Shapeshifting - scientifically possible?

Earlier tonight in the ATS chat, a bunch of us were talking about random topics like usual when the ideas of aliens and shapeshifting were brought up -- I know, big suprise right?

Anyway, I was trying to tell the others in the chat how I think that it is actually scientifically possible for some kind of "shapeshifter" to exist, despite the fact of how incredibly unbelievable it sounds. I was going to just copy and paste a few snippits of information I've collected over the months / years (who knows) but I quickly realized that this would be impossible to do. So, here I am making a thread. I'm already assuming there will be a ton of ridicule and laughter. All I ask is that you look at the actual science and put the peices of the puzzle together - I have to say it does require thinking outside of the box.

I have collected a good amount of information, but the fact remains that nobody has proved that shapeshifting is possible -- well other than in one very strange octopus -- and I'm not saying that I myself think it does - I'm just saying I think it is possible.

Here's my collection of scientific "data":

1) A mirror neuron is a neuron that fires both when an animal acts and when the animal observes the same action performed by another. Thus, the neuron "mirrors" the behavior of the other, as though the observer were itself acting. This leads into the ideas of dual coding and common coding theory. Keyword: Theory.

2) A chiral molecule is a type of molecule that has a non-superposable mirror image. The feature that is most often the cause of chirality in molecules is the presence of an asymmetric carbon atom. The term chiral in general is used to describe an object that is not superposable on its mirror image.

3) The mimic octopus, Thaumoctopus mimicus, is a species of octopus with a variety of capabilities in mimicry. The act of mimicking can refer to appearance, behaviour, sound, scent, location.

4) Crypsis is the ability of an organism to avoid observation or detection by other organisms. Methods include camouflage, nocturnality, subterranean lifestyle, transparency, and mimicry. Crypsis can in principle involve visual, olfactory or auditory camouflage

5) Clonal Fragmentation in multicellular or colonial organisms is a form of asexual reproduction or cloning where an organism is split into fragments. Each of these fragments develop into mature, fully grown individuals that are clones of the original organism.
For example; sponges, cloral, annelids (worms) -> polychaeta

As I said above, this obviously does not show a "step-by-step" process of shapeshifting, but I think it's a pretty good direction. I feel that these different processes COULD provide a way for an organism to successfully accomplish such an outlandish task. Not only is it a way to explain the physical concept, to me I feel it could also explain a way for the brain to acheive such an incredible feat by actually firing neurons and interacting with individual cells on a molecular level... I know, pretty far out huh? I'll say it a second time - I just think that shapeshifting could, in fact, be possible based on current scientific evidence.

Thanks to wikipedia and google, as usual - for finding most of this information. I realize there are several people out there who despise using wikipedia as a source for everything, so I tried to put links up to other sources as well. I was trying to put this thread together rather quickly from a bunch of random bookmarks I've collected - please forgive me for not putting quotes around certain information from wikipedia. If it's a problem I'll edit the post and do so. Please respond back with any thoughts you have, good or bad I'm open to all of it

reply to post by Time2Think


Ok,that octopus critter, I was aware of from the science channel, I never thought about it as a type of shape shifting, but it was amazing beautiful creature, and I can also see where you could go there.

The rest of the science, you presented, was brand new to me, but equally fasinating. I think you have an amazing start to your arguments. I just love this "What If " stuff.

Heading should read
Shape shifting Scientifically describable.
Anything is possible. Its just not accepted by mechanical thinkers until it is scientifically describable and testable.
Shapeshifting exists as a natural ability in nature whether science has gotten around to describing and claiming it or not.
Also Mirror Neuron I suspect is a key component in the Telepathy phenomenon.

reply to post by Time2Think


Well, consider all of the 'shape-shifting' that we have already undergone as an organism from gastrulation to development into our adult form. All of that folding upon folding. Wouldn't we have to unfold all of that to change shape? Seems to me it would surely kill us. I find it unlikely, even though I would like to be a lycanthrope.

The biggest issue for me in shape shifting is mass. You cannot change your mass regardless of what you could change into.
Forgive me, I did not read all of your links, is there any that describe how mass would relate to shape shifting?

reply to post by randomtangentsrme


Clonal Fragmentation in multicellular or colonial organisms is a form of asexual reproduction or cloning where an organism is split into fragments.

To put into english this is the stuff where a salamander will lose its tail to get away from a predator then grow it back, or a starfish will lose one of its arms, then grow a new one as well as the actual lost arm regrowing into an entirely new starfish.

Other than that I'm not really sure what you're getting at with mass - I'd have to do more of my own research. Are you saying that it's impossible for an organism to change it's mass? As in... becoming larger or smaller?

Originally posted by Time2Think
reply to post by randomtangentsrme

 

Clonal Fragmentation in multicellular or colonial organisms is a form of asexual reproduction or cloning where an organism is split into fragments.

To put into english this is the stuff where a salamander will lose its tail to get away from a predator then grow it back, or a starfish will lose one of its arms, then grow a new one as well as the actual lost arm regrowing into an entirely new starfish.

Other than that I'm not really sure what you're getting at with mass - I'd have to do more of my own research. Are you saying that it's impossible for an organism to change it's mass? As in... becoming larger or smaller?

I am saying if you are a 200 lb. individual, you cannot take the shape of a fly, without some impressive physics going on.
That is where mass come in

Shapeshifting will definitely be possible in the future, thought it will look nothing like the animorphs on tv. At the current rate of scientific breakthrough I'd say as early as 2050 people would be able to physically alter themselves using gene therapy. Once we reach that point the technology would grow quicker and quicker, and within a decade or two be more or less perfected (think of the timeline of the computer and cell phone, starts out slow then quickly explodes)

Originally posted by StarsInDust
reply to post by Time2Think

 

Ok,that octopus critter, I was aware of from the science channel, I never thought about it as a type of shape shifting, but it was amazing beautiful creature, and I can also see where you could go there.

It is amazing.





- Lee

reply to post by Bybyots


Hmm.. nice concept, that one never even crossed my mind before - I think you're onto something there too.. But I think that would be more of an artificial means. Sort of like injecting animal DNA into a human or something as mentioned below with the "animorphs" - I'm picturing some sort of weird "egg-like" machine, such as some strange cryogenic chamber to serve as an embryo. Sounds like something straight of a weird sci-fi movie...

well...keeping in mind how big is the universe..and how much diversity reigns everywhere...i will not be surprised to find out shape shifting to be possible..

we are energy beings ...the physical body is only made of atoms held together

reply to post by heineken


I agree with you 100%, but you can't just go around saying that to people. There has to be something to back it up... You know, if I just say "well sure it's possible because we're all really just energy and everything else is just energy, because in reality, everything is just made of atoms." You don't really get too far... that's why I'm trying to think out of the box and use actual, factual modern scientific knowledge to show that I think its possible for someone to do, despite being incredibly difficult (requiring a ton of energy - as far as we know) You can get into a whole other discussion on the idea of energy alone....

Maybe shape shifting has something to do with how the atoms and the spaces between atoms are arranged? Like ice and liquid water? It's technically the same stuff (oxygen and hydrogen), just arranged differently.

reply to post by heineken


Very valid point. Even right now scientists are able to manipulate single atoms and rearrange them to form a new structure, and thus a new material.

reply to post by lee anoma


Wow, thanks for the videos, they were great on the camouflaged animals of the water.

Now just think if science could actually swing this shape shifting technology for humans, what impact it would have on the diet industry, or even the beauty industry. If we were in control, some people might not even opt for what is considered the norm now. I bet the gothic youth would have a totally different idea on how they would be shifting their image.

Originally posted by Time2Think
reply to post by heineken

 

I agree with you 100%, but you can't just go around saying that to people. There has to be something to back it up... You know, if I just say "well sure it's possible because we're all really just energy and everything else is just energy, because in reality, everything is just made of atoms." You don't really get too far... that's why I'm trying to think out of the box and use actual, factual modern scientific knowledge to show that I think its possible for someone to do, despite being incredibly difficult (requiring a ton of energy - as far as we know) You can get into a whole other discussion on the idea of energy alone....

you are correct!

and the good thing now we can present facts

I'm gonna be 100% honest now..

I was one of the most skeptics persons around regarding spirituality etc...
Since early childhood I had a passion and love for science, particularly everything related to how the universe work.

Spiritually I was lost , I am an atheist for quiet sometime now...6 years or so..and only till recently I rejected any idea related to spirits, higher being etc and considered persons whom dedicated time to their spirituality cookos wasting time trying to attach to something which we cant see or feel.

BUT

after the recent famous quantum experiments such as the Quantum Entanglement and the Double Split everything changed..now quantum physics is telling us different things we were used to hear from the scientific community.

Physics is telling us that YES we are one..we are the same..everything is energy..and we have an impact on the environment around us with the power of our mind!

reply to post by heineken


Yea I'm pretty much the same way. You can't explain what a "soul" really is.. but when people say there's no such thing as a soul, then what do they feel like when they're looking at something, or talking to somebody else? For myself, it's like I'm just inside of a body looking out.. I've had a few experiences similar to out of body experiences and they kinda freak me out.. I actually talked to someone who claims to have done it a lot, and she was telling me a good way to "practice" is to simply tie a string to your hand... which sounds so stupid it just might work Still freaks me out though.

But yes.. whenever I think about a "God" I just think of energy. Everything is energy, energy's eternal.. etc. It just makes sense, in a weird way. But there's still a whole lot of other areas you can get into when you start thinking about this kinda stuff, which just leads to more and more topics.. like the ideas of positive and negative energy for example. Definitely some weird stuff to try to wrap your head around.

Just read through this guy's thread today and it has tons of great information in it:

The new science of life...

I recommend spending some time to check it out. Very good stuff

The closest you will get to this will be smart matter.

Think, grains of sand that like can clump to form anything, any shape.

a technology seen in the last kitt car, it's armor was self regenerating via smart matter

I'm bored, and drinking, and would just like to say that I am sick of people trolling. Guess what everyone, the world is flat and if you try to sail a boat from one side of the planet to the next, be careful, because you might get destroyed by a gigantic sea monster.. or even worse, you might fall off the edge. So much for "deny ignorance" that motto on this site has become a complete joke. I am NOT directing this to anyone on this thread just venting at the general public and a few select people on here (you know who you are).

Anyway, whatever.. mmm beer. FTW