Humanzee? Oliver the chimp and his DNA analysis

this may have been covered before, but i am going to point out some things. there are certain anomalies with regard to this remarkable specimen. he walked upright, shook hands, smoked cigars, and even attempted to mount women when he reached puberty. but the real scientific data is given a footnote treatment instead of being fully disclosed.

in the 70's japanese scientists sequenced olvers DNA and came to the conclusion he had 47 chromosomes, and although the science of DNA was still in its infancy then, it is hard for me to believe that the new analysis is being 100% honest...

both in the documentary, and in the limited almost "poo pooed" and what is being shoved on people as "technical writeup" is very vague and not really disclosing at all.

Oliver is an African ape whose species identity has been debated in the popular media and by various scientists since the early 1970s. Although decisive morphological data has never been adduced on Oliver, many reports indicated that Oliver was morphologically unusual for a chimpanzee, particularly in his habitual bipedal posture. In addition, his diploid chromosome number was reported to be inconsistent with either human or chimpanzee, but instead intermediate between those species. We performed standard chromosomal studies which demonstrated that Oliver had the diploid number expected for a chimpanzee (2N = 48) and that the banding patterns of his chromosomes were typical for a chimpanzee and different from both humans and bonobos. We also sequenced a 312 bp region of his mitochondrial DNA D-loop region. Results indicated a high sequence homology to the Central African variety of chimpanzee, Pan troglodytes troglodytes. The highest percent homology was observed with a previously characterized specimen from Gabon, strongly suggesting that Oliver originated from this region. Am J Phys Anthropol 105:395–403, 1998. © 1998 Wiley-Liss, Inc.

this is very vague coming from an establishment that purports to be dedicated to the scientific method. why the vague explanation? what they do not tell here in this limited explanation is that he had patterns in his DNA that were not like any chimp on the planet. certain "switches" were turned on that are not turned on in other chimps. the documentary film, which is on youtube shows this very briefly. but i am wondering if there is a detailed documentation of this somewhere that can be independently studied, and if so, are there complete explanations as to what these switches are? we know that DNA science has matured to the point that now they can tell what each switch does, so what did oliver's switches enable him to do that was not chimp like at all? certainly we have anecdotal reference from his various owners, and people who knew him. but what we do not yet have is a detailed explanation as to every part of that sequence that was different from all other chimps, and they avoided comparing his chart and analysis to human DNA sequences to see if any of the same switches were turned on in his sequence as a human being.

there is also a legend that claims some scientists actually impregnated a chimp with human sperm, but destroyed both the mother and the offspring after the experiment. only one photograph remains as proof this offspring existed, if it actually was a hybrid. this raises questions on its own. who would do such an experiment? and furthermore, who would kill their own offspring if they actually did this? kind of fits the disregard for life that the establishment (not just science) has concerning humanity and life in general in "the big picture". now im not saying it was possible or was not. the chances of a human and chimp successfully producing offspring are very slim, and no openly documented cases exist.

now of course established science is wary to tread into these waters, since it would throw a wrench into political or social psychology, and most assuredly into religious theology. they use the excuse most often that its not worth looking at, when they usually mean "we are not ready for that". but if people are asking, then when is a good time to disclose the truth?

so what exactly was oliver? an example of chimpanzee evolution? do we have to start worrying about them sneaking up on us from behind? im sure some would have this fear if it were a more frequent phenomenon, but as it stands he was an anomaly. one that does need more investigation to give the public the real conclusive results.

anyway, take it for what it is, but if anyone wants to contribute any real data to this, not conjecture, not flaming or your particular religious dogma, but fact, then by all means add to this thread. if not then please go elsewhere to battle out ideologies. this is a sincere post dedicated to solving this mystery.

reply to post by studythem1


wow, cool story.
reading into it abit more, I came across this story from new scientist.
A Russian scientist in the 1920's attempted to create a hybrid.

In February 1926, Russian biologist Ilia Ivanov set out for Guinea in French West Africa, where he planned to perform one of the world's most sensational experiments. Ivanov was an expert in artificial insemination and had used his ground-breaking methods to create an assortment of hybrid animals. Now he was going to try something even more radical - crossing an ape and a human.

www.newscientist.com

Could the chimp in the op be the offspring or even a direct result from such an experiment?
In the article linked above it says that Ivanov's experiments failed, but were more experiments performed that were successful and kept secret?
There was another thread a month or two ago, scientists are looking for surrogate mothers for Neandertal baby.
So creating hybrids still seams to be on the agenda to some degree.

I've never heard of Oliver.
I'm sorry I can't contribute anything about his DNA, I don't understand that much, not being a scientist.
I tried watching the YouTube story on him, but its sad seeing how he was treated as a circus freak and all the testing he was used for.

I like chimps and to me they look close enough to humans that I consider them related. However they are aggressive dangerous animals.
Maybe in his case his parents were human and chimp.
Or he grew up near a human settlement and mimicked what he saw. My cat walks upright to come in the back door. She stands up with her front paws on the door pushing it open as she walks in. It looks cute she does that because all other cats use their heads to push the door open. She did this her own way because my other older cat didn't know he could push doors open. He thought he had to just sit and wait. Or she might have watched him use his head and never tried walking in. He finally started pushing the door open using his head like a cat 'should' . I had a male cat that used to like to be held by his front paws,the way you teach a baby to walk. He would walk a few steps. Possibly animals can be taught much more than thought of. The male cat I have now uses the toilet. I didn't teach him.

I think all species, animals and humans are capable of doing amazing things if they aren't instructed not to in the first place. we do what we're told we can. Oliver might just march to his own drum, however you say he has different DNA. You're right there should be more of a knowledge base about this.
Thanks for the thread

reply to post by LeLeu

I forgot about the Neanderthal baby. Wonder if there's an update on that.

reply to post by violet


The story about the Ivanov experiments that I linked states that he found 5 Russian women who volunteered to be inseminated with chimp spoof.
I'm pretty sure they will find some young lady to put her name in history as the Neanderthal mother.

u have to post a picture when talking about oliver to me thats the most intresting part of his story
compare his picture to a typical chimp

First thanks for a very interesting story. I am afraid that I have nothing to add because I had never heard of Oliver. But I will now be checking him out.

Thanks for the picture. WOW! Yeah, the picture really completes the post!

this is the video to watch if you are interested. but it only brings up even more questions about this remarkable chimp.

below is a purported image of an actual hybrid, that was destroyed.





and here is an image link from another post on ATS that shows just one of the differences in DNA sequencing between oliver and chimps...which needs more thorough disclosure...

reply to post by studythem1






Jesse investigates the "Humanzee" conspiracy.

-SAP-

Wow!
This is an incredible thread! Thanks for bringing it to us!
Chimps are awesome! A dude I used to work with used to own one. He said that he and the chimp would sit on the front porch all day long and the chimp would go fetch the beers. Haha

Any sort of a human chimp hybrid would truly be an amazing animal.
S&F

Originally posted by toothpastert

u have to post a picture when talking about oliver to me thats the most intresting part of his story
compare his picture to a typical chimp

I agree we need to see the fella but I saw that pic and after looking at videos of him wasn't sure that was real.

ETA
Ok nevermind sorry. Its him.

reply to post by studythem1


Cute pic of the hybrid. Ss sad it was destroyed.