To all those who blame Obama.....here's the truth..

Originally posted by dethduck
The hell with Obama or Bush.
You want to point fingers, point them squarely at Congress that allows this to happen, if not encourages it.
Some serious housecleaning needs to go on there. Has for decades.

I COMPLETELY AGREE, Dethduck!

When we begin arresting our sitting Senators and Congressmen for accepting bribes and dirty money from these corporate lobbyists and their greedy agendas, THEN we will start to see some REAL CHANGE in Washington, DC, the most corrupt place on Planet Earth.

I TRULY want us to stop giving that wicked Halliburton ALL of our government contracts, and hold Dick Cheney responsible for the SERIOUSLY CRIMINAL "Conflict of Interest" that was demonstrated by he and his office of the Vice Presidency.

My goodness, it's all so clear to me. Right and Wrong. America seems to have lost its way AND its ability to measure this essential quality of leadership. The difference between good and evil.

reply to post by PurpleDog UK


Oh my God, you have no idea what you're talking about. Zero. I'm so sick of BS threads like this. No. The president doesn't set the budget. Congress does. The president can veto the US Federal budget but ultimately congress is the one writing it. That is how it works in the USA guys. Learn this simple fact.

Even if the president did control the budget, they are obviously just doing what their handlers tell them to do half the time. Clinton gets zero credit for the budget under him. Bush gets zero credit for the budget under him. And, Obama gets zero credit for the budget under him.

Obama's a particularly complete idiot when it comes to management of the economy in the highest degree, just like *all* Marxists are. Bush, by dumb luck of being raised as a Republican, is smarter on the other hand. But again, that does not matter because they don't do what they want to do. They do what other people tell them to do. Otherwise the first thing Bush Jr did in office wouldn't have been to install steel industry tariffs. Poet1b just got done telling me what a free-market hero Bush Jr was. No! He installed policies contrary to free-market economics.

These people in office are idiots on account they have no incentive to actually learn things or solve problems. They simply do what their economic advisers tell them to do, who in turn say what other people tell them to do. It isn't in their best interest to be smart or they'd turn out like Ron Paul. Obviously right, intelligent, and able to solve problems at the drop of a hat, but yet paradoxically "unelectable" because all his expertise is how to solve problems rather than lure in gullible idiot sheep suckers into voting for them using neat-o 30 second sound bites.

reply to post by Crapspackle
Ya I read it and I have read many more just like it all over the web everyday but when it started with ridacule and obvious hate from the left.............as usual it got to me,Note what I edited.

How does this concern you,I was replying to the OP?

reply to post by dolphinfan


Sorry to break it to you Dolphinfan,

But the Republican Party "IS" harming our country. This is so much like the Middle Eastern conflict in so many ways. Offer the Palestinians their homeland, and NO, they want EVERYTHING.

I see little difference.

Harming our Seniors with their medicare that they've worked so hard for, and the poor people on unemployment, who ALSO worked for those benefits, is not good or decent.

Let's stop the bribery by Corporate America, who's BUYING our Senatorial and Congressional votes, and penalize BOTH parties, and TRULY clean up Washington, or we will get nowhere on BOTH sides of the Political Agenda.

What an amazing time it had to have been, when our Congress could actually agree on SOMETHING!

reply to post by PurpleDog UK


So the world's largest advocate of TARP and bailouts (Obama in 2008) takes no responsibility for them? That goes in the Bush side of the graph? The Senate (which the newcomer Obama was the biggest mouth of in 2008) was responsible for funding TARP and bailouts. All Bush did was sign the bills.

But none of that will match the complete stupidity of Obamacare which the government can no more fund than they can now fund Social Security. We have 300 million dupes. They are called Americans. Greece does not have the same number of citizens but that is where we are headed with Obama. No question about it.

Originally posted by neo96
www.usdebtclock.org...


for those who arent living in reality and still try to blame bush while he was bad hes nothing near the level of obama bad.

that link is the current debt at the upper right is a little red arrow click it to 2008 when obama took over

and i am saying obama has not done this country any favors and has even been close to "fiscally conservative"

You just said the most ridiculous (and partisan) thing I have ever read.

Everyone knows Bush was worse... everyone.

Economists know, the CBO knows, former presidents know, the American Public knows, Presidential scholars know, Mathematicians know and people with common sense know.

Who helped usher in the Patriot Act?

Who helped deceive congress into the Iraq war?

Who stayed on vacation during Katrina?

Who took a surplus and threw it all away helping corporations like Haliburton on the backs and blood of our troops?

I mean I could go on and on.

You are out of line with your statement and I question if you live in reality or some weird paranoid state where you actually believe all liberals are socialist Nazis bent on destroying America.

3 seconds into this thread I realized it was Bush's fault. Ooops. That is Obama's only memorized speech. My bad.

Originally posted by whathasitcome2
3 seconds into this thread I realized it was Bush's fault. Ooops. That is Obama's only memorized speech. My bad.

No there are a lot of people to blame. Obama did bring up the fact that this is what we are dealing with post Bush Admin, which is honestly the truth.

Most people understand this and know this. Unfortunately, we live in a instant coffee society where people think you can save a disaster overnight.

If anything I think the Dems should have done other things that matter (besides universal health) to get the economy rolling. Instead they went after that huge thing and scared the public while doing it (even though 50% support it)

Oh well. All politicians are guilty of things, but the truth is we are in the mess because of the Bush administration.

reply to post by maceov


No they're not. Ultimately the very nature of the way our government runs is going to have to be blown up and rebuilt and those holding the line and not being willing to accept more of the same may in fact cause some short term pain, but in the long term are doing what is right.

The fallacy is that the programs you suggest need not be touched in the short-term at all. There is enough cash coming in to pay those bills and the Democrats are lying to suggest otherwise. Those programs need to be overhauled in the short term, but not today.

The big worry on both sides of the mainstream politicians is that if we get real honesty in budgeting and real transparency all of the corrupt practices, driven by special interests will be driven to the surface and their base of power eroded. Both sides are complicit and Obama, being new to politics and certainly not as beholden to the "Washington way" as most Presidents, had an opportunity to call BS on all of it. He did not do that because he is an ideologue and would not dream of seeing his social justice agenda exposed for the pork and special interest web that it is.

What is interesting is that through all of this not one single leader has come forward and suggested that the first thing that will be done is to eliminate every and all earmarks currently planned or in progress. Is that a lot of money? Not really, but it is certainly symbolic. Here you have political leaders working big deals when not a single one of them has offered up the pork going to their own districts. Put the kibosh on every one of them and to the extent that they do have legitimate merit, resubmit them once our fiscal house is in order.

Ultimately it will probably be best if they can not cut a deal and the government shuts down, the credit takes a hit and the crisis that will spur these jokers to legitimate action will come to pass.

Originally posted by dolphinfan
reply to post by maceov

 

Obama does not have leadership ability, period. He never was in a position where his leadership talents could be exercised, nor demonstrated. Now here we are.

We have a sharply divided country with representatives on both sides being held hostage by ideologues. To suggest that one side or the other should simply support the agenda of the other when it clearly runs counter to the views of their constitutents is absurd. Mitch McConnell is doing his job to support conservative policies, period. To the extent that he is required to frustrate the attempts of Obama to achieve his agenda, so be it - its his job to do so. Certainly not to harm the country in the process, but by a legitimate harms analysis it is quite easy to determine that doing nothing is less harmful than enacting certain policies, regardless of what they are and regardless of what side you're on. Sorry, Mr. Obama, but these are the big leagues and pushing Mitch McConnell around is a bit more difficult that pushing some Chicago ward boss around as a community organizer.

The congress opposed everything Reagan did as well. The media was also opposed to him. What did he do? He led. He ignored by in large the media and the congress and went on TV and talked to the American people. He turned their opinions and in turn got them to put pressure on congress. He largely got his agenda in the minds of the American people and made it their agenda. When you can do that, you've won and that is called leadership.

Obama should have, upon taking office, when the nightmare of the Bush administration was clearly not of his creating, communicated in facts, the reality of the situation. What the options were and what he proposed to do in specifics, not in teleprompted bromides. Candid, President to people, straight talk. He should have published plans, bills, proposals and executive orders to get the house in order. He should have placed public sunshine on the nonsense that occurs within the government on both sides and led our way out of it. He should have done it repeatedly. He should have in other words, done what Reagan did.

Instead he delegated the running of the government to Pelosi and Reid, two of the most reviled leaders in American politics. He went golfing and on vacation. He looked disengaged, above the petty business of governing. He looked (looks) petulant that folks are simply not doing what he wants. He has failed to lead and blaming the gent who was in office several years ain't working.

Now what is happening is becoming each day less of a left vs. right deal and more of a anti-government, throw them all out deal. When people become so frustrated that they are willing to accept terrible options to win on principal, such as shut the government down or default, the entire leadership class has failed.

Enough of the lies, enough of the accounting tricks, enough of seeking to craft bills that are designed so that each side can declare victory. This problem is not that difficult to solve. Its solved every day in every household, small business, large corporation and in most of the states in the country. You need to cut 5% off the total cost of government across the board? Easy. Cut it across the board. Not cut the rate of growth, cut it and make it work. If certain functions can't reasonably be cut by 5%, fine. Take a look at that after the plan to cut 5% has been submitted and explain to the American people why it can't and what the impact is and if its the case, then cut other things by 6-8% until you get to a place where the total cost of government is cut.

It ain't rocket science and the challenge is that we all know it and its become a game.

Allowing it to become a game is Obama's fault.

edit on 29-7-2011 by dolphinfan because: (no reason given)

I see Obama as just another grad student who hates the free market capitalism system.
They are running around all over the place.
--------------
Obama is doing everything he can to destroy the free market capitalism system so
he can replace it with a George Soros nightmare.
--------------
I can see the trap the liberals are throwing out there.
Label everything Speaker Boehner says - Dead on Arrival -.
They are praying for Speaker Boehner to lash back with "OK, anything Reid sends us is
dead on arrival."
Those magical words will send Obama to the nearest microphone to inform America
that he has just signed an executive presidential order to raise the debt limit by
$2.4 Trillion.

Yea. That's it. It is Bush's fault. We are only paying Obama to take exotic vacations to Egypt, Ireland, Brazil and India. He really has nothing at all to do with anything. He is just a cute little black guy from Chicago and hears nothing, has done nothing, and advocates nothing. It is all Bush's fault. High unemployment? Ahh humbug. Not true. Don't read that in the papers everyday. Unfunded liabilities with Obamacare (my bad, I mean Bushcare) don't worry about it mates the money will come from somewhere.

Get real. Man up. Obama has been a documented (for the first time in his life) failure for the past 3 years. He has controlled Congress for the first two of those years. Eligible to be president or not. Forged Birth Certificate or not. He has been a failure as a leader. Failed with the anti American speech in Egypt. Failed to get anything from Brazil on this trip there. Leaving Iraq with nothing. Accomplishing what? with this good war in Afghanistan? Bombing Libya and accomplishing zero there.

I mean really. Really? You call this immature document hoaxer a president? Is OBAMA also Bush's fault? LOL.

I like it. Obama is Bush's fault.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012


I see Obama as just another grad student who hates the free market capitalism system.
They are running around all over the place.
--------------
Obama is doing everything he can to destroy the free market capitalism system so
he can replace it with a George Soros nightmare.
--------------
I can see the trap the liberals are throwing out there.
Label everything Speaker Boehner says - Dead on Arrival -.
They are praying for Speaker Boehner to lash back with "OK, anything Reid sends us is
dead on arrival."
Those magical words will send Obama to the nearest microphone to inform America
that he has just signed an executive presidential order to raise the debt limit by
$2.4 Trillion.

Dude, you are out of touch with reality.

How many times was the ceiling raised under Reagan and Bush? Do you know?

So far it's been once under Obama.

There is no Liberal conspiracy. You are on crack and paranoid.

I mean what is the worst thing they will do? Support education? Stimulate the actual economy from the ground up rather than the top down (which doesn't work)

Pfft hates the free market, my @ss. Taxes haven't been this low in over 50 years.

Boehner's bill is not good for the economy, Wallstreet has said it and the CBO has already said it saves a whopping 2 billion (vs Reids 1.3 trillion)... talk about accounting tricks.

Socialism is a fear tactic and honestly the only fear mongers I see is the neo-cons.

Do the math. Read the bills and try (FFS) to learn something for once.

Originally posted by whathasitcome2
Yea. That's it. It is Bush's fault. We are only paying Obama to take exotic vacations to Egypt, Ireland, Brazil and India. He really has nothing at all to do with anything. He is just a cute little black guy from Chicago and hears nothing,

The expenses are a farce. Fox lied about the costs. Bush took plenty of vacations and the ones you mentioned were not vacations they were actual business in those countries. Why not bring up Rio? That was a vacation.

Anyways I think you hit the nail on the head when you had to mention is was black. No I am not playing the race card... you already did.

That is probably your issue and I am sorry, it is too hard to fix stupid so I wont bother trying.

reply to post by mudbeed


There is no liberal conspiracy???
So certain are you.
-----------
We need spending cuts. - Real spending cuts - No more smoke and mirrors.
The good news is that thanks to the Tea Party we have stopped talking about
raising taxes during a horrible economy that has slowed to 1.3% growth.
-----------
Now we are just arguing about how much to cut spending.
Deficit spending is addictive. They ALL need to go to rehab and then have a long
conversation with Dr. Phil.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by mudbeed

 

There is no liberal conspiracy???
So certain are you.

-----------
We need spending cuts. - Real spending cuts - No more smoke and mirrors.
The good news is that thanks to the Tea Party we have stopped talking about
raising taxes during a horrible economy that has slowed to 1.3% growth.
-----------
Now we are just arguing about how much to cut spending.
Deficit spending is addictive. They ALL need to go to rehab and then have a long
conversation with Dr. Phil.

1.3 trillion was real according to the CBO. That was a Dem lead plan and it also had revenues attached to it. Charging (so-called) job creators... which is also a lie BTW.

Yes I am certain there is no conspiracy.

The tea party is whats wrong in our politics, but I suppose you haven't paid attention to where it came from, what gave birth and how it all began. The tea party was a made up media created falsehood ( and no I don't mean the original teaparty... I mean the current one... the fake one)

All you need to do is read facts and numbers. See what economists think and try to avoid liberal or conservative leaning economists. See what Wallstreet says. It's all there in front of us.

I am not sticking up for liberals, or anyone else. I am sticking up for whats right. Reaping the rewards on the back of the old, sick and poor is not helping our country. These are the people we need to support to ensure an awesome free market society.

The late 90's are a testament to this, but not only that if you peer throughout history it's always been this way. Trickle down is non existant.

If you look at my responses to the original argument, ( reply #1 and reply #2 ), everyone would have noticed how the Democrats spun the argument. Even though Bush had contributed to this mess, Obama didn't do anything to address the problem. According to the CBO projections, Obama's policies will cost (10x) times more than Bush's. Don't believe me? Click through the links I provided.

Our overall argument is that government is on a spending binge. Democrats and Republicans, over the last eleven years, are guilty of fleecing America. Regardless about what side of the isle the politician is on, the new trend in Washington is to spend as much as possible. Social services, defense, pet projects, etc...

Obama is our currently elected president, so that means he should start taking some responsibility. Even though Bush had started certain policies, Obama signed an extension to many of them. Gitmo, Iraq War, Afghanistan War (expanded), TARP, etc... Obama had the ability to let them expire (or to end them), but he chose to continue them for the foreseeable future. Within some of these cases, Obama's inaction is just as bad as Bush's actions. Obama also followed Bush's footsteps by expanding the government. Obamacare is a monster government expansion, which mirrors Bush's Homeland Security expansion. Both men are guilty.

Fourth, everyone's problem with Obama is policy. Many people do not agree with his approach. Although they find Michelle Obama extremely attractive, arroooo, Barrack Obama is the 'current' cause of everyone's anxiety. Obamacare was voted on by a Democrat dominated congress. *shrugs* If you think about this rationally, the same exact thing happened during Bush's administration. We had a Republican dominated congress ram stuff down our necks, and we had a Democrat dominated congress ram stuff down our necks. While the political loyalists were yelling, 'Well... The other guy was able to do it", the undeclared and Independent voters were saying, "Do two wrongs make a right?" Do you know what the Democrat voters said, "Yes... Since you disagree with us, you are a racist, bigot, and hater." *shrugs* As an undeclared voter watching this, I feel as though the whole nation should just burn down. Since no one wants to take responsibility or act mature, why should I not agree with the radical idea of letting everything go to hell?

Republican and Democrat voters and politicians do not care if everyone else has to suffer.

*shrugs*

Unless the loyalist voters get a mind wipe, I see no reason why this country should remain united. We would have better luck with all 50 states becoming 50 separate nations.

Originally posted by PurpleDog UK
ps - this is my 100th Thread so I thought i'd make it an inflammatory one...

Congrats. PurpleDog UK created a thread with the intentional purpose to tick everyone off.

Originally posted by Section31

Originally posted by PurpleDog UK
ps - this is my 100th Thread so I thought i'd make it an inflammatory one...

Congrats. PurpleDog UK created a thread with the intentional purpose to tick everyone off.

Agreed.... this isn't cool no matter which opinion you have.

Originally posted by mudbeed

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by mudbeed

 

There is no liberal conspiracy???
So certain are you.

-----------
We need spending cuts. - Real spending cuts - No more smoke and mirrors.
The good news is that thanks to the Tea Party we have stopped talking about
raising taxes during a horrible economy that has slowed to 1.3% growth.
-----------
Now we are just arguing about how much to cut spending.
Deficit spending is addictive. They ALL need to go to rehab and then have a long
conversation with Dr. Phil.

1.3 trillion was real according to the CBO. That was a Dem lead plan and it also had revenues attached to it. Charging (so-called) job creators... which is also a lie BTW.

Yes I am certain there is no conspiracy.

The tea party is whats wrong in our politics, but I suppose you haven't paid attention to where it came from, what gave birth and how it all began. The tea party was a made up media created falsehood ( and no I don't mean the original teaparty... I mean the current one... the fake one)

All you need to do is read facts and numbers. See what economists think and try to avoid liberal or conservative leaning economists. See what Wallstreet says. It's all there in front of us.

I am not sticking up for liberals, or anyone else. I am sticking up for whats right. Reaping the rewards on the back of the old, sick and poor is not helping our country. These are the people we need to support to ensure an awesome free market society.

The late 90's are a testament to this, but not only that if you peer throughout history it's always been this way. Trickle down is non existant.

edit on 7/29/2011 by mudbeed because: (no reason given)

The Tea Party is the only thing right in America.
Just look at the ripple effects of their actions.
Taxed
Enough
Already
Raising taxes is now off the table. - Thank you Tea Party -
All the Tea Party wants is a - real - austerity plan put in place here in the USA.
Other nations have passed real austerity plans. Why can't we???
-----------
The Tea Party members in Washington DC are the - only - adults at the table.
The gross debt to GDP ratio is a nightmare.
We can't kick the can down the road anymore. We are at the end of the road.
The time has arrived to
1 - Grow the GDP to $18 Trillion
2 - Cut spending - reduce the size of the U.S. government
3 - Give our children a stronger USA not a weaker USA
4 - Find a way to reduce the size of the national debt from $14.3 Trillion down to
$9.5 Trillion. - Take 10 years to do it -

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
The Tea Party is the only thing right in America.
Just look at the ripple effects of their actions.
Taxed
Enough
Already
Raising taxes is now off the table. - Thank you Tea Party -

Yeah considering that the only ones getting screwed are the lower and middle class. This TEA is a joke.

Taxed enough already? Where were you when taxes weren't the lowest they have ever been since the 1950's

The tea party you are referencing do not exist in modern day.

You are referencing a farce neo-con tea party.

Do you make more than a million a year? I didn't think so.

In order to fix this debt mess, the government has to do the following:
(1) Cut spending.
(2) Reduce the size of government.
(3) Raise taxes slightly.
(4) Put the surplus generated from revenue (taxes) onto the principle of our debt.

Ronald Reagen (r), George Bush (r), and Bill Clinton (d) were centralist politicians.

Even though I didn't like seeing the Clinton scandal, he was one of our last 'centralist' politicians. We are a better nation with a centralist than a loyalist. Everyone wins and everyone loses.