Banks spying on your bills, rent payments, paychecks: report

Banks spying on your bills, rent payments, paychecks: report

www.rawstory.com

The age of the plain old credit score is gone, says a report at the Wall Street Journal, and it's been replaced by ever more intrusive efforts by banks and credit agencies to gauge exactly what you're worth, and what you can pay.

To that end, financial firms are now tracking their customers' bank deposits, rent payments or home values, and even utility bills to figure out who may soon become a financial risk, reports WSJ's Karen Blumenthal.

(visit the link for the full news article)

But the efforts don't end there. A new area of research, income estimation, "took off earlier this year," WSJ reports, and involves financial firms collecting information about mortgages, personal loans and credit history to determine how much an individual makes and how much credit they should be given.

In this new era of deep data-mining, even your utility bills and rent check aren't out of bounds.

The banking industry just gets nastier and nastier, the more we find out about it. What really gets me, is that they probably only want to minimize their risk with the more conventional banking operations, so that they can really roll the dice with the more exotic gambling, with the tax-payers on the hook, of course.

This latest trend is scary for a whole plethora of reasons, to include the corrupt and powerful banking industry keeping tabs on our personal lives.

There is something amiss with our entire banking industry and our outlook sure isn't pretty. The really scary thing is that we are their subjects, whether we like it or not and there is little to nothing that we can do about it. Mett your new reality that isn't really new at all, the facade is just peeling away.



--airspoon

www.rawstory.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

I guess I don't have to worry about my fico score now. The banking system makes itself out to be one giant creepy stalker, doesn't it? It seems like a small indicator of where we are headed within our system. We truly have entered the "big brother" era, haven't we. What will they think of next?

Debt is such a curious thing, because the flip side of the word is another known as credit.

People like getting credit, especially credit where they feel credit is due! Like, great thread Airspoon star and flag.

When people get credit it makes them feel good, it's a form of validation, it's some one or some thing saying, you made the grade!

You did good, you are alright, and now you deserve something for your efforts, something that not everyone else is given.

However in your case there are no misgivings.

People like credit, they will go through just about anything to get it, tests, and contests, challenges and tasks, as long as they think there is a chance to have their efforts singled out and rewarded by credit being given where they feel credit is due, there is little people won't accept or do.

So many people will embrace this and think it's a good idea and more fair, especially those that think and imagine that the standards truly better recognize their own true worth. You will never convince them something like this could possibly cause harm.

Of course on the flip side of credit is that word known as debt, which is something God, nor Government, or your Neighbors or Friends will ever let you forget.

The truth is all people don't really want to be equal, they want a gradient scale that rates one's worth bellow or ideally above another's to get credit where they feel credit is due, to have some way to prove the "I am better than you".

Thank goodness for the banks and the corporations that understand this.

Why without it we might all live as brothers and sisters in harmony and bliss.

We couldn't have that now could we?

Originally posted by divinetragedy79
I guess I don't have to worry about my fico score now. The banking system makes itself out to be one giant creepy stalker, doesn't it? It seems like a small indicator of where we are headed within our system. We truly have entered the "big brother" era, haven't we. What will they think of next?

How to cut their cloth according to your inside leg measurments?

Oh, wait, they do that already! Once they've paid themselves a bonus for securing your inside leg measurments that is!

Data Protection be damned.

Anyone who has a checking/savings account with a bank will be spyed on, if you don't want them to know what bills you are paying you can always close them out and pay cash for everything which isn't an easy task these days.

one should not confuse the words debit and credit ,
both have distinct meanings and mean different things

but

its not your money (debit / credit), your leasing it on behalf of the company you lend it from and by agreeing to their terms you at the same time agree to it that they may oversee your transactions.

read your EULA before signing it or complaining about it ,

overseeing of transactions have been a standard for atleast 30 odd years in credit/debit/bank industry.

A lot of the stuff in the article is speculative, and much of what can be done can be prevented. Why anyone would lay out their entire lives on Facebook or MySpace is a complete mystery. (No, I don't need to be told why; I just think it's insanely stupid.)

The last banking fiasco happened in part because banks were at first forced to lend to people who had no hope of repaying because it was so "unfair" that they couldn't also get credit. How stupid is that? But the banks didn't stop there and began lending to anyone on "stated" (unverified) income because the banks knew they could resell the loans in derivitives. You can thank Barney Frank, Fannie Mae, etc. for that clueless move.

On a personal level anyone who uses credit wisely will not have a problem getting credit. You do need some credit to get along, usually, if you're going to fully participate in society. You can't rent a car without a credit card, for example. And you can't usually buy a house without a mortgage, though in some countries you cannot get a mortgage, so you buy a house by saving the full amount. (Vietnam was once this way--don't know if it still is.)

The irony here is that once you get excellent credit, you usually don't need it. My credit score is over 800, but I have no debt beyond monthly bills and don't intend to incur any in the future.

One thing you all might consider doing is "freezing" your credit. It costs $10.00 per credit agency. This locks down your credit and prevents anyone from getting credit in your name (such as in identity theft) and also prevents companies from obtaining a credit report. The downside is that if you want to get a new car loan, for example, you'd have to unfreeze your credit for a short period of time to allow the lending company to get your credit, then freeze it back up again. (Another $20 for the cycle.) Here's a link to show how this is done.

There are lots of things you can do to help yourself fly under the bank's radar here. You just have to be proactive enough to do it.

About 7 or 8 years ago I transferred a significant amount of cash from my savings to my chequing account - it was February, the end of which is the cutoff for claiming RRSPs in Canada for the previous year ... and I made the transfer with the intent of writing a cheque to myself at another institution.

Next day I get a phone call from my bank - they straight up told me they noticed this and wanted to see if I would invest with them and keep my money there. Since they called me, I felt I had them by the kahonas and went in and negotiated the top rate available anywhere.

The next year they hardballed me and wouldn't even negotiate ... people are lazy ... so the modus operandi is once you're in, you'll probably stay in. I'm not lazy and moved my money.

So, I KNOW the banks track and flag certain transactions for their own benefit. And have been for some time.

Originally posted by schuyler

The last banking fiasco happened in part because banks were at first forced to lend to people who had no hope of repaying because it was so "unfair" that they couldn't also get credit. How stupid is that? But the banks didn't stop there and began lending to anyone on "stated" (unverified) income because the banks knew they could resell the loans in derivitives. You can thank Barney Frank, Fannie Mae, etc. for that clueless move.

On a personal level anyone who uses credit wisely will not have a problem getting credit. You do need some credit to get along, usually, if you're going to fully participate in society. You can't rent a car without a credit card, for example. And you can't usually buy a house without a mortgage,

Banks were forced to lend money? by who? so they got loans because it was unfair they couldnt get credit? yes that sounds insane and has me completely baffled?

you do not need a credit card to get along in life. your bank debit card is held on file just as a credit card would be.

recently the banks noticed that our Bank Acc was only used to cash checks and pay bills money that goes in goes out the next day for the most part, they really hate that so now there is a hold on all our checks even payroll for 3 days. even if the amount is in the bank. the banks controlled the collapse make no mistake about that, this was planned, control.

Originally posted by -W1LL
Banks were forced to lend money? by who? so they got loans because it was unfair they couldnt get credit? yes that sounds insane and has me completely baffled?

You've heard of the Community Reinvestment Act, right? Pay particular attention to all the amendmentrs congress has made over the years. Now add some "community organizing" by NGOs staging protests in front of BofA and you have effectively forced banks to make (you're right) insane loans. That's not the ONLY thing that caused all the fuss, but it certainly did contribute.

you do not need a credit card to get along in life. your bank debit card is held on file just as a credit card would be.

Have you ever rented a car with only a debit card? A debit card, btw, is directly attached to your checking account and does not always have the same identity-theft protections and guarantees as a credit card (Some do; some don't). If you use your debit card for online transactions I maintain THAT'S insane, too. I'm not saying you can't get along without a credit card, but you cannot participate fully in normal transactions, including online, without one. For example, try making a hotel reservation without a credit card. They'll want a 'guarantee' even if you wind up paying cash. Nothing wrong with being a hermit; it's just more difficult.

Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by -W1LL
Banks were forced to lend money? by who? so they got loans because it was unfair they couldnt get credit? yes that sounds insane and has me completely baffled?

You've heard of the Community Reinvestment Act, right? Pay particular attention to all the amendmentrs congress has made over the years. Now add some "community organizing" by NGOs staging protests in front of BofA and you have effectively forced banks to make (you're right) insane loans. That's not the ONLY thing that caused all the fuss, but it certainly did contribute.

you do not need a credit card to get along in life. your bank debit card is held on file just as a credit card would be.

Have you ever rented a car with only a debit card? A debit card, btw, is directly attached to your checking account and does not always have the same identity-theft protections and guarantees as a credit card (Some do; some don't). If you use your debit card for online transactions I maintain THAT'S insane, too. I'm not saying you can't get along without a credit card, but you cannot participate fully in normal transactions, including online, without one. For example, try making a hotel reservation without a credit card. They'll want a 'guarantee' even if you wind up paying cash. Nothing wrong with being a hermit; it's just more difficult.

edit on 11/7/2010 by schuyler because: (no reason given)

yes I have rented a car and hotel with only a debit card and I did not have to give my card # to the hotel or the car company until I was there, they also did not charge me until I was done with my stay or use of the car I can call three hotels that I personally have stayed at and make a reservation there with nothing more than my name.


I buy online all the time and you know what I do I put the money in the Acc before the bills get paid. if you dont have any $$ in the account there is nothing to get stolen, simple as that. sure I might not be able to spend 500$ on a new toy that I see somewhere but it also makes me think twice about spending a large amount of money.
and it really is not that big of a deal to go to my safe and get the cash. so I have to disagree you can participate FULLY in normal transactions without a credit I card I have lived my life for over three years without any type of credit. and I have also been on the other side of the debt prison as-well.


I dont see how very small protests in front of a bank is forcing any bank to give risky loans, and I will need some more direction as to how the community reinvestment act also forces banks to do anything.
I knew several loan officers who were handing out loans to anyone and everyone they could get approved and I know for a fact the banks were looking for the more risky people to give the loans too. I was asked to provide a college degree, with a credit score of 750 and a bank Acc. at 30K they were going to deny me because I didnt have a college degree. yet my neighbor a self employed struggling rap artist got his loan approved in half the time it took me. this was in 2006 late 2005 when the golden approved stamp was in all the home loan bankers hands.

in the end it doesn't matter the reasons that got us here, it is the same people control us with the same false debt $ system.

Nice find.. S&F

I am curious what would happen if people started to demand their employers pay them in cash and side step banks all together.

reply to post by Xcathdra


Government employees can, at least GS positions, military retirement and VA. With the VA, it's even the default payment method. It comes in the form of a Treasury Dept. check, similar to social security. However, many banks won't cash a social security check, unless you have an account there. It makes you wonder if this is why.


--airspoon

reply to post by airspoon


I would have thought that ever since direct debits and standing orders came in the banks were in a position to see this information on your account, and to be honest since a lot of tax payers money is now tied up supporting banks it doesn't worry me.

What I really like is the fact EVERYONE likes to blame the banks and doesn't seem to BLAME the IDIOTS that took credit when they were in the best position to know there was no way in hell they could pay it back

I think this is kind of funny, only for the fact that i over drafted my bank account and have no plan on repaying my school loans. They can look all they want but until they decide to actually do something, I see no point in this. This country is going down too fast, this isn't going to fix anything and won't help us soon enough. But like I said, let them spy on my bills and what not because if they're just going to see that I am in debt and what not and not do anything, it's pointless. And just think of how many other people in the country do the same exact thing as me. Do they think this is going to fix it? Quite funny really.

Banks charge people to cash cheques if they have no account.Even if it is a goverment cheque supposedly cashable at any branch of any bank.....
Even if you have multiple ids!
it still costs 5 dollars or more to get your welfare cheque cashed, and many many wefare recipients have no bank account.
These slime are ripping off the poor as well as the rich,but the rich have the option of investing in them.

This in nothing new. Banks have been doing this for a hundred years or more. It is SOP for them.

reply to post by wmd_2008

What I really like is the fact EVERYONE likes to blame the banks and doesn't seem to BLAME the IDIOTS that took credit when they were in the best position to know there was no way in hell they could pay it back

Because the problem is with the banks. When those "idiots" took loans that they couldn't pay, they lost whatever it is they took the loans for (i.e. homes or colatoral). The banks on the other hand loaned out this money, seemingly with the inderstanding that the tax-payers would be on the hook. So, they not only made money from these bad loans, but they then made money from the tax-payers when they drove their respective company in the ground by handing out the bad loans in the first place.

It is up to the bank to decide who gets a loan and who doesn't and if they want to give loans out to people who can't pay them back, then all fine and dandy but don't leave me holding the bag. The banks gambled with our money and when they lost it all, we were forced to hand over more. I could care less whether some turkey can't pay back his loan because I didn't approve his loan in the first place and it should have nothing to do with me.

This is a banking scandal, not a scandal by some fella who got in over his head, regardless of what the "bought and paid for" media tells you. The banks and bankers knew exactly what they were doing and they knew that those loans were bad, yet they sucked them dry and then left us, the tax-payers, on the hook for the bill. When it is all said and done, it is the bankers who came out on top and the peasant who payed for it all. Basically, what it boils down to, is that the tax-payer was forced to hand over billions of dollars to pay for rich bankers' yachts, mansions, coc aine habits, prostitutes or whatever else the elite like to spend their money on these days.



--airspoon

I'm sorry, but every time I've ever applied for a loan or whatever, it's just been routine that a bank would ever have this information. Even used car lots need to know you're expenses to know whether or not you can afford the car you're wanting to buy.

How is this post not continuing a trend of inciting fear and opposition to banks and the banking industry? Although everyone seems to want to forget it, aspects of the banking industry can be traced back to the Knights Templar. . .who by many are supposed to be the good guys.

If you know of a bank that will give credit without knowing my income and expenses. . .please post a number so I can call them!