Former NASA Astrobiologist claims: evidence of alien life on Mars was destroyed!

Another confirm of the huge Conspiracy about Mars and its past/present(?) condition to host LIFE! According Richard Hoover the one who established the Astrobiology Research Group at the NASA/Marshall Space Flight Center, and became internationally known for his research on microfossils in meteorites, evidence of alien life on Mars was destroyed! Hoover has published many papers in which he asserts the discovery of extraterrestrial life in meteorites. Hoover shares revelations with journalist Lee Speigel from the Huffington Post. So, dozens of years for hide or discredit or destroy any evidence of that. WHY?
When the deception will finish? How many other years, billionaire rovers missions, former scientists, former generals, former admirals, former intelligence operatives and whistleblowers we need, to know the truth?

The fossilized crinoid. (Credit: NASA/JPL/Cornell/USGS)

The same area after being ground down by the rover’s abrasion tool. (Credit: NASA/JPL/Cornell/USGS)


Crinoids

Opportunity rover in 2004 took an image of a fascinating structure on Mars that shows structural features that are consistent with organisms on Earth known as crinoids . . . Crinoids are echinoderms, like starfish . . . so these are animals! And I’m saying that Opportunity took a photograph on Mars that shows features that are consistent with what we know of crinoids . . . Now, the fascinating thing is here you have a possible fossil of a very interesting organism in a rock on Mars, and three hours and a half after that photograph was done, that rock was destroyed by the rock abrasion tool.

Hoover claims that he asked NASA astrobiologist David McKay to explain why such an interesting structure was destroyed. He was told that it was done “to look at the inside looking for carbon.” But Hoover has a problem with this answer. He explains, “Well, the problem is, anyone who does much in the field of paleontology knows that you don’t have to find carbon to find fossil.” To further explain his confusion by the decision to destroy a potential fossil, Hoover offered this analogy: “If a paleontologist finds on Earth a rock containing an interesting fossil, they collect it. You would never have a paleontologist say, ‘Gee. That may represent a new genus of life on Earth. Where’s my rock hammer? I want to smash that to bits.’”

My Thread: Fossilized Mytilis and Molluscs on Curiosity images
Other links:
www.dldewey.com...
marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov...

Oh, for the "It's a Rock!" crowd...: Yes, these are rocks with fossilized organisms...

reply to post by Arken


Interesting thread & topic, I can well remember the discussion back then ... and it's kind of true: paleontologists on Earth would go ahead and work very carefully to unearth potential fossils using a brush and other tools in order to NOT damage the discovery. But here, the exact opposite seemed to have happened:



Unfortunately, the Mars Exploration Rovers only had the Rock Abrasion Tool (RAT) at their disposal. So the next rovers might need a set of fine brushes in order to avoid such "accidents"! Looking forward to what others have to say to this historic event ...

Oh, for the "It's a Rock!" crowd...: Yes, these are rocks with fossilized organisms...

reply to post by Arken


And for the Pareidolia crowd, the area closest to the bottom left (that was obliterated in the second image) looks like the profile of a face with a very canine-esque set of teeth First thing I saw was that set of chompers...I'm sure it's just my imagination though

Just out of curiousity, why would that apparatus need a resurfacing tool in the first place?

reply to post by jeep3r

Unfortunately, the Mars Exploration Rovers only had the Rock Abrasion Tool (RAT) at their disposal.

And a Laser Beam to kill everything moving...

Arken
reply to post by jeep3r

 

Unfortunately, the Mars Exploration Rovers only had the Rock Abrasion Tool (RAT) at their disposal.

And a Laser Beam to kill everything moving...

'Merica

It's not the first time TBTB tried to discredit a scientist for finding evidence of life on Mars & it wont be the last...


microorganisms found in Mars soil

Gilbert V. Levin invented a method to detect microorganisms. The method was selected in 1969 for use on NASA’s 1976 Viking Mission to Mars to detect extraterrestrial life & returned evidence of living microorganisms..

So he is suggesting "they collect it". How is he suggesting they do such a thing? Magical unicorns warp to Mars and bring it back?

So he thinks those small round things are fossils, based on the similarity of their shape. But morphology alone cannot be used unambiguously as a tool for primitive life detection.
proceedings.spiedigitallibrary.org...

Those things are probably concretions.
Concretions vs. fossils

So, another thread with a loud, sensational title, but little to show for it. A former NASA scientists does not make an infallible expert; plenty of knowlegeable people with big achievements went down the pseudo-science/conspiracy/anti-mainstream path.

Still, I admire your enthusiasm Arken.

reply to post by wildespace


With all due respect, wildespace, but... are you an astrobiologist?
Has you established the Astrobiology Research Group at the NASA/Marshall Space Flight Center?

Stll, I admire your attempt to discredit, wildespace..

Still, I admire your enthusiasm Arken.

Thanks. Enthusiasm and perseverance.
Well, my uncle was a blacksmith and he has taught me how using hammer and anvil, fire and water in order to soften the steel...

reply to post by wildespace

Still, I admire your enthusiasm Arken.

Not only his enthusiasm but dedication as well. I can't totally write off the idea that signs of life could be controlled by a select few under direct orders from above.

If you are aware of the scientific community and the lack of objectiveness when underlings are trying to satisfy the person they work under, you realize that the field is not infallible nor unable to be corrupted. (Drawing on a lab I know of funded with ~50 million for an experiment the director knew wouldn't work but took the funding anyway. And the workers that faked numbers to keep it coming in…)

I will say I find it very unlikely and when I look into it most if not all accusations come up with too much evidence contradicting them, or on par with mentally questionable types disseminating them.

However, one day 50 years from now they might find a bunch of stuff they overlooked, or perhaps someone arranged to be overlooked, and Arken will be the smartest man in the room. I really used to hate the rock threads, I'm starting to appreciate the work put into them even if it's simply to make the subject more popular.

reply to post by wildespace

A former NASA scientists does not make an infallible expert

But all those that currently do work for NASA are....infallible...by simple govt mathematics...if you work for us...you can+t be wrong...if you don't ...you surely are.

reply to post by Arken


Curious what your thoughts are on this. Life?

Hiatus concretions[edit]


Hiatus concretions at the base of the Menuha Formation (Upper Cretaceous), the Negev, southern Israel.


Hiatus concretion encrusted by bryozoans (thin, branching forms) and an edrioasteroid; Kope Formation (Upper Ordovician), northern Kentucky.

Hiatus concretions are distinguished by their stratigraphic history of exhumation, exposure and reburial. They are found where submarine erosion has concentrated early diagenetic concretions as lag surfaces by washing away surrounding fine-grained sediments (Zaton 2010). Their significance for stratigraphy, sedimentology and paleontology was first noted by Voigt (1968) who referred to them as Hiatus-Konkretionen. "Hiatus" refers to the break in sedimentation that allowed this erosion and exposure. They are found throughout the fossil record but are most common during periods in which calcite sea conditions prevailed, such as the Ordovician, Jurassic and Cretaceous (Zaton 2010). Most are formed from the cemented infillings of burrow systems in siliciclastic or carbonate sediments.

A distinctive feature of hiatus concretions separating them from other types is that they were often encrusted by marine organisms including bryozoans, echinoderms and tube worms in the Paleozoic (e.g., Wilson 1985) and bryozoans, oysters and tube worms in the Mesozoic and Cenozoic (e.g., Taylor and Wilson 2001). Hiatus concretions are also often significantly bored by worms and bivalves (Taylor and Wilson 2001).

Hiatus Concretions

Arken
reply to post by wildespace

 

With all due respect, wildespace, but... are you an astrobiologist?

With all due respect ..

"If you look at the microscope photos, they are certainly suggestive – looking like photos made of various terrestrial bacteria," Shostak told SPACE.com. "But then again, while intriguing, that's hardly proof. If similarity in appearance were all it took to prove similarity in kind, then it would be pretty easy for me to demonstrate that there are big animals living in the sky, because I see clouds that look like them."
-Seth Shostack S.E.T.I. - In regards to Hoover's work

Cyanobacteria live in liquid water and are photosynthetic, meaning they convert carbon dioxide into organic compounds using energy from sunlight. That implies that the meteorites would have had to contain liquid water exposed to sunlight, and also that high concentrations of oxygen would be present.
Chris McKay of NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field, Calif.

Maybe this is Hoover getting back at McKay .. who IS an astrobiologist.

reply to post by boncho

However, one day 50 years from now they might find a bunch of stuff they overlooked, or perhaps someone arranged to be overlooked, and Arken will be the smartest man in the room. I really used to hate the rock threads, I'm starting to appreciate the work put into them even if it's simply to make the subject more popular.

Thanks boncho. Your words are a big compliment for me, because that is my real attempt.

Arken
With all due respect, wildespace, but... are you an astrobiologist?
Has you established the Astrobiology Research Group at the NASA/Marshall Space Flight Center?

No, but even I can see failings in his logic and conclusions.

MarioOnTheFly
But all those that currently do work for NASA are....infallible...by simple govt mathematics...if you work for us...you can+t be wrong...if you don't ...you surely are.

All humans are fallible, but it's the scientific method that gives us the truth. It's not about people, it's about the methods they use. What gave us spaceflight, computers, advanced medicine and technologies? Science, performed by scientists.

reply to post by Arken


NASA trying to hide the evidence of life in the Solar System and possibly elsewhere. The big question is why? Why are they doing this? I suspect the answer maybe part of a control mechanism.

DrunkYogi
reply to post by Arken

 

NASA trying to hide the evidence of life in the Solar System and possibly elsewhere. The big question is why? Why are they doing this? I suspect the answer maybe part of a control mechanism.

This indeed doesn't make sense, because any evidence of life in the Solar System would make NASA budget skyrocket and give them amazing publicity and support.

DrunkYogi
reply to post by Arken

 

NASA trying to hide the evidence of life in the Solar System and possibly elsewhere. The big question is why? Why are they doing this? I suspect the answer maybe part of a control mechanism.

Yes, they want to hide the one thing that would ensure their relevance and funding.

I was watching a documentary on the discovery channel about the red rain in India and how it may have been caused by a meteor blast in the upper atmosphere and how the cells found inside the red rain did not contain DNA but the cells could still replicate. The lead astrobioligist from India sent his research to NASA to ask for help and NASA swiftly replied that they were no longer funding research in this field. Wait so you're telling me we could possibly have some sort of alien life here and NASA aren't interested in investigating. Isn't this the why we are sending rovers worth billions into outer space ? to find life. If the claims were made from some average Joe i can see why but these are scientists and people with years of research and experience forwarding these claims and asking for help and yet they are turned down.

soul44
I was watching a documentary on the discovery channel about the red rain in India and how it may have been caused by a meteor blast in the upper atmosphere and how the cells found inside the red rain did not contain DNA but the cells could still replicate. The lead astrobioligist from India sent his research to NASA to ask for help and NASA swiftly replied that they were no longer funding research in this field. Wait so you're telling me we could possibly have some sort of alien life here and NASA aren't interested in investigating. Isn't this the why we are sending rovers worth billions into outer space ? to find life. If the claims were made from some average Joe i can see why but these are scientists and people with years of research and experience forwarding these claims and asking for help and yet they are turned down.

Why would you send life found on Earth to NASA? Clearly that was done for political reasons to perpetuate a certain belief. When you get cancer do you ask NASA for treatment? There is absolutely zero evidence of any claims made on that program, I watched it. If you disagree with me, show me peer reviewed work based on the case. I will wait for it.