Who Killed Kennedy?

Originally posted by Grifter42
Does anyone really believe Oswald killed Kennedy?

All I can speculate is that the official story, 'lone gunman' just never seemed to feel right. Unfortunately, I believe it will be one of those events that we will never really know what actually happened. I've always been interested in documentaries that have re-visited this event. A number of them seemed to have actually proved that the three shots could have been fired exactly as the official story claims, there have been many reproductions of this. However, with that said, the official story just doesn't feel right. And there certainly does seem to be a number of other possible scenarios and collaborators, the Mob, Castro, Russia, our own government. I just don't think we will ever understand nor ever find the truth. Just one of many events that are strange and we will probably never know the truth. Or at least feel like we have been told the truth

Lucian Sarti - is suspected to be one of the gunman.

Sarti

The CIA would be my best guess as well. I haven't done near as much research as I should, though, so my guess is as good as anybody's.

reply to post by AsTallAsLogan


The fact that the CIA was well represented in Dallas has been established in a court of law. An article appeared stating that E. Howard Hunt was in Dallas on assassination day. Hunt said the statement was a lie and sued for damages. Hunt lost the case. It came out in testimony that not only was he there, his function in being there was to represent the CIA.

The lawyer defending the publisher was Mark Lane. See his book Plausible Denial.

It is interesting to note that daddy Bush is just about the only American of age that can't remember where he was on the day that JFK was assassinated. Really?

Also little known, but well-detailed in Russ Baker's book "Family of Secrets: The Bush Dynasty, America's Invisible Government, and the Hidden History of the Last Fifty Years," is the strong connection between Lee Harvey Oswald and George HW Bush (the senior Bush.) George de Mohrenschildt was a Bush family friend and a roommate of Bush's nephew at Andover prep school. De Mohrenschildt was also Lee Harvey Oswald's main handler and closest friend in the States. This connection has been completely ignored by scholars of the assassination.

It is well-known now that Bush was in Dallas on the day of the assassination, but lied about it.

The Wikipedia entry on George de Mohrenschildt begins:

Quote:

George de Mohrenschildt (April 17, 1911 – March 29, 1977) was a petroleum geologist and professor who befriended Lee Harvey Oswald in the summer of 1962 and maintained that friendship until Oswald's death, two days after the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy. He was acquainted with the Bush family, including George H. W. Bush, with whose nephew, Edward G. Hooker, he had been roommates at Phillips Academy in Andover, Massachusetts.[1]
On September 5, 1976, De Mohrenschildt wrote a letter to the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency, George H. W. Bush asking for his assistance in "removing a net" of surveillance from around him. The letter said:

Quote:

"You will excuse this hand-written letter. Maybe you will be able to bring a solution to the hopeless situation I find myself in. My wife and I find ourselves surrounded by some vigilantes; our phone bugged; and we are being followed everywhere. Either FBI is involved in this or they do not want to accept my complaints. We are driven to insanity by the situation. I have been behaving like a damn fool ever since my daughter Nadya died from [cystic fibrosis] over three years ago. I tried to write, stupidly and unsuccessfully, about Lee H Oswald and must have angered a lot of people — I do not know. But to punish an elderly man like myself and my highly nervous and sick wife is really too much. Could you do something to remove the net around us? This will be my last request for help and I will not annoy you any more. Good luck in your important job. Thank you so much.[43][44]"

Bush answered in a letter that he could not help. Soon after that De Mohrenschildt apparently killed himself. Richardson Preyer, then chairman of the House Select Committee on Assassinations, said: "He was a crucial witness."

www.dailypaul.com...

One of the best-researched and most respected exposes you will ever read:

Family of Secrets: The Bush Dynasty, America's Invisible Government, and the Hidden History of the Last Fifty Years

Has anyone here added the fired and butt-hurt CIA traitor and paranoid Allen Dulles to the conspirator list yet? Don't forget that jerk.

Originally posted by Grifter42
reply to post by abdel

 

Certainly, L.B.J. had a lot to benefit from the assassination. But there would always be doubt in his mind they would do the same to him, as he was president, I'd think.

Maybe he knew. Maybe he didn't. Governor Connelly certainly didn't know, or he wouldn't have been in the car.

I'm with LBJ. If you notice, he didn't rock the boat...he was bland next to Kennedy. He did what he was told. As a good boy, he had nothing to fear.

reply to post by amazing


Just BEFORE the shooting started in Dallas, LBJ in his limo (second) behind the JFK limo, hid by crouching on the floor. Later as president, LBJ falsely claimed that he was shielded by a heroic secret service agent Youngblood.

Senator Yarborough was in the limo with LBJ and he said the Youngblood incident never happened. See Jim Marrs Crossfire.

Also it had long been understood that for security reasons the president and the vice president would not travel together or appear in harms way together. That policy was not in effect in Dallas.

When Jackie Kennedy had to witness the swearing in of Lyndon Johnson shortly after the death of her husband she refused the offer to change her clothes which were splayed with blood and brain material from the shooting and said, "No, let them see what they have done to him". And so she stood their as a witness during the swearing-in in the same clothes that she was wearing when the President was murdered. Her own message to the world as to the truth but noone wanted to believe it.

reply to post by Shema


I was listening to a very interesting video by Gary Oldman.
I love that guy, great actor.
Played Oswald, in JFK, the Oliver Stone flick.

The Interview Video has some good dialogue from the actual Oswald too. He went to the bitter end, proclaiming his innocence.

This post brought to you by the Gary Oldman Society, a radicalist splinter group of the John Birch Society.

I don't for one moment believe that Oswald killed Kennedy. If you look at the video, the shots quite clearly come from the front. If Oswald was firing from the book depository, as alleged, then he was far in the rear of Kennedy.

I have no doubt that it was the CIA. Oswald had been associated to them for some time, almost being courted by them. He was quite obviously being set up as the fall guy. Look at his final words, 'I'm just a patsy.' If he was guilty, he'd proclaim that he was innocent, not that he was a patsy.

I, like most everyone here, think that the story of Oswald being the lone gunman is crap. I think it was the CIA/Military that pulled it off, and that LBJ was informed of the plot well beforehand. Anyone who's been to Dealy plaza can see that Oswald would have had to been both a crack shot, and stupid at the same time if the "official" version of the assassination happened. Why would he have waited till the limo was moving away from his position when he had ample time to get off his shot while they were coming towards him. I'm no sniper, but a target moving towards you would seem to be easier to hit than one going away from you, and going underneath trees to boot. The fact that its 50 years later and we're still talking about who really did it just shows how sloppy of a job the people who actually ran the operation to assassinate President Kennedy did.

If you look at the video, the shots quite clearly come from the front.

reply to post by Scorchio

The Zapruder film has been altered in many ways. Some frames have been painted over. The large orangish blob on the right side of JFKs head is painted on the frames. Also frames have been removed to hide the fact (seen by many eye witnesses) that Secret Service Agent Greer brought the limo to a stop at the time of the head shot.

There is good evidence of shots from the front. There was a bullet hole in the windshield. There is no evidence of this bullet hole in Zapruder.

There is an abundance of information on the web about the fake Zapruder film.

These facts come into my mind when I read your words [quite clearly] in reference to Zapruder.

I have no doubt that it was the CIA. Oswald had been associated to them for some time,

reply to post by Scorchio


Oswald was indeed associated with the CIA. But there is more. He was also associated with the Defense Intelligence Agency. He was also an informant for the FBI.

reply to post by Grifter42


You have been here long enough to probably know that there is more information on this site, than perhaps anywhere else in the world, concerning the Kennedy Assassination. To that end, you really have to read what it here before spurting off a question like that.

I am not trying to undermine your spirit in wanting to understand this. One of the most complex of ATS subjects indeed, but you MUST become familiar with what is here before even starting a thread with that title, and otherwise come in with a point of view that is unique, or coo-berates what has been presented.

I was a teenager when Kennedy was killed, and I have still not been able to satisfy to my personal satisfaction, that there is a concrete explaination that ties in all of the incredibly lucridous circumstances or fact, that lead up to his being murdered in Dallas. I would imagine that the only way I will ever know is to die, and only then , will it become crystal clear.

Please read what ATS has to offer here, because it is so in-depth, so overwhelming, that you may find a common thread that jumps the gap from just "wanting to know Who", but instead , the realization of "wanting to know Why".....then the "Who" becomes a game of "Round up the usual suspects." This is where the real detective work starts.

Oh... and the "How" is just as great a dilemma, once you get a handle on the "Why" and include or eliminate the "Who".

reply to post by leostokes


I haven't studied either films or theories, just going by what my own eyes tell me. And what my own eyes tell me is that he was shot by some-one to his front. I base this on the fact that the back of his head was blown off and landed on the rear of the car, consistent with an exit wound. I also base this on the movement of his head with the impact; If you're shot in the front of the head, your head moves backwards. If you're shot in the back of the head, your head moves forwards. Everything i see is consistent with the shots being fired from the front.

reply to post by Scorchio


What you see comes from the Zapruder film? This film has been extensively altered.

I did a search before I started my thread, but missed this one. There is lot's of info here in my thread.

At the point of the pyramid were LBJ and Hoover. Hoover flew into Texas the night before and, after a back room "pow wow" with Johnson and crew, flew back to D.C. that same night.

If you can ignore the cheesy intro music, I think you'll find this very compelling. This country could use men like Roger Craig today... It's linked because embedding is blocked.

Two Men In Dallas

It would be nice if there were a conspiracy to blame it on, rather than admit that the world can be so radically changed by the actions of one random individual. We would like the world to have more substance and resilience than that, and believe that our leaders/heroes are not that vulnerable.

It would also be nice to think that all the investigative dead ends and third-hand "revelations" and half-lines attempting to link Point A to Point B all add up to an airtight, solid, unimpeachable case that is in some way better than the case against Oswald.

Maybe if Oswald hadn't gotten to him first, Kennedy would have eventually been killed by somebody else working for some other shadowy organization. In hindsight, through the lens of history, Kennedy seemed destined to die violently one way or another. It was just a matter of whose number came up first.

Blue Shift
It would be nice if there were a conspiracy to blame it on, rather than admit that the world can be so radically changed by the actions of one random individual. We would like the world to have more substance and resilience than that, and believe that our leaders/heroes are not that vulnerable.

It would also be nice to think that all the investigative dead ends and third-hand "revelations" and half-lines attempting to link Point A to Point B all add up to an airtight, solid, unimpeachable case that is in some way better than the case against Oswald.

Maybe if Oswald hadn't gotten to him first, Kennedy would have eventually been killed by somebody else working for some other shadowy organization. In hindsight, through the lens of history, Kennedy seemed destined to die violently one way or another. It was just a matter of whose number came up first.

I agree with much of what you say, but I wish you'd check out my thread. A guy that worked for the JFK administration as a sound engineer realized after the assassination that he still had connections that few people had back then. The very same proprietary video that kept him from marketing the Evidence of Revision DVDs is what makes it impossible to believe the lone nut stuff.

A little fact and some conjecture has lead me to... a guy with unlimited power. Huge ego. No conscience. Untouchable. Did he have it done for himself? Did he do it for someone else? Always thought it was J Edgar Hoover.

intrepid
A little fact and some conjecture has lead me to... a guy with unlimited power. Huge ego. No conscience. Untouchable. Did he have it done for himself? Did he do it for someone else? Always thought it was J Edgar Hoover.

I always thought the mafia did it. Since they bank rolled his campaign and then he got 'tough on crime' from what I remember.

But yeah, methinks the young JFK ruffled a few feathers too many.