrosion is one of the main corrosion modes for most stainless steels.

Agreed, and I would add, in some ways the way those tanks are kept in situ with straps, (as well as brackets) whether they are also stainless steel or not are something of a compromise, they have to be subject to friction, and could well corrode over time in their own environment, I would presume though that they would be a maintenance item.

Wouldn't being exposed to extreme heat prior to immersion in saltwater affect the rate of corrosion?

MH-370 carrying cargo of lithium-ion batteries

squarehead666
Wouldn't being exposed to extreme heat prior to immersion in saltwater affect the rate of corrosion?

MH-370 carrying cargo of lithium-ion batteries

I would say yes it would, if the fire was all comsuming it would steal all the oxygen available, To add a thermal runaway if there were those lithium batteries in the cargo, and it's not a good idea. I think I read somewhere that some cargo carriers won't even carry them, I could be wrong though.
What is true though is that the big batteries used in the Dreamliner fires were very difficult to extinguish. I don't think that they have yet got the hang of the thing.

its spacecraft fuel cs.astrium.eads.net...