The forever puppy

Apparently, one of the latest internet frauds out there is this claim that someone has created a "forever puppy" by mixing Cocker Spaniels and Golden Retrievers. You can find sites making this claim:

Here's a fully-grown Golden Cocker Retriever. Forever a puppy

Sounds great, you get a cute little puppy that never grows up to become a big, fat, smelly, lazy dog that likes jumping up on everyone who visits your house. Who wouldn't want that?

Unfortunately, there's this funny thing called "reality" and the truth of the matter is that there is no such thing as a "forever puppy".

Regarding this "forever puppy" nonsense:
I’m sure many of you have seen this photo with the caption “Guys. This is a fully grown Golden Cocker Retriever. In other words, a forever puppy.”

Let’s set the record straight.

-This is not a full-grown dog. This is an actual puppy. This is what this mix looks like when fully grown:

-Anyone who breeds this mix is an irresponsible breeder, and anyone who buys one of these puppies is an irresponsible buyer.

-The breeding of designer dogs like this must stop. All it does is create more unwanted pets and prevent dogs who already exist and need homes from being adopted.

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It sure does look like they are setting people up for disappointment. Sure, the full grown dog is still plenty cute but, how many shallow, petty owners wouldn't toss it off to the shelters after it doesn't live up to the hype?

Internet frauds like this are despicable. I hope anyone who gets taken in by this one at least has the responsibility to take care of the dog they've adopted after its grown out of its puppy stage.

Let the buyer beware.

There are many breeds of dogs which have been inbreed so much that it is actually evil to continue the breed, look at King charles spaniel they have been breed for a look that makes the dogs brain to big for it's head and causing severe pain throughout it's life.

I urge people to watch this




I also urge dog owners to only get mixed breeds they are more healthy and do not suffer.

While researching this dog, I found another site that offers "forever puppies" by swapping out the dog every six months.

Perpetual Puppy

Wouldn't you like a puppy forever and ever?
Everyone loves puppies, but cute puppies have a habit of growing into large smelly dogs. ShinyShack.com have for the first time in history solved this problem. You can now buy a Perpetual PuppyTM that will be forever a puppy!

How does this work?
Simple. You order a puppy from us. We send you a beautiful 3 month old puppy of your chosen breed. You get to keep, play with, and love this puppy for 6 months. At the end of that 6 month period, we collect the puppy. You have a choice of receiving a replacement puppy for an additional £299.99 payment, or terminating your Perpetual PuppyTM contract. This happens every 6 months, so you can if you choose keep a Perpetual PuppyTM forever.

How much does this cost?
The first puppy costs £499.99 (inc VAT and delivery). Each subsequent replacement costs £299.99 (inc VAT and delivery).

What happens to the old puppy?

Shiny Shack

They grind them up to make hamburger for the European market, of course.

Actually, they claim they find them all good homes but, who really believes that bunk?

I don't know what type of person can treat a living animal in this way. How is it that someone would not become attached to the puppy after raising it for six months? What type of sick would actually be interested in switching out puppies every six months?

The way people treat dogs in this world.

reply to post by FortAnthem
It's funny, but what are now referred to as "designer hybrid" dogs we were raised to call "mutts" meaning dogs born of two or more different breeds rather than being pure bred. Anyone who would pay hundreds or even thousands of dollars for a "mutt" is pretty silly in my book.

Now if your were to breed a cocker spaniel with a golden retriever you could assume that the smallest the ensuing puppies might grow to be is the size of a cocker spaniel- which is a far cry from puppy sized. There is also the chance that the puppies could turn out as big as a golden retriever, in which case the idiots that bought them will be in for a huge surprise- literally!

Please. All breeders belong in a very, very hot place frequented by a large red man with a big fancy tail, bred just for their torture.

No such thing as a "good breeder". Just a money-whore.

reply to post by chasingbrahman


Now, wait just a minute. There ARE responsible breeders out there. My mom and I are one of them. I raised Labrador Retrievers for most of my teen and adult life.

We only bred the bitches once a year at the most, usually only once every 18 months to 2 years. After 3 litters, they were spayed and either sent to very good homes (we thoroughly interviewed and background checked each client) or were put into training as, at a minimum Junior level water dogs and then sent on to homes of people that hunt or compete. We never had more than 3 bitches, 2 sires, and 15 puppies (of two different age groups) at a time.

My entire 3-acre lot was fenced in for the Labs to run and play instead of having just a small dog run, with chicken wire dug 2 ft down and going all the way up to 5 ft above ground to prevent diggers, climbers, and jumpers from accidental escapes. Bitches weren't allowed to breed until they were over a year old and had been through at least 3 heat cycles. This was so they had time to fully mature and their bones fully formed and their bodies were more able to handle the pregnancy. They also bounced bank much better afterwards, completely regaining that attractive curve from their chest, under the belly, to the hind-quarters, without those saggy, droopy tits that most breeder bitches get.

The only time the bitches were kennel-bound (in their 6x8 ft pens, air conditioned and cleaned twice a day) was when they were in heat and we didn't want them to breed yet, or while they were nursing puppies. Pups got moved to a 10x10ft pen after they were weaned. There were never more than 9 in the pen at one time, as we spread out the breeding so much.

We selected 3 puppies from each litter to go in a different pen, also 10x10 ft, for training. 2 were trained to age 6months UKC Junior champion level bird/water dog, and the third was trained up to 18 months and UKC Champion or Grand Champion. We used the Water Dog method, never once hit a trainee or any of the others for that matter, used Kibble and a whistle for positive feedback, and only sharp, firm voice tones when they disobeyed. We also gave copies of "Water Dog" to the new owners, and offered a two-week "how to use your dog in hunting and/or competition" course. It was like a Cliff's notes of the hours and hours of training we put in, so the new owners could maintain the training and have effective hunters and contestants in birding competitions.

All puppies were crate-trained and micro-chipped, as well as fully vaccinated with a final vet checkup before they went to their new homes at 8-10 weeks, 6 months or 18 months. We included a spay/neuter option for our 6 and 18 month old pups that were being trained, and strongly urged spaying/ neutering of all the pups that left our home.

We never lost a puppy due to "puppy mill" related illnesses such as kennel cough, although one died shortly after birth because the mother accidentally smothered it. It was her first litter and she freaked out for days. We supplemented the mother's sporadic nursing by bottle feeding the puppies several times a day and gradually decreased each day until she was more calm and able to nurse them completely on her own, then she didn't want to wean them. Poor girl. That was her only litter.

When we decided that we could no longer sustain the breeding and training, we spayed all the bitches, neutered the sires, kept one of each and two puppies who were also spayed and neutered, and sent the rest to good homes under the same thorough guidelines we had for all the others who went before them. After a year, we found everyone a forever home, including the four that are my family's pets to this day.

reply to post by littled16


To be clear, these are *not* mutts. Mutts are the result of uncontrolled breeding, most frequently with no human intervention. And yes, they tend to be very healthy (but not always).

The funny part about this is calling them "hybrids" when that applies to every dog breed out there. Every single one was created in this way.

I have mixed feelings about "designer dogs," mostly because the people doing the breeding are not educated about genetics. Most breeders have zero idea what they are doing on the genetic side of things, actually.

However, creating new breeds is a good thing. It introduces new genetics into quite isolated genetic pools (inbred).

If you start looking at a dog from a breeder, its not a bad idea to also look at newer breeds and look at their bloodlines to see if they have been properly bred over time (by introducing new genetics).

So, the issues with designer dogs is slightly different than most think. One is that they tend to be smaller. Once a canine starts to deviate too far from their original phenotypes (seen in the wolf), some extreme abnormalities can start to show up. Hearing starts to go downhill proportionally as you go lighter than 20 pounds. Brachycephalic breeds also have enormous issues with everything from heat dissipation to breathing. Nature tends to let us know when what we are doing has veered off course, and some of these breeds are actually incapable of giving birth naturally (with the rare exception). They need to receive C-Sections (like the Boston Terrier).

Not all breeders are inept, thats a sure thing. However, many more are than the breeding community would like to admit. Backyard breeders are almost unanimously viewed in a negative light, but the real question to ask is "Does this breeder actually know what phenotypes are, or have they educated themselves at all on the hard science of genetics?"

Most breeders think that just taking good care of their dogs is all that is needed, but its a much, much more in depth field than just seeing traits and breeding for them.

Of course, then you have the outright scams, like this thread is about. That speaks to a whole 'nother set of problems.

Breeds like the Puggle, while straddling the line as far as weight goes, actually are a good thing for genetic lines. It certainly helps eliminate health problems that are inherent with Pugs, although Beagles are generally healthy.

Canines have been by humanities side for a very, very long time. At some point, I think its important to take our responsibility in our participation in eugenics and actually start to learn about what we are doing to a species which has "had our back" more than any other in existence. Its one of those things that we have gotten into that we cant just leave it be. So much meddling has been done, that it needs a truly scientific look at what is going on currently, and where to take it from here. This is what a real breeder should be doing, without exception.

reply to post by Lobster


To clarify: the reason I, and perhaps some others here, despise breeders hasn't a thing to do with how the dogs are treated by those breeding them. It has to do with the fact that there are actually people on this planet who breed a creature we already have too many of in order to make money. It's empirically gross because it displaces good dogs so people can profit.

Every dog you sell results in one dog being euthanized, because if families looking for dogs had only kennels to solicit, we wouldn't have so many homeless and euthanized dogs. It's basic addition and subtraction.

I love my forever puppies!!!! They will always be puppies in my heart!
PS they both came from rescues.

reply to post by FortAnthem


I have never, nor wil I ever have a 'pure-bred' companion animal. The very notion that a species is somehow enhanced by the selective breeding of a tiny population runs counter to everything that science says on the topic.

The very fact that the fat man from the RSPCA admitted that he wouldn't dream of bumping uglies with his own daughter is proof that he is well aware of the dangers that are facing 'pure breeds', however much like any other organization, the money is too good to risk changing the current status quo. Add in the fact that most prosepective puppy purchasers are too damn dumb to know about genetic risks, too lazy to do any research and have had an image of perfection presented to them I can say withoutt any doubt that we will not see any change.

Every dog I've had has been a mutt, or was unwanted/unloved/abused/abandoned. Many were abused puppies that I saved from #ty owners, one pitt bull I stole because the owner prefered beating him, used him as an extension of his penis (typical ghetto mentality towards that breed) and wouldn't give him up and a few were shelter dogs.

Until people begin to become educated about the disgusting level of inbreeding that takes place and some serious reporting is published to the masses regarding the pain these animals are in and the financial burden they are in relation to vet bills nothing will change.


But I and my animal companions wil have a long and happy life together, most likely free from debilitating genetic deformities. Every one of those supporters of the current system are nothing more than monsters, making and selling monsters that look like they'd be more at home in the forests surrounding Chernobyl than winning 'Best In Show'.