Lets not end Illegal immigration, let the supporters pay for it.

I could make this simple. A law that requires the bleeding hearts to register online to have some of their pay deducted from their check to help illegal immigrants. Lets say a 10% gross pay deduction each pay check. This fee will go to support illegals and pay their emergency room visits, food stamps, etc. It will also go toward paying to have text books and signs written in Spanish. Some of this money will also go toward financial aid for college. The rest of us who do not support ILLEGAL immigration will be assured none of our taxes go toward anyone in this country illegally.

Also in the event a illegal can not find a job their will be a program where said illegal can register and take 15 hours a week doing the job of one of the supporters if said illegal can perform job. Of course for those 15 hours only the illegal will be paid and not the person who is sharing the hours.

This way everyone is happy.


Do not come in here spouting racism, xenophobia or attempt at making straw man arguments. If you truly support illegal immigration here is your chance. Put your money where your mouth is.

Would you sign up? A simple yes or no will suffice.

Not to be taking seriously but to make a point that this is basically what supporters are asking us to do.

What?

You're asking the people that favor or feel sorry for illegals to actually abide by the same laws and rules they expect the rest of us to follow?

i wouldnt support anything the govermental law tells me too.

Il just give money to the local community who supports immigrants. Just like a homeless shelter you go their voluntarily. IF you give money to the Gov you never know where it really goes. If you wanna give more money to the Gov go ahead.

Doesnt this already happen through taxation?

All you are asking is to have people "voluntairly" donate money and no one would do that except for the select few who actually make a profit of of Illegals. I think most people just want a cause to get behind, they dont want to have to sacrafice for said cause.

I say no and just execute upon the heavy laws that are on the book. At the end of the day, the laws are on the books, the Gov just doesnt follow through with said legislation.

JMO

That would be a fail...only legal immigration should take place, and i think it should be the way the ozzys have it..with a point system.

reply to post by armtx


Of course thread is in jest but its more of a thread to point out this is actually what supporters are asking us to do..

Nobody supports illegal immigration. (Except for illegal immigrants themselves and a very small fringe of radicals).

What the "bleeding hearts" support is a reasonable solution to the problem.

The 'deport them all' strategy is a logistical impossibility, securing the border to the point that absolutely no one can get through is a logistical impossibility, and the idea that a country as large as the United States will ever be completely free from illegal immigration is downright foolish.

The best option, in my opinion, is a combination of stronger border security, increased penalties for the employers of illegal immigrants, fostering better economic developments in Mexico and other countries where large numbers of illegal immigrants are sourced, and full-scale immigration reform.

The problem with illegal immigrants is that they are illegal.

They need to be processed, given a tax id, and fall under lawful rules of employment. the faster they are "on the books", the faster they qualify for wage standards and taxing, the faster companys will stop using slave labor wages of the illegals and start using competitive wages..for now, they (illegals) work for nothing and therefore take loads of jobs away from legal citizens simply because they will work for 20 bucks a day or whatnot. 20 people living in a camper trailer hiding from the law.

I would support, and gladly sacrifice some of my wages for, a system to rapidly get illegals to legal status, understanding of basic english, and some minor skilled labor training. this would enhance the economy and return us to competing for good jobs verses having a citizen try to compete with someone willing to sell themselves into slavery.

As far as signs and all that crap...naa, english is the national language (however, I do think we as a people should learn a second language also..spanish seems reasonable considering thats the common toungue with our southern neighbors)...however, english first.

Bleeding hearts? how very 1992 of you. heh

Let's not pay for healthcare unless you are sick, let's not pay road taxes unless you have a car, let's not pay for school taxes unless you have children, let's not pay for war if we don't agree with it.

Let's wait till you are the one that needs help before, maybe helping you.
Selfish egocentric!
Go live on a deserted island, at least you will be a self made man that doesn't give anything he makes and that doesn't get anything from anyone.

Since businesses are one of the prime consumers and advocates of illegal labor, not the bleeding hearts, how are you going to "make them pay for it?"

They will just pass the costs off to consumers and escape their "fine" that way.

reply to post by ker2010


Nobody supports "illegal immigration" - We all want to reform it. The problem is unfortunately ignorant people like you who don't have any desire to really reform immigration in a meaningful way.

The illegals here will never all be deported. Deal with it. Move on and try to find a constructive solution. There is no Democrat or Republican candidate who will commit US troops to rounding up the millions and millions of immigrants in the US.

We are not going to put automated turrets along the border or pass "kill on sight" laws. Deal with it. Find a better solution.

It's people like you that make illegal immigration a problem in the first place. If we actually were able to implement real reforms and make immigration easier, then the illegal problem would go away and we would be able to appropriately track our immigration. As it is, there are too many naive Americans who fear some kind of "brown" wave and believe that human migration is somehow stoppable that real reform will be impossible until demographic changes marginalize you to the point of obscurity.

Look for this to happen over the next decade as all of those scary anchor babies who are citizens begin to go more and more into the voting pool. You want to know what the future looks like? Just look to California, Colorado, and Nevada. Even in an amazing Republican year like 2010, they couldn't dominate those states. Expect that situation to happen more and more frequently as the old angry faux Tea Party faction of the Republican wing begins to die out and is replaced by a multi-cultural and firmly to the left generation of Americans.

There really just isn't anything you can do about it. At the very worst the status quo will be maintained.

reply to post by ker2010


I would support it. I am a "bleeding heart" as you so kindly mention in your OP. It makes more sense to me as a human being that I would want to help my fellow human beings in providing them with basic needs. For me it's just common sense that we would have a system in place which supports all of our basic needs. But we don't.

Ideally, In my humble opinion, we would all chip in enough so that half the world doesn't have to starve, live in filth, watch their children die because they don't have any money.

In other words, I would love to see our "basic needs" (food, healthcare, housing, etc) be socialized while everything else remains capitalized. But I understand that until most of the population desires the same thing, it's not possible because it would have to be enforced. But one can dream.

However, the republicans and tea party have overplayed their hands so badly since the midterm that I wouldn't be surprised if the demo's enjoy real power in 2012. Mix in a new economic collapse coupled with public outcry demanding economic reform...the dream may be realized sooner rather than later.

Fining CEOs only means that everybody will end up paying for it.
In many countries like mine, it is illegal to hire illegals, yet, no boss has ever been sent to jail for it.
Illegals come to our contries to find jobs, who gives jobs ?

So, agreed with the OP, let's make the profiters / supporters pay for it and get the jail time they've been deserving for a long time.

mob rule ftw

Originally posted by Avenginggecko
reply to post by ker2010

 

Nobody supports "illegal immigration" - We all want to reform it. The problem is unfortunately ignorant people like you who don't have any desire to really reform immigration in a meaningful way.

The illegals here will never all be deported. Deal with it. Move on and try to find a constructive solution. There is no Democrat or Republican candidate who will commit US troops to rounding up the millions and millions of immigrants in the US.

We are not going to put automated turrets along the border or pass "kill on sight" laws. Deal with it. Find a better solution.

It's people like you that make illegal immigration a problem in the first place. If we actually were able to implement real reforms and make immigration easier, then the illegal problem would go away and we would be able to appropriately track our immigration. As it is, there are too many naive Americans who fear some kind of "brown" wave and believe that human migration is somehow stoppable that real reform will be impossible until demographic changes marginalize you to the point of obscurity.

Look for this to happen over the next decade as all of those scary anchor babies who are citizens begin to go more and more into the voting pool. You want to know what the future looks like? Just look to California, Colorado, and Nevada. Even in an amazing Republican year like 2010, they couldn't dominate those states. Expect that situation to happen more and more frequently as the old angry faux Tea Party faction of the Republican wing begins to die out and is replaced by a multi-cultural and firmly to the left generation of Americans.

There really just isn't anything you can do about it. At the very worst the status quo will be maintained.

There is a better solution Fine the company's who employ them. Enforce the laws already in the books. No one fears a brown wave. Their goes the race argument right on que. Every country has immigration laws most are quite a bit harsher than that of Americas.

reply to post by Chrysalis


I agree, only actual physical jail time for those who hire illegals will do anything to solve the problem.

Originally posted by brianmg5
reply to post by ker2010

 

I would support it. I am a "bleeding heart" as you so kindly mention in your OP. It makes more sense to me as a human being that I would want to help my fellow human beings in providing them with basic needs. For me it's just common sense that we would have a system in place which supports all of our basic needs. But we don't.

Ideally, In my humble opinion, we would all chip in enough so that half the world doesn't have to starve, live in filth, watch their children die because they don't have any money.

In other words, I would love to see our "basic needs" (food, healthcare, housing, etc) be socialized while everything else remains capitalized. But I understand that until most of the population desires the same thing, it's not possible because it would have to be enforced. But one can dream.

However, the republicans and tea party have overplayed their hands so badly since the midterm that I wouldn't be surprised if the demo's enjoy real power in 2012. Mix in a new economic collapse coupled with public outcry demanding economic reform...the dream may be realized sooner rather than later.

Cool beans. So out of the close to a billion starving people in the world how do we choose who comes over since we cant accept them all who gets the benefit of coming over? Who do we deem special? Would it not make more sense for their own country's to be fixed? Hmmmm Save a few million by bringing them here or save them all by fixing their place of citizenship?

reply to post by ker2010


You hardly speak English yourself and probably think that Craplish is the official language of the US of A. Well buddy I got news for you, there is no official language in the US of A.

Besides that you're all illegal immigrants at least that what I heard last time I was chilling with a Navajo buddy of mine.

Stop wining, look for a job or get some education and don't blame some poor people for your own misery.
So much you can get from someones words, I should've worked for the Feds

reply to post by ker2010


I guess I went a bit off topic there because I didn't mean to imply that they would come here. I meant that the world would cooperate with each other. I suppose I should have kept my post to just Americans and their basic needs.

reply to post by ker2010


Complete BS. You can't possibly be sitting there with a straight face and say that the opposition to illegal immigration has nothing to do with race. Race plays a huge factor in the opposition to any kind of immigration reform.

Just because you prefaced this thread with, "Oh btw nobody can pull the race card because I say so! Neener neener!" doesn't change the fact that race plays a role. Maybe not with you, but with a lot of people. I live in Texas and deal with rural citizens and people close to the border, and trust me race is a big part of their "Round 'em up or shoot 'em!" mentality.

Forcing companies to pay fines is unrealistic as well considering the cost to the government in increase in size and bureaucracy would definitely outweigh any fines levied against the business. These businesses are either too big and have too much influence, or represent far too many small business owners to be effective. Are you going to start hiring immigration agents to knock on every door in every suburban neighborhood and start auditing their housekeepers? Gardeners?

When you begin to look at the logistics, money, and manpower required to do these "simple" things, you begin to see why it is never going to happen and why people don't really take those things seriously as reform.

The illegal immigration war was lost a long time ago. It can never be stopped. The hispanic population far outweighs the caucasian population under the age of 18. If you really want to fix illegal immigration, you have to start looking beyond unrealistic punishments by finding the root cause of the problem.