The Left Right Paradigm is OVER... It's now You vs The Corporations

Highly agree with your post... it would also be fitting to add that these corporations are but tools for the elite...

They want the united states gov't to be in perpetual debt, the corporation is a system that can't be taken down as easily as a human can...

The CIA is a similar tool for the elite...

Opened up an article regarding the CIA's involvement with Drug Cartels and how it affects Immigration.

Is The CIA Behind Mexico’s Bloody Drug War?

“The CIA, as Cockburn and (Jeffrey) St Clair reveal, had been in this business right from the beginning. In fact, even before it came into existence, its predecessors, the OSS and the Office of Naval Intelligence, were involved with criminals. One such criminal was Lucky Luciano, the most notorious gangster and drug trafficker in America in the forties.”

The CIA’s involvement in drug trafficking closely dovetails America’s adventures overseas – from Indo-China in the sixties to Afghanistan in the eighties….As Alfred McCoy states in his book: Politics of Heroin: CIA complicity in the Global Drug Trade, beginning with CIA raids from Burma into China in the early fifties, the agency found that ‘ruthless drug lords made effective anti-communists.” (“CIA peddles drugs while US Media act as cheerleaders”, Zafar Bangash, Muslimedia, January 16-31, 1999)

Mexico Alone has to deal with more inefficiencies and corruption due to United States led policies. Please look at the links below.

It's About (Mexico's) Oil

Mexican Drug Cartels Smuggling Stolen Oil To US, Selling It To American Refineries

On top of this, Mexico is in debt due to a deal the United States made with Mexico and then backed out on leaving Mexico in Perpetual Debt for years.

This was of course when the United States lent money to Mexico to build Refineries and buy oil based equipment from the United States so Mexico in turn could sell the refined oil back to the United States. This of course didn't happen once OPEC came into the picture leaving Mexico with the Bill. Please take a look at the link below and you will find more than one example of this.

Alexander's Gas & Oil Connections

Now the reason I want to show this connection is to explain why Illegal Immigration will continue.

Every Person that comes into this country illegally knows that they're not wanted here... They're here because they have no choice. In fact the reason more Mexicans have arrived here is due to the CIA led Mexican Cartels. Please look at the link below.

CIA Drug Planes

The United States Policy has always been to keep every country in Debt... Thats it. Nothing else... As long as this continues, Citizens from Countries South of the US border will continue to come into this country illegally. The above references show what depths our gov't will go to keep these contries in constant termoil.

We are starving and infringing on their rights by doing this, forcing them to seek a living somewhere else.

If you want to fix the problem, fix it at its source. Change US policy. If you've read the links you know that it's the only real solution.

I would really want every reader to consider that U.S. Policy is in fact the problem, which means we can easily as a country provide a solution.

Fox

edit on 11/10/2010 by FoxStriker because: (no reason given)

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Very true. I have no doubt that corporations run our country, we are a consumer society. Almost everything we use or consume, is making someone somewhere a lot of money. It sucks, what can we as the people do to stop it? Go live in the woods? yeah, right, why should we have to do that? And to double stab us poor folks, the big corps who run our country give our jobs to OTHER countries.

Well it is not really that you have to go live in the woods.

You can stay in the cities when Agenda 21 is put in full effect, I just
think once you see Agenda 21 and their other plans in FULL EFFECT,
camping will look a lot better than what they got in mind.

Under Agenda 21 you are the enemy, you are the problem.

www.dailymotion.com...

Stay in the cities while you can, but have a back up plan just in case
for the first time in your life you are wrong.

Good Luck to all the good ppl !!!

reply to post by TheBandit795


Corporation took both my houses and my business and when i tried to fight back with a lawyer the corporation went bankrupt and it was no longer viable to seek retribution.

Point is that the banks are at fault for the economic fall yet we give them more power and incentives to grow stronger.

when these banks go under they just rebuild stronger or merge with a different bank. sigh.... nothing will ever change...

While I agree with your statement OP, I fear the Left/Right goes deeper than what people think the government has to be. Some people are not comfortable with gay marriage, and will always be Right leaning due to that belief. Some people want legalization of certain substances, and are Left leaning. Both of these subjects are social issues, and are not tied into how a populace thinks their government should act.

We will truly get rid of the Left/Right argument when we, as a global community, reach a balance of human rights and learn to accept everyone for who they are, mostly. We will never get rid of the hardcore theocrat, because some people like to be restricted, but we can still greatly influence people who maybe want out of their position. In turn, this newfound freedom of human rights will start to crack the large Corporations, who rely on blind consumerism to keep afloat.

Life is a cycle folks, not one thing is standalone in our world anymore.

reply to post by BobbinHood


It doesn't matter. It's still a big dumb show.

Just like everything else on TV.

I'm for the puppet on the right! I'm for the puppet on the left!

They are both being held up by the same guy.

Some of us have known this since the late 80's. The rest won't know it until they are dead.

Originally posted by UnknownPhilosopher
The beautiful thing is. This battle could be easily won. Corporations require customers or clients. If your tired of how the bank treats you? Don't put your money in a bank. Don't like how a store treats its employees or consumers? Don't shop there. Don't particularily care for your city government? Stop being a patron to the city. Don't like the war overseas? Stop paying taxes. If You get enough people standing up for themselves and correcting a few small things, the larger ones will take care of themselves. Without revenue from its easily manipulated needless consumers, Corporations have no leg to stand on. These corp. are only as powerful as we allow them to be.

CIVIL Disobediance is the only way to go. And I emphasize civil for all you out there who think creating more chaos is a good thing.

i love your post. we have more power than we think we do. why don't we utilize it more?

reply to post by ZiggyStardust


Because the corporate lobby would write legislation mandating that we purchase their products and services.

Just like they have been doing for at least 25 years. The only way such a plan could work is through widespread (at least 50%) tax and shopping revolt. With ZERO violence.

reply to post by TheBandit795


I agree/disagree with some of your post. It IS us vs Corporations, I agree. But the left and right paradigm is still in tact and working beautifully might I add. Of course it isn't working for us but against us. We have been so diversified that we can't tell our hands from our arse.

The Left and Right is funded by corporations to keep us in this state. Order through Chaos. It is a tool used to keep us in a confused mind set so we can't oppose them.

People are shouting you can't make change through violence, I beg to differ. Without violence our change is just an illusion, nothing gets done. Even though in our perception it seems that a lot got done it gets unreported and then buried by the news outlets.

That is the MAIN thing that is holding us back right now. The media manipulated by the people who own them, the corporations, which they use as a means of warfare against us.

Cleanse the media of all the biased crap they put out and our problem will be solved within months.

So who do you think will be our next president?

President Monsanto VP McDonalds
President Bayer VP Pfizer
President Philip Morris VP Coca Cola

I'm not going to go too far outside common sense on this one, but political reform is one of the major stumbling blocks to having a better quality of life.

I know that people are coming up with all kinds of conspiracies and master plans that the shadowy elite have, but I think it's just old-fashioned greed. We need political/campaign reform and the people who would start that process down the road are the people who need to be reformed. There's no way around it but things HAVE to get worse for people to realize that their government is screwing them over for the benefit of the politicians and their "friends".

Until things get worse, nothing will happen. In a recession, people cut back, but I don't think I've ever seen more SUV's on the road.

Research your candidates, or even run for office yourself if you want things to change, but you need to vote in people that will make moves to reform campaign and politics. Everyone has their motivations for running for office, but right now, its the get-rich-quick scheme that's dominating.

My idea would be to limit political contributions to $100 from ANY source and government has to match whatever is contributed. You cannot go into business or lobby for any business which you have passed/denied legislation for 10 years after you leave office. Your salary as a public servant should be capped at 10% above the median household average. If it goes up, you get a raise, if it goes down, you get a pay cut. If you have another job, you must abstain from legislation if it affects that business that you work in.

It's too bad we can't just pass a law that says don't be a douchebag politician.

I know some great local politicians, but once you hit the federal circuit, the prizes get much bigger.

I've been preaching this for a long, long time.

Yet, it seems the more I preach it, the more the Red v Blue argument heats up.

That's why I no longer frequent the Political Boards. You might see a thread about NAFTA or about re-calling our troops or about the bail-outs but when you join the thread try to discuss your stance on foreign or domestic policy, it's gets dragged down into a "liberal" versus "conservative" argument.

Ugh. People just don't get it.

Let's stop worrying about the TEA Party or Obama. Let's stop worrying about gun rights or Abortion or whether a homosexual wants to get married. Let's start worrying about the job losses to India, the Billion Dollar Bailouts that our kids are going to pay out the nose for, the repercussion for having an imperialistic international agenda.

This is being way oversimplified here. I know there are others on ATS as old or older than I am? This is not new by any stretch of the imagination. If anything, it was worse in the 1960's.

By oversimplified I mean in regards to Corporations and I assume you mean Big Business? Not all are crooked. To assume that is naive. If you hate businesses simply for being businesses, you are on the wrong path. I think many don't really comprehend how good we have it here? Our Poor live lifestyles way beyond that of the much of the rest of the World. It's because of large businesses ability to market products far cheaper due to their size.

Anti-Capitalism is insane as we have many examples of the other side of that coin throughout history to teach us. Yes we need better regulation and perhaps we need to enforce our Anti-Trust Laws more vigorously and not allow them to become quite so large; on that I agree.

Large Corporations are not the employees who run them, but rather those who own the Stock. These days it's mostly peoples retirement funds and futures wrapped up in them.

Things like boycotts are the product of juvenile minds, illiterate in how our system works and why it has worked so well compared to the rest of the world.

I agree fully that both political parties are heads of the same beast. That is completely true and why I refuse to be associated with any Party. They most certainly use the parties to divide us to control. That is absolutely true.

There is another weapon they use however; Class Warfare. Class Warfare is just as dangerous and destructive and yet another tool to divide us. Socialism might sound good, but history teaches us that it always leads to a two class society of the very poor and the very rich and powerful. Only Capitalism leads to a stable middle class. The trick is to find the middle ground through regulation and enforcement of those regulations.

You want low prices? You must have Big Corporations. You want a chance to succeed yourself and live well, you must have unfettered Capitalism. To get either, you must have honest government. All this bad stuff going on is due to money in politics. Take the money out of the equation and you get honest government and well regulated Big Business. Without honest government, you have a pseudo-Socialist State where Big Business and Government are the same animal.

It would be simple to take money out of politics and in fact the elections would be more fair and more GOOD people could get involved. You also have to eliminate the Unions influence to reach that goal. They are a privileged class along with the government workers as it is now. They in fact are a huge factor in the costs of the goods we buy.

All you do by turning on business in general is to do a little dance and empower them to use class warfare to replace partisanship. The end result is the same. The only way off the teeter-totter is honest government and a return to real Capitalism in the form that made our country the richest and most powerful with the wealthiest and most vibrant Middle-Class on the planet Earth.

History is so important and yet the Progressives choose to ignore history or they even rewrite it because they wrongly believe their Socialistic plans have always failed, because it was done wrong last time. A total fallacy. Progressive have always ran on the idea that everyone before them was stupid and they are always people who suffer from Grandiosity. Sadly they completely control our Universities and the Schools through the Unions. Look what they gave us! A generation of young who think the world owes them a luxury lifestyle and why? So they will vote the way they want them to vote.

China is laughing at us because we are returning to progressive lunacy while they are going the other way and prospering. Russia is laughing at us for the same reason. Well not laughing exactly because it's starting to hurt them. This latest batch of money printed out of thin air is going to make Obama the target of ridicule because it is so utterly stupid. Now I don't believe Obama is stupid, do any of you? Then why does he keep making such obvious mistakes? You tell me? I think it's obvious.

He does not care who won the last election. He just wants to leave us all destitute on purpose to enable the formation of a One World government, with everyone on the planet working for a Union and under the full control of both. He want's a worldwide equivalent of the former Soviet Union and how do you all think that worked out for the Russians? Not well I'm afraid.

Originally posted by TheBandit795
Personally I find it to be ridiculous that I even have to start a thread like this here on ATS... A conspiracy website. But there are still enough members who are still... STILL buying into the Left-Right paradigm, believing that Democrats and Republicans are still two different entities that have different goals for the U.S. population.

Well sure. There are also many 'normal' Americans who would never dream of going to a site like this ('paranoid nutsos') that know perfectly well that the corporations own the country; and yet they still wax neurotic about the partisan talking points (I mean I see spittle and veins popping out in forheads n stuff) like it makes a difference. When you point this out to them the general response goes along these lines (nearly every time); "Well yes. I KNOW but what are we supposed to DO about it?"

Apparently b*tch needlessly about socially diametric talking points so that we are all at each others throats over... nothing really. That's what we're supposed to do about it. Yes that is so much more productive...

*sigh*

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


And unfortunately, the People vs the Corporations is a VERY uneven 'fight', especially when the entire government is the property of those Corporations!


Ahh, but they cannot exist without US.
We have the ultimate advantage in this fight. We can simply walk away from it.
We (human kind) survived for thousands of years without them.
Does that mean that the "fight" is only the realization that there is a choice?
0.02

STH

Yes, I do realize it's much easier said than done. I fail at it every day. But I try.

Originally posted by BobbinHood
I wish the left/right paradigm was over.


Right now America is more politically polarized than it ever has been

Well guess what's benefiting form it firsthand... corporate profiteers, from both the left and the right!

That's the whole joke with liberals and conservatives. It's that BOTH got their hands all deep-stained with corporatism. On one hadn you've got the big capitalist businesses, and on the other, federated unions and "community" organizations, and behind it all, a corporate State backed by the people from all of these sectors!

Welcome to a brave new world of countless, multilevel, phony corporate covers!

reply to post by TheBandit795


Yes, I agree with your post! The Council on Foreign Relations has been successful in at least one of their missions: make the Democratic Party just like the Republican Party.

I can only hope that Dennis Kucinich finally decides to leave the (so-called) Democratic Party and become a Third Party candidate for President in 2012.

I forgot to mention that my friends still act as if there are still two distinct parties. It's like people have been hypnotized into still thinking that way, despite loads of evidence to the contrary. I can't talk with them about it at all because they will just come back and say "well, you have to admit Obama is better than Bush!" or...."Patty Murray is better than Dino Rossi", etc..... It drives me up the wall.......

reply to post by stopthathurts


Yeah, actually the "we the people" (all these lower class workers who don't participate in high finance and high-level politics) are the ones who really got the power. I we ever decide to simply STOP FUNCTIONNING with their system, they'll crumble very quickly.

reply to post by iamcamouflage


The left/right illusion drives the political machinery. Politicians don't necessarily "believe" in a left/right divide, but they use it to create the fear required to win elections. While each side demonizes the other (Foxnews vs. MSM), they are all drinking the same corporate kool-aid. Obama is elected and the Patriot Act that liberals despised became even stronger. They hated Bush for getting US into Iraq, but don't seem to mind Obama getting us deeper into Afghanistan. Likewise, the conservatives will face the same hypocrisy.

Left/right is an illusion....let's get beyond it.

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Very true. I have no doubt that corporations run our country, we are a consumer society. Almost everything we use or consume, is making someone somewhere a lot of money. It sucks, what can we as the people do to stop it? Go live in the woods? yeah, right, why should we have to do that? And to double stab us poor folks, the big corps who run our country give our jobs to OTHER countries.

It's not just that Corporations run your country.. your government is A CORPORATION. You work for a corporation when you use your SSN and pay your taxes.

You can find the Corp of CANADA registered on the Securities and Exchange Commission, I would imagine you can do the same for the US of A, or GREAT BRITAIN. A name in CAPITAL letters defines a body as a corporation, a figment of imagination given breath of life by the consent of its handler. Look up capitis diminutio maxima, look up the difference between Common Law and Admiralty/Maritime Law. One only applies vessels of the sea, and I won't tell you which one! You might be able to guess.

I've in no certain way explained in detail the intricacies of what is actually going on, but I've left you some solid hints. Hopefully you do well with them.

Much luck.

Edit to add: Yes, we should live in the woods. We are killing the Earth, encasing her in a womb of concrete and asphalt never to be born again but through lengthy amounts of time and strife. Cities are death, Cities represent ROME, conquest!!!!! Get rid of them! You don't think you could live in nature? What kind of animal are you? Do you think you are better, more suited for 'civilisation' than a bear who does nothing but co-exist? We _were_ animals until _somebody_ GAVE us civilisation. Do you think our puny human brains could come up with all of this? Go make me a cellphone, build an aqueduct! Living in a city is a paltry existence better suited for the corrupt and uncaring.

Originally posted by DZAG Wright
reply to post by hawkiye

 

You start off by saying you know it's just a facade, and then degenerate into the "socialist" rant. That shows you do not get the picture.

What is being said is we can have a 100% Conservative government and we'll still have socialist things happening, while we can have a 100% Liberal government and have things Conservatives would want.

There are no socialist and capitalists which matter anymore, it's all corporation. When more people like you get this in their heads we can begin somewhere.

Thanks for the laugh looks like I hit a nerve with you...Sigh. Look up some of my post and you will see how ridiculous your statement about me is. I am not against social programs as long as they are funded voluntarily. Recognizing forced socialism is wrong does not degrade the discussion. My point was there are plenty of avowed socialist even here and they are so caught up in thier belief that government should force it they are worthless to try and work together with because these differences are exploited by said government and corporations and they will listen to nothing else.

That fact that you dismiss it as something not worth pointing out shows that it is most likely you who doesn't get it.