The Secret Caves of Giza [doco]

On March 3, 2008 three British explorers - Andrew Collins, Sue Collins & Nigel Skinner-Simpson - found and entered an unknown cave complex under the Giza Plateau. They explored the caves four times over the next month.

In September 2009 Dr. Zahi Hawass issued a stern formal statement stating that the cave system did not exist.

In September 2010 a History Channel show featured Dr. Hawass exploring Collins' Giza cave system, which Hawass had said didn't exist.

Hawass called it the greatest adventure he had ever had.

This is the incredible story of the Lost Caves of Giza.

I am completely amazed that no one has posted a thread about this documentary yet, well I couldn't find one anyway. This doco is absolutely mind blowing. There was a thread about this discovery posted last year which received almost 200 flags. This doco explains the whole story about the cave system and how it was located by Andrew Collins and his team.

The first clue was uncovered when they discovered an alignment of the Giza pyramids with the Cygnus constellation and they used that as a tool to locate a possible entrance to the cave system. They examined an obscure tomb area at the location which they called the "Tomb of the Birds", but were unable to find any opening into a larger cave system.

The next clue came when old memoirs of British explorer Henry Salt pointed to the exact same location. After carefully examining the same area again, they found a small opening inside the Tomb of the Birds which led to a larger underground cave complex as indicated in the 1817 memoirs where Salt had described the same cave system.

They explored at least 350 feet into the cave system before coming upon a small narrow "tube" which could barely fit one person. Collins wife Sue was brave enough to start crawling into the tube section to see if it would lead anywhere but ended up turning back because she felt like it was dangerous to go alone and heard something moving about in front of her.

Eventually they decided to inform Dr Zahi Hawass, Secretary General of Egypt's Supreme Council of Antiquities, about the cave system. Hawass refused to believe them. However, Collins talked about his findings publicly and released images and videos of the expedition. Hawass countered this by issuing a statement claiming that no such cave system existed.

The next year Hawass was shown exploring the cave system in an episode of Chasing Mummies. He went with a film crew to the Tomb of the Birds with the intention of debunking the claims made by Collins but instead found an extensive cave system. However, they claimed the tube was a dead end.

Collins contends that the tube continues on much further and that he had intended on returning to the caves with proper safety equipment enabling him to enter further into "the tube". He cites satellite imagery which suggest the caves do continue on and reach under the second pyramid. However, before Collins could explore the caves further Hawass had the entrance sealed off.

What Lies Beyond the Stone Tube?

Whether or not the caves do reach the Second Pyramid, as the radar satellite imagery suggests, might now never be known. During our own explorations we came to a halt in a compartment beyond which was a narrow horizontal tube that appeared to connect with an even deeper section of the caves. Yet due to the stressful circumstances that had brought us to this moment, and the fact that my wife Sue had clearly heard something moving about beyond the tube, we had decided against venturing further.

GIZA'S CAVE UNDERWORLD SEALED SHUT

RELATED THREAD:
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I love this stuff! but I always find myself yelling at the tv, "Dammit, Hawass, let us in!!" Lol

Thanks! Perfect bed time viewing material!

watching now

Watching now, another discovery stolen by Hiawass

Amazing, thanks for this I haven't heard of it before, I love how HawAss always with any discovery in Egypt automatically discredits it because he didn't discover it, the dudes a muppet, the problem is he is actually great in his field, I wish he worked for the people he would have become perhaps the greatest Egyptologist of all time, but Dr Hawass, your an idiot, sort your priorities out fella

Cheo

FAIL

www.drhawass.com...
This story shows how people who do not have a background in archaeology use the media and the Internet to make headlines. Unfortunately, when people make statements without knowing the history of the subject, they may mislead the public...
...
...Andrew Collins and Nigel Skinner-Simpson came to Egypt in order to rediscover the tomb. They thought that they were the first to fully explore the tomb although it had been found almost two centuries ago and has been explored and reported by many scholars. This rock-cut tomb is about 150 meters from my excavation in the western field and extends from north to south with the entrance in the north. About 3.2 meters high, the entrance leads south into the front hall, shaped like an inverted T. From there two halls are visible, one to the right and one to the left. The left leads to a big room cut into the rock, about 6 meters long, which contained Latin inscriptions on the ceiling, showing that this tomb has been opened throughout the ages. To the right there is another square hole cut into the rock, which leads to a descending passage filled with sand, and contains pottery sherds, bones and other artifacts. There are other passageways cut into the rock from the main corridors, but these are short tunnels....
...It can be clearly shown that this tomb has been entered recently due to finds of modern debris and gypsum plaster coating the walls, as well as the modern lighting found in one of the chambers. Also, this tomb is known to have been used as a storeroom by George Reisner during his excavations at Giza in the 1910’s to 1920’s....

One of the most annoying documentaries i have seen for a long time.

Just a cave, nothing found inside the cave, nothing new, and shut of to the public by hawass.

This was a waste of time to watch, and could have been cut down to 15 min.
No need for a 1½ hour docu. with no ending, other than still a mystery.

Originally posted by Mianeye
One of the most annoying documentaries i have seen for a long time.

Just a cave, nothing found inside the cave, nothing new, and shut of to the public by hawass.

This was a waste of time to watch, and could have been cut down to 15 min.
No need for a 1½ hour docu. with no ending, other than still a mystery.

But see, --now you know about the mystery.

About 12 or 13 years ago i was working in a welding shop on 1st shift. I had gotten up and absently turned on the TV to the History Channel at about 5:30 in the morning and used it for background noise as I scrambled to get ready because i had to be at work at 6am. I could tell it was an old rerun documentary and didn't pay it much mind because i thought i had watched all the Egyptian shows ever made, i was wrong.

At about 5:45 toward the end of the episode i saw a very young Hawass doing an interview down in a set of caves. He said they have confirmed the man-made caves are extensive and has personally went down 7 of the known levels and said using rope and a flashlight could see at least 2 more levels below that. The show was probably from the late 70's or early 80's and was the first and only time i have ever seen any mention of a set of caves underneath the Giza Complex. I have searched and searched for this ever since watching that show and found nothing. So when Hawass says he knows nothing about a complex and instead tells the public what these people claiming a cave system actually found is an already discovered single level tomb, that old documentary pops back into my head and cry bull@#$%

I know what i saw in that old rerun show and i remember vividly what the young Hawass said about just how extensive and deep it goes. BTW, i was late for work that day but it was so worth it...

i always resist to believe the official stories about the Giza Plateau,is no secret that theres more to it,than what the tv and books tell.Hope this info relly gets out and reach those who really understand humanity.

reply to post by DavidWillts

...Andrew Collins and Nigel Skinner-Simpson came to Egypt in order to rediscover the tomb. They thought that they were the first to fully explore the tomb although it had been found almost two centuries ago and has been explored and reported by many scholars.

Actually they knew very well the cave system had been found before. They openly admit to using obscure references to the cave system written in Salt's memoirs, and they used that info to locate the caves. The problem is, that cave system was never truly admitted to exist by official sources, they clearly didn't think Salt actually located a cave system did they, because they denied the whole thing existed. Now if you are just talking about the tomb then of course people had known about that for a long time, no one is saying any different. The focus is the actual cave system, which was officially denied to have existed until Hawass went there himself with the intention of proving it didn't exist, however he found that it did exist. Stop quoting Hawass's blog like he's some sort of saint, he's a lying fool who can't stand the fact he was wrong. So FAIL.

reply to post by Mianeye

Originally posted by Mianeye
This was a waste of time to watch, and could have been cut down to 15 min.
No need for a 1½ hour docu. with no ending, other than still a mystery.

Well then perhaps you should have just read the summary I wrote huh? I rather quickly summed up everything in the documentary. You would have known what it was going to be about and how it would end if you had bothered to read my summary.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

Yeah, i guess you are right, but sometimes i like to watch before reading because of spoilers or not to pollute my mind with others opinion, in this case i should have read.
Just annoying anyway, cause i thought of a good docu, and got nothing really, not your fault by the way

reply to post by Mianeye

cause i thought of a good docu, and got nothing really

Well is was quite fascinating imo. But I can understand how it might be boring to some people. Not everyone is into this ancient Egypt stuff as much as other people. I'm just really drawn into ancient information of this nature. Even if the documentary was a bit slow and drawn out it had me completely sucked in all the way through.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

Don't get me wrong, i do love this stuff to, thats why i jumped directly to the video, to get a clean view of it's content.

But i also had the feeling that even though it was well hidden that many people would have found this cave as it was not shut of(kind of surpricing actually), be it tourist or grave robbers or teenagers hanging out, and that it would not be a big discovery, aside from that it might lead to a bigger cave system.
The trash inside the Tomb of birds revealed that the place was known by other people, they might not know that the place is "undiscovered" by archaeologist, but it sure looked used.
The problem for me now is, will it ever be opened again and by who, and what is behind the small tunnel if anything at all, as it very well could be emptied by grave robbers.

I just hate that thought, but i guess we will just have to wait and see

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

Actually they knew very well the cave system had been found before.

Most people did, the difference was they went around declaring that they discovered it.

They openly admit to using obscure references to the cave system written in Salt's memoirs, and they used that info to locate the caves.

That means nothing, all that really shows is how stuck in their ways they are and how they did not even bother to check their "discovery" to see if it already has been documented.

The problem is, that cave system was never truly admitted to exist by official sources,

That is an outright lie. Show me ANYTHING besides the words of these two jackasses to back that up.

Stop quoting Hawass's blog like he's some sort of saint, he's a lying fool who can't stand the fact he was wrong.

Wrong about what exactly? If you are going to make bold stupid claims you should at least TRY to back them up with something.

Thank you - love this fascinating subject. You gave a great summary before watching the video but I still really enjoyed it and how everything they said has been backed up and the team were vindicated after Hawaas's lies.

S&F Hope they soon get permission to further excavate those tubes they found and the fact that this has been backed up by satellite technology which shows the tunnels/tube leading toward the 2nd pyramid makes it so exciting.

Actually they knew very well the cave system had been found before.

Most people did, the difference was they went around declaring that they discovered it.

Yes, most people knew there were claims that the cave system existed, but according to official sources there was no such cave system. Hawass plainly denied the existence of the cave system. There was furious debate on the internet concerning their existence, until it was finally officially confirmed.

They openly admit to using obscure references to the cave system written in Salt's memoirs, and they used that info to locate the caves.

That means nothing, all that really shows is how stuck in their ways they are and how they did not even bother to check their "discovery" to see if it already has been documented.

Obviously they did freaking check if old documentation existed, since the use of such documentation was one of the ways they were able to locate the god damn cave system. The people stuck in their ways are those who refused to believe the cave system actually existed.

The problem is, that cave system was never truly admitted to exist by official sources,

That is an outright lie. Show me ANYTHING besides the words of these two jackasses to back that up.

Errrrrr... how ignorant are you? Hawass was Secretary General of Egypt's Supreme Council of Antiquities at the time when he tried to claim Collins was wrong about the mere existence of that cave system. He said that it DID NOT EXIST. It doesn't get any more "official" than that.

Stop quoting Hawass's blog like he's some sort of saint, he's a lying fool who can't stand the fact he was wrong.

Wrong about what exactly? If you are going to make bold stupid claims you should at least TRY to back them up with something.

Uhhh, wrong about the claim that the cave system didn't exist. How about you check the damn article you linked to huh?

The article reports that a huge system of tunnels and caves has been found; however, I can say that there is no underground cave complex at this site.
---
If you consult this resource, it will tell you that this “cave” is a rock-cut tomb that was found and opened in 1816-1817 by Henry Salt.
---
Anyone who enters this tomb may feel they are in a maze corridor because of the multiple tunnels, and it seems more than its 35 meters long.

CLEARLY he is talking about the TOMB AREA. He flat out claims "there is no underground cave complex at this site". He is talking about the MAN MADE tomb area, which OBVIOUSLY had been discovered and recorded by official sources many times.

He is trying to say they were "confused" by the "maze like" layout of the tomb area and mistook it for a cave system. How stupid can he think they are? They wouldn't mistake what looks like a natural cave system for a clearly man made tomb area.

It can be clearly shown that this tomb has been entered recently due to finds of modern debris and gypsum plaster coating the walls, as well as the modern lighting found in one of the chambers. Also, this tomb is known to have been used as a storeroom by George Reisner during his excavations at Giza in the 1910’s to 1920’s.

The "modern lighting" and "plaster coating the walls" are descriptions of the man made tomb area. Throughout that whole article is talking about the tomb area, and he clearly states there is no underground cave complex. That was the article which sparked the controversy and led to many debates over whether or not the cave system actually existed or not. As we now know it clearly does exist.

And why don't you try watching the documentary before speaking like you know what you're talking about? Better yet, watch the Chasing Mummies episode where Hawass finds the true cave system and is amazed as the extent/depth of it, clearly indicating he didn't know of its existence. Stop trying to step around the truth like an acrobat, it's getting very tiring and annoying.

Great post and find. I am always watching and reading about the past and the Pyramids, The Valley of the kings

Once again great post

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder

Actually they knew very well the cave system had been found before.

Most people did, the difference was they went around declaring that they discovered it.

Yes, most people knew there were claims that the cave system existed, but according to official sources there was no such cave system. Hawass plainly denied the existence of the cave system.

And for good reason - there is no cave system at that site.

It's a tomb - hand-cut into solid rock.

It's not a "cave system." There's no actual "cave" there. In a "cave system," one would ordinarily expect to have a cave.

Harte