One Religion Can't Be Declared The Correct One

"Free yourself of the crippling crutch dependant shackles of religion!!!"

I'm sure that you have a belief system of man, of self or of science.
Or do you subscribe to humanism - the belief in man's ability to solve all of humanity's problems because there is no Divine God? Because if you do, turn on your telly and have a good look at the world - don't lock your front door tonight - let your five year old child walk to school alone tomorrow - let your wife walk alone at night - don't bother with a condom because your lady can just abort the mistake if it happens - go for a walk in almost every major city and don't worry about what street you walk down - promote yet another war -

The "shackles of religion" as you call it, came off too many people, and you've got your head in the sand if you can't see the consequences of that in our own country. You somehow think that God's laws are senseless and imprisoning, but guess what? They were given to give humanity freedom and blessings. And God's biggest warning, a huge moral lesson in the Bible, is that a society, without God's presence, DISINTIGRATES.

reply to post by TupacShakur


Religion does divide us, but the moral teachings of the bible do not. God does not divide us either.

Humans are at fault for interpreting things wrong and out right lying.

Blame those who use the source not the source itself.

As for Science, it told us we can't go faster then Light, look where that got us. Neither stream is better then the next and both are equally as important. Don't let human decisions cloud your judgements.

i agree with your op 100% but noone should tell people what they should beleive. thats why i think that both creationism and evolution should be taught in school. evolution in science, letting students know that it is the accepted scientific theory and creationism in religous studies making sure students understand that some people do beleive religion over science. as well as that religous studies shouldnt focus so much on christianity and teach various religion giving students an understanding of all beleifs and science lets them make up their own mind on what they beleive......

and before anyone says anything, i said BELEIVE. i know that evolution makes a hell of a lot more sense then creationism, but at the end of the day they can beleive what they want as long as they have all of the facts. this does also meen that pushy parents shouldnt force their kids to follow the same religion they they themselves follow.

One Religion Can't Be Declared The Correct One

Sure they can. Any religion on the planet can declare itself to be the one and only correct one.
Heck .. they all do it. Some then go out and kill in the name of their 'one correct religion'.
But just because they all declare it .... doesn't make any of 'em right.
In fact, the more someone pushes that theirs is the only right one ...
the less 'holiness' you tend to see in that particular faith. Just seems to me that's true.

Originally posted by WhoKnows100
"Free yourself of the crippling crutch dependant shackles of religion!!!"

I'm sure that you have a belief system of man, of self or of science.
Or do you subscribe to humanism - the belief in man's ability to solve all of humanity's problems because there is no Divine God? Because if you do, turn on your telly and have a good look at the world - don't lock your front door tonight - let your five year old child walk to school alone tomorrow - let your wife walk alone at night - don't bother with a condom because your lady can just abort the mistake if it happens - go for a walk in almost every major city and don't worry about what street you walk down - promote yet another war -

Dude,same argument can be used against you.I will reverse the words:
"Or do you subscribe to creatonism - the belief in God's ability to solve all of humanity's problems because there is ONE Divine God? Because if you do, turn on your telly and have a good look at the world - don't lock your front door tonight - let your five year old child walk to school alone tomorrow - let your wife walk alone at night - don't bother with a with any sex at all because your lady cant just abort the mistake if it happens - go for a walk in almost every major city and don't worry about what street you walk down
The "shackles of religion" as you call it, came off too many people, and you've got your head in the sand if you can't see the consequences of that in our own country. You somehow think that God's laws are senseless and imprisoning, but guess what? They were given to give humanity freedom and blessings. And God's biggest warning, a huge moral lesson in the Bible, is that a society, without God's presence, DISINTIGRATES."



Besides that, from what I know, even atheists and agnostics (I am one of them) have good manners. I know I would never kill,rob,rape,etc. a person.
Religions are useless, there are religious people who behave worse than non religious people. It all really goes down just to one thing: how have parents raised their children, and what environment children live in.

Maybe they're all correct in their own little way. Strip em down to their general message, and they're all connected.
I think they're ALL on to something.

I think we need more religions.

Variety is the spice of life.

As for Buddhists proclaiming the Bauddha Dharma as being the true religion, only a foolish practitioner would make that claim. All we say is, that you have innumerable lives to follow whatever dogma you choose, or lack thereof. if that's the game you want to play, then by all means play it.

Akin to hitting yourself over the head with a hammer and asking why your head hurts. If you want your head to stop hurting, taking aspirin (worldly pleasures) or hoping it will go away by itself (faith) are not worthwhile answers. the answer is to drop the hammer.

So if you're a Christian, be so. If you want to be an atheist, be so. But at some point when you want your headache to go away, stop hitting yourself.

reply to post by WhoKnows100

- How exactly does the existence of other religions destroy the Truth of the Bible? God's Word makes it quite clear that not all are His children.

Because those other religions claim that there's too is the "truth".

- Who says? You? You do realise that that your opinion is based on a belief that God does NOT exist. So because you believe THAT, you therefore feel that OTHER people are simply believing in a lie.

Simple exercises in logic and critical thinking is what invalidates religion, not simply my opinion.

- theories are just that - theories.

Theories which are backed by evidence and supported by the scientific method.

On evolution, you do realise that no missing link has ever been found, right? Every decade we've been given one, and later that same decade it's ruled out.

Fossilization is not a perfect process, yet we have enough evidence to piece together an adequate scientific explanation.

Yet people still maintain that the vast complexity of life just happened by chance.

Well the vast complexity of life that we see today didn't just pop up one day from some chemicals, it began with single celled organisms which evolved into more complex life forms, which eventually created what we see today.

You'd rather believe that you were descended from an ape, I know otherwise.

You don't "know" otherwise, you just believe otherwise. From a scientific standpoint, you would be laughed out of the room of scholars for saying that evolution is a bunch of hogwash. But with your Bible buddies, you can pretend to "know" all you want.

- How on Earth do you connect a level of intelligence with a religious belief?

Because the facts back that up:

"Of 43 studies carried out since 1927 on the relationship between religious belief and one's intelligence and/or educational level, all but four found an inverse connection. That is, the higher one's intelligence or education level, the less one is likely to be religious or hold "beliefs" of any kind."”

"The God Delusion" by Prof. Richard Dawkins (2006)

This is really just a rant of yours, calling religions "silly fairy tales".

Oh I'm sorry, what would you like me to call your book of talking snakes and magical wizard men who can walk on water? A historical account?

How does obeying the 10 commandments or other moral laws hold back civilisations? Do you even recognise that our society is failing right now? Millions upon millions in prison, houses burgled, rapes, child molestations, drugs, sexual diseases, teenagers thinking nothing of having babies, millions of babies aborted each year, greed and materialism promoted everywhere etc? Do you realise that these have all risen as society's belief in God has been destroyed?

Do some research on the ratio of atheists in prison to those of Christians (with the population accounted for), and I promise you'll be suprised at what you find.

-

Rant again. You do have real hatred of anyone that still believes in God. Religion didn't block it, powerful men did.

Poweful men who were deeply religious, and believed that such a scientific discovery went against the word of God.

If anything, the theories keep getting closer to the reality that the life and universe show intelligent design.

I take it you haven't been keeping up with the field of Astronomy and Physics for the past 100 years?

reply to post by TupacShakur


Just because there's a thousand different religions doesn't mean one cannot be the correct one. Do you realize how ridiculous that logic sounds?

Even though technically I believe ALL religions are wrong, a person relationship with Christ isn't a religion.

reply to post by Lionhearte

Just because there's a thousand different religions doesn't mean one cannot be the correct one. Do you realize how ridiculous that logic sounds?

But that means there's a very slim chance that one specific religion which people say is correct actually is correct.

Originally posted by SuperiorEd

Originally posted by GR1ill3d

Christ died on a cross to pay your sin debt.

He died to pay off the "Sin Debt" His father created in the first place, gotta love the logic on that one.

Wrong again. You are speaking from ignorance. To speak of these things well, you must read the Bible and know what it says. God cannot be anything apart from the infinity that He is. Creation is the separation of light for darkness. In other words, material creation is the place we start life to learn to separate light from darkness. We are here to be prepared by the consuming fire of God, acceptable unto good works in the kingdom of God. For love to survive the trials, it must be true. No union anywhere in life happens apart form love if it is to last and be seen as worthy of truth.

We are children of God. As such, we are as children, learning from the Father. By denying you have a father, you are disallowing this work to take place and simply revealing a childish nature. Ignorance can only deny the purpose in what is not understood. Refuse to be ignorant and discover the world around you. The Bible charges us with testing all things and clinging to what is good. In the end, you will discover that loving others is the point of life. God is one of the others to be loved. He is the main one to be loved. Becoming a man require putting away childish things. It requires suffering for others and denying self. Raising kids requires this sacrifice. God is our example, not a thing to be trampled in pride and ignorance.

In life, we either light the fire we burn by, or we are the light on the path to others. It's a choice.

Wow you really try to live up to your name don't you?
It's amazing that you, and a lot of other religious types, make these grand statements about what is and isn't true about God and arrogantly tell people how wrong they are about their beliefs - that they obviously do not understand the bible the way that you do.................I have to laugh at you!!!!!

There is no definitive answer - which is the point of the thread. It's just something that some people believe in and formulate what they think is the truth. Nobody actually KNOWS anything about God or the bible or Jesus Christ or Mohammed etc etc etc so therefore nobody can be right or more accurate because it's all just different opinions..........

So my opinion is that the idea of an omnipotent, ever present God is ridiculous and is a man-made idea used to make people obedient to the 'rules' of certain religions. Nobody can prove me right or wrong. Especially you, SuperiorEd, regardless of all your Sunday School posturing...........

reply to [url= by SuperiorEd[/url]




Well my only question is then who created sin? Was it man? could not have been man unless you want to use the story of Adam and Eve which is quite possibly the most illogical story in the bible other then the flood. IF you want to use the story of Adam and Eve here is the problem with it, They disobeyed god which created sin, but they could not have known disobedience was bad because they hadn't eaten from the tree of knowledge yet. Therefore "Sin" is something your version of your "God" made.

I hope you also realize that the way "Jesus died for our sins" is portrayed in the bible is like going to court for a crime YOU committed and watching Jesus take the punishment for it. How exactly does my son have sin? was he born with it? What did he do to get "Sin"? What did this little girl to get rejected by god and die from starvation/thirst? Why does "God" not help out the needy? I mean he did make everything we see, yet he can't give a little girl a way to get food and water?



I have a slew of other things i could put down here to make a point but it wouldn't make a difference so i won't waste the time.

Originally posted by TupacShakur
But that means there's a very slim chance that one specific religion which people say is correct actually is correct.

No. It doesn't. I'll address why in a moment. I actually have time to respond in full, so I'll start with your OP.

When talking with people who are religious, I notice that many of them seem absolutely sure that it is correct. *snip* However this falls apart when met with a simple fact: There have been thousands of religions throughout the history of man.

First off, I'm not religious by any means. I've only been to church maybe 3 times this year, and have never donated anything except maybe some blood back in school. That said, I'm not 100% certain on a lot of things, but there's only one thing I am certain of, and that's the existence of God.

Now, the reason I said I'm not religious, is because it doesn't take a mathematician to know 2+2 = 4, just as you don't need a "religious" person to know there is a God, because Religion != Christianity.

And then you go and make a claim as absolute fact.

They basically all maintain the belief that their religion is correct, however if only one can be correct, the mathemetical odds of that being reality is very slim, 1% with an incredibly generous estimate, realisically more like 0.01%-0.001%, if not less. *snip*

(Where did you even GET that number?)
The problem with your logic, is that you're viewing it all as a whole. You're assuming, because there is a thousand different religions, that the odds of their being a "true" one is so small, it should be impossible. But that's not how it works; instead, you look at each individual religion, and say - there is a 0.01%-0.001% chance that this is the True one.

You know what that implies? That there IS a true one; that is the basis for your formula.
Otherwise, it would be 0%.

No matter how strong you believe it's true, or whether you "feel" God and "speak" to him, that's simply the effect of believing in it for so long. *snip*

Originally posted by JonU2
There is no definitive answer - which is the point of the thread. It's just something that some people believe in and formulate what they think is the truth.

Wrong.
2+2 will ALWAYS = 4.

There is a 'definitive' answer; it just isn't clear. Truth can be skewed. A person can lie, can deceive, can misinform..

A person can believe in whatever he wants; Aliens, Animal gods, Buddha, Muhammed, Allah, etc.. Whatever they want. A person's PERSONAL truth does NOT make it the universal TRUTH.

A person can believe 2+2 = 5, but when that person dies; so, too, does their 'truth'.

If a person who is Buddhist or some tribal religion that none of us have ever heard of since birth, they will share the same feelings towards the accuracy of their religion versus others. *snip* Some might be more thorough and detailed than others, but that's not an indication of the accuracy of the account, instead the effort put into into it.

Not exactly. A person can be raised a Christian his entire life and turn Atheistic 60 years down the road, just as a man can be raised as a Muslim his entire life, and accept Christ once he realizes the truth. It works both ways.

There's no reason to bring statistics even into this. People view statistics the wrong way all the time. Researchers could one day find a link between purple jelly beans and cancer (P < 0.05) and later on in the news you'll hear about how all Jelly Beans give you cancer. That's just how the world fails.

That said, the accuracy IS key. The Bible has never been historically inaccurate; in fact people did accept this, until they started questioning it; they found no evidence of say, the Hittites, and the Bible was put under scrutiny. Until a few decades ago, when evidence of the Hittites arose.

And of course, you have prophecy.

Not only does it do that, but in the past, religion has blocked/suppressed certain scientific discoveries. Looked at from this perspective, it's actually detrimental to the human species. Luckily things like that don't happen any more, but the past can't be erased, and those people who engaged in such a stupid campaign believed in the same religion as many of you still do.

No it hasn't, lol.

People seem to forget that the world's scholars were Christian Monks, who've kept written history down on scrolls, and protected them with their lives.

People like to call it the "Christian Dark Ages", but seem to forget (or are just unaware) that the Dark Ages were caused by the fall of the Roman Empire, and the invasion of the barbarous hordes of Gaul and Iberia. If anything, Christianity helped homogenize the Roman people for a few decades longer, prolonging the fall and helping maintain a bit more stability.

Sorry, but there's just no factual evidence for Christians suppressing any scientific discoveries or advancements.

Originally posted by GR1ill3d
reply to [url= by SuperiorEd[/url]

 

Well my only question is then who created sin? Was it man? could not have been man unless you want to use the story of Adam and Eve which is quite possibly the most illogical story in the bible other then the flood. IF you want to use the story of Adam and Eve here is the problem with it, They disobeyed god which created sin, but they could not have known disobedience was bad because they hadn't eaten from the tree of knowledge yet. Therefore "Sin" is something your version of your "God" made.

I like how you asked a question, and found it fitting to answer it yourself.

Let's look at it this way - what is sin? Let's look at the Ten Commandments; how about, 'Thou Shalt Not Lie'
Now, why would God make that a commandment? Did he flip a coin, on whether lying should be good or evil?
No, it isn't so much a 'law' as it is the very nature of God himself. God cannot lie. Therefore, what is considered a sin, is anything other than the nature of God himself. It is indeed ungodly acts.

You can't have one without the other. God, being ultimately righteous, can only be called so if there was something other than righteousness.

As to your concern for the validity of the stories within the Bible, the 5000 character limit per post isn't enough for me to respond to that.

I hope you also realize that the way "Jesus died for our sins" is portrayed in the bible is like going to court for a crime YOU committed and watching Jesus take the punishment for it. How exactly does my son have sin? was he born with it? What did he do to get "Sin"? What did this little girl to get rejected by god and die from starvation/thirst?

When Adam and Eve fell to temptation, Sin was let into this world. Hint: Sin is still here.
When Sin was let into the world, so was disease, so was sickness, so was hunger, so was thirst, so was pain, so was misery, so was death.

So, yes. If you are born into this world, like your son, you are born into Sin. That should answer your other question, as well; it isn't God punishing these people, they are simply born into a sinful world, and with it comes hunger, thirst, pain.. everything I mentioned above.

Why does "God" not help out the needy? I mean he did make everything we see, yet he can't give a little girl a way to get food and water?

God sends out His people. Christians are the only ones in the entire world who donate the most; who have missionaries in other countries helping out people just like this. My blame isn't onto God, but onto the people who make this world even more miserable than it already is. Why aren't people doing something to aide these poor children? What reason could there possibly be? Simply, evil flourishes in this world; for the prince of this world is the Devil.

I have a slew of other things i could put down here to make a point but it wouldn't make a difference so i won't waste the time.

You're right, it wouldn't make a difference; I don't see what point you set out in making, but it seems to have failed, and I doubt any of the other evidence you apparently have could change that.

reply to post by Lionhearte

That said, I'm not 100% certain on a lot of things, but there's only one thing I am certain of, and that's the existence of God.

This statement is absolutely meaningless to me and proves nothing other than your own belief.

(Where did you even GET that number?)

It was an estimation, based on the fact that there have been thousands of religions. If you have a problem with that value, do some research, find out how many religions there have been throughout history, and you'll probably find that the percentage would be even smaller.

The problem with your logic, is that you're viewing it all as a whole. You're assuming, because there is a thousand different religions, that the odds of their being a "true" one is so small, it should be impossible. But that's not how it works; instead, you look at each individual religion, and say - there is a 0.01%-0.001% chance that this is the True one.

You know what that implies? That there IS a true one; that is the basis for your formula.
Otherwise, it would be 0%.

I was just making that point so that from the perspective of a religious person, they could understand that if they maintain the belief that their is correct, there are people of thousands of other religions who share the exact same sentiments. So from their "I am certain that my religion is correct" perspective, there is realistically a slim chance of that being true.

That said, the accuracy IS key. The Bible has never been historically inaccurate; in fact people did accept this, until they started questioning it; they found no evidence of say, the Hittites, and the Bible was put under scrutiny. Until a few decades ago, when evidence of the Hittites arose.

The Bible being historically accurate, now THAT is funny.

Talking snakes? A worldwide flood and an old man making a boat and rounding up two of every species? A magical garden where humanity was inbred into existence? That's a historical account? A virgin being impregnated by a ghost and giving birth to a man-god? All I can do is laugh at the absurdity.

And of course, you have prophecy.

Yes we all know how accurate prophesies are.

People seem to forget that the world's scholars were Christian Monks, who've kept written history down on scrolls, and protected them with their lives.

Tell that to Thales of Miletus, Aristotle, Anaxagoras, Ibn al-Hassan Ibn al-Haytham, and Abu Rayhan al-Biruni.

Sorry, but there's just no factual evidence for Christians suppressing any scientific discoveries or advancements.

Wait, so Galileo wasn't imprisoned in his home for life due to pushing a Copernican model of the solar system?

reply to post by JonU2

Wow you really try to live up to your name don't you?
It's amazing that you, and a lot of other religious types, make these grand statements about what is and isn't true about God and arrogantly tell people how wrong they are about their beliefs - that they obviously do not understand the bible the way that you do.................I have to laugh at you!!!!!

There is no definitive answer - which is the point of the thread. It's just something that some people believe in and formulate what they think is the truth. Nobody actually KNOWS anything about God or the bible or Jesus Christ or Mohammed etc etc etc so therefore nobody can be right or more accurate because it's all just different opinions..........

So my opinion is that the idea of an omnipotent, ever present God is ridiculous and is a man-made idea used to make people obedient to the 'rules' of certain religions. Nobody can prove me right or wrong. Especially you, SuperiorEd, regardless of all your Sunday School posturing...........

The Analects of Confucius are written from the point of view of a teacher of virtue. Confucius called the changed man the "Superior Man." Not superior to others, but superior to himself each day. Confucius said, "If one day you can renovate yourself, yea, let their be daily renovation."

I wrote a book called the Superior Educator. This is a book that allows a teacher to see the value in renovating themselves first to be a superior educator in the classroom for the students they lead. This is a process of building your own virtue first to then reflect this virtue to the ones you lead. It is the correct way to value the other person as the example to follow. This allows the teacher to preserve the dignity of those they lead without compromising the process with their own lack of virtue as the example.

My username comes as a short version of my website. Superiored.com

Dignity can be preserved if you remove bias. Talk to the subject and not down to the object you are speaking to. Context is the way to remove any doubt about what you say. I clearly said that you spoke form ignorance of the subject. From there, I provided context to back it up. You can say what you like about me. I have no problem with being called a name, just back it up and answer why.

If you are angry at my subject and it convicts you, remember that I am not the subject. What I have provided is what any Christian with a well-grounded understanding of the Bible would have said. Aim your wrath at the subject.

What I have said about the subject must be in context to all my posts on this thread.

Originally posted by TupacShakur
This statement is absolutely meaningless to me and proves nothing other than your own belief.

That was the reason I made that statement.

It was an estimation, based on the fact that there have been thousands of religions. If you have a problem with that value, do some research, find out how many religions there have been throughout history, and you'll probably find that the percentage would be even smaller.

I have done plenty of research onto the different 'religions' and belief systems, and it still wouldn't be that small. You act as if every person on Earth has imagined up a new religion. There aren't billions out there. You can't take in assumption those you might not know about either, such as the possibility there is a tribe out there that has a religion no one ever heard of. You don't play the assumption game in statistics.

I was just making that point so that from the perspective of a religious person, they could understand that if they maintain the belief that their is correct, there are people of thousands of other religions who share the exact same sentiments. So from their "I am certain that my religion is correct" perspective, there is realistically a slim chance of that being true.

Yes, but you imply none of them are true, as you're mostly praising Science. I simply find it odd you would suggest that there is the possibility one of the Religions to be true (ie, anything >0%), but at the same time be convinced none of them are.

Talking snakes?

Satan tempted Eve.

A worldwide flood and an old man making a boat and rounding up two of every species?

An old man and his family, and 2 of every species within the area, not across the world. Why is this so ridiculous? There's perfectly logical explanations as to how the world could have been covered with a flood, and supported by different cultures around the world with the same story of a worldwide flood, there's logical explanations as to how many species there actually would have been needed to create all of the ones we have today (which is some 10,000?), there's logical explanations as to how the vegetation survived, in fact none of it is contradictory to anything we know about science today.

A magical garden where humanity was inbred into existence? That's a historical account?

Magical? It was a paradise, sure, don't know what kind of magic they had going on there, though. As far as the inbreeding, there would have not been any 'corrupt' seed from Adam (if you will), as he and Eve were the first created humans. That said, Adam, living to be 800, likely had.. quite a few children. Again, that generation wouldn't have been affected by inbreeding. However, if Adam's children's children were involved in incest, then yes, they would have - but they could still reproduce with their cousins, with only a 4-6% chance of having ANY form of birth defects. Major defects are even less of a chance. And, of course, that is with today's research.

A virgin being impregnated by a ghost and giving birth to a man-god?

That's why it's called a 'miracle'. It would be quite difficult to deny the existence that a man named Jesus indeed walked this Earth. But it would be more difficult to claim he was 'just a man', if you did believe in his existence.

Yes we all know how accurate prophesies are.

Biblical prophecies are 100% accurate to this date, with some yet to be fulfilled.

Tell that to Thales of Miletus, Aristotle, Anaxagoras, Ibn al-Hassan Ibn al-Haytham, and Abu Rayhan al-Biruni.

There's a difference between Christians and the Catholic Church, which seems to be what you're egging at. I was careful to not confuse the two.

Wait, so Galileo wasn't imprisoned in his home for life due to pushing a Copernican model of the solar system?

As I've said, the Catholic Church, though believing in the same God (though is bound by Religion), is not the same. Christians praised Galileo's work,

Originally posted by GR1ill3d
reply to [url= by SuperiorEd[/url]

 

Well my only question is then who created sin? Was it man? could not have been man unless you want to use the story of Adam and Eve which is quite possibly the most illogical story in the bible other then the flood. IF you want to use the story of Adam and Eve here is the problem with it, They disobeyed god which created sin, but they could not have known disobedience was bad because they hadn't eaten from the tree of knowledge yet. Therefore "Sin" is something your version of your "God" made.

I hope you also realize that the way "Jesus died for our sins" is portrayed in the bible is like going to court for a crime YOU committed and watching Jesus take the punishment for it. How exactly does my son have sin? was he born with it? What did he do to get "Sin"? What did this little girl to get rejected by god and die from starvation/thirst? Why does "God" not help out the needy? I mean he did make everything we see, yet he can't give a little girl a way to get food and water?



I have a slew of other things i could put down here to make a point but it wouldn't make a difference so i won't waste the time.

You are asking questions that have an answer. Sometimes it only takes perspective to see the larger paradox resolved. This is called the excluded middle. It's like a train engineer and his friend arguing over the fact that the train whistle changes pitch or not. Both are right when they come to realize that the Doppler Effect is to blame.

The first thing you need to realize is this: ALL sin is forgiven apart from disbelief. Disbelief is not the same as never having the chance to believe from ignorance. There is a difference. Disbelief is defiant and willful hatred against God. You don't disbelieve there is a God. All of us realize there is a God. It is disbelieving what God stands for, which is truth and justice. God requires this of us first. Can he save the child in your picture. Yes and already has. This is the point. The child was never lost. This is an image only in a reality of images. All sin is forgiven apart form standing against truth and justice from a disbelieving heart. There is no such thing as denying God exists. There is only disagreement with the facts as presented.

How can I say that all sins are forgiven? Two reasons. There are jubilee years when all debts are cleared. This is the law. Second, Jesus paid our debt because we cannot end sin. Sin is a choice man made and continues to make. As an example, why are you not feeding the child in the picture and others like him?

Think on this............Think.........Think............

Ask another question. Why is the child there in the first place?

Think again...............

Sin. The answer is, someone had the power and did not act. Sin is our example here. We are the cause and the ones to blame, not God. We are caretakers of the Garden, not God. We are to subdue the earth and master it or it masters us.

Now answer the first question. Why are you not acting for the benefit of the child? You may be. Maybe not. Either way, we see the value in it and this is the point. Hell and heaven was never the point of being here either. From the life we live, we see the point.

You might say, that's too harsh. One life is not enough. I say you are correct. Jesus said, you must be born again. In other words, its not an option. Nothing God creates will die. John 3 reveals that there are two births. One in the water of the material world. This is the symbol for baptism. One is a union with the spirit of God in love. All unions happen from love. Man and wife and so on. Union is the point. Coming to God in faith with a pure heart of love is where our lives take us. Nothing can be lost because God goes after the lost sheep. If not, you would not be here now. Faith requires trust. If it were fact, there could be no trust because we would already know.

Take a good look at the child in the picture. This is a picture of our sin as it affects others. Would a loving Father fail to teach this lesson? Confucius said, "I hear and I forget. I see and I learn. I do and I understand." God provides us all three in a place where nothing can be destroyed. We can only reveal our unwillingness to learn the lessons.

reply to post by TupacShakur


I imagine if God is real and he had a book that is real he would make sure it was readily available. Maybe you should start with the most printed book in the history of the world. I think God might be pointing you to the one that is right. Not the right religion but definitely the right book.

Only one book can lead man to live a life free from the bondage of sin and completely change the will of that man.

If you want to know for yourself what book is right, if possible forget everything you have ever heard about the bible. Read the book accepting the possibility that every word could indeed be true. Read or listen (MP3) to the bible allowing only what you read or listen to enter your heart, and begin to be changed. If it is possible for you to do this completely open to finding the truth you will believe.

The position described by the OP has proven time and time to be correct. Regardless of the obsessional and downright one-eyed views/certainties expressed by spiritualists and religionists alike.

Taking 'religion' on its own...there are only a handful of 'major' religions that claim exclusive rights to the truth - damning and relegating 'unbelievers' to the hands of the devil, satan...or whatever other scapegoat comes to hand.

It is, THE UTMOST flavour of temerity for any individual/organisation to make the claim of exclusivity on truth. It always comes across as, self-serving, 'I am saved, and you are not', childishness that permeates all Major religions that claim this exclusivity. Psychologically, it resides in the infant-to-child range of responses to valid life & death questions.
(On forum boards such as this one), no sooner is the question asked of free thinkers, the 'SAVED' ones appear, to damn, pray for your soul (as if this was asked for), explain to you, through a heavily edited manuscript...that, Christ belongs exclusively to them...to the exclusion of those who have never heard of a Christ (but may be spiritual in thier own way, living a life of actual virtue) and existing without the self-serving judgements of the newly 'Saved', 'born again' etc...
These lives, when examined carefully are free of the kind of judgement meted out by those who would spend more time concerning themselves with other peoples' souls; instead of looking inward (where the real Christ resides) to examine thier own souls journey...and understand at a more global level what it means to have humility, and in reality walk in the footsteps of a hero, whose life 'story' has become the playground of...the lost.

The message has become totally overtaken by the messengers...
The rest is history.

Akushla
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