Psychosis: Mental Illness or Spiritual Awakening?

Psychotic Symptoms Relating to Schizophrenia

A – Characteristic symptoms - *two or more of the following, one month, less if treated:
1. Delusions
2. Hallucinations
3. Disorganized Speech
4. Disorganized or Catatonic Behavior
5. Negative symptoms
B – Social/Occupations Dysfunction
*One or more areas of functioning, work, self care or interpersonal relationship.
C – Duration
- continuous signs of disturbance for six months
- Continuous criteria for a month, less if treated
- May also include Prodromal / residual symptoms
DSM-IV TR
Schizoaffective Disorder – Case Study
26 year old female bank officer
- No relevant family, past or medical history
- Separated from husband for 4 months
- Brother was jailed a month ago.
- Moved in with her parents a month ago.
- Gradual deterioration in her functioning.
- Found in a “confused” state in a railway station.
- Agitated, hallucinating with marked thought disorder
- Voices making comments about her.
- Command hallucinations to kill herself.
- Hospitalized and treated with antipsychotics.
- Discharged c/o mother with follow up.
- Readmitted after 6 months.
- Anxiety, insomnia and auditory hallucinations.
- Convinced mother was going to hurt her.
- TV is controlling her, others can read her mind.
- Also, prominent manic symptoms for 3 wks.
- Shopping sprees, not sleeping, pacing for much of the night.
- Convinced that God, too, was talking to her.
- Someone was touching and arousing her sexuality.
- Hardly slept for 3 nights prior to admission.
- Hyperactive, disruptive, excites and irritable.
- Hypersexual, convinced she would heal everyone.
- Treated with Fluphenazine & Lico3.
- Improved within the next 6 months.
DSM-IV-TR

Spontaneous Kundalini Awakening Symptoms
1. Pranic movements or kriyas; ‘Prana is the Hindu word for vital energy. Thus as intense energy moves through the body and clears out physiological blocks, a person may experience intense involuntary, jerking movements of the body, including shaking, vibrations, spasm and contraction.’

2. Yogic Phenomena; ‘Some people find themselves performing yogic postures or hand mudra gestures which they have never learned or could not do in a normal state of consciousness. Similarly, they may produce Sanskrit words or sounds, or have an awareness of inner music or sound, mantras or tones.’

3. Physiological Symptoms; ‘...often generates unusual physiological activity as intense movement of energy releases toxins in the body. Symptoms include apparent heart problems, pains in head and spine, gastrointestinal disturbances and nervous problems. Internal sensations have been reported as sensations of burning, oversensitivity to sensory input, hyperactivity or lethargy,...’

4.Psychological Upheaval; ‘...a direct challenge to the primacy of ego consciousness and the myth of separation. It brings with it a challenge to move beyond the unconscious responses ruled by drives and instincts and remove ego consciousness from the centre stage of the psyche. It comes as no surprise that such a challenge produces a period of confusion and unbalance. People find themselves beset by inexplicable emotional states as they move to clear out unresolved issues. The emotional roller coaster may swing from feelings of anxiety, guilt and depression, through to compassion, love and joy, with accompanying bouts of uncontrollable weeping.’

5. Extra Sensory Experiences; ‘As perception expands outside of consensus reality, people experience atypical visual phenomena, including visions of lights, symbols, entities, or review of past life experiences. Auditory input may include hearing voices, music, inner sounds or mantras. Even the olfactory system may be stimulated with perception of scents of sandalwood, rose or incense. There may also be disruption of the proprioceptive system, with losing a sense of self as a body, or feeling bigger than the body, or out of the body, with the resulting confusion and disorientation.’

6. Psychic Phenomena; ‘With the opening up of psychic abilities, a person may experience precognition, telepathy, psychokinesis, awareness of auras and healing abilities.’

7. Mystical States of Consciousness; ‘A person may shift into altered states of consciousness where they directly perceive the unity underlying the world of separation and experience a deep peace and serenity with a profound knowing of wisdom. In some cases, the state of emergency due to psychological upheaval is so acute that it resembles a psychotic episode. Many clinicians still regard phenomena associated with spiritual emergence as indicative of pathology because the signs are so easily confused with the indicators of psychosis, mania, depression, schizophrenia or borderline personality disorder. Many people undergoing spiritual emergency are misdiagnosed and treated with suppressive medication which further complicates their process.'
SOURCE

Language is such a curse to us sometimes. Here’s the symptom list for a psilocybin trip.

‘At low doses, mushrooms induce a tingling body feeling and sense of euphoria and lightness. You may feel happy and giggly. Colors seem more vibrant, music sounds richer.
Simply put, it alters and expands consciousness by loosening or -- at higher doses- completely erasing the normal filters and screens between your conscious mind and the outside world.
With these filters down, more information rushes in and you become aware of things normally filtered out by your mind. You sense more, think more, feel more -- visual, auditory, sensory, emotional -- the intricate details on surfaces, the richness of sound, the brightness of colors, and the complexity of your own mental processes.’
SOURCE

I see each of the altered states above as being pretty much the same experience. It’s the circumstances of how, where and when that experience occurs that makes the difference as well as the perspective of those around you at the time.

Psychiatry, basically being anti-religious and motivated by cash, will tend to label anyone going through any altered state as ‘ill’ requiring lifelong medication. It sticks steadfastly with its bio-medical model to explain these symptoms and ignores the ‘social model’. They say it’s the cost but really it’s their jobs.

If the social model was to be used as the paradigm to explain psychotic breaks i.e. consideration of life stressors; money, relationship probs and/or being victim of abuse be it sexual, emotional, physical alcohol or drugs, would be a part of the treatment process. While psychiatry does demonstrate a passing interest in these matters it considers its role to ask the question, ‘This person is high. What drug will bring them down?’ It would be psychologists who would deal with psychotic patients using the social model – a psychiatrist being seen as infrequently as a psychologist is seen by a sufferer is today. Using the social model would tend to get to the root cause of the psychosis. Psychiatry simply sticks a plaster on the symptoms.

Emotional issues? See a psychologist. Brain probs? See a neurologist. In my perfect world there would be no psychiatry.

A full blown psychotic break will tend to last for around 6 weeks whether medication is taken or not. (The build up can be apparent for much longer and the damage to personal life can be irreparable). The body cannot cope physically for much longer and simply falls down in exhaustion.

Next kundalini – a very similar symptom list to psychosis. I have listed the symptoms for spontaneous kundalini awakening because many people spend years trying to achieve this state while with others it just ‘happens’. Those who ‘prepare’ are extremely familiar with what they might expect should they succeed in their aims whereas those who experience the kundalini energy spontaneously are often diagnosed with...psychosis.

When people seek a profound spiritual experience they will often fast to prepare. When people are in the build up to psychosis they tend not to eat. It amounts to the same thing. In my view people subjected to accumulating life stressors accidently fill the criterion for kundalini awakening preparation.

Those who experience spontaneous kundalini awakening can, due to their lack of training/preparation, often think that they areGod. Often reported by both labels is that sense of oneness with the All which bring me nicely to my last point – the mushroom trip.

In a recently aired TV show, ‘The Brain: A Secret History – Mind Control’ (6 January 2011) the presenter discusses some of the extremely cruel psychological experimentation that has taken place over the past 100 years. During the show, in a lab environment, he is given a dose of psilocybin while in a CT scanner. He had nothing but positive experiences to report, including that sense of oneness, but interestingly when they looked at his scan afterwards they could see what parts of the brain had been affected. It seems that the area of the brain that gives us our sense of self is virtually closed down which may be an explanation for that ‘one with everything’ experienced by the psychotics and those going through kundalini awakening.
The Brain: A Secret History - Mind Control (Vid)


In summary, if an individual is given psilocybin without their knowledge (or the knowledge of anyone in the vicinity) chances are they will think one of 2 things - they have gone completely mad - or they will feel the most spiritually connected they have in their entire lives. Anyone around them would likely go with the former. I submit that all three experience amount to largely the same thing.

reply to post by christina-66


Whats sickening about these threads is that it describes everyone on earth.

Its how police and gov get away with murder.

Kudalini is funny thing like you say, if your not ready for it, it can be frightening.

Theres like a thread about this every week.
Should I go ahead and post them?

reply to post by andy1033


I'm not trying to describe everyone on earth...I'm trying to look at the different labels attached to those going through what would be described as a psychotic/spiritual/hallucinogenic experiences and argue that they are fundamentally the same process.

It is psychiatry that attempts to apply a label to every human behaviour and medicate it, not 'threads like these'. Are you saying that every person on earth goes through the experiences listed above? I don't think so.

reply to post by Segador



Please do post links to any live threads on this topic. I would enjoy the debate.

Thanks.

as a view only, I don't see that any drug or prescription could ever match a brain defect such as a psychcotic episode in any true depth for a experiencer of such an disorder, the base views may be similar for each though the underlying effects of psychosis and its varied degrees of disturbance and actions derived through the nature of symptoms of each case, to be something of which any man made or self induced episode could ever be able to match as same in disorder or feeling.

We have to get something straight here, schizophrenia is a mental illness. People who suffer from mental illnesses can go on to kill a lot of people based on their delusions. Provided they don't take their medication of course.

You're taking that psilocybin thing out of context. I also watched it. What he actually meant was the areas of the brain that it affected showed a reduced amount of blood flow. Professor David Nutt, the one who was running the tests, said that it was possible that this could be used in the treatment of depression. It restricted blood flow to the areas of the brain that worked on hyperdrive in people suffering from depression.

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I just searched up "Schizophrenia" and got a bunch of threads of people linking a mental illness to some sort of deeper or spiritual meaning.

A mental illness is a mental illness.

You can change the name of disease, but it is still a disease. I don't think anyone suffering from cancer thinks it is a spiritually based change on the cellular level. The same can certainly be said for mental disorders, especially ones like Schizophrenia. A shattered mind is not a spiritually awakened one, it is a shattered mind. One that can never be 'fixed', but maybe with the right combination of courses of action one can be given a chance to put the shards together and exist within their own bodies a little more cohesively.

Surely there are members here who can give you direct insight from their own experiences?

Are you serious? How many psychotic Tibetan monks do you know? If you're having problems get help...

Originally posted by Griffo
We have to get something straight here, schizophrenia is a mental illness. People who suffer from mental illnesses can go on to kill a lot of people based on their delusions. Provided they don't take their medication of course.

You're taking that psilocybin thing out of context. I also watched it. What he actually meant was the areas of the brain that it affected showed a reduced amount of blood flow. Professor David Nutt, the one who was running the tests, said that it was possible that this could be used in the treatment of depression. It restricted blood flow to the areas of the brain that worked on hyperdrive in people suffering from depression.

I've really got to take exception to the perpetration of this myth. There is a book called 'Schizophrenia: A Scientific Delusion?' There's actually a raging debate (among psychiatric professionals) about whether or not schizophrenia is a mental illness requiring lifelong medication and a massive anti-psychiatry movement made up largely of people and their carers who have experienced psychiatric care in many places around the world.

There is no test for schizophrenia...its diagnosis is based purely on observation and subjective opinion. A person diagnosed as being schizophrenic in Britain may not be diagnosed with schizophrenia in India. That's what makes its existence as an actual disease (bio-medical model) treatable with drugs so questionable. A diabetic in London is still a diabetic in Delhi.

Now for the schizophrenics are all dangerous potential killers. That is urban myth.
'People with schizophrenia are far more likely to harm themselves than be violent toward the public. Violence is not a symptom of schizophrenia.

News and entertainment media tend to link mental illnesses including schizophrenia to criminal violence. Most people with schizophrenia, however, are not violent toward others but are withdrawn and prefer to be left alone.

I used to have the actual stats....not from the net but from the NHS Internal Statistics Dept. who record that 5% of the male population under the age of 25 have a criminal record due to violence. In schizophrenics than number goes down to 2%.

Oooh...and that medication. Lethal meds....with horrendous side effects - including tardive dyskenesia - prescibed for non-fatal conditions. There is no insanity in someone not wanting to take these meds.

In any event you don't have to be diagnosed schizophrenic to experience psychosis. It occurs in manic depression too....or in some cases it’s a one off and is never given a diagnosis. It is the psychotic experience I am comparing to spiritual awakening.

I again disagree that I'm taking the finding of the vid out of context. It was clearly stated that those areas denied blood flow were the areas of the brain that accorded us with our sense of self. Reduced blood flow would suggest reduce activity. If our sense of self is turned down it stands to reason that we would have an altogether different view of reality.

Originally posted by Nyiah
You can change the name of disease, but it is still a disease. I don't think anyone suffering from cancer thinks it is a spiritually based change on the cellular level. The same can certainly be said for mental disorders, especially ones like Schizophrenia. A shattered mind is not a spiritually awakened one, it is a shattered mind. One that can never be 'fixed', but maybe with the right combination of courses of action one can be given a chance to put the shards together and exist within their own bodies a little more cohesively.

Surely there are members here who can give you direct insight from their own experiences?

A hundred years ago there was about 6 different psychiatric labels. They have grown and developed as the industry has to include some ludicrous diagnoses. Normal behavious patters, diagnosed and medicated. (Conduct Disorder - apparantly 4 out of 10 of our teenagers have this. i.e. not doing as they are told. IMO it is a teenagers duty to rebel.

A psychotic episode could happen to ANYONE given the right circumstances you don't have to be schizophrenic to experience that. Also psychosis or, 'a shattered mind,' is certainly not a lifelong state....its temporary. It is very 'fiixable' given the right treatment. My point is that its not necessarily medical treatment that's required (not in the manner that its treated anyhow). In the old days it was called a nervous breakdown.

There has been an epidemic of mental illness for the last 50 years. That is, ever since the first medications were produced (1955). The only figures that run in tandem with the figures of mental illness diagnoses are the number of pills prescibed. Could there be a connection there? I am not completely anti-medication - if someone is in the full throws of a psychotic episode I'd say the only thing to bring them down is medication - but that should only ever be for the short term.

I have a great deal of experience in this field and sat on a commitee in my God forsaken little country to determine mental health policy here over the coming decade.

reply to post by Throwback


Where to get help? From the doc? From a friend or family member? From your minister/priest/rabbi? From a counsellor? From a financial advisor?

Mental illnesses are not static! Because of two hospitalizations in the last eight years for acute and chronic depression, and a 32 year background in medicine, I have a perspective from both sides of the table. I've spent hundreds of hours studying these diseases, to help learn how to help myself and to just learn in general. Yes, a psychopath is a sociopath, but a sociopath is not always a psychopath. Yes, sociopaths are often quite weird, with a totally screwed up conscience, but if you've ever spent any time around a psychopath you learn quickly the highly-charged negative thinking, emotions, degree of delusions and reactions are exponentially more profound than any other psychiatric condition. Sociopaths are manipulative and often highly capable liars, but psychopaths are DANGEROUS, most usually to others. That is why serious mental illness can in no way be called Spiritually awakening, because of the high potential for extreme and deadly outcome. I'm running as fast and as far away from "spiritual awakening" of this kind as I can, and so should you!

reply to post by christina-66


Whoever will listen then go from there. If nobody listens go to a doctor. My suggestions based on a little bit of schooling.

reply to post by christina-66

I hope this clears things up for you.

What do doctors do? You have a head ache take a pill. come back a week later your head ache worsens take more pills. Which can get into a whole new theory population control Etc. But the my point is medicine might do more wrong than right. I don't know maybe I'm crazy what do you think?
or

reply to post by QuidEstVerita


I think you're crazy. Or that headache is a tumor, which could make you crazy. Either one.

Originally posted by deadred
Mental illnesses are not static! Because of two hospitalizations in the last eight years for acute and chronic depression, and a 32 year background in medicine, I have a perspective from both sides of the table. I've spent hundreds of hours studying these diseases, to help learn how to help myself and to just learn in general. Yes, a psychopath is a sociopath, but a sociopath is not always a psychopath. Yes, sociopaths are often quite weird, with a totally screwed up conscience, but if you've ever spent any time around a psychopath you learn quickly the highly-charged negative thinking, emotions, degree of delusions and reactions are exponentially more profound than any other psychiatric condition. Sociopaths are manipulative and often highly capable liars, but psychopaths are DANGEROUS, most usually to others. That is why serious mental illness can in no way be called Spiritually awakening, because of the high potential for extreme and deadly outcome. I'm running as fast and as far away from "spiritual awakening" of this kind as I can, and so should you!

Thanks for your post. Mental illnesses are not static, nor is the normal human condition. Psychiatry seeks to ‘stable’ a patient beyond the usual public perception of what ‘stable’ means. Anyway stable’s for horses – human beings are supposed to run the gamete of emotions throughout their lives

There was a man sent to our hospital for the criminally insane. He shot one of two men on his doorstep and was diagnosed as being a psychopath – a personality disorder. (What was never reported was that he lived alone and was being victimised by a group for some time prior to the incident). Often, people are sent to the hospital for the criminally insane without limit of time – but unlike in the criminal justice system – a doctor can determine if a patient is well enough to be released at any given time. It could be 2 years from detention – it could be 30 – it could be never.

Psychopath and sociopath are in a completely different grouping from the schizophrenic or manic depressive, so much so, that it is maintained that neither condition can ever be ‘cured’ or effectively treated. (The psychopath has no empathy and the sociopath has an often shallow display of emotion whereas the schizophrenic or manic depressive tend to feel emotion too much – these conditions are almost the opposite to one another. As stated previously a schizophrenic, unlike a psychopath, is more likely to harm themselves than anyone else. It doesn’t do to confuse the public) The aforementioned man took the authorities to court – diagnosed as a psychopath who was determined to be untreatable – his legal team argued that as a hospital was fundamentally a place in which to receive treatment and that they had ceded they could not treat him – they had no right to detain him. He won his case and was released. This would be just over 10 years ago.

Horrified the authorities rushed through a new law. A new poorly drafted law. This new law holds that anyone who is diagnosed with a personality disorder (as you will know ALL psychiatric conditions are held to be personality disorders – not just the psychopath and sociopath) and it is felt that theymight commit a crime in the future can now be held without limit of time – having broken no law. On top of that – medication previously could only ever be enforced when under a legal obligation to do so (we call it being sectioned under the mental health act) now the authorities have the right to enforce medication on any diagnosed individual whether under section or no.

Maybe, just maybe, these laws would be fine if the medications actually did what they say on the tin....but they do not. The movie ‘A Beautiful Mind’ about Professor John Nash implies that this tortured genius suffered schizophrenia was eventually diagnosed, and medicated, and everything was then ok. John Nash himself has expressed his views on how inaccurate the movie’s depiction of mental illness and the treatments actually was.

John Nash NEVER relied on medication to facilitate his recovery – that is the big lie of the movie. He was asked at one time about the efficacy of psychiatric medication and commented that it depended on your measure of success. If you measure success by halting delusions and hallucinations etc. – but that was only achieved by suppressing every other function – was that a real success. He states if the measure of success is that a person receiving medication is put back to the state they were in prior to having any psychotic episode then psychiatric medications simply do not achieve this.

I will reiterate – I am not talking about the psychopath or the sociopath or the schizophrenic or the manic depressive, I am talking about psychosis.

This is an interview with John Nash - he talks about the depiction of mental illness in 'A Beatiful Mind' about 3 minutes into the clip.