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Originally posted by narwahl
It wasn't for saying vagina.
An email to the press corp has surfaced explaining it was because they were all upity, and wouldn't know their place.
(Meh can't find it anymore)
Anyway: They were both propably having a visit, if you know what I mean.
Originally posted by sheba2011
Originally posted by TinkerHaus
Originally posted by narwahl
reply to post by TinkerHaus
Yes tinkerhouse.
You propably don't get to hear those that often in forced-birth circles, but it's fairly standard fare outside of it.
There is a T-Shirt "If I wanted government in my vagina, I'd F. a senator"
There is also a picture of an ultrasound wand. on the side it reads "If you can read this your government is too close"
It's innuendo
It's funny.
It drives the point home rather powerfully (as humor often does)
Sidenote: one of the provisions in the bill forces women to carry to term a baby that is found to be not viable after 21 weeks.
In my book that is plain and simple torture.
Thank you for admitting that it was intentional innuendo, Representative Brown was insinuating that the Legislature wanted personal access to her vagina. She was being dramatic and disrespectful.
Sexual innuendo has no place in a legislative body. If someone was wearing one of those t-shirts in session they would have been thrown out.
The word "VAGINA" is not the problem here - it's the act Representative Brown attempted to project on the Legislature with her statement.
Let's be perfectly clear here, shall we?
It wasn't sexual innuendo in the "wink wink, nudge nudge" way. It was sexual innuendo in that Rep Brown implied that the Republicans wanted to, essentially, rape her. That's why she added "no means no."
Yes she was being dramatic -- I would have been too. How else do we get our point across? THIS IS A DRAMATIC ISSUE.
Was she being disrespectful? No more disrespectful than those that passed this disrespectful law.
Originally posted by TinkerHaus reply to post by Benevolent HereticYou obviously haven't educated yourself on what Representative Brown actually said, and why she was temporarily banned for speaking.
If there was a debate on legislation determining how they could use their penis reproductively, absolutely; (and it still would have been funny.)
Originally posted by TinkerHaus If I were a state rep and said to the floor "I'm flattered that you're all so interested in my penis, but no means no!" would that have been appropriate?
They do, and you're right she should have referenced examples of that. However, she is not just trying to rally "stupid feminazis" (here is an example an offensive statement... are you male?), she is trying to rally any woman who is offended that the state is attempting to regulate what she does with her body, and how that effects her reproductive/social choices. I'm standing firmly with this lady on this one, and if that makes me a "stupid feminazi" in your book then we can count all of the ways that I don't give a sh*t.
Originally posted by TinkerHaus Brown claims that men make offensive statements all the time, but are not banned from speaking. She doesn't give any reference or example of that, however.. Sounds like she is trying to rally the feminazis who are too stupid to actually look in to what happened. Sadly, it appears to be working.
Originally posted by SunnyDee
Originally posted by narwahl
It wasn't for saying vagina.
An email to the press corp has surfaced explaining it was because they were all upity, and wouldn't know their place.
(Meh can't find it anymore)
Anyway: They were both propably having a visit, if you know what I mean.
Since when is being uppity cause for banning? Like congressmen don't ever get uppity! You'd think freedom of speech would at it's strongest in government.
Hope you were being funny with the visitor comment, I'll assume so, but that comment even as a joke, is so demeaning to me as a woman.
To the Capitol Press Corps,
Just to be clear, despite the misinformation being spread by Reps. Brown and Byrum, and Sen. Gretchen Whitmer, there are two representatives not being recognized on the House floor today because of their actions yesterday. It has nothing to do with their gender, their religion or the topic they were discussing. All day today, we have had representatives of both parties, both genders and several different religions passionately debating important issues that will significantly impact the future of Michigan. I would urge you not to become too distracted by temper tantrums designed to score political points.
Regards,
Ari
Originally posted by DeathbecomesLife
Originally posted by DeathbecomesLife
When a mother is not left alone to raise her child, but is helped by the whole community...
When each child is regarded as the sacred continuation of our species...
When each person is free to explore this world again with the same wonderment they had as a child...
Then and only then will no one consider an abortion.
It is interesting that the above, which is the truth on the matter, has gotten not one reply and only a modicum of acknowledgement through stars. It is the truth. Before you can say you are against something, you should do some home work to find out why a thing is being done. You should try to get to the root of the issue and address it there.
How can you begrudge someone for having an abortion if all you are going to do is raise that child to go die in a WAR?
How can you begrudge someone for having an abortion when you first stripped them of the right to choose to get pregnant through rape or oppression?
How can you begrudge someone for having an abortion when the child will only be born suffering due to birth defects?
There is a reason the weaker sex physically is endowed with the divine right (it is in HER womb, not yours) to choose whether to allow life into this world or not. It is not the place of Man to decide this.
However, it is a man's place to protect this sacred vessel. To provide a sustainable environment for the child once it is born. To ensure the safety and health of the child. To teach it. To love it.
Do we acknowledge the sacredness of our women today? Truthfully?
Do we do what is the logical thing to do as Man who is trying to ensure the survival of our species?
It begins in the womb.
Originally posted by DeathbecomesLife
What are you willing to sacrifice that abortion is no longer considered?
How against it are you?
So I ask these again...
It is no one's place to dominate the body of another. A woman has the sacred right to do with what she will her own body. Until a child leaves her womb, she has the power.
Look at your women, and ask yourself, what will I do to protect them?
Then when you find your answer, know that the other man will too.
What is disrespectful about the law? No offense, but I doubt you even know what this bill would do. It's not even a LAW yet.
"The bills totaling 60 pages of legislation would end legal abortion procedures in Michigan after 20 weeks without exceptions for woman's life, fetal anomaly, in cases of rape or incest. All health facilities access providing access to family planning based medical care to have surgical rooms on site even if they do not provide surgical abortions. Physicians would be mandated to be present for medication abortions, to screen women for "coercion" before providing an abortion, and the legislation's would create new regulations for the disposal of fetal remains. Additionally, the measures would ban "telemedicine" abortions, use of technology to prescribe medication for abortion services and the morning-after pill."
Originally posted by TinkerHaus
This bill isn't discussing REPRODUCTIVE rights. Reproduction is the act that leads to abortions. This bill still allows people to be completely irresponsible and do what they'd like with their vaginas. It's not about limiting a woman's right to her vagina, but rather about the law concerning what you can and cannot do to a fetus that was created through the free use of a woman's vagina.
Let's please stop trying to smear the words, and speak appropriately. Let's discard the buzz word labels and speak on the issue honestly.
Lisa Brown was insinuating that those who support this bill want personal access to her vagina. The comment was blatant sexual innuendo and had no place in a civilized discussion. It wouldn't and doesn't offend me, but I completely understand why these temper tantrums were punished. When my kids throw a tantrum we take a little time out to calm down too.
Act like a child, get treated like a child. If you guys want to watch the whole session you can see MANY people use the word vagina, including Republicans and Democrats, and OBGYNs.
So again, for the 50th time, despite what the MEDIA IS TELLING YOU the word "vagina" was not the reason Lisa Brown was censured.
edit on 18-6-2012 by TinkerHaus because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by sheba2011
Originally posted by TinkerHaus
This bill isn't discussing REPRODUCTIVE rights. Reproduction is the act that leads to abortions. This bill still allows people to be completely irresponsible and do what they'd like with their vaginas. It's not about limiting a woman's right to her vagina, but rather about the law concerning what you can and cannot do to a fetus that was created through the free use of a woman's vagina.
Let's please stop trying to smear the words, and speak appropriately. Let's discard the buzz word labels and speak on the issue honestly.
Lisa Brown was insinuating that those who support this bill want personal access to her vagina. The comment was blatant sexual innuendo and had no place in a civilized discussion. It wouldn't and doesn't offend me, but I completely understand why these temper tantrums were punished. When my kids throw a tantrum we take a little time out to calm down too.
Act like a child, get treated like a child. If you guys want to watch the whole session you can see MANY people use the word vagina, including Republicans and Democrats, and OBGYNs.
So again, for the 50th time, despite what the MEDIA IS TELLING YOU the word "vagina" was not the reason Lisa Brown was censured.
edit on 18-6-2012 by TinkerHaus because: (no reason given)
I find you horribly offensive. Please go sit in the corner.
Ah, personal bias. Such a wonderful thing. =]
I haven't said anything offensive or against the clear and well-documented rules of ATS. If I had, I would expect to suffer the consequences as outlined in the ATS T&C. =D
Originally posted by TinkerHaus
reply to post by sheba2011
Talk about splitting hairs!
No, actually I am a supporter of choice.. Again, had you read my earlier posts you would know this.
When I said women can continue to be completely irresponsible with their vaginas, it was an extreme example.. But to that line of thought, the vast majority of abortions are 100% voluntary,
and serve to abort an unwanted fetus due to irresponsible breeding habits of the mother.
Basically the majority of abortions are party girls who don't want the party to end. Adoption is a legitimate solution.. And for those of you that would argue that a woman's body is different after childbirth.. Well, partygirl should have thought of that before she hooked up.
I am sorry to hear about your sister's situation, and I absolutely agree that if a mother's health is threatened by a pregnancy, that it should be aborted. I am glad she and her doctor's made the right choice and that she is still with us today.
I do NOT agree with what I will refer to as "casual abortion."
I do NOT agree with late term abortion where the fetuses body is literally RIPPED APART.
I do NOT agree with making a mockery of our political system by using inflammatory language
and misrepresentation to serve a political agenda. I do not believe in speaking out of turn or yelling while The House is meeting. In my opinion, these women were acting for political reward and exposure, which they have received.
You are making assumptions based on my interpretation of the story presented in this thread, and I can understand that. You would assume someone that is pro-choice (for the most part) would agree, without thought, that these women were unfairly targeted. Well, I am for the most part pro-choice, and I still believe they were acting immaturely and were justifiably censured.
edit on 18-6-2012 by TinkerHaus because: (no reason given)
Now, more than 2,800 people say they plan to attend a protest at the Capitol tonight, with many of those taking to a Facebook page created for the event to share their plans.
One man posted a picture of cupcakes decorated like vaginas he said he plans to bring, while a woman suggested showing up wearing tampon jewelry to the play, "The Vagina Monologues," which will be performed on the steps of the Capitol at 6 p.m.
"Bring signs, bring your vagina, bring your outrage, bring your humor," said the play's author, Eve Ensler.
Aren't we glad for that? If the vast majority of abortions were coerced or forced, that would be a bad thing, no? We do not want to coerce or force anyone into anything now, do we? Isn't that the definition of "choice"? The choice you say you are for?
I think it's absolutely hilarious that you continue to use inflammatory word choices that I could easily call offensive. "Breeding" habits? My dear, women do not "breed" -- dogs breed.
I am in my late 40s. I am no party girl; I'm a mother of two teenagers. I am still fertile. I cannot use any form of b.c. except condoms. Should I accidentally get pregnant, my doctor will insist on a therapeutic abortion, due to health issues I am considered "high risk." Adoption? Very likely any child I might conceive would have chromosomal abnormalities, at this age. But, you think I am a party girl ........
If you agree with that, then you do NOT support the Michigan bills.
My dear, there is no such thing as a casual abortion. You have obviously never been pregnant.
They were, rightly so, drawing attention-- National attention-- to the slippery slope we are about to descend down, the one that will lead us right back to 1950s and back alley abortions with hangers. Be silent, your rights are taken away. It's not about their individual political exposure and reward. It's about calling attention to an issue.
The bill would impose new insurance and licensing requirements on abortion clinics that bill opponents said could force them to close. It also would regulate the disposal of fetal remains, require some physicians who perform abortions to carry $1 million in liability insurance, ban the use of teleconferences to prescribe abortion medication, and force doctors to screen women for coercion before providing abortions.