In Alabama, a Harsh Bill for Residents Here Illegally

In Alabama, a Harsh Bill for Residents Here Illegally

www.nytimes.com

Alabama has passed a sweeping bill to crack down on illegal immigrants that both supporters and opponents call the toughest of its kind in the country, going well beyond a law Arizona passed last year that caused a furor there.

(visit the link for the full news article)

About freaking time! DC needs to pay attention and follow suit! Violates the Constitution my ass, they are not legal residents if this country, therefore they are not covered by it. International law should prevail! People need to start picketing these pro illegal immigrant organizations. Which part of illegal don;t you get? Deport them ALL!

www.nytimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

While I agree that any person here illegally, is in fact here illegally, they still have some form of rights here.
But, that does not negate the issue of criminality. They broke federal law by there action of coming here illegally. They should be held accountable.
All those that harbor them should be held accountable. This includes those that employee them.
If you should not be doing something and are caught, then pay the price.

I am glad America finally starts to join the rest of the developed and developing world in anti illegal immigration laws. I could not believe it when I first learned that the police in USA do not have any simple, fast and legal way or right to determine whether someone is an illegal or not if there is a suspicion he is (such as universal citizen ID), or that knowingly hiding, employing or transporting an illegal immigrant is not even a crime. If we had laws like this in Slovakia (and such leaky border) we would be overrun by human trafickers and drug dealers from Ukraine in no time.

That was one of the few benefits of EU - since our border with Ukraine became Shengen space border to the whole EU, EU ansured it was properly protected (that was one of the conditions to join it), even giving us donations to install advanced scanners, cameras and such.
This resulted in measurable crime decrease along the border region.

Yes it is about time. There are places in Alabama that have been completely taken over by illegals. Someone has to have the guts to stand up for their citizens. The states need to stand together in this fight, the fed will try to stop them. A lot of pressure will be put on the Alabama legislature by DC. When Alabama voted for McCain in the last election, the state was punished by the new administration. Two large government contracts worth billions of dollars were given to other states It's how the fed works by threatening people's money.

It's about time! I only wish other states fall in line and do what our Federal law has failed to do. I have no issue with foreigners coming to the U.S. and working, just have a legit green card. I used to work with a guy from India and he even felt it was unfair that he had to go through the proper channels (payed his dues) to come to the U.S. and work, but others just cross our border illegally, get a job, get paid and suffer no consequences for not holding a green card.

If you want to take advantage of the "American Dream" (what's left of it)... pay your dues like everyone else that holds a Green Card!

Anchor babies and they are here to stay. And guess who doesn't pay taxes to pay for all the social services they receive. Get them before it happens. Last I checked you had to carry ID if you are an adult in this country and it has to be presented when asked for, so what's the big deal?
I hear how sad it is that they just want something better, but what about the other billions that can't just live so close by that they can get here easily...
It's like working hard and applying to get into a good university. You bust your butt to get in... but what if a whole bunch of people just sign up and enroll without going through that same process or following the rules? Class sizes explode and the people who worked hard to get in see people who did nothing but enroll. Tuition increases to compensate. Same thing different scenario but replace tuition with taxes.

reply to post by haarvik


The only reason the president and the justice department in DC are so "easy" on the immigration issues is because they have to have the Mexican vote in order to win. The more that jump, is the more votes for Obama, in his eyes anyways.

Originally posted by macman
While I agree that any person here illegally, is in fact here illegally, they still have some form of rights here.

Correct, they have the right to miranda, they have the right to an attorney if they cannot afford one themselves and they have the right to decent treatment while a 'guest' in our justice system

But, that does not negate the issue of criminality. They broke federal law by there action of coming here illegally. They should be held accountable.
All those that harbor them should be held accountable. This includes those that employee them.
If you should not be doing something and are caught, then pay the price.

I concur. I applauded AZ when they attempted to quell the wave of illegals coming across their borders, as I now do with AL. The problem is that the Federal Government fails to enforce their own laws on illegal immigration while slapping down the states who try to enact the same laws. So much for states rights, eh?

Just as an aside here, has anyone taken the time to read Mexican immigration laws as it pertains to illegals coming across their border? It is a very very interesting read...... here is a Washington Times article that sums it up.

Under the Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony, punishable by up to two years in prison. Immigrants who are deported and attempt to re-enter can be imprisoned for 10 years. Visa violators can be sentenced to six-year terms. Mexicans who help illegal immigrants are considered criminals

Washington Times Source Article

What I found so ironic is that Mexico's president has the stones to accuse the US of discrimination when our states take the matter into their own hands, yet would treat an illegal on their soil much worse than they would ever be treated here. Go figure...............

People who think more immigration laws will fix anything really amaze me.

Can't you see the root issue here? You're afraid so called illegals are going to take your resources. Thus, the issue is one of scarcity, a technical problem not a political or legal one.

You are fed this false idea that there isn't enough for everyone, so we "have to" have borders, laws, money, property, police, most jobs, judges... All 300 year old thinking (at least)...

Today we have the technological means to provide resources efficiently for everyone; our social & political systems today are extremely wasteful & provably ineffective. Your being lied to about this to keep the machine of differential advantage going. Ask yourself this; when has a politician ever tangibly helped build a school or a bridge or eliminated hunger in a community?

Isn't it time we grew up as a species & demanded more from each other and effectively eliminate scarcity in our societies? If not now, then when?

We are ONE planet; why don't you do your part to evolve our species?

Originally posted by JosephMatthew
People who think more immigration laws will fix anything really amaze me.

Can't you see the root issue here? You're afraid so called illegals are going to take your resources. Thus, the issue is one of scarcity, a technical problem not a political or legal one.

You are fed this false idea that there isn't enough for everyone, so we "have to" have borders, laws, money, property, police, most jobs, judges... All 300 year old thinking (at least)...

Today we have the technological means to provide resources efficiently for everyone; our social & political systems today are extremely wasteful & provably ineffective. Your being lied to about this to keep the machine of differential advantage going. Ask yourself this; when has a politician ever tangibly helped build a school or a bridge or eliminated hunger in a community?

Isn't it time we grew up as a species & demanded more from each other and effectively eliminate scarcity in our societies? If not now, then when?

We are ONE planet; why don't you do your part to evolve our species?

If you want to share your resources with people that entered here illegally, then by all means, open your home and wallet.
Don't expect others to follow suite because you say so via guilt trip.

They are here illegally and should be charged when found and deported, as per Federal Law. Since the Fed Govt would rather ignore the law, then the States have to step in and do the work for them.

This One World crap does one thing for me,

I am a US citizen, and have to follow US law. Illegals need to as well.

And further more, in the age old idea of most, if the Fed Govt would enforce the current law, then new laws would not need to be created.



For you.

THEN...

Big business in the U.S. also played a role in diverting Latin American migration streams to the southern states. Many large firms, such as poultry giants Tyson and Gold Kist, recruited The migration of Hispanics to Alabama has stimulated Making Tamales Hispanics to work in chicken-processing plants in Alabama. In the late 1990s, a huge billboard in Tijuana, Mexico, sponsored by Gold Kist, offered a promising future. Its message: "Mucho Trabajo en [Much Work in] Russellville, Alabama," followed by a local labor recruiter's telephone number. Freelance recruiters along the border in Mexico and Texas regularly bused willing Hispanic workers directly to jobs in Alabama plants. In addition, corporate recruitment and the expansive service economy in southern states and Sun Belt cities have helped to divert this migration stream to places that never experienced much immigration in the past, including Alabama.

source

NOW...

“This is a jobs-creation bill for Americans,” said Representative Micky Hammon, a Republican who was a chief sponsor of the bill. “We really want to prevent illegal immigrants from coming to Alabama and to prevent those who are here from putting down roots,” he said.

Mr. Hammon, where were you when Alabama businesses were hiring illegal workers? I guess illegal workers were good for keeping wages down for local American labor when the economy was good, but now the economy is horrible and you can help business get rid of excess labor in the workforce. A deal as sweet as sweet tea, Mr. Hammon. Just make sure your business buddies don't hire back illegal workers in the future.

reply to post by desert


Sounds like you have just zoomed out and found the bigger picture. Good job.

reply to post by macman


It's not about guilt, it's about responsibility to your fellow human beings. Look around you... More division (the heart of the immigration issue and many other social issues) is killing our ability to survive on this planet. The writing is on the wall it has become so evident.

I can tell you're the type of person who cannot imagine a life without police, without laws, without money, without being told what to do, without war. That is due to your values and the lies you were raised on (like "there isn't enough for everyone" & "borders are necessary"). You believe all of this nonsense because of fear...

Simply, you're afraid of a world where you don't have someone to hate.

I thought ATS members were smarter than this...

If we want to solve illegal immigration, we need to look at the core issues (see my post above); NOT perpetuate outdated notions of society where division & differential advantage go hand-in-hand with crime, poverty, war.

The fear mongers don't decide how life is; we've let such proponents run amok for too long.

Simply, the type of thinking you are pushing is holding our species back from evolving. Please stop.

Originally posted by JosephMatthew
reply to post by macman

 

It's not about guilt, it's about responsibility to your fellow human beings. Look around you... More division (the heart of the immigration issue and many.other social issues) is killing our ability to survive on this planet. The writing is on the wall it has become so evident.

I can tell you're the type of person who cannot imagine a life without police, without laws, without money, without being told what to do, without war. That is due to your values and the lies you were raised on (like there isn't enough for everyone" & "borders are necessary"). You believe all of this nonsense because of fear...

Simply, you're afraid of a world where you don't have someone to hate.

I thought ATS members were smarter than this...

If we want to solve illegal immigration, we need to look at the core issues (see my post above); NOT perpetuate outdated notions of society where division & differential advantage go hand-in-hand with crime, poverty, war.

But the fear mongers don't decide how life is; we've let such proponents run amok.

Simply, the type of thinking your pushing is holding our species back from evolving.

Love your assumptions NOOBIE. Yes, you joined in 09, yet 6 posts. Lurker.

As you know nothing about me nor my stance on other issues, aside from this, allow me to retort.

I hate nothing but the idea that I am responsible for you or others, especially ones that are here illegally.
I am responsible for myself and my family, period.
If you want to provide for them, open your wallet and quit complaining. Unless, you are above your own suggestion.

I have no hatred towards people, groups or persons.
I don't really care what you do with your property. Save it, piss it away, give it to the homeless or lock it up. It's yours to do with.
Just like your last statement, your logic is wrong.

reply to post by kellynap43


That is more myths being perpetrated. I know a lot of hispanics personally. Thosel that I have spoken to are disgruntled about the illegals. They feel that they are getting a bad reputation by the things that are going on. Many have family roots in this country for generations. They are being affected like any other American in regards to unemployment and low wages. They are being harrassed by people thinking they are illegal. When they had not been exposed to this until recently. I was told by one that nobody hates the illegasl Mexicans more than they do. It has made their life pure hell.

reply to post by macman


Your anger & name calling only proves my point.

I can make the claims i do because they are evident in your text. From your contributions on this topic, it is very clear you were raised with values that justify murderers killing people (military), and "more for me & mine, to hell with the rest of you" (division & differential advantage).

You can say you "don't hate" all day long, you can try to draw lines in the sand, but at the end of the day, you refuse to look at the root causes here. We both know why... It is because you are afraid...

Afraid that if you did, you would lose that so-comfortable feeling you get from punishing others for not having the same values as you. Just because people like you made a law about it doesn't make it just or necessary.

I'm here to say, your attitude is killing our ability to live on our planet. Please stop.

There is no such thing as illegal immigration; we are ONE planet. Effectively solve the root cause (resource scarcity), and you solve illegal immigration. Any other focus is just a waste of time.


And since this discussion is going nowhere, am ending this with a quote:
"Being well adjusted to a profoundly sick society is no measure of health." -Krishnamurti

Know this: Even though we disagree, I love you.

Illegals are committing a crime by being here, and therefore, as criminals, they deserve to be punished. I also like the following quote from the article:

“This is a jobs-creation bill for Americans,” said Representative Micky Hammon, a Republican who was a chief sponsor of the bill. “We really want to prevent illegal immigrants from coming to Alabama and to prevent those who are here from putting down roots,” he said.

Sounds GOOD to me for the LEGAL folks of Alabama!!

Legal folks SHOULD be REWARDED, and CRIMINALS need to be PUNISHED!!!

Why is this SO HARD to see??? WHY?

Originally posted by macman

Originally posted by JosephMatthew
People who think more immigration laws will fix anything really amaze me.

Can't you see the root issue here? You're afraid so called illegals are going to take your resources. Thus, the issue is one of scarcity, a technical problem not a political or legal one.

You are fed this false idea that there isn't enough for everyone, so we "have to" have borders, laws, money, property, police, most jobs, judges... All 300 year old thinking (at least)...

Today we have the technological means to provide resources efficiently for everyone; our social & political systems today are extremely wasteful & provably ineffective. Your being lied to about this to keep the machine of differential advantage going. Ask yourself this; when has a politician ever tangibly helped build a school or a bridge or eliminated hunger in a community?

Isn't it time we grew up as a species & demanded more from each other and effectively eliminate scarcity in our societies? If not now, then when?

We are ONE planet; why don't you do your part to evolve our species?

If you want to share your resources with people that entered here illegally, then by all means, open your home and wallet.
Don't expect others to follow suite because you say so via guilt trip.

They are here illegally and should be charged when found and deported, as per Federal Law. Since the Fed Govt would rather ignore the law, then the States have to step in and do the work for them.

This One World crap does one thing for me,

I am a US citizen, and have to follow US law. Illegals need to as well.

And further more, in the age old idea of most, if the Fed Govt would enforce the current law, then new laws would not need to be created.

For you.

The point is that the problems you are trying to fight don't actually have anything to do with immigration.

You have been manipulated by the media.

Originally posted by JosephMatthew
reply to post by macman

 

Your anger & name calling only proves my point.

I can make the claims i do because they are evident in your text. From your contributions on this topic, it is very clear you were raised with values that justify murderers killing people (military), and "more for me & mine, to hell with the rest of you" (division & differential advantage).

You can say you "don't hate" all day long, you can try to draw lines in the sand, but at the end of the day, you refuse to look at the root causes here. We both know why... It is because you are afraid...

Afraid that if you did, you would lose that so-comfortable feeling you get from punishing others for not having the same values as you. Just because people like you made a law about it doesn't make it just or necessary.

I'm here to say, your attitude is killing our ability to live on our planet. Please stop.

There is no such thing as illegal immigration; we are ONE planet. Effectively solve the root cause (resource scarcity), and you solve illegal immigration. Any other focus is just a waste of time.


And since this discussion is going nowhere, am ending this with a quote:
"Being well adjusted to a profoundly sick society is no measure of health." -Krishnamurti

Know this: Even though we disagree, I love you.

Yeah yeah yeah, blah blah blah. Same one world crap pitched over and over.
You can keep it. No amount of quotes do anything except show that you can find and post quotes.
Again, I get angry when people like you think that I and others need to carry the weight for all. Or, how about those that come across high and mighty with a smile on their face. Still high and mighty.

If you want them here, open you home and wallet. You still can't own up to that. But, like most, you want everyone else to do it, because you have become one with the earth or think that the US is unfair.
Typical do as I say, not as I do.
Sorry but I fear very little in life, let alone man.

See, here is the other flaw that you have. You want everyone to adapt to your point of view over their own. How very heart warming.
So instead of charging with a knife from the front, you sneak from the back.