Does a fetus feel pain before 24 weeks of gestation?

According to this article, no. The study shows that a baby is in an unconscious state before 24 weeks, and cannot feel pain.

I'm not sure how I fee about this, whether or not it should ease the mind of women who decide to have an abortion, or not.

www.telegraph.co.uk... alth/healthnews/7854109/Unborn-baby-cannot-feel-pain-before-abortion-limit-report.html

Research from the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists has found that the feotus cannot experience pain before 24 weeks and is kept in an unconscious state while in the womb.

There is another article on the link, where people brought home a baby born at 23 weeks, that survived.


www.telegraph.co.uk... 14140/Baby-born-at-23-weeks-home-with-parents.html

Lexie Slater-Folksman is being hailed by her proud family as living proof of their campaign against abortion laws.

Seems like a contradiction to me, to find 2 articles with varying proof on the same site.

Would this new information about a fetus not being able to feel pain before 24 weeks change your mind at all, when seeing that a baby born at 23 weeks, has survived?

To these reports and not directed at you I would say: If I kill you but inflict no pain?

Is it still murder?

reply to post by Blanca Rose


Blanca,

I want to say, please do not have an abortion.

There is a child saying please do not murder me.

reply to post by stoo82


Good question.

I just find it curious, that the baby born at 23 weeks survived, and so does that mean it felt no pain outside of the wormb, until it was 24 weeks old?

I wasn't there for the birth of this baby, but I'll bet you it could cry, and be fed food before it was 24 weeks old!

Originally posted by stoo82
To these reports and not directed at you I would say: If I kill you but inflict no pain?

Is it still murder?

Heh, of course it is. If someone sneaks into your home while you are drunk, gives a fatal shot of anesthetic you wont feel it, but I think you would have still considered it murder.

In personal opin... If there is no brain development there is no individual life-it's basically a tumor. Up until the point of brain wave detection (Think the earliest is 14 weeks) I have no qualms with abortion. Later I think it depends on threat to the mother... That being said my opinion has no bearing on the rights and bodies of others. I don't think I will ever be in the situation where that choice will come up so in the meantime, those who are in that place have nothing but my sympathy.

Originally posted by stoo82
To these reports and not directed at you I would say: If I kill you but inflict no pain?

Is it still murder?

I've had similar thoughts. I remember a while back reading about a condition where people literally feel no pain.

Found it:
en.wikipedia.org...

I'd say yes to your question.






[edit on 26-6-2010 by cLOUDDEAD]

Originally posted by lordtyp0
That being said my opinion has no bearing on the rights and bodies of others. I don't think I will ever be in the situation where that choice will come up so in the meantime, those who are in that place have nothing but my sympathy.

I feel the same way. I have never been forced into a situation where I would have to decide on something like this, and have always felt sympathy for anybody who has been.

I'm pretty sure there is no way you can make a woman feel better about having an abortion, facts or not, they are still going to feel like the worst person on earth until it heals. I'm pro choice, but personally never would as it too me 43 months to fall pregnant with this baby.

But personally, and from what i've heard from friends, you will feel bad no matter what you decide so imo, these studies end up just hurting womens rights more.

reply to post by cLOUDDEAD


The article you linked is for people with a congenital condition that allows them to feel presssure, and not pain. There is a 1 in 125 million chance of people being born with this.

Are you saying it's ok to murder them, like it would be ok to abort a fetus before 24 weeks?

I can't say I agree with this.

If a fetus can respond to sound and kick at 20 weeks, is it still in a unconscious state?

If a fetus at 20 weeks moves closer to a flash light shinned at your belly is it still in a unconscious state?

Just because someone is in an unconscious state it doesn't mean they can't feel pain. Look at people in car accidents.

How did they determine all this?

My husband would talk to my belly and my son would jump all around. This was before we found out we were having a boy at our 20 week u/s. Both of my girls responded to sound and light prior to 6 months of pregnancy.

Originally posted by bkaust
I'm pretty sure there is no way you can make a woman feel better about having an abortion, facts or not, they are still going to feel like the worst person on earth until it heals. I'm pro choice, but personally never would as it too me 43 months to fall pregnant with this baby.

But personally, and from what i've heard from friends, you will feel bad no matter what you decide so imo, these studies end up just hurting womens rights more.

You do feel bad whether it is by choice or not. I had a loss at 13 weeks. My body just did not want to let go. I had to go in for a D&C. All of my insurance paperwork coded it as an abortion. I was so upset. It did not matter if you wanted the baby or not they code it as an aborted fetus. I was crushed needless to say.

Unless you have a threat to your life and or some crazy genetic problem. 6 months is a little late so while I am pro choice. I am against late term abortions of a live fetus/baby.

Come to think of it, wasn't there a similar study done on lobsters? Some law which said the animal can't feel pain so the seafood groups commissioned a study which said lobsters don't have the brain functions to feel pain. Something profoundly stupid like that.

At least I usually associate blood curdling death screams as a sign that pain is being felt.

Though conflicted... though it's relevant in a study of pain and whether it is moral if pain isn't felt... Still feel kind of dirty bringing the second study up :/

Originally posted by JRho900


My husband would talk to my belly and my son would jump all around. This was before we found out we were having a boy at our 20 week u/s. Both of my girls responded to sound and light prior to 6 months of pregnancy.

I agree with you 100% on this. I had a set of twins, and I could feel them moving around just at about 4 months, and I swear, those boys were already boxing at that time! They also responded to music, and would get hiccups if I ate something a little too spicy!

nevermind

[edit on 26-6-2010 by Carseller4]

A woman has the right to her own body.

No-one can tell you what to do with your own body.

Who cares.

Do you remember *being* a fetus?

Exactly. End of argument.

reply to post by catwhoknows


That might be true, however, when a woman is pregnant, isn't there another body inside of hers?

Yep, she should be able to decide whether or not to have a surgury, but what can the body inside of hers do about the descision?

Originally posted by SquirrelNutz

Who cares.

Do you remember *being* a fetus?

Exactly. End of argument.

Well, if you didn't make it past the fetal stage, you wouldn't be here in this thread responding.

I can't remember much before the age of 5, so I think your argument is a little silly!

Originally posted by JRho900
I can't say I agree with this.

If a fetus can respond to sound and kick at 20 weeks, is it still in a unconscious state?

If a fetus at 20 weeks moves closer to a flash light shinned at your belly is it still in a unconscious state?

Just because someone is in an unconscious state it doesn't mean they can't feel pain. Look at people in car accidents.

How did they determine all this?

My husband would talk to my belly and my son would jump all around. This was before we found out we were having a boy at our 20 week u/s. Both of my girls responded to sound and light prior to 6 months of pregnancy.

Agree.

I felt our little girl move at 17weeks 5 days. From then on it was every day. Now it's constant. even now she's kicking the crap outta me (32 weeks). From beginning weeks on, she would kick with certain music, but not with others, and she would kick when my partner would say goodbye in the morning. I would assume that a fetus that can hear and respond is not in an unconscious state, and would possibly be able to feel pain. Even so, like i said, these sort of things won't help a woman out when she's struggling to face a decision like abortion/termination. It is what it is. Hard, difficult, painful, guilt racking, but woman's choice. This might sound sexist, but i really don't believe men should have an opinion on Abortion (unless of course its a partner etc involved in the decision) But what i mean is, i don't believe men have a right to Judge.

reply to post by Blanca Rose


Blanca,

That person inside you has no choice.

So I am going to ask you to give that person a choice to live?