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Proof of ATS Scooping the Web?
page: 6share:
theabsolutetruth
reply to post by frozenP
Like another poster said, mostly from other sources, either more credible news sources or sites like Reddit, ie. they are posted there, then ATS and places like the Daily Mail online. Similarly as per this thread's 'conspiracy', the article and pictures were first posted on a Russian news site, then youtube, ATS and the Daily Mail.
So many times have I seen practically word for word article pasted from other 'similar' sites, often falsely claiming originality with little fake disclaimers like ''I stumbled upon this'' or ''I was wondering about something the other day and I randomly and originally came up with this'' etc.
I guess it's a star and flag thing for many on ATS.
For those of us that are here for less ego serving purposes, it does make the sifting more tedious and perhaps at least 80% of the content less worthy. I mostly read the first few lines of a thread and know if it's bunk and ignore it, but sometimes comment on it if it's sufficiently worthy of commenting on.
The irksome thing is when something you know is bunk gets 200 flags and zillions of stars followed by heaps of unwarranted, sycophantic praise for the poster. Along the lines of 'it's a conspiracy site, aimed at educating sheeple about the truth filled with sheeple buying BS in spades from egotists and charlatans' is there a freaking point at all style irksome.
edit on 10-3-2014 by theabsolutetruth because: (no reason given)
That's what has turned into a real shame with ATS, it's like Reddit on Steroids. It's been turned into just another news feed, nothing here is ever new, it's just ripped headlines, and most of these are planted propaganda. The OP is guilty of this more than anyone else. Posting that "Blackwater in Ukraine" nonsense without tracing it back to a known source of Russian propaganda. That is what the propagandists want, to see their lies spread viral on copy-paste forums and boards like ATS, lunatic outpost, GLP, and Reddit. I always run a topic through a good debunking site so I don't get snookered with propaganda.
RancorXXX
Who's are the bigger fools here? The one who claimed to "scoop the Web" with material he found ON the Web, or the fools who rush to defend this practice because he's "popular"?
What happened to the old ATS, where users got to the truth no matter what? In two years this site has gone downhill, now its a competition to who can rush here to post headlines the first.
This post is slaying me, I thought it was a joke at first, but now I see the OP believes his own hype... oh dear, keep the egos in check, if that is to much to ask, otherwise we'll all feel violated by a lack of trust.
Good catch on the Alexander Dugin link Black, he is a Russian propagandist, it's too bad our vaunted ATS members would rather be fed lies than do any fact checking these days.
A scoop is typically a new story, or a new aspect to an existing or breaking news story. Generally the story is unexpected, or surprising, and/or a former secret.
Now, the OP used the pictures as his proof that his "new aspect which was unexpected" may have been copied by others.
In the debate, I believe BlackMarketeer won, because the OP did not present his case as well.
However, perhaps the OP was only trying to use his story as only 1 example of ATS'ers in general scooping other journalists therefore wasn't really trying to present a case for himself at all, since he said in the beginning concerning himself that he could be wrong where concerned himself.
But again, the OP has a milder quality about himself than his opponent, and wasn't as assertive with his points...
I do not find this means the quality of the site has gone downhill, it was a good debate all the same. Blackmarketeer and his supporters provided the alternative view to the OP and his supporters.
I do believe the OP was correct, perhaps not in using himself as an example (as I do believe he lost the debate), but in the fact that several threads on ATS do in fact scoop the rest of the web.
reply to post by SLAYER69
let this be a lesson to you, when debating, be more assertive.
nah... nevermind... I like your laid back way you have... it is what makes you likeable!
I do think you could have won the debate though...
let this be a lesson to you, when debating, be more assertive.
nah... nevermind... I like your laid back way you have... it is what makes you likeable!
I do think you could have won the debate though...
reply to post by OpinionatedB
It was nothing to do with supporters or debates or the like.
This is about ego, dishonesty and the 'game' being played by some on ATS.
As somebody previously mentioned, it used to be about the content and sharing info, not being popular and having followers and winning arguments.
Just engaging one another in discussion and striving for a common goal of seeking the truth.
Some people have long forgotten that and the site suffers.
It was nothing to do with supporters or debates or the like.
This is about ego, dishonesty and the 'game' being played by some on ATS.
As somebody previously mentioned, it used to be about the content and sharing info, not being popular and having followers and winning arguments.
Just engaging one another in discussion and striving for a common goal of seeking the truth.
Some people have long forgotten that and the site suffers.
reply to post by stargatetravels
My sentiments, too.
If I dare say, this post is a perfect example of what ails ATS. As Blackmarketer had wrote, with the star and flag popularity contest raging, we have a newer type of ATS poster, who is a populist. Whatever the popular opinion is, that is what they write. If you refuse to disagree with other popular posters out of fear it will cost you stars or flags, you are a populist. If you are too cowardly to offer up an unpopular opinion, an opinion you firmly believe, then you are a populist. If instead congratulating other posters no matter what nonsense they wrote, so long as it's popular, you are a populist. It's no longer about alternative news, unless it get's stars and flags and reflects the popular sentiment.
This site hates your president Obama, therefore let me become an Obama hater- instant popularity! This site loves attributing all the worl'ds woes to the Illuminati, let me do the same, no matter how far-fetched some Illuminati posts get, and i'll be popular.
Very few posters on this site are willing to risk their popularity to shed the light of truth on a topic, even if it means hurting a popular members feelings. Phage is one example. Harte in the Ancient and Lost Civilizations forum is another. I commend Blackmarketer for guts in outing an obvious falsehood. These members at least have conviction, even if doesn't make them the most popular. Most of the time that is all it takes, is a little fact checking and due diligence, and posts like the OP would fall on their face, and damn the popularity contest.
This ism't an attack on Slayer, just the board overall could use more reality and less populism., remember the sites motto.
My sentiments, too.
If I dare say, this post is a perfect example of what ails ATS. As Blackmarketer had wrote, with the star and flag popularity contest raging, we have a newer type of ATS poster, who is a populist. Whatever the popular opinion is, that is what they write. If you refuse to disagree with other popular posters out of fear it will cost you stars or flags, you are a populist. If you are too cowardly to offer up an unpopular opinion, an opinion you firmly believe, then you are a populist. If instead congratulating other posters no matter what nonsense they wrote, so long as it's popular, you are a populist. It's no longer about alternative news, unless it get's stars and flags and reflects the popular sentiment.
This site hates your president Obama, therefore let me become an Obama hater- instant popularity! This site loves attributing all the worl'ds woes to the Illuminati, let me do the same, no matter how far-fetched some Illuminati posts get, and i'll be popular.
Very few posters on this site are willing to risk their popularity to shed the light of truth on a topic, even if it means hurting a popular members feelings. Phage is one example. Harte in the Ancient and Lost Civilizations forum is another. I commend Blackmarketer for guts in outing an obvious falsehood. These members at least have conviction, even if doesn't make them the most popular. Most of the time that is all it takes, is a little fact checking and due diligence, and posts like the OP would fall on their face, and damn the popularity contest.
This ism't an attack on Slayer, just the board overall could use more reality and less populism., remember the sites motto.
Hi Slayer, I always enjoy reading your threads, I don't always agree with your opinion but they always make a great read.
On this occasion I think you might be right as there seems to be three or four Daily mail journalists (I do use that term loosely) in this thread defending them.
Anyway keep up the good work.
On this occasion I think you might be right as there seems to be three or four Daily mail journalists (I do use that term loosely) in this thread defending them.
Anyway keep up the good work.
reply to post by RancorXXX
It isn't so much what ATS posts here. It's how we post it and what we do to and with it that is the difference.
And I guess we hope we do it to a higher standard than most, even if we don't always achieve that goal.
It's perfectly natural to post what the rest be discussing things the rest of the world is discussing...and in some cases not really discussing.
It isn't so much what ATS posts here. It's how we post it and what we do to and with it that is the difference.
And I guess we hope we do it to a higher standard than most, even if we don't always achieve that goal.
It's perfectly natural to post what the rest be discussing things the rest of the world is discussing...and in some cases not really discussing.
If a student in college turned in some research like the news reporter and then a professor checked it for Plagiarism and found the ATS stuff back
dating, that student would be toast.
I don't see how those pictures matching, especially more than one could simply be a coincidence, it would be impossible. Someone just duped it to be their own work.
I don't see how those pictures matching, especially more than one could simply be a coincidence, it would be impossible. Someone just duped it to be their own work.
reply to post by JustXeno
LOL, "3 or 4 daily mail journalists in this thread defending them", a typical response from someone not thinking.
Maybe you missed earlier in the thread where one member (Blackmarkter) demonstrated to Slayer his claims in his OP were nonsensical. I believe he demonstrated where the images Slayer had asserted he posted influenced DM were, indeed, already posted to the web by RT.com. So unless Slayer wants us to believe DM hopped in a tardis and jumped forward in time to when he had posted his images, then his claim was quite obviously false.
Nobody takes DM serious, they are a tabloid. They are like your Enquirer. Please do not ever refer to them as Mainstream Media.
But nice of you to interject on behalf of Slayer by insulting everyone who did not agree with his post, claims, or tactics. Your insults ensure that no one on this site will ever offer that unpopular opinion, lest they be accused of being shills. I can see yet another reason why members here become "populists". It's much easier to just go along with everyone else.
LOL, "3 or 4 daily mail journalists in this thread defending them", a typical response from someone not thinking.
Maybe you missed earlier in the thread where one member (Blackmarkter) demonstrated to Slayer his claims in his OP were nonsensical. I believe he demonstrated where the images Slayer had asserted he posted influenced DM were, indeed, already posted to the web by RT.com. So unless Slayer wants us to believe DM hopped in a tardis and jumped forward in time to when he had posted his images, then his claim was quite obviously false.
Nobody takes DM serious, they are a tabloid. They are like your Enquirer. Please do not ever refer to them as Mainstream Media.
But nice of you to interject on behalf of Slayer by insulting everyone who did not agree with his post, claims, or tactics. Your insults ensure that no one on this site will ever offer that unpopular opinion, lest they be accused of being shills. I can see yet another reason why members here become "populists". It's much easier to just go along with everyone else.
reply to post by alienreality
Slayer's images were not the ones used by DM. As Blackmarketer demonstrated, the images used by DM came from RT.com. (that is Russia Today) Those images were already on the Web by hours before Slayer made his post. So unless you believe tardis technology exists, then Slayer is wrong to think his images had anything to do with those at RT or DM. His images are visibly different.
The implications made by Slayer was that DM took his post as the basis for their article, he did so by showing his post headline then a DM headline. He then showed his image, then a DM image. Whilst similar, they are visibly different. The implied snark is that DM took his post as influence for their story. Slayer's additional snark is that he "scooped the Web". What he doesn't seem willing to acknowledge is the story broke days earlier, and originated with a well known Russian propagandist named Alexander Dugin. How does one "scoop the Web" with material one finds on the Web, on sites like Reddit?
I do not known anyone that considers DM to be a source for conspiracy news, as the few times they touch the subject it's to mock conspiracists.
Slayer's images were not the ones used by DM. As Blackmarketer demonstrated, the images used by DM came from RT.com. (that is Russia Today) Those images were already on the Web by hours before Slayer made his post. So unless you believe tardis technology exists, then Slayer is wrong to think his images had anything to do with those at RT or DM. His images are visibly different.
The implications made by Slayer was that DM took his post as the basis for their article, he did so by showing his post headline then a DM headline. He then showed his image, then a DM image. Whilst similar, they are visibly different. The implied snark is that DM took his post as influence for their story. Slayer's additional snark is that he "scooped the Web". What he doesn't seem willing to acknowledge is the story broke days earlier, and originated with a well known Russian propagandist named Alexander Dugin. How does one "scoop the Web" with material one finds on the Web, on sites like Reddit?
I do not known anyone that considers DM to be a source for conspiracy news, as the few times they touch the subject it's to mock conspiracists.
reply to post by Macabe
You sure do jump to a lot of conclusions without proof yourself. I am Unthinking, LOL in terms you use.
"My National Enquirer" LOL again, that would be "my Daily Mail" if you are assuming I'm an American wrong again LOL.
Interjecting on Slayer behalf and insulting people ??? LOL. If being called a daily Mail Journo is an insult, I'll remember to use it next time I'm down the pub.
Where did I say the mail was mainstream media even though it is a popular news reporting newspaper, which in my eyes makes it mainstream and a part of the media.
As for me being Populist you really haven't got a clue.
Enjoy the rest of your day
ps. I did that without insulting you, If you reply could you please use the same decorum,
You sure do jump to a lot of conclusions without proof yourself. I am Unthinking, LOL in terms you use.
"My National Enquirer" LOL again, that would be "my Daily Mail" if you are assuming I'm an American wrong again LOL.
Interjecting on Slayer behalf and insulting people ??? LOL. If being called a daily Mail Journo is an insult, I'll remember to use it next time I'm down the pub.
Where did I say the mail was mainstream media even though it is a popular news reporting newspaper, which in my eyes makes it mainstream and a part of the media.
As for me being Populist you really haven't got a clue.
Enjoy the rest of your day
ps. I did that without insulting you, If you reply could you please use the same decorum,
reply to post by JustXeno
Your stating "3 or 4 daily mail journalists in this thread defending them" was clearly a barb aimed at those who did not agree with the OP. So yes, if you persist in calling those who do not agree with the OP a "daily mail journalists" defending that organisation, then you are insulting those members. By all means, go to the pub, have yourself a pint, and rest easy in the knowledge that there's a few ATS members willing to offer the occasional unpopular opinion, even if it deprives us of stars and flags.
Your stating "3 or 4 daily mail journalists in this thread defending them" was clearly a barb aimed at those who did not agree with the OP. So yes, if you persist in calling those who do not agree with the OP a "daily mail journalists" defending that organisation, then you are insulting those members. By all means, go to the pub, have yourself a pint, and rest easy in the knowledge that there's a few ATS members willing to offer the occasional unpopular opinion, even if it deprives us of stars and flags.
reply to post by Macabe
Just starred your last message so your post star ratio can keep well in front of mine, wouldn't want people thinking i was a star grabbing populist.
A bit petty I know but mildly amusing I hope.
Just starred your last message so your post star ratio can keep well in front of mine, wouldn't want people thinking i was a star grabbing populist.
A bit petty I know but mildly amusing I hope.
reply to post by JustXeno
That applies to those who start topics. Run along to Reddit, find topics that get up-voted the most, then rush back to ATS and post them here. Try to be the first, and among your copy-pasting try not to offer any opinion that strays outside the norm. Then you too can be a populist. Then throw in a boast about being the first on the Web to break a story, just for giggles.
That applies to those who start topics. Run along to Reddit, find topics that get up-voted the most, then rush back to ATS and post them here. Try to be the first, and among your copy-pasting try not to offer any opinion that strays outside the norm. Then you too can be a populist. Then throw in a boast about being the first on the Web to break a story, just for giggles.
reply to post by SLAYER69
This is so funny. Cause it just gives me reassurances that this site is being moniterd and dumbed down. If the media are using this site, I wonder what black budjet projects do with it. I just see it now.
User1 - I post conspiracy theory with physical proof.
Black budget1 - post comment that debunks what I post.
User2 - post something that contributes to the debunking due to lack of information on the net and in information control.
Black budget2 - post something to support User2s statement.
Media news user - makes suttle friendly comment to user1 post but supports black budget 1 comment then runs to there boss with the story with debatable Avenues from user1, black budget 1 & 2 . Story gets twisted by media boss and then shows up on bbc and cnn as true reliable news.
This is so funny. Cause it just gives me reassurances that this site is being moniterd and dumbed down. If the media are using this site, I wonder what black budjet projects do with it. I just see it now.
User1 - I post conspiracy theory with physical proof.
Black budget1 - post comment that debunks what I post.
User2 - post something that contributes to the debunking due to lack of information on the net and in information control.
Black budget2 - post something to support User2s statement.
Media news user - makes suttle friendly comment to user1 post but supports black budget 1 comment then runs to there boss with the story with debatable Avenues from user1, black budget 1 & 2 . Story gets twisted by media boss and then shows up on bbc and cnn as true reliable news.
reply to post by Macabe
I'm on mobile so I can't give a lengthy reply, however the DM scrubbed ATS references from their site - I watched it happen when their search function went down and came back up. FACT. You cherry picked what the DM left behind - the belittling words from that Robbie Williams story.
I'd say they covered their rear, but I can rebuild their shoddy post-editorializing. Starting with a certain Mars story, a flower, and the ATSer Arken. I'll be on a proper machine in a few days to source it all back together. Cheers.
I'm on mobile so I can't give a lengthy reply, however the DM scrubbed ATS references from their site - I watched it happen when their search function went down and came back up. FACT. You cherry picked what the DM left behind - the belittling words from that Robbie Williams story.
I'd say they covered their rear, but I can rebuild their shoddy post-editorializing. Starting with a certain Mars story, a flower, and the ATSer Arken. I'll be on a proper machine in a few days to source it all back together. Cheers.
reply to post by Jason88
When did this happen, the Daily Mail scrubbing ATS references from its site? Much earlier, or in timing which may indicate it was a response to this thread? The timing wasn't clear. Thanks.
When did this happen, the Daily Mail scrubbing ATS references from its site? Much earlier, or in timing which may indicate it was a response to this thread? The timing wasn't clear. Thanks.
stargatetravels
reply to post by OpinionatedB
It was nothing to do with supporters or debates or the like.
This is about ego, dishonesty and the 'game' being played by some on ATS.
As somebody previously mentioned, it used to be about the content and sharing info, not being popular and having followers and winning arguments.
Just engaging one another in discussion and striving for a common goal of seeking the truth.
Some people have long forgotten that and the site suffers.
I don't see any game playing by slayer to be honest here. What I see was someone who saw an article days after he posted a thread about the same thing getting excited and wondering if they got the idea from himself or from the video.
Once after my wolf had surgery and I was out monies on that I told my kids I should start a health insurance company for pets, that with the amount of money Americans pay out for the pets and vet bills that something like pet health insurance was feasible.
Oh they laughed at me... lol ... and teased me mercilessly over how crazy my idea was... it was for the most part forgotten and about a year later we were all in the car listening to the radio and a commercial came on advertising just that, health insurance for your pets...lol
I was proud of myself, not because they stole my idea... there was no way anyone could have known my idea as it never went past family... but because what I thought of someone else did too, and they did it... I felt vindicated (and my children apologized for calling me crazy... hahahaha )
What I see in this thread is a coincidence that left the OP feeling just like I did that day... proud that something he thought was worthy of discussion someone else did too...
That is not dishonesty intellectual or otherwise. Perhaps he jumped the gun and didn't think it all the way through, but that makes the premise no less true, that there ARE probably times that media outlets get their ideas from this site. That is not about any popularity contest, that is about probability. I have seen mainstream media follow ATS many times in their stories... and not without merit. There are many very intelligent people here on ATS, some popular and some not.
I think most here still want a common goal of seeking truth... yet, most people don't want to hear the truth, and the truth is, this site is what you make of it. If you want less msm, do your own investigative reporting and come up with new things, new stories, stories no one has...by doing this yourself, you will encourage others to the same end.
Be a leader; leaders lead by example, not by complaining.
edit on 11-3-2014 by OpinionatedB because: (no reason given)
reply to post by Blackmarketeer
First, I just noticed this on ATS homepage, and decided to evaluate and comment.
Second, I am writing this from an OBJECTIVE POV, and I come in peace for both you and the OP. To be honest, I'm not really on friendly terms with either you. At times, I've been mildly irritated with you both within others' threads. I understand that I am a sporadic member, you/OP don't even remember me, Lolz, and that you both have more important issues to attend to, so I try to justify it contextually.
Given all that, I do think you have been unnecessarily mud-slinging SLAYER69.
Based on the his/her depth and breadth of topics here, do you honestly think that s/he would have placed this topic at hand within the forum, "Conspiracy Theories" if s/he wasn't considering it something more newsworthy?
Her/His OP clearly states the pure speculation.
Plus, her/his topic choice is a "boost" of some truth for the ATS community, and the membership, for the most part concurred. Therefore, you should also be addressing other members that replied to the OP as s/he was MIA for some of the posts cropped up, it appears.
I do honestly think that the OP makes a good overall point.
I am not a fan of MSM ( especially on air tv and radio broadcasts) as am sure we all agree to within a degree.
However, sometimes we do have to back-track to them. As an example, I generally dislike Fox (faux) News, but I do occasionally like to hear Hot Toddy Shep. Smith's perspective on things, and am leaning towards the idea that his staffers draw from CT sites like ATS. Data points in the past have included his perspective on not getting the swine flu jab and the non-missile? event off the coast of Cali - at least those are the ones I remember the most.
Have you considered partnering with the OP on thread creation or creating more of your own?
I hope there is more peace moving forward. I hope there is more debate moving forward. We are all brothers and sisters in the end.
First, I just noticed this on ATS homepage, and decided to evaluate and comment.
Second, I am writing this from an OBJECTIVE POV, and I come in peace for both you and the OP. To be honest, I'm not really on friendly terms with either you. At times, I've been mildly irritated with you both within others' threads. I understand that I am a sporadic member, you/OP don't even remember me, Lolz, and that you both have more important issues to attend to, so I try to justify it contextually.
Given all that, I do think you have been unnecessarily mud-slinging SLAYER69.
Based on the his/her depth and breadth of topics here, do you honestly think that s/he would have placed this topic at hand within the forum, "Conspiracy Theories" if s/he wasn't considering it something more newsworthy?
Her/His OP clearly states the pure speculation.
Plus, her/his topic choice is a "boost" of some truth for the ATS community, and the membership, for the most part concurred. Therefore, you should also be addressing other members that replied to the OP as s/he was MIA for some of the posts cropped up, it appears.
I do honestly think that the OP makes a good overall point.
I am not a fan of MSM ( especially on air tv and radio broadcasts) as am sure we all agree to within a degree.
However, sometimes we do have to back-track to them. As an example, I generally dislike Fox (faux) News, but I do occasionally like to hear Hot Toddy Shep. Smith's perspective on things, and am leaning towards the idea that his staffers draw from CT sites like ATS. Data points in the past have included his perspective on not getting the swine flu jab and the non-missile? event off the coast of Cali - at least those are the ones I remember the most.
Have you considered partnering with the OP on thread creation or creating more of your own?
I hope there is more peace moving forward. I hope there is more debate moving forward. We are all brothers and sisters in the end.
edit on 11-3-2014 by watchesfromwall because: (no reason given)
reply to post by Jason88
This isn't about past instances of Daily Mail stealing content from ATS. I don't doubt that is true. But then how does ATS get it's content...?
This is about Slayer69, in his opening post making an issue to have been the source for the images used in an Daily Mail story.
Blackmaketeer proved him wrong. The provenance of the images proved to have been sourced from RT.com, and similar images to Slayer's appeared several days earlier than his. As Blackmarketeer also pointed out, the story officially broke March 4, appearing on Reddit, then RT and Web in general, several days before Slayer posted anything about it.
End of story. ATS did not scoop the Web, not in this case.
What should have happened is Slayer69 should have done his due and checked on their images before making his fanciful boast. It would have saved him a lot of embarrassment. Lesson learned, don't claim to be a source when your own work is derivative.
This isn't about past instances of Daily Mail stealing content from ATS. I don't doubt that is true. But then how does ATS get it's content...?
This is about Slayer69, in his opening post making an issue to have been the source for the images used in an Daily Mail story.
Blackmaketeer proved him wrong. The provenance of the images proved to have been sourced from RT.com, and similar images to Slayer's appeared several days earlier than his. As Blackmarketeer also pointed out, the story officially broke March 4, appearing on Reddit, then RT and Web in general, several days before Slayer posted anything about it.
End of story. ATS did not scoop the Web, not in this case.
What should have happened is Slayer69 should have done his due and checked on their images before making his fanciful boast. It would have saved him a lot of embarrassment. Lesson learned, don't claim to be a source when your own work is derivative.
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