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Originally posted by BravoBull
Thanks for the thoughtful response. My apologies for the caustic reply to the last post. I guess my ire was up from going through a few threads where posters of the fox news/rush limbaugh ilk were criticizing the demonstrators for not knowing what they were protesting about, no clear message, nothing will change, etc... Everyone is at different levels of awareness and our views will always be shaped by our experience and unfortunately the drivel that is spewed by the corporate media. Those people do not even recognize that en masse people are starting to awaken. They would disparage the movement as a "communist/socialist" plot. While I admit, there will be organizations in power and that want to maintain that power, who will try to channel this energy to their own purposes. Only time will tell if the OWP people will recognize this and refuse to be herded. But I won't denigrate the fact that America is starting to realize we are being led and controlled for the benefit of a few and not for the progress of humanity. Its a shame that the loudest voices in all of this are generally part of the problem and not interested in real fundamental change.
Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine
You missed the point here. The point is all these techy gadgety toys and stuff being used while doing anti corporation protests. They need to dump all electronics and such items and live directly off the land like they are recommending everyone do by getting rid of corporations. That means no tents, no coffeemakers, no Nike shoes, no laptops, no iphones, no electric stoves, etc.
and definitely nothing with a CARBON FOOTPRINT
Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
Originally posted by BravoBull
Thanks for the thoughtful response. My apologies for the caustic reply to the last post. I guess my ire was up from going through a few threads where posters of the fox news/rush limbaugh ilk were criticizing the demonstrators for not knowing what they were protesting about, no clear message, nothing will change, etc... Everyone is at different levels of awareness and our views will always be shaped by our experience and unfortunately the drivel that is spewed by the corporate media. Those people do not even recognize that en masse people are starting to awaken. They would disparage the movement as a "communist/socialist" plot. While I admit, there will be organizations in power and that want to maintain that power, who will try to channel this energy to their own purposes. Only time will tell if the OWP people will recognize this and refuse to be herded. But I won't denigrate the fact that America is starting to realize we are being led and controlled for the benefit of a few and not for the progress of humanity. Its a shame that the loudest voices in all of this are generally part of the problem and not interested in real fundamental change.
where did you come up with the last statement? if you're referring to the media, they're not "in" this at all. but i don't see myself surrounded with people who have to say things, without having things to say..
Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
Originally posted by pngxp
Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
I'm on scene with my macbook, flip camcorder, and nikon d60.
really? does anybody else see the completely unfunny irony of that right there? which seems to be oh so common amongst these protestors.
so youre their protesting corporate greed, loaded to the gills with corporate products. complaining about how we need to tax the rich more, while you are carrying a $1,000 laptop, a $500 camera and however much a flip camera cost?
seriously? and people cheer this sort of garbage on?
i work full time and eat ramen noodles 4 days a week because i dont want help from anybody, and especially not the government, and youre hanging out for days at a time with upwards of $1,500 of toys complaining about how youre not getting enough?
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUedit on 11-10-2011 by pngxp because: (no reason given)
and who the # said i bought the # on my own? think before you type because stupid assumptions make an ASS out of you..
and no, i'm not "their" I'm "there"...
get the # outta here..
Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by BravoBull
Actually, there are two important things to consider when looking at what I wrote there. First, my whole attitude toward Atlanta changed after watching several more hours of their group and having a few pieces of information clarified by the posts given by the OP on this thread.
Second though, was the fact that when I wrote that, I was with everyone else watching live as Atlanta Police Department was staging a massive force (given the number they would have been hitting) to apparently stomp the protesters every bit as much as Boston DID get it a bit later the same night.
So.... I suppose in hindsight, my comments deserved your response. On the other hand, take what I said here along with it. As a matter of fact, the events of Boston and coming to understand the Atlanta group a bit better by observing their GA and overall situation by the live streaming...I may just be in Atlanta Saturday. I'm still debating which direction I'm going to spend some time at one of these...but thus far, Atlanta is looking like one of the most promising for an organized and well grounded group of folks to be around for a bit of time.
People can change...and mindsets can evolve with new facts or perspectives. In this case, I got a lot of both.
Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine
I understood. So did Lewis. The look on his face cannot be taken out of context. He got the message. Parliamentary procedure at an protest! In my world Hero's are treated with dignity and you interrupt silly rituals to accommodate them if they are willing to support you. It was a mistake
I don't care for his politics but he deserved to be shown respect.
I'm curious here; can you give your message in detail? What exactly are you asking for as a group?
How many of you are there around the country? How do you coordinate and communicate?
How did you arrive at your platform and message?
United States
Confucius Institute in Atlanta [195]
Alfred University [196]
Arizona State University [197]
Bryant University [198]
Chinese Opera at SUNY at Binghampton [199]
Chicago Public Schools [200]
China Institute (New York) [201]
Cleveland State University [202]
Columbia University [203]
Community College of Denver [204]
George Mason University [205]
Indiana University-Purdue University Indianapolis (IUPUI) [206]
Kennesaw State University [207]
Miami Dade College [208]
Miami University in Ohio [209]
Michigan State University [210]
Middle Tennessee State University [211]
New Mexico State University [212]
North Carolina State University [213]
Pace University [214]
Pennsylvania State University [215]
Pfeiffer University [216]
Portland State University [217]
Presbyterian College [218]
Purdue University [219]
Rutgers University [220]
San Diego State University [221]
San Francisco State University [222]
State University of New York at Buffalo [223]
State of Washington [224]
State College of Optometry [225]
Stony Brook University [226]
Texas A & M University [227]
Troy University [228]
University of Akron [229]
University of Alaska Anchorage[230]
University of Arizona [231]
University of California, Los Angeles [232]
University of Central Arkansas [233]
University of Chicago [234]
University of Delaware [235]
University of Hawaii at Manoa (UHM-CI) [236]
University of Iowa [237]
University of Kansas [238]
University of Kentucky [239]
University of Maryland [240]
University of Massachusetts Boston [241]
University of Memphis [242]
University of Minnesota [243]
University of Montana [244]
University of Nebraska-Lincoln [245]
University of New Hampshire [246]
University of Oklahoma [247]
University of Oregon [248]
University of Pittsburgh [249]
University of Rhode Island [250]
University of South Carolina [251]
University of South Florida [245]
University of Texas at Dallas [246]
University of Texas at San Antonio [247]
University of Toledo [248]
University of Utah [249]
University of Wisconsin-Platteville [250]
Valparaiso University [251]
Wayne State University [252]
Webster University [253]
Western Kentucky University [254]
Western Michigan University [
above quoted from your first wiki link.
In politics, she condemned the initiation of force as immoral and opposed all forms of collectivism and statism, instead supporting laissez-faire capitalism, which she believed was the only social system that protected individual rights
Nonetheless she continues to have a popular following, and her political ideas have been influential among libertarians and some conservatives.
For politics, of course, arise, though the author of Atlas Shrugged stares stonily past them, as if this book were not what, in fact it is, essentially — a political book. And here begins mischief. Systems of philosophic materialism, so long as they merely circle outside this world's atmosphere, matter little to most of us. The trouble is that they keep coming down to earth. It is when a system of materialist ideas presumes to give positive answers to real problems of our real life that mischief starts. In a age like ours, in which a highly complex technological society is everywhere in a high state of instability, such answers however philosophic, translate quickly into political realities. And in the degree to which problems of complexity and instability are most bewildering to masses of men, a temptation sets in to let some species of Big Brother solve and supervise them.
One Big Brother is of course, a socializing elite (as we know, several cut-rate brands are on the shelves). Miss Rand, as the enemy of any socializing force, calls in a Big Brother of her own contriving to do battle with the other. In the name of free enterprise, therefore, she plumps for a technocratic elite (I find no more inclusive word than technocratic to bracket the industrial-financial-engineering caste she seems to have in mind). When she calls "productive achievement" man's "noblest activity," she means, almost exclusively, technological achievement, supervised by such a managerial political bureau. She might object that she means much, much more; and we can freely entertain her objections. But in sum, that is just what she means. For that is what, in reality, it works out to. And in reality, too, by contrast, with fiction, this can only head into a dictatorship, however benign, living and acting beyond good and evil, a law unto itself (as Miss Rand believes it should be), and feeling any restraint on itself as, in practice, criminal, and, in morals, vicious — as Miss Rand clearly feels it to be. Of course, Miss Rand nowhere calls for a dictatorship. I take her to be calling for an aristocracy of talents. We cannot labor here why, in the modern world, the pre-conditions for aristocracy, an organic growth, no longer exist, so that impulse toward aristocracy always emerges now in the form of dictatorship.
Originally posted by DarkStormCrow
I dont get the issue here, Atlanta parks have always been closed from 11pm to 6 am for like years now. Protesters can either clear the park and come back in the am or they can be arrested, and if they dont clear they should be arrested.
Originally posted by aivlas
Originally posted by DarkStormCrow
I dont get the issue here, Atlanta parks have always been closed from 11pm to 6 am for like years now. Protesters can either clear the park and come back in the am or they can be arrested, and if they dont clear they should be arrested.
Is this true? if so are you all now allowed to stay in them 24/7 or is that only for protesters?
Originally posted by JBA2848
reply to post by Honor93
She was very confusing picking pieces of different forms of governments and creating a fictional government that would never work. But it all sounded like Utopia to who ever heard it. That was the magic of creating a fictional Utopia and turning it into a propaganda type society that all could enjoy.
Any group or “collective,” large or small, is only a number of individuals. A group can have no rights other than the rights of its individual members. In a free society, the “rights” of any group are derived from the rights of its members through their voluntary, individual choice and contractual agreement, and are merely the application of these individual rights to a specific undertaking. Every legitimate group undertaking is based on the participants’ right of free association and free trade. (By “legitimate,” I mean: noncriminal and freely formed, that is, a group which no one was forced to join.)
For instance, the right of an industrial concern to engage in business is derived from the right of its owners to invest their money in a productive venture—from their right to hire employees—from the right of the employees to sell their services—from the right of all those involved to produce and to sell their products—from the right of the customers to buy (or not to buy) those products. Every link of this complex chain of contractual relationships rests on individual rights, individual choices, individual agreements. Every agreement is delimited, specified and subject to certain conditions, that is, dependent upon a mutual trade to mutual benefit.
This is true of all legitimate groups or associations in a free society: partnerships, business concerns, professional associations, labor unions (voluntary ones), political parties, etc. It applies also to all agency agreements: the right of one man to act for or represent another or others is derived from the rights of those he represents and is delegated to him by their voluntary choice, for a specific, delimited purpose—as in the case of a lawyer, a business representative, a labor union delegate, etc.
A group, as such, has no rights. A man can neither acquire new rights by joining a group nor lose the rights which he does possess. The principle of individual rights is the only moral base of all groups or associations.
Any group that does not recognize this principle is not an association, but a gang or a mob.
Any doctrine of group activities that does not recognize individual rights is a doctrine of mob rule or legalized lynching.