Michael Horn: Why Billy? The Photos, The Grays

Originally posted by Gazrok
Q: Please look at the pictures below. On the left, is part of a Billy Meier photo. On the right, is the Testors brand model of a UFO. As you can see, the (top) ship in the photo bears a striking resemblance to the model, any comments as to why this would be? I'm not saying that's what the photo is, just curious as to the similarity.... After all, the stated date of the photo predates the model release...it is uncanny though.



EDIT: Just noticed the copyright notice, so if you wish, I'll remove the image, though discussion of it is impossible without it... In any case, if you wish, I can also remove it after this event is over. As a hint, you may wish to right-click protect these on your site....

[edit on 24-9-2004 by Gazrok]

im NOT answering for mr. horn...

but i want to make a comment...

i fing it AMAZING that the pic billy took (from maybe 1980s???) can ONLY be duplicated (am i right???) by using computers and technologies...

what about billy's religion and why did he change??? you forgot that part of the question (#1)

MH: Billy�s family may have been Lutheran or another denomination, I don�t recall. He was encouraged by the Plejaren to study all of the major Earth religions, which he did, joining many, one at a time, learning about each one and then moving on. This was also to prepare him to learn the truth about the various religions and how they differed from the true spiritual teachings.

1.) you said that the "aliens" can not interfere in the free will of other beings (unless being attacked) but in this case they already did! they came to our planet and allowed billy to take their pics. and all of the other species of aliens and their ships we have pics of too. i guess there all breaking the rules right???

MH: No, at all. They didn�t violate Billy�s free will as he had agreed to the contacts, apparently before this incarnation (according to the reincarnation/spiritual information), as well as in this life. As a matter of fact, there were times when he came close to abandoning his mission and times when the Plejaren were on the verge of discontinuing it as well. They also haven�t forced anyone to take their pictures, haven�t inflicted irrefutable proof of their existence on us (though if we take the time and trouble to prove it that�s another matter) and they haven�t in anyway interfered with any other aspects of our free will.

2.) is the government (any government) trying to stop the info from coming out??? i know in other alien stories the government is trying to protect info (are 51 etc.) for billy's species of aliens, do the goverment try to stop the spread of info. (besides trying to kill him)???

MH: My opinion is that they certainly are doing their best to marginalize, suppress, discredit, etc. the Meier case. Their willing accomplices in this (whether consciously or not) have been the media. I have spent the past couple of years trying to move it into the media. I�ve been able to get onto the major alternative radio stations, a very decent story appeared in a tabloid (the Sun, out of Florida) and I recently have been appearing on more mainstream shows. I was interviewed yesterday on CNN and I am in contact with a major news organization that�s doing a story on UFOs for next year but which is already trying to marginalize the importance of the Meier case.

If there is another actual, ongoing UFO contact case, with REAL proven, evidence and not just �stuff in the sky� photos, please, somebody let me know.

3.) how many species of aliens are there and can you explain each in detail (what they look like, religion, government, etc.)

MH: I don�t have an actual number but I do recall that the Plejaren told Meier that their civilization, over the past 50,000 years or so, knew of, or had contact of some sort with over 8,000,000 human races (that�s the number, as best I remember). As far as religion, the kind we have here is virtually unknown anywhere else. The Plejaren government is actually administered by spiritually wise leaders, not politicians. They abandoned politics a long time ago having correlated politics with dissention, wars, strife, etc. Politics is not, contrary to popular opinion, the art of the possible but rather the art of advantage and as such will always lead to conflicts.

Q: Please look at the pictures below. On the left, is part of a Billy Meier photo. On the right, is the Testors brand model of a UFO. As you can see, the (top) ship in the photo bears a striking resemblance to the model, any comments as to why this would be? I'm not saying that's what the photo is, just curious as to the similarity.... After all, the stated date of the photo predates the model release...it is uncanny though.

MH: The obvious answer is as you state, i.e. the photo precedes the model.

[edit on 24-9-2004 by michaelhorn]

i fing it AMAZING that the pic billy took (from maybe 1980s???) can ONLY be duplicated (am i right???) by using computers and technologies...

MH: So far, NO ONE, with ANY technology, has duplicated ANY of Meier�s physical evidence, photos included. The professional skeptics took three years to fail. The special effects people I spoke with said that IF they COULD duplicate them it would be with CGI. They are currently out of the country but I intend to ask them to accept my challenge to duplicate Meier�s photographic evidence when they return.


[edit on 25-9-2004 by michaelhorn]

1.) will the aliens continue to have special humans (such as billy) do their work for them until we are able to have daily visits with them (in 700 years like you said)???

2.) if a war broke out between the human race and any alien race, would we stand a chance??? problably not right???

3.) so when a person dies, he / she will be reincarnated and be on this planet??? what happins to "bad" people, is their reincarnation a bug or something???



thank you...

1.) will the aliens continue to have special humans (such as billy) do their work for them until we are able to have daily visits with them (in 700 years like you said)???

MH: From what I understand, Billy is the last �prophet� per se in this lineage. A large part of his mission was to create a body of work and teachings that would serve as a slowly unfolding base of information for Earth people some time into the future. There may well be other people who benefit from the unconsciously received impulses of a telepathic nature that are generated by the Plejaren.

2.) if a war broke out between the human race and any alien race, would we stand a chance??? problably not right???

MH: At this time in our history such an event is unlikely�with a couple of exceptions. It has been said that we will face a threat from an ET race that is even more barbaric, and likely better armed, than we are. The time for this wasn�t given but the warning carried the suggestion that we should unite as a planetary people if we wish to prevail. The other situation, mentioned in the Henoch Prophecies, is that, under certain conditions, an ET race would assist an alliance of other nations in a war: ��And at this time, the possibility could become reality that extraterrestrial forces intervene against the Western industrialized countries, because these will be responsible for the extreme and enormous disaster of the coming evil times. These extraterrestrial forces will give up their anonymity and their state of secrecy and will assist those who are being terrorized by the irresponsibly acting Western countries, should this possibility become reality. In addition, apocalyptic natural catastrophes will occur which will cause all of Europe to shake and tremble; but Europe will continue to exist, even after having suffered enormous destruction.�

3.) so when a person dies, he / she will be reincarnated and be on this planet??? what happins to "bad" people, is their reincarnation a bug or something???

MH: According to the information on reincarnation, a person always incarnates on the planet on which they die. The only way we�d incarnate on another planet, therefore, is by being able to go there and then dieing there. The idea of �bad� people applies in the course of time to everyone, as we all make mistakes (go against truth and the spiritual as well as manmade laws) of varying degrees of seriousness, usually intentionally but also sometimes intentionally. No human ever incarnates as anything other than a human being, all myths, legends and/or religious beliefs notwithstanding.

I noticed on another thread that some question/comment was raised re my being a "promoter", as if there's something inherently wrong with promoting per se. It apparently escaped the notice of the person raising the point that I VOLUNTARILY (i.e. without compensation) represent Meier in the U.S., doing media interviews and lectures, researching, writing articles, corresponding with interested parties, dancing with the skeptics and engaging in this type of online forum discussion.
I average anywhere from 8 - 10 (uncompensated) hours per day focused on this work in one way or another.

While absolutely no apologies are necessary for my being enterprising and self-responsible, perhaps those who take offense at my selling my DVD, the books, etc. might recognize that all of the above activities and 25 years of research, on my own dime, costs both in time and money. And they might also avail themselves of the abundant, FREE information at my site, which I deliberately provide so that people who either do not have, or do not wish to spend, any resources can still learn much about the case.

Originally posted by michaelhorn
And they might also avail themselves of the abundant, FREE information at my site, which I deliberately provide so that people who either do not have, or do not wish to spend, any resources can still learn much about the case.

Yes, and you're not counting on the fact that mentioning there are pictures of aliens in the latest book here will get you a few sales.

I tell you what, if you've got a few pictures of aliens and you are here for the common good of the human race, as a sign of your good will post 1 of these pictures of aliens from the book. People will still pay for the book to see the rest of the pictures (unless they look rediculously fake that is) so you've got nothing to lose if you believe it.

Regarding getting me " a few sales":

Ah yes, the old "I didn't pay attention to what you said in the first place so I'll challenge you to REALLY prove your good intentions" ploy.

"MH: The only (meager) photographic evidence for both of these things is in the new book. (See: www.theyfly.com)"

First, my response was, obviously, to a question regarding the pictures. Perhaps you'll notice the qualifier "meager". Using that word is hardly great salesmanship. But, since it has triggered your fear that someone would buy the book and enrich me, hugely of course, let me suggest that neither you nor anyone else wanting great pictures of aliens get the book for that reason. You'll be disappointed if that's what you're expecting.

Now, as for your "raise the bar" tactic re my posting the pictures to prove anything to you. No, thanks, if you don't perceive my intentions from the answers I've given then you're wasting your time.


[edit on 25-9-2004 by michaelhorn]

Originally posted by michaelhorn
you're wasting your time.
[edit on 25-9-2004 by michaelhorn]

you ain't kidding, that's the first true thing I've heard come out of this thread.

out.

"you ain't kidding, that's the first true thing I've heard come out of this thread.

out."

MH: Then you've been participating against your better judgment.

Q: When do Billy, and yourself, believe will be the point of actual disclosure by these beings? What kind of timetable can we expect?

Q: Have you read Mr. Lear�s comments, both on this board and elsewhere? Would you care to comment on them, and how they may relate/differ from those made by Billy? Mr. Lear suggests a less benign agenda for aliens.

Q: What are your thoughts (and Billy�s) on the New World Order and Illuminati? Have the aliens spoken of this to Billy?

Again, thank you for your time...

Thank you for the opportunity to have this interaction. I hope that those people who espouse interest in actual contact will join us in examining the evidence for, and content of, it as contained in the Meier Contacts.

Q: When do Billy, and yourself, believe will be the point of actual disclosure by these beings? What kind of timetable can we expect?

MH: If by actual disclosure you mean contact with the Plejaren, they have said that that will be some 700 years from now. But actual disclosure, i.e. �proof� of their existence, the contacts, etc. is really up to us (interested parties) to assure through research, logic, etc. I make the claim that the case is now proved authentic far beyond a reasonable doubt. That claim has not been disproved. Cracking the mind set of lazy, prejudiced people who either don�t want to know, are fearful or otherwise invested in the contacts not being true is a difficult task.

Q: Have you read Mr. Lear�s comments, both on this board and elsewhere? Would you care to comment on them, and how they may relate/differ from those made by Billy? Mr. Lear suggests a less benign agenda for aliens.

MH: No, I haven�t read all of Mr. Lear�s comments, just a few so I can�t really comment on all he�s said. I think that there may be aliens who have positive agendas and those who have negative ones. But, after 62 years of contacts with Meier, I find no evidence that the Plejaren are ill-intended towards us, just the opposite, in fact. To me it�s common sense that, if the Plejaren are indeed real and the contacts true, they certainly have had more than enough opportunity (as well as the technology) to have done whatever damage they would have wanted to do. I think though that it�s humanity that is ill-intended towards itself and most other living things; we have more to fear from our own aggression than from outside forces, at least for a while.

And I am surprised that so-called knowledgeable people would go off on the kind of fantasy that overlooks the obvious, real state of affairs and see supposed aliens as the threat. For one thing, I�d like to see one slimy scale, one iota of proof about the popularly accepted idea that there are �shape-shifting reptilians� lurking around everywhere and impregnating women. There�s no end to people talking about this nonsense as if it�s factual. Apparently they all are certain that people, from Geoprge Bush to Queen Elizabeth, take their lunch hour sunning themselves on rocks and catching passing flies with a flick of their tongues.

Q: What are your thoughts (and Billy�s) on the New World Order and Illuminati? Have the aliens spoken of this to Billy?

MH: I know that Meier has already written about and described some of the scenarios regarding dictatorial, enslaving world government; he was one of the first people to write about the dangers of people being bio-chipped and linked into a super-computer in Brussels through DPS satellites. He�s also written about the same kind of negative outcome possible regarding the EU. I think that the gist of it is that while we do need to eventually come together as a one-world people (not unlike what we�re told about the Plejaren and other races) we may first find ourselves struggling against a very negative kind of one-world dictatorial regime that many people see unfolding even now.

As far as the Illuminati are concerned, if I recall correctly, he actually downplayed the power of that group saying it was only a remnant, now based in Europe, of a once more powerful organization. He may have said that people were making this group more important through perpetuating their unfounded belief in its power, which is actually quite diminished.

If you read the Henoch Prophecies (free link at www.theyfly.com) you can see that the so-called great Western capitalistic powers, which have sought to dominate the rest of the world, are not regarded as true civilizations, nor are they projected to survive long during this millennium.
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Hi Michael,

You have certainly been patient in answering questions directed at you.

On the site you promote, there is a link to a Nexus Magazine article which talks about some of the predictions made in the Henoch (or Enoch) Prophecies -- a number of which have been proven to be accurate.

One of the current, as of yet, unfulfilled predictions, regards two civil wars in the United States, resulting in five different territories.

Would the reported Zetan-Grey alliance, stemming back to President Eisenhower's Meeting With Extraterrestrials In 1954 and the currrent covert operations with the Greys in abducting common citizens for heinous, self-serving reasons (like a long-term breeding program) have anything to do with this upcoming civil war?

In other words, will greater awareness about the covert US-Grey alliance trigger the upcoming first and/or second civil war in the United States?

Thank you.

One of the current, as of yet, unfulfilled predictions, regards two civil wars in the United States, resulting in five different territories.

Would the reported Zetan-Grey alliance, stemming back to President Eisenhower's Meeting With Extraterrestrials In 1954 and the currrent covert operations with the Greys in abducting common citizens for heinous, self-serving reasons (like a long-term breeding program) have anything to do with this upcoming civil war?

In other words, will greater awareness about the covert US-Grey alliance trigger the upcoming first and/or second civil war in the United States?

MH: First, let�s acknowledge that this alliance is still unproven. I�m not saying that it�s not true but no one has satisfactorily proved that it is. Having spent more than 25 years researching the Meier case, and now being satisfied that there�s overwhelmingly abundant proof of its authenticity, I�m hesitant to simply subscribe to popular rumors.

As for the abduction scenario, using the information in the Meier case as a reference (and acknowledging that this information is also still speculative, i.e. unproven), the Plejaren told Meier in 1975 that the Betty and Barney Hill case was a contact examination (abduction) performed by the Zeta beings, who they described as non-malevolent, scientifically minded HUMAN beings. They stated that while there are hostile races who have performed a small number of malevolent abductions, kidnappings and even murders, the abduction phenomenon is, in their opinion, a vastly overblown mass hysteria originating in people�s subconscious, mass consciousness, etc. perpetuated by beliefs, inundation of UFO/ET (mis)information, misdiagnosed sleep paralysis, nightmares, etc.

They also state that the mutilation phenomenon is terrestrial in origin, as may be some abduction phenomena as well.

Again, that�s what I�ve derived from the information. Having mentioned that the Zetas are human, let me reiterate that the Plejaren state that Roswell (and perhaps some of the other crash retrievals) were of android entities made by the Zetas but were not the ETs themselves. In other words, they were artificial, engineered beings.

Now, as for what triggers the civil wars, while no dates were given and these events may lie in the far future, it can be seen that there are a number of already occurring situations that may contribute to that. These include illegal immigration (which the Plejaren claim can foment strife, resource and economic imbalances, wars, famines, etc.), political polarization, economic conditions, etc.

And thanks for your interest!

1.) do meier's aliens make crop cirles and do you (or meier or the aliens) know who (or what) made the pyramids???

2.) how far away do meire's aliens live from the earth (light years?)???

3.) what do you (or meier) think about the people that believe that aliens gave us some cool alien technologies??? i.e. WHO / WHAT gave us these alien tech. if we (human race) did not come up with this tech. ourselves.


thanks...

1.) do meier's aliens make crop cirles and do you (or meier or the aliens) know who (or what) made the pyramids???

MH: No, they�re not made by the Plejaren. Actually, they had originally told him that all crop circles were hoaxes as they had taken him, on a couple of occasions, to observe some hoaxers making them. I had long disagreed with this because it looked to me that many of the more complex ones were made by the same anti-gravity technology that created the landing tracks on his property. (I wrote about my disagreement with their position in the UFO magazine article you can find at www.theyfly.com.) Then during one contact they told him that not all crop circles were hoaxed, that some were actually being made by an ET race. Meier was pretty upset by the late revelation, pointing out that it hurt his credibility and asking why he hadn�t been told before. The Plejaren said that they thought it wasn�t that important because to them it was an illogical, indirect way to contact us and that the ETs involved should have been simply more direct. Goes to show that wherever human beings are involved (even ETs) things can, and eventually will, get screwed up�at least a little.

As for the pyramids, they told him that they were constructed by ancient terrestrials and ETs from the Orion constellation. There are some surprises here. They said that a huge amount of slave labor, as well as levitation technologies, were employed in its construction. And they date the construction of the Great Pyramid, and all other pyramids around the world, as having been accomplished some 73,000 years ago. The Great Pyramid (and maybe others) was used for various purposes, including providing shelter to a large population of people when a naturally occurring cataclysm, which had been predicted by the original designers of the pyramid using astrological and other means, actually occurred.

2.) how far away do meire's aliens live from the earth (light years?)???

MH: They say that they live 500 light years from Earth.

3.) what do you (or meier) think about the people that believe that aliens gave us some cool alien technologies??? i.e. WHO / WHAT gave us these alien tech. if we (human race) did not come up with this tech. ourselves.

MH: I don�t recall Meier speaking or writing a lot about this, though it could be in the 25,000+ pages of information still in German, but there is info that explains that the ETs helped the Germans (telepathic impulses, unconsciously received) to develop such craft just before the Second World War. Apparently, seeing the negative direction that the Germans were actually taking, as opposed to a more positive one that they anticipated, the ETs sabotaged the technology so that it wouldn�t have the capabilities that would have allowed the Nazis to use it for real world domination. Some of it was used by a group of Germans (primarily men) to escape to South America and, according to the information, the U.S., Russia and Canada developed versions of this anti-gravity craft with certain limitations (they�re not truly interplanetary and can�t perform like ET craft.)

Meier told me, in May of 2004, that he was told by the Plejaren Ptaah that the greater majority (not all) of sightings in the U.S. are secret U.S. military fighter craft originally developed at Area 51. He said that the objects in the nighttime footage from James Gilliland are actually these U.S. craft, something which James wasn�t thrilled to hear, even though he had asked me to show the video to Meier and get his opinion.

I have heard that we also back-engineered technologies from crashed ET craft and that may well be, I just don�t know.

1.) why are there no writting of the aliens helping the egyptians building the pyramids in the hyrogliphics (sp?)???

2.) why is the 25,000 pages not translated into every language the world has ever known if this stuff is so inportant???

3.) so ETs can predict the future but not see what the Germans were going to do with the tech. (initialy)???


thanks...

1.) why are there no writting of the aliens helping the egyptians building the pyramids in the hyrogliphics (sp?)???

MH: I think the time, i.e. 73,000 years is certainly one factor. I�m not aware of how deep in time the record of Egyptian history actually goes but I�ve never heard of any records that far back. The Plejaren material has a lot of time frames that are quite different than what we have been told. One example, the person known as Noah was said to have lived 100,000 years ago, not 10,000 or so years ago.

2.) why is the 25,000 pages not translated into every language the world has ever known if this stuff is so inportant???

MH: Simply because it hasn�t (until recently) yet been recognized as such by enough people from enough different language groups. It�s not up to the Swiss to translate it for us, it�s up to us if we want it. Believe it or not, the English language isn�t the most precise one, especially compared to German. To see what different groups are doing a la translations see: www.figu.org

2.) so ETs can predict the future but not see what the Germans were going to do with the tech. (initialy)???

MH: That one bothered me too. If nothing else it reinforced my first law, i.e. wherever humans are involved things can and will get screwed up. It may also have something to do with the negative ET group that was based under the Giza plateau until the Plejaren removed them in 1979. A splinter group from the lineage from which the Plejaren developed, they were bent on world domination and had contributed to a number of nefarious endeavors, which included a sophisticated kind of mind control affecting over 700 key people, as well as helping Hitler through the Thule society.

Mr. Horn, how do you respond to things presented by Meier, that are now known to be hoaxes? I�ll point to the issue of Asket and Nera, This rather blurry photo of two �Pleidians� is claimed by Billy to be a picture of the aliens. It has since been found to be taken off a tv set (with the reflection and curve noted in the picture) and indeed off of the Dean Martin show, of two guests on the show�
Here is a link to this: members.tripod.com...

Another such known hoax is an alleged time travel photo taken of dinosaurs, recognized as a scene from a movie, or a picture of a post-earthquake LA, which was taken from a scientific geological magazine� If such pictures are hoaxes, is there not reason to doubt the rest?

You have stated in your introduction that you may not reply to debunkers. I would like to give you the chance to address such points brought up here though. You of course, retain that option to not reply if you wish.

Another contention is that photo analysis could not duplicate Billy�s photos, nor explain them. Yet, here www.ufowatchdog.com... is such duplication. How is that?

On Wednesday, February 11, 2004, The Independent Investigations Group (IIG) and CFI-West published a side-by-side comparison of �fake� UFO photos taken by members of the IIG versus �real� UFO photos taken by Billy Meier on the IIG website at www.iigwest.com/ufopix.html. Having successfully completed
Michael Horn�s original challenge to �duplicate the effect� of the Billy Meier photos, he then changed the challenge to include having the IIG photos tested in the same manner he claims the Billy Meier photos were tested.

Even the computer analysis as stated by Meier supporters seems flawed, as seen here www.ufoevidence.org...

The title image shows a Type-4 spacecraft over Mount Auruti, Switzerland, photographed by Billy Meier on 29 March 1976. Above, the two computer-enhanced images made from this photograph reveal a great deal about this picture. The left-hand image shows, in the words of Ground Saucer Watch who made the computer analyses, 'evidence of a linear structure above the craft - in plain english, a string or rod supporting the object. The structure is equally clear in the computerised enlargement in the second image. In addition,study of the focus in this picture indicates that the object is close to the camera and is therefore small - about 8 inches (20 centimetres) across, not 23 feet (7 metres) as claimed.

Finally, there is the book and investigations by Kal Korff, an investigator who also refutes Meier�s claims.

Over the years, UFO investigator Kal K. Korff has cast doubts on Meier's claims, first in a small, self-published book in 1981, then in subsequent articles in UFOlogical magazines, and with lectures at UFO meetings and conferences. Now he has produced his magnum opus on the Meier saga, Spaceships of the Pleiades, a 439-page tome that subsumes all previous writings on Meier.
To gather new evidence, Korff set out for Switzerland. To avoid being identified as the notorious Meier skeptic, he disguised himself by letting his hair and beard grow and adopted the undercover name "Steve Thomas." Armed with a hidden video camera, he and a female companion appeared at Meier's rural commune for six visits - three of which were "covert,"

www.findarticles.com...
www.virtuallystrange.net...

Even reports of models found� www.theness.com...
And described� www.geocities.com...

Not to mention our own thread here on ATS a while back... www.abovetopsecret.com...

You must admit, this casts some �shadow of doubt� on Meier�s remarkable claims�


[edit on 28-9-2004 by Gazrok]

Mr. Horn, how do you respond to things presented by Meier, that are now known to be hoaxes? I�ll point to the issue of Asket and Nera, This rather blurry photo of two �Pleidians� is claimed by Billy to be a picture of the aliens. It has since been found to be taken off a tv set (with the reflection and curve noted in the picture) and indeed off of the Dean Martin show, of two guests on the show�
Here is a link to this: members.tripod.com...

MH: Long ago both Meier and the Plejaren spoke about various problems with photographic material being stolen or altered by parties who had a vested interest in debunking Meier. This was not a difficult thing for them to attempt because Meier�s photos and films were given to a local photo developing facility, which sent them away for processing. When Meier started to get a lot of attention for his photos from the public he started to encounter such problems. The photos of Asket and Nera were discovered by them to have been altered by certain parties to discredit Meier.

If only ONE of Meier�s (1,200) photos are real, we have a monumentally important story. Likewise for his film segments, video, sound recordings and metal alloy samples, to say nothing of the abundant prophetically accurate material. I give Meier the benefit of the doubt here. Since we have physical evidence proved to be authentic why would he deliberately go about discrediting himself? People need to apply a little thinking, especially when there are sites like this one that, by its very title, acknowledges the possibility that there are forces that operate behind the scenes to promote certain agendas and discredit others.

Another such known hoax is an alleged time travel photo taken of dinosaurs, recognized as a scene from a movie, or a picture of a post-earthquake LA, which was taken from a scientific geological magazine� If such pictures are hoaxes, is there not reason to doubt the rest?

MH: Your information is second hand and faulty. Re the dinosaur photos I do come down on the side that questions their validity, only because I cannot prove them real (and there are a number of them and they haven�t been connected to any movie I know of) and it�s such an amazing thing to contemplate that they even could be real. As I have long maintained, there are things I can prove and things that remain speculative.

Regarding the earthquake, it�s best to not rely on second hand info, it referred to photos of San Francisco, not L.A. And don�t tell me they were �known hoaxes�. The (11) photos of the future SF earthquake were seen by Wendelle Stevens and a number of other people in 1978. AT THAT TIME Stevens described what he saw in the photos and what he found especially interesting were the cars. He described them as looking quite different than the ones of the time (1978), the windshields seemed to come up higher into the roofs, the overall shapes of the cars were much rounder�have you been paying attention to the development in auto design lately? D o the cars of today resemble the cars of 1978 more or the cars Stevens was describing?

By the way, your logic is faulty. If one photo is real, then, are they all real? If one thing is true, is everything true?

You have stated in your introduction that you may not reply to debunkers. I would like to give you the chance to address such points brought up here though. You of course, retain that option to not reply if you wish.

MH: I have no problem replying to debunkers, they have had a great problem in being truthful.

Another contention is that photo analysis could not duplicate Billy�s photos, nor explain them. Yet, here www.ufowatchdog.com... is such duplication. How is that?

quote: On Wednesday, February 11, 2004, The Independent Investigations Group (IIG) and CFI-West published a side-by-side comparison of �fake� UFO photos taken by members of the IIG versus �real� UFO photos taken by Billy Meier on the IIG website at www.iigwest.com/ufopix.html. Having successfully completed
Michael Horn�s original challenge to �duplicate the effect� of the Billy Meier photos, he then changed the challenge to include having the IIG photos tested in the same manner he claims the Billy Meier photos were tested.

MH: Pay close attention to this answer, which is also amply spelled out on my website. The original challenge had NOTHING to do with duplicating the �effect�. If I wanted that I could rent a sci-fi movie. What they stated here is a LIE. They said that Meier�s photos were an �easily duplicated hoax�, they accepted the challenge to duplicate ONE photo and ONE film segment. Their photos of little models in no way meet the challenge, despite taking them more than 3 years to produce and despite there still being no film submitted by them. The skeptics go to great lengths to lie. Let�s look at this:

�Having successfully completed Michael Horn�s original challenge to �duplicate the effect� of the Billy Meier photos, he then changed the challenge to include having the IIG photos tested in the same manner he claims the Billy Meier photos were tested��

MH: Obviously, not only didn�t they meet the challenge, they claimed that having the photos tested according to the same standards as Meier�s was changing the challenge? What kind of idiocy is that? How do tell if the photos actually duplicated Meier�s if you don�t apply the same standards?

�He also said that he had a piece of metal that he claims to have come from an extraterrestrial��

MH: An outright LIE. I have challenged anyone to produce evidence that I ever said such a thing. As a matter of fact, the record of my correspondence with the skeptics is posted for all to see. Please show me where I ever claimed to have the metal. If you�re going to quote despicable liars and frauds, well, may I suggest a little homework?

By the way, I DID offer them physical evidence in the form of the sound recordings FREELY available at www.theyfly.com Funny thing, they refused my offer and won�t attempt to duplicate them, or analyze them, because they can�t even come close. The sounds like ALL of Meier�s other physical evidence, remain irreproducible to this day.


spacecraft that also proves that Billy Meier has had contact with extraterrestrial visitors.�Even the computer analysis as stated by Meier supporters seems flawed, as seen here www.ufoevidence.org...


quote: The title image shows a Type-4 spacecraft over Mount Auruti, Switzerland, photographed by Billy Meier on 29 March 1976. Above, the two computer-enhanced images made from this photograph reveal a great deal about this picture. The left-hand image shows, in the words of Ground Saucer Watch who made the computer analyses, 'evidence of a linear structure above the craft - in plain english, a string or rod supporting the object. The structure is equally clear in the computerised enlargement in the second image. In addition,study of the focus in this picture indicates that the object is close to the camera and is therefore small - about 8 inches (20 centimetres) across, not 23 feet (7 metres) as claimed.

Finally, there is the book and investigations by Kal Korff, an investigator who also refutes Meier�s claims.
quote: Over the years, UFO investigator Kal K. Korff has cast doubts on Meier's claims, first in a small, self-published book in 1981, then in subsequent articles in UFOlogical magazines, and with lectures at UFO meetings and conferences. Now he has produced his magnum opus on the Meier saga, Spaceships of the Pleiades, a 439-page tome that subsumes all previous writings on Meier.
To gather new evidence, Korff set out for Switzerland. To avoid being identified as the notorious Meier skeptic, he disguised himself by letting his hair and beard grow and adopted the undercover name "Steve Thomas." Armed with a hidden video camera, he and a female companion appeared at Meier's rural commune for six visits - three of which were "covert,"


MH: I see that this article relies upon Kal Korff, a twice, publicly, self-admitted liar and defamer (he had to apologize to Art bell, twice, on air for his lies and defamation). A man of so little integrity and courage that he disguised himself and snuck around the center in Switzerland, avoided talking with Meier, and completely discredited himself. For a thorough debunking of this charlatan, who just so happens to be associated with CFI-West and James Randi, read the info at James Deardorff�s and Jeroen Jansen�s sites (linked form mine). And let me add that Ground saucer Watch, closely aligned with Korff and others hostile to the Meier case, is suspect, relying as they did on Korff and his information. They also tightly focused on one aspect of the analysis, there�s a whole book written about it.

By the way, the investigative team itself made models for testing the authenticity of Meier�s photos, which were distinguishable from the models every time in computer analysis.

In case I failed to amply answer this or make myself clear, the CFI-West crew ABSOLUTELY FAILED to duplicate Meier�s photos, HAVE FAILED TO SUBMIT the agreed upon film, HAVE FAILED TO ACCEPT MY OFFER to test/duplicate the sounds, HAVE LIED AS TO MY POSSESSION of the metals, etc. ad nauseum.

And they are hopelessly out of their league and incapable of explaining the nearly 50 years worth of prophetically accurate information.

I�ll be glad to go into more detail if you think I missed anything here.