Sun wheels, fire chariots and winged discs

The symbol people have been most obsessed with as far back as the Stonge Age is the so-called "Sun-Wheel". This is also one of the only symbols found all over the world, from India to Ireland, from South America to Siberia.
This article proposes that the sun wheel, the "chariots of fire" and the "winged sun disc" are one and the same thing: Ancient flying devices used by extraterrestrials or technologically advanced humans.

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Sunwheels 2000 B.C.

The reason we can be fairly certain that the "spoked chariot wheels", "winged sun discs", "solar discs", "chariots of fire" and "sun wheels" refer to the same thing is be cause ancient scriptures refer to them in these different words and because they are sometimes shown with wings and sometimes without. Its reasonable to assume that the wings are shown in order to indicate "these discs fly!". Its as if the ancients wanted to make sure to communicate that message over long spands of time, by adding wings. .

The circled part is what a celtic sun wheel looks like. I am depicting it along with the cross ("The Celtic Sun Cross") to imply that the religious symbol of the cross may originally come from the celtic 4-spoked and 8-spoked sun wheel.

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The celtic sun wheel is associated with the God Taranis, the God of thunder. Whats so amazing about this is that the Anatolian (ancient Turkish) God and culture-bearer Tharun is also associated with varios sun-discs. He is likely also associated with the Nordic "Thor", the Thundergod. "Thunder" may refer to the noise the flying discs made when breaking the sound barrier. In celtic Mythology Tharanis is also called "wheel god" and "sky god" because he flew through the sky with a wheel. Taranis wheel is 8-spoked. The name suggests a possible connection to Tara

The following is an ancient Babylonian piece that shows the winged sun flying high above two people. The reason I chose it from many hundreds of pictures is because it shows the sun beside the sun-wheel. This and other images showing the sun-wheel beside the sun refute the claim of archaeologists, anthorpologists and historians that "the sun-wheel is the ancients way of stylizing the sun".

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This Mesopotamian one shows various flying objects, one being a sun-wheel, the other a winged cylinder:

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This is a "spoked chariot" from India. The Hindus actually call this the wheel of the "Sun God":

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In the Encylopedia entry on Solar Deities you will find that the Sun God appeared on every part of the Planet.

This coin called "Pyu-Halin" owas found in Burma and belonged to the "Pyu" people, a culture that is now extinct. It is believed that The Pyu were ancient builders that were more advanced than later Generations and that Buddhism originates from this culture.

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In order to show a correlation to the Americas, this is an ancient Mayan idea of a Sun God:

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Ancient Assyrian flying discs. I use the first picture because it shows a passenger and the second because it shows the spokes of the original sun-wheel as seein in all ancient cultures, but with wings added.

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7b4781932977.jpg[/atsimg]

This rendering of a Babylonian Sun-Disc shows the more mechanical looks of the craft:

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An image of the God Ahura Mazda:

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Finally, two modern uses of the sun-wheel. The first is the Nazi occult-symbol called The Black Sun" (which in German is abbreviated SS). This one is from the Castle Wewelsburg, Germany, an SS-Headquarters. It is based on the ancient "Zierscheibe" (Zier-Disc) which were placed in graves to help the dead ascend. This is a custom shared with the ancient Chinese and their Bi-Discs.


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The second is in the Vatican, in the middle of which rises an Obelisk. it is an 8-pointed sun-wheel.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/61c4a2a989f8.jpg[/atsimg]

There is much more to discover on this subject, I am only presenting the tip of the iceberg. I look forward to others digging up more pieces of the mystery. I will also add to the thread as I find the time to.

This is an Anatolian Sun Disc connected to the God Tharun:

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This is the Celtic Wheel-God Tharanis:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3d925f0cbec7.jpg[/atsimg]

Both have Gods of similar names, both are connected to flying wheels and both are thousands of miles apart, from two very different cultures.

S+F
This is the kind of level headed research that drew me to ATS in the first place. Great presentation. Concerning the classic "winged cylinder": It has always reminded me of the eagle.

This, of course, opens the way for discussion of the symbolic use of the eagle by the United States - the Great Seal, etc. Any thoughts on this.

And this is probably where the production designers for "Dune" got the idea for the Guild Transport as well:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/6618689ec513.jpg[/atsimg]

This may not be related, but I remember weird wheel references in the Old Testament. Note: I am not preaching, or bringing religion into this as the explanation. I just thought the reference was significant.

"Then I looked, and behold, a whirlwind was coming out of the north, a great cloud with raging fire engulfing itself; and brightness was all around it and radiating out of its midst like the color of amber, out of the midst of the fire. Also from within it came the likeness of four living creatures . . . Now as I looked at the living creatures, behold, a wheel was on the earth beside each living creature with its four faces. The appearance of the wheels and their workings was like the color of beryl, and all four had the same likeness. The appearance of their workings was, as it were, a wheel in the middle of a wheel. " (Ezekiel 1:1, 4-5,15-16, NKJV)

The symbols look remarkably like the USAF insignia/s.
Two words: Time Travellers

reply to post by dialecticchaos77


Back to my wacky "rapture" research with this:

Luke 17
Geneva Bible translation

36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

Think evacuation instead of magic whirlwinds...

Talk about synchronicity...

This is my Sun Disc:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/dd3f9388276e.png[/atsimg]

Whenever I draw it, I draw it with wings. I feel like a higher entity exists within it.

He teaches me a lot about the universe.

Hope this helps. Feel free to ask questions about him.

Hiya Sky. No doubt the thread will generate scores of flags and an overwhelming level of agreement with the notion that all these symbols were flying devices and space craft.

Naturally, I'm opposed to the idea of ancient astronauts or even 'lost advanced technology.' We have no evidence of the infrastructure needed to build machines at any point or location in ancient history. Things that fly need engines or power sources. They need metal presses, steel and alloy foundries, lathes, and machines to build nuts, bolts and washers. They need factories of one size or other. Another point is that the civilisation that creates them would need to face great catastrophe in order to lose the machines and all that knowledge. Your contention would need earth-shattering events that removed the knowledge from all the civilisations you suggest had these machines. Such a series of events, spread across continents and a period of some thousands of years would need to erase all the evidence and then erase evidence of itself.

Alternatively, the objects and symbols in your images are actually what they are claimed to be...sun symbols. The sun has always been very important to humans, being both a source of heat and way of measuring time and seasons. As we developed agriculturally, it also grew in importance. It's no surprise that we have tried to capture the qualities of the sun in objects and images. A lot of these have become stylised and specific to regions and cultures. The 'winged disc' was shared by Egyptians, Assyrians and the Sumerians with the wings representing the vaults of the skies iirc.

I guess the 'abridged version' of my argument is this; either we were flying around in stuff for thousands of years or these symbols are representations of the Sun.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
either we were flying around in stuff for thousands of years or these symbols are representations of the Sun.

I agree. And since we have people sitting inside who are reported by the ancients to have been flying through the sky and since we have landing legs, spokes and other mechanical looking gadgets, I guess we can rule out the sun part.

Originally posted by this_is_who_we_are

This, of course, opens the way for discussion of the symbolic use of the eagle by the United States - the Great Seal, etc. Any thoughts on this.

Yes, thats an important point in all this.

The Symbols used by the Superpowers seem to be tributes to the ancient Superpowers (Gods). The Eagle could be a Tribute to the Egyptian Horus who sometimes appears as an Eagle, somtimes as a Winged Disc, sometimes as the all-seeing-eye.

Of Related Interest:
Of Flying Dragons and Metallic Discs

Originally posted by SolarE-Souljah
Hope this helps. Feel free to ask questions about him.

Are your drawings based on Mayan or Pre-Columbian ideas of sun wheels, by any chance?

reply to post by Skyfloating


Excellent thread.
In MHO, I think the common denominator is simply the Sun. Cultures all over the planet have mythology and symbolism regarding the Sun, the Moon and the Stars because they are not isolated or influenced by landscape or geography, or language etc. Like many other influences on culture are, like other mythologies surrounding aspects of nature like rivers, seas and oceans or mountains.

Sun mythology and worship is represented in many ways. I think it is important to reflect on the broader picture in relation to the many variations of imagery and mythology for the sun. The winged sun, and the discs you use as examples are just some of the imagery. The Egyptians for example(and many cultures that came before) used the Winged Sun of Thebes but also have many other mythologies and images for the Sun as it traverses the sky.
I am sure you are aware of the relationship of Horus, and his animal form the falcon and the suns position. This also relates to Harmakhet and the sphinx form, and the horizon and sun rise, Kephri and the form of a scarab for the morning and so on and so forth relative to different solar positions.

All these have imagery associated with them.

I think it is also important to note that you have chosen specific medium to represent certain images. Many of the example you use are metal work or stone work of a similar theme. What is interesting is that similar art work appears in different mediums but are representations of the Sun.
Many early paintings and imagery from Akkadians and the representation of Shamash as well as Native American artists have artistic similar themes to the examples you provide.
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I think that isolating imagery and the way it is presented can interesting on its own, especially when speculating about the origins or inspiration for such work. But I think it is important to also consider the entire scope of such imagery and the variety of ways it is used in representing something that is of universal significance to all cultures, that being the Sun.

Once again great thread. S and F.

From Winged Sun:

The winged sun is a symbol associated with divinity, royalty and power in the Ancient Near East (Egypt, Mesopotamia, Anatolia, and Persia). The symbol has also been found in the records of ancient cultures residing in various regions of South America as well as Australia.

In all cultures the descendants of the "Gods" are considered to be Kings and Royals. Hence...

From roughly 2000 BC, the symbol spread to the Levant and to Mesopotamia. It appears in reliefs with Assyrian rulers and in Hieroglyphic Anatolian as a symbol for royalty,

See also: Of Emperors and Sky Gods

reply to post by atlasastro


Hello Atlasastro,

long time no see. Thanks for your Addition.

Re: Shamash: Thats also the flying guy in the 9th picture of the OP.

reply to post by Skyfloating


Hi Sky,
I know you refer to Shamash, I do too. In a different medium. The Second image in my post is an early representation. The black and white "Star". It is also similar to many other cultural images spread across wide geographic distances which is why I also used the native american image aswell.


Thank you for the reply.

More on the "Black Sun"

The term Black Sun (German Schwarze Sonne), also referred to as the Sonnenrad (the German for "Sun Wheel"), is a symbol of esoteric or occult significance, notable for its usage in Nazi mysticism.

the original artifacts had a solar significance, stating that "this twelve-spoke sun wheel derives from decorative disks of the Merovingians of the early medieval period

Erich Halik was the first to link the esoteric SS with the Black Sun roundel insignia carried by German aircraft in the polar region at the close of World War II.

Austrian researchers Norbert Jürgen Ratthofer and Ralf Ettl produced the documentaries "UFO - The Third Reich Strikes Back?)" and "UFO - Secrets of the Third Reich)" which talks of the Thule Society with the Geheimnis Schwarze Sun flashing on screen and talking about it. Professor Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke states that "In the early 1990s, the Austrians Norbert Jürgen Ratthofer and Ralf Ettl and developed new nazi UFO myths involving ancient Babylon, Vril energy and extraterrestrial civilisation in the solar system of Aldebaran. These colourful ideas are integral elements of a dualist Marcionite religion propagated by Ralf Ettl through his Tempelhofgesellschaft (Temple Sociey) in Vienna, identified as a secret successor to the historic Templars, who had absorbed Gnostic and heretical ideas in the Levant"[41] Ratthofer and Ettl state in "UFO - Geheimnisse des Dritten Reichs (1990) (UFO - Secrets of the Third Reich)"[39] that "Within the SS the Thule Society created a separate secret organisation called the "Black Sun"" with the "Geheimnis Schwarze Sonne" as its logo.[unreliable source?]

Source

Winged Craft from around the World. Notce how the bottom two, both from Pre-Columbian America, look more mechanical:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b53d3760b8d6.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by Skyfloating

These Sun wheels remind me of when the Sun will rise to conjunct the intersection of the Milky Way and the ecliptic plane. Because if they were seen all over the world there had to be either a understanding of certain time related activites or the SUN basically emitted some interesting blast that formed the type of visual display depicted in the sun wheel art.
Some Sun wheels.
The first pick hase the 8 spoked wheel and the smaller 4 spoked Sun wheel in upper left corner.

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The 7 Spoke Cycle/Wheel of Time and Karma moves to 8 ... infinity ... as yet unwritten. The wheel of time and karma comes to a halt, the hourglass empty, the tale of the lion complete. The emotional burdens of time will now be released from the back of the man dressed in red (emotions, the physical plane). The peacock goes to ascension through the eye at the center of the Milky Way Galaxy, the eye. The hand of god, the scribe and the peacock control time.
link
www.crystalinks.com...

I think there are 8 spokes as well on this one. I like this Sun wheel because of the way the calander is used within it as well.
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Above we see Quetzalcoatl returning to us on a long cord originating out of the base of an eight pointed wheel-star image, an image which forms the very heart of the Mayan cosmology. From the Codex Vindobonensis

Mayan prophecy supposedly says a ladder will emerge from the center of our Milky Way galaxy in 2012.From out of the ladder will emerge the serpent rope carrying the god Nine Wind also called Quetzalcoatl.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2c53b3c446c6.jpeg[/atsimg]

I'm curious, do we know if any of these "sun wheels" preceed the invention of the wheel (4500-3500 BC)?

In regards to Thor and Taranis, some people believe he was an ancient Indo European war chief possibly from the Kurgan culture.

The older Indo-European thunder god's name was something along the lines of Perkunos, which has surived into Slavic, Baltic, Thracian, Prussian myth and as a title of the Vedic Indra.

This ancient Indo European god's symbol was the Thundermark, its not quite a wheel but similar. Its more like a cube within a circle, in many ways almost identical to Metatron's Cube.