Did the Moon split in two in the 7th century?

a reply to: RussianTroll

1. The point is im not in England, and you said "you", so there is that.

It's not a big deal buddy just geography.

2. Russia has engaged in territorial expansion and military campaigns that could be considered colonial in nature.

Take for instance the 18th and 19th centuries. During that period, Russia expanded into Siberia, Central Asia, and the Caucasus, bringing these territories under its control.

And in the 19th century, your nation also expanded into territories such as Alaska and the Russian Far East.

Russia has waged colonial wars which is a fact and part of recorded history im afraid.

3. The concept of equality before the law is a fundamental principle in many legal systems around the world, including your own.

The practice of equality on the other hand leaves a lot to be desired.

Your nation suffers from the same sort of inequalities and problems as many another mate, to think otherwise is simply wishful thinking.

4. That's nice but multiculturalism is hardly the domain of just Russia and is apparent in many nations and cities around the globe.

Glad you seem to have enjoyed your childhood all the same. Thats important.

5. And what would that be?

6. Maybe someday, but I'm a bit hard-pressed and occupied with trying to secure accommodations for next year in my own nation right now.

7. That's ok buddy its just a saying meaning, been there seen it, and got the hat and balloon, with regards to the history of religious warfare and intolerance in the UK.

Anyhoo you teach away i like to learn, but that doesn't mean we will always agree.

As to being sincere, well why would anyone wish you to be anything but?

a reply to: RussianTroll

Don't know how and more importantly why you've turned this thread into something completely different to your OP?

On topic; I suspect its incredibly unlikely - I'm bordering on saying impossible - that the moon split in two and was then re-joined in some show of higher power.

If something like that did appear to happen then I suspect it would have been the result of some natural phenomenon which was then interpreted by those who witnessed it the best they could.
Chinese whispers and blind faith explains the rest.

As for the off topic;
The UK will stay the UK as long as the people in the UK want it to.
Its irrelevant what people from elsewhere think, do or support.

And you right us off at your peril my friend, we Brits are at our best when our backs are against the wall and we're fighting the odds.
Do not be fooled.

za zdarovye.

a reply to: andy06shake
Unfortunately, I see that we had different teachers and different history textbooks.
This cannot prevent us from finding common ground and agreement.

a reply to: Coelacanth55

The thing is the Moon has an extremely thin atmosphere.

And it lacks the necessary conditions to support the formation of clouds as we understand them.

Might be something to do with the shadow cast by the Sun i suppose.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: RussianTroll


The UK will stay the UK as long as the people in the UK want it to.
Its irrelevant what people from elsewhere think, do or support.

And you right us off at your peril my friend, we Brits are at our best when our backs are against the wall and we're fighting the odds.
Do not be fooled.

za zdarovye.

My friend, I want you to make your standards universal for all humanity. For Russia first of all.

a reply to: RussianTroll

Unfortunately, I see that we had different teachers and different history textbooks.

Perspectives on history can be varied and based on a multitude of individual experiences RT.

Take for instance our education systems, and other sources of information, but I'm not one for alternative facts.

This cannot prevent us from finding common ground and agreement.

Feck no, common ground is everywhere, down to the fact that people are more similar than different.

As to agreement, well if everyone agreed with one another the world would be a rather boring place to exist.

That being said the world could be doing with some form of accords and agreement right now, or at least calm it back down to a frenzy imho.

a reply to: andy06shake

It’s for the sake of comments like this that I’m happy to be on the ATS!

a reply to: andy06shake

You know, my friend, maybe I’m old-fashioned and conservative, but, unfortunately, we (Russians) will never see the new Sherspear, Thackeray, Dickens, Pink Floyd, Beatles, Rolling Stones, Uriah Heep and many many others. It is sad. A great culture is leaving((((

a reply to: RussianTroll

I would have thought the information age in which we exist should surely put pale to such a thing ever occurring RT.

TPTB will never be able to restrict people's ability to be able to view/hear/read the classics.

As long as there is a will there will be a way.

For instance, a VPN or even employing the likes of the use of Tor network allows people do what they wish to do, and communicate, should their government and media networks decide to block certain incoming data and websites.

a reply to: andy06shake

Ha, I don’t need a VPN to read English classics or listen to my favorite music. My late parents have a library with the complete works of Shakespeare, Thackeray and Dickens, and I have a large collection of over 2000 CDs and DVDs of my music. There are some extremely unique discs. I know English culture well, love and appreciate it. I am sad that there are no and there will not be new geniuses, since culture is disappearing (((

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Coelacanth55

The thing is the Moon has an extremely thin atmosphere.

And it lacks the necessary conditions to support the formation of clouds as we understand them.

Might be something to do with the shadow cast by the Sun i suppose.

Earth clouds, not moon clouds.

a reply to: Coelacanth55

a reply to: RussianTroll

I live in a city that's steeped in culture RT.

With a large selection of museums that include those devoted to transport, religion, classical and modern art.

I don't see how culture is disappearing.

Are things changing, yes, but that's always in the post.

As to geniuses, well there are always new geniuses being born, whether or not they ever get to fully recognise their true potential is a different matter.

Sounds like some sort of distortion in the atmosphere made the moon appear to be separated. I would think it is possible for that to happen, not probable, but possible. Our eyes filter the light of the moon into a single image, but in reality there are multiple moons because of atmospheric distortion and the curvature of the atmosphere. Just like the piller that comes at sunset, and the sun seeming to freeze in a spot at sunset and quickly going down in ten minutes.

Our minds adjust the image, but if distortion is bad or some chemicals in the environment block our mind from combining the image, it could lead to people seeing something different. Look at the moon at night when you are all tired out and see how it seems to be like five moons, the ability to filter and combine the image makes it all blurred out.

How do I know about this? Temporal lobe epilepsy, I thought my eyes were bad, yet I could see good most times but many times when I was tired it got worse. So I investigated what was happening and there are medical science articles on this issue out there. So what exactly caused this issue to form, did they have a fire and burn something that messed with their minds ability to work right? or it could have been some distortion caused in the atmosphere, something past the mountain that caused the distortion to increase. Look at the harvest moon...how can it appear so big sometimes and small others. What could a piller coming from the northern lights do to the moon image?

Or then again, it could just be something made up and written in their book, something nobody could prove wrong at that era of time. Anyone who denied it was possible might have been killed or had their eyes poked out if they challenged it. There were no records of this anywhere else that I know of, so I am guessing it was one of the things I mentioned or possibly some other cause. I have seen the moon look like a football once, it was back to normal within twenty minutes. I have seen the moon around the church steeple of a church, it was bigger than the church, I went to get the camera in the house and when I got out it had shrunk....damn, had to load the kodak film into it and unwind the old film. That only took about ten minutes and I missed it.

Sure, why not. The moon could have been hit by something and appear to have been split in two, or it may have even been split in two but remained close enough together that gravity just forced the pieces back together.

a reply to: RussianTroll

The 5 extra days in the calendar Rt is a interesting one as is speculation that the year once had 330 days long long ago when there was more than one moon in the sky .

www.varchive.org...

a reply to: rickymouse

I can remember being in Spain one year when i was about 17.

Lloret de Mar i think, where the Moon in the night sky appeared to be the size of a beach ball and really low on the horizon.

I just put it down to viewing the object from a different longitude and latitude but the thing appeared huge.

Comparatively speaking i would suggest the Moon generally appears to be the size of a volleyball or size 4 football here in the UK for the most part.

a reply to: RussianTroll

What about calenders that have 365 days (or there abouts) that predate the 7th century?

What about calanders that have 360 days that predate the 7th century?

Personally I'm not so quick to judge Islam or the stories they have, sometimes things aren't to be taken literal and I guess others are totally situational. I wouldn't be so quick to judge them as thick because they have knowledge of a Luna calender of which "360 days" alludes to.

The rest I don't know enough about, I have my doubts the moon split in two but then I suspect the story is saying a lot more of which I'm not exactly privy. One thing is for certain though Muslims in that day and age had a lot more access to navigators and they had holy days so it really wouldn't have been difficult for them to tally some days and keep an accurate score of time.

Definitely a lot to think about with this one, time keeping is a skill cultures are built around. For every story like this I'd imagine 10 have been lost. Evidence suggests we've had 365 solar days for at least 5-6000 years though?

originally posted by: RAY1990
Definitely a lot to think about with this one, time keeping is a skill cultures are built around. For every story like this I'd imagine 10 have been lost. Evidence suggests we've had 365 solar days for at least 5-6000 years though?

Yes but it seems 360 day and 365 day calendars and years have co-existed for much of that time. There were at least two ways to get them to synchronize so you didn't end up with your winter festivals happening in the summer, as would happen with a strictly 360 day calendar:

1. One method used by the Egyptians was to add an extra 5 days each year to the 360 day calendar, as described by historian Heroditus around 440 BC:

DIVISION OF TIME

...the Egyptians, basing the calendar on twelve thirty-day months, intercalate five additional days every year, whereby the cycle of the seasons returns with uniformity."

So that's a 360 day calendar with 5 days added each year, keeping it in sync with the seasons.

2. Another method was to have 360 days per year, 12 months per year for 5 years, then in the 6th year, add a month so there are 13 months. Then repeat that 6 year cycle. This still works out to about 365 days per year, though using the “Green ears of barley” method could also compensate for 365.25 days per year since the 13th month was actually added as needed, which as it turns out is only approximately every 6 years, not exactly:

At the beginning of the new year, an observation of the first “Green ears of barley” was made and it was decided to add or not a 13th intercalary lunar month (Veadar) to the old year.

3. To those who think the 360 day calendar is not still with us, because we know there are a little over 365 days per year, think again. The 360 day calendar is actually a function built into excel, and is used for some financial and accounting purposes:

This article describes the formula syntax and usage of the DAYS360 function in Microsoft Excel.

The DAYS360 function returns the number of days between two dates based on a 360-day year (twelve 30-day months), which is used in some accounting calculations. Use this function to help compute payments if your accounting system is based on twelve 30-day months.

That's explained a bit more in the Financial Use section of this article on 360 day calendars. Apparently even modern accountants like the symmetry offered by having 12 months per year of 30 days per month, even if that's not reality. Ancient cultures may have appreciated that symmetry even more, but it wouldn't have taken them too long to figure out there weren't 360 days in a year, when their winter festivals ended up happening in the summer, had they not intercalated the extra 5 days per year or the extra month every 6 years or so.

Fun fact: about 600 Million years ago, long before humans, there used to be about 417 days per year, that were only 21 hours long each. So the science is that the number of days per year is gradually decreasing over millions of years, mostly due to tidal interactions, but not enough for you to notice during your lifetime:

Earth's rotation

Over millions of years, Earth's rotation has been slowed significantly by tidal acceleration through gravitational interactions with the Moon. Thus angular momentum is slowly transferred to the Moon at a rate proportional to r^−6, where r is the orbital radius of the Moon. This process has gradually increased the length of the day to its current value, and resulted in the Moon being tidally locked with Earth.

This gradual rotational deceleration is empirically documented by estimates of day lengths obtained from observations of tidal rhythmites and stromatolites; a compilation of these measurements[44] found that the length of the day has increased steadily from about 21 hours at 600 Myr ago[45] to the current 24-hour value.

For the moon splitting, it seems like a good test of credulity. Some people are credulous, whereas other people have studied how the world works and require extraordinary evidence to believe what amount to essentially supernatural claims that contradict well-established observation. It's more endearing in children, than in adults, who should have learned by now that Santa Claus was just a made up story, and it's not the only made up story we've been told, for sure.

Do I understand correctly that when at the beginning of the month they saw one half of the moon, then at the end of the month - the other, they thought that these were two different cosmic bodies?