Muslim immigrants more criminal than other groups?

Every year Danish statistics makes an analyze of the various crimes in Denmark. Every year it shows that immigrants and decendants of immigrants is far more criminal than the rest of the population. I wonder if it is the same problem in other European countries and America. Most of the immigrants discussed is from Turkey, Marokko, Somalia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libanon and Pakistan (numbers also show its Somalians and Libanese who are the worst).

Lets have a look at a few of the numbers from oktober 2011.

The group the article speak of is immigrants males and 1. generation decendants between 15-50 years, this group has increased from 2,8% to 4,3% of our total population in 11 years.

They are over-representated 9 times when we look at rape compared to the average Dane.
They are over-representated11 times when we look at robbery compared to the average Dane.
They are over-representated 5 times when we look at violence compared to the average Dane.

27% of all murders is done by immigrants or decendants.
33% of all rape's is done by immigrants or decendants.
20% of all violence is done by immigrants or decendants.
35% of allrobberies is done by immigrants or decendants.

Our new prime minister Helle Thorning Smidt (the Bilderberg hore) wants to open up our boarders for new groups of immigrants.....but when you look at numbers like this you cant stop wondering how "smart" that is.

I wonder if you got similar problems in your countries?

Source (in danish)

reply to post by Mimir


I don't know ask the Swedish...

I imagine crime figures are more representative of socio economic background rather than religious or ethnic background. Immigrants in most countries tend to fall into the lower socioeconomic backgrounds in their societies, where I would imagine the majority of crime comes from.

No chance. In the UK where I live it seems that most crime is csrried out by polish immigrants. Where I oive in lincolnshire tere is at least one stabbing a fortnight or a car jacking or a car crash due to a polish illegal immigrant. Its out of control here.

Lol, you guys. This reminds me of the times the pilgrims illegally emigrated from the eastern hemisphere to the west and called the natives savages. Good old propaganda. What happened to bad people being bad and good people being good? Why the sudden link to it's Muslims?! It's the Buddhists! Meh, think what you will.

Originally posted by TheMindWar
No chance. In the UK where I live it seems that most crime is csrried out by polish immigrants. Where I oive in lincolnshire tere is at least one stabbing a fortnight or a car jacking or a car crash due to a polish illegal immigrant. Its out of control here.

I think it is a cultural thing - we should be careful about tying it to religion. Different cultures (not necessarily immigrants) tend to 'specialise' in different crimes. I ran an elderly persons housing scheme in an Asian Muslim area (UK). We had very little trouble, no drunkenness and no break ins. The crime in that area tended to be of the 'Mr Big' variety - ie drugs and dodgy cars. Whereas up the road in a predominantly white area a housing scheme run by the same company suffered from 'white chav' crime ie yobbery and burglary. You feared to go out at night. I know which area I would have chosen to live in.
That said, a couple of local towns are the UK hotspot for fake car crashes/insurance scams - in which the car in front breaks suddenly causing the car behind to go into them. Here that is almost exclusively an Asian set up.
The recent influx of E Europeans has brought it's own problems - ie more violent crime and more guns on the streets.

reply to post by Mimir

What are the comparisons/stats of un-employed Danes Vs un-employed Immigrants.
I bet they are over represented there too.

What to turn the stats around? Get them Jobs!

They might just be victims of the Danes prejudice of not giving them a chance to earn a good wage.

It compares all males age 15-50 with immigrant males and "1. generation" decedents of the same age from the mentioned countries. The survey explicitly say its "muslim countries", its not my choice of words.

I agree theres a social issue worth discussing. Many of these people live in "ghettos" and on social services. Theres no doubt they have a tougher time finding jobs because of hidden racism or their crime-record. that offcause drives some into criminal acts like robbery or theft, but it doesn't explain or excuses why they are overrepresented by a multiplyer of 9 on rapes does it?

The overrepresentation in violence might partly be because of rasicm and mostly because of the "foreigner gangs" thats spawning in our major cities.

I also agree culture has a lot to do with it. As mentioned the "worst groups" in Denmark are from Libanon and Somalia. That doesn't make all of them crooks, I've worked with and befriended Somalians that aint criminal, we had the same class at uni.

From what i can see in the answers it's not a general problem in all western countries, which is good to know.

Hej Danish neighbour!..., yes i think its the same here in Germany.
I don't wanna sound racist, but i don't like these guys at all.
Their whole attitude doesn't fit in our society i think!?
And that's the same in Denmark

I'll say it: Most any nationality other than the core Western countries have social and cultural values that are far less than the Western standards. In a word, those cultures and societies are corrupt in many areas, sometimes to the extreme.

One of the contributing factors in this difference is the strong representation of religious views and values tightly ingrained in the lives of those places. Then, in some countries, there is the exact opposite, a lack of the same.

Western cultures tend to be more middle of the road across both areas of culture and society. We can suspect that this more humane view toward politics, business and human interactions is caused by education that does not drill religion superiority into the heads of the young and the all-around general freedom that people in the West assume their cultures and societies grant them in terms of thinking and doing.

Perhaps it has been done already, but in my estimate it is time that rather than marking the advancement of humans from savages, to barbarians, to civilized folk that a new classification be squeezed into place between barbarians and the civilized. This one one would catagorize he religious fanatics that attain the trappings of a pseudo-civilization.

--And I ain't saying the West is perfect, but all in all, political operations aside, it is more humane.

(I would include modern Japan in this fold of "Western" civilizations.)

From what i can see in the answers it's not a general problem in all western countries, which is good to know.

reply to post by Mimir



Of course it is a problem in ALL western societies - just that since it doesn't fit a leftist progressive NWO agenda then it has become Politicaly Correct to pretend not to notice - it does fit their agenda to blame it on poverty and white racism.

It is especially compounded in the muslim population because to them we are infidels ie of no value, it is in the spirit of jihad, it is not possible for a good muslim to be a good citizen of the West, and they have the example of Mohammed to follow - a life of banditry, murder, extortion, rape and deception.

Originally posted by PatriotAct
This reminds me of the times the pilgrims illegally emigrated from the eastern hemisphere to the west

It wasn't 'illegal'.

Originally posted by starchild10
I think it is a cultural thing - we should be careful about tying it to religion.

But how much of 'culture' is tied in to religion? It influences them a whole lot ...

reply to post by Mimir


1. I think the factors are well known.

2. The founding documents justify almost any abuse against NonMuslims.

2.1 We periodically read on ATS about some fatwaw being issued affirming a Muslim's "right" to kidnap a non-Muslim husband's wife and essentially rape her after a month or so.

3. It will get worse.

3.1 The Western societies deplore violence in the neighborhood.

3.2 Muslim society sees violence as a major form/aspect of conquest as well as a major form of protecting/insuring/restoring "honor" to the family.

3.3 That major conflict is insoluable. That difference is inherent in the different belief systems/set of values from the founding documents to deeply inculturated values and family rearing up into all levels of society from the micro to the macro levels.

3.4 Throughout history, cultures which thrive on; highly value; incorporate and use violence as a major factor in conquest and daily life tend to ONLY RESPOND responsively and compliantly to GREATER POWER/VIOLENCE.

3.5 Otherwise, it is the less violent culture that is conquered, overwhelmed, obliterated, enslaved.

4. The oligarchy seems determined to use such violence to increase the anarchy and violence in the world generally.

4.1 The oligarchy's goal is logically, as well as brazenly stated, to shred the old order to enable establishment of the "new" order on top of the ashes of the old all that much easier. As one of Obama's advisors has exalted--NEVER LET A CRISIS GO TO WASTE . . . particularly those created for such purposes.

5. The oligarchy seems determined to particularly use such violence against Christians, Christian culture, Christian values.

6. This looks like barely the beginning, to me . . . just the warm-up skirmishes.

7. Buckle seatbelts. Live as though this day were your last. Lots of people are eager to make it so.

The reason they have been bringing in millions of those foreigners is for you to make money off of them.

They are a tool.

Countries are making much money off of those immigrants. Plus it gives you a pool to get replacement lungs, kidneys, organs for your large old people problem. Those old people have money/assets and can spend $50,000 to get replacement body parts from those immigrants.

Just figure out how you are going to make money off of them. Use the tool your Government provided.

Lol, do any of you realize perhaps this propaganda to further divide the populace, build tensions, and to hate/fear your fellow human? Then why Muslims? If it was 1941 would this study call them nazis? I see through it.

reply to post by PatriotAct


It is facts, not invented numbers. We gotten similar numbers for years, and number of articles in papers suggest its even worse.
And we're not making money on them as it was suggested. "They/we" got to many people on social service to give surplus for the country.

Why don't you just deport them? If the majority of Danish people feel the same way you do about them, then why not elect a politician that will try to repatriate them in their home countries?

Hi alien,

Are we looking at the same civilizations&citizens?

Originally posted by Aliensun
I'll say it: Most any nationality other than the core Western countries have social and cultural values that are far less than the Western standards. In a word, those cultures and societies are corrupt in many areas, sometimes to the extreme.

According to you're values perhaps that is so but which countries have been responsible for the world wars of the last century? The imperialism? The Genocides? Western 'society'. If you are not willing to study even the recent historic record of genocidal imperialism what right does that give you to comment on era's when Muslim civilization were on the rise and imperialistic in their own right? Also what is more corrupt than current western society and devastating damage it's industry has wrought on our biosphere? Does it even matter if Muslim society is violent or corrupt when western society are apparently fast heading to destroying EVERYONE's ability to survive outdoors?

One of the contributing factors in this difference is the strong representation of religious views and values tightly ingrained in the lives of those places. Then, in some countries, there is the exact opposite, a lack of the same.

So the protestant ( nazi's) and Calvinist movements ( to say nothing of even smaller sects ) and the various so called civilizing religions of the west are not known to have resulted in orders of magnitude more death and destruction on continents the Muslims were not even aware of? While i am no expert on the middle ages and the long reign of Islam in North Africa/ Iberia and the Balkans i have never been led to understand that they were any more brutal or more corrupt than what they replaced or were in turn replaced by.

Western cultures tend to be more middle of the road across both areas of culture and society.

What does 'middle of the road mean'? The slave trade that practically depopulated Africa, the genocide of North, South America and Australia? What's so middle of the road about recent western history?

Can i bring up a few of those cultural/legal values western civilization prides itself by such as women's rights? Did you know that until 1976 a married man could not be prosecuted for raping, to say nothing of overlooking frequent beatings, his wife in the USA/Canada ( have not even checked Europe but their normally a few decades ahead on such issues) and that in the mid 90's only 17 US states had completed abolished this types of exemptions to rape laws? What does it matter if good segments of Islamic/Muslim law are still were western society were a few decades ago on such an important issue. What about Muslim society is really unique to them? What practices do they believe in that were either never practiced in the west or were long ago done away with? I am no scholar on comparative merits so feel free to impress me with extensive lists on what makes Islam so utterly intolerable&irredeemable.

We can suspect that this more humane view toward politics, business and human interactions is caused by education that does not drill religion superiority into the heads of the young and the all-around general freedom that people in the West assume their cultures and societies grant them in terms of thinking and doing.

So it's not feelings of religious superiority that allowed for the attempted destruction of the Slavic/Jewish people during the second world war? It's not feelings of religiously inspired superiority that allowed for the western powers destroying Vietnam, South and North Korea, South America and the continuing grand theft of African and third world resources in general? What comparative good can western society do while it perpetuates globalization and capitalism under threat of genocidal sanctions or outright violence?

Where would this sense of superiority come from if not from nationalistic&religious indoctrination/education? What all round general freedom does people in western society have beside being able to choices as to how to spend the money they MUST make while ensuing in capitalistic competition with their neighbours&friends other human beings in general?

Continued

We can suspect that this more humane view toward politics, business and human interactions is caused by education that does not drill religion superiority into the heads of the young and the all-around general freedom that people in the West assume their cultures and societies grant them in terms of thinking and doing.

So it's not feelings of religious superiority that allowed for the attempted destruction of the Slavic/Jewish people during the second world war? It's not feelings of religiously inspired superiority that allowed for the western powers destroying Vietnam, South and North Korea, South America and the continuing grand theft of African and third world resources in general? What comparative good can western society do while it perpetuates globalization and capitalism under threat of genocidal sanctions or outright violence?

Where would this sense of superiority come from if not from nationalistic&religious indoctrination/education? What all round general freedom does people in western society have beside being able to choices as to how to spend the money they MUST make while ensuing in capitalistic competition with their neighbours&friends other human beings in general?

Perhaps it has been done already, but in my estimate it is time that rather than marking the advancement of humans from savages, to barbarians, to civilized folk that a new classification be squeezed into place between barbarians and the civilized. This one one would categorize he religious fanatics that attain the trappings of a pseudo-civilization.

Perhaps if we truly had western civilization ( thanks Gandhi) Islamic nations would not feel so threatened by invasion and the frequent western state sponsored terrorism ( AI, invasion and airial bombardment&sanctions) that they know to be the norm when they do anything anti capitalistic. Perhaps if you understood that the people in the charge in the west cares not one iota about religion as long as Islam nations behaves capitalistically/subordinate you would understand why and when we get wars and how the western destabilization of these nations leads to waves of immigration and the supposed higher crime rates in the western nations these people sometimes flee to. Since we are on the topic of immigration since when have those that left a given country or area to settle themselves elsewhere , for whatever reason, been the best their society had to offer? Do you think America got settled by the best men leaving Europe? That Australia were settled by the best the British empire had to offer? Normally those who leave one area for another are those who can not adapt to changes where they used to live and as best i can tell nothing has changed.

--And I ain't saying the West is perfect, but all in all, political operations aside, it is more humane.

(I would include modern Japan in this fold of "Western" civilizations.)

More humane how? Did you know that German forced sterilization practices in the Nazi era came from practices in the USA? What is Humane about locking up 0.8% of your population ( more than any other nation) by total or by percentage as the US does? What is so civilized about a nation where policing is either so strict or criminality so rampant? What about western political operations is more or less humane than Islamic practices?

In summary i don't think anyone who studies history, recent or ancient, should or can call western civilization especially civilized or Islamic civilization any kind of general improvement on it. Many of the hard won liberties in the west are as ever in danger while Muslims all over the world are modernizing ( 50% of them are women after all so it's hard to do worse than they currently are) as best they can to survive in a changing world while , as Christians in other places, clinging to their religion to provide them with what little security they can extract from it.

It is truly sad that so many people are unable to see the similarities in our common struggle for the freedom to worship as we choose while pursuing the economic liberty we can only attain by means of a independent income. The freedom from debilitating need ( hunger/shelter etc) is after all the preeminent freedom hence it's absence in western constitutions and pretty much anywhere else.

I truly wish the commonality of our struggles were as self evident to others as they have become for me.

Stellar

reply to post by StellarX


In general you raise a lot of legit points, but you also generalize a lot in a few cases which I will try to address.
Once again this is not an attack on Islam or muslims in general, I know most of you are normal people just like I hope you see “us” as normal.

According to you're values perhaps that is so but which countries have been responsible for the world wars of the last century? The imperialism? The Genocides? Western 'society'.

Yes Germany was behind WW I and II but most of the western countries suffered during those wars, you are blaming the populations that in most cases was the target of genocide.
I agree there has been far too much genocide in Europe in the last century but you have also seen a lot of nasty genocide in some African countries, also in recent years. Somalia, Rwanda and Nigeria too mention a few.
On the issue of imperialism your almost spot on. America and the European governments are moving at a frightening speed towards a totalitarian global empire. I know that the populations in several European country’s is against this growth in empire, some of these populations are in England, Ireland, The Netherlands and Denmark.

Does it even matter if Muslim society is violent or corrupt when western society are apparently fast heading to destroying EVERYONE's ability to survive outdoors?

Yes it does matter.
And you are right about the destruction of the environment. Again I would blame the governments (politicians) and not the populations in most European countries. Some European countries got very advanced programs for renewable energy, and the power plants don’t pollute a fraction of what they did 30 years ago. This is because our politician believe in the global warming (hoax), but at the same time they are to corrupt to allow real alternatives to get a chance for a real change. The reason for this is because they believe they can use taxes like carbon tax as a tool to create their global empire. They would rather focus on a hoax manipulation tool like manmade global warming, compared to doing something about real issues such as Fukushima.
Another point would be that if they released free energy devices, they would have a hard time keeping the matrix alive and the "third world countries" at bay. The energy"crisis", the polution and the rise of tyrany are the three most importent issue if you want to increase the standard of living all over the world (from my point of view).

Our politicians buy into another hoax to, most of them follow the tune of the global corporate elite for various suspect reasons. The corporate elite is the real people to blame for the environmental mass-murder and we the people should start yelling “enough is enough” and send some of these criminals to rot in jail for life. We don’t have a real alternative in Denmark, we can vote for red or blue block parties, both is pro war (against the peoples will), both is pro-empire (against the peoples will) all thou both got a few anti-empire individuals, both are pro bailouts sponsored by devaluation of our money and the list could go on and on....basically we got a choice between two of the same kind and none of the handle real issues as i mentioned.

So the protestant ( nazi's)

hmmm...You'r far over the line here. I don’t know any nazi's, but I know thousands of protestants.

Can i bring up a few of those cultural/legal values western civilization prides itself by such as women's rights?

Women "won" the right to vote in 1915 in Denmark and 1919 in America. We're not allowed to beat up our women in any western countries as far as i know of and in most of the countries you wont find sadistic laws like sharia that got some nasty punishments for women, so how are muslim countries doing with women rights?
What we do lack of is in the western (and the rest) of the world is protection of our human rights and liberties which is getting undermined by the growing empire controlled by the corporate/finacial global elite.

impress me with extensive lists on what makes Islam so utterly intolerable&irredeemable.

I'm happy your post don’t address me, I would have a hard time fulfilling your request.
I can add one thing to the list. I'm very much pro-secular society and believe any kind of religious interference in poletics should be illegal and banned from government’s that’s reason enough to despise Sharia-law, another reason would be the content of Sharia. Now you will say I'm the one generalizing here and yes I do know Sharia is not practiced in that many countries.

Where would this sense of superiority come from if not from nationalistic&religious indoctrination/education?

We do have to much indoctrination and brainwashing in the western schools, but that’s going on all over the world.
Nationalism sadly is on the rise in many western countries, partly because of a very BIAS'ed media and partly because of things like the issue of this thread.

Normally those who leave one area for another are those who can’t adapt to changes where they used to live and as best i can tell nothing has changed.

True, but that doesn't change the fact of their background or their deeds. I would never consider raping anyone or hurting any innocent "just because" members of my family got bombed or worse.

It is truly sad that so many people are unable to see the similarities in our common struggle for the freedom to worship as we choose while pursuing the economic liberty we can only attain by means of a independent income. The freedom from debilitating need ( hunger/shelter etc) is after all the preeminent freedom hence it's absence in western constitutions and pretty much anywhere else.

Very good point.