"Chinese government buying up our farms"

www.dailytelegraph.com.au...


I'm not sure how reliable this is, but it does fit in with China's ever-expanding needs. The proximity to the mainland would make it a feasible move, as well.



Any thoughts on where China will go after there's no more farmland to buy down there?


As always, ATS, I welcome your input, insights, and any other relevant information you may have to offer.

China-hating is not what this thread is about. Respect for the Chinese is.

A worthy opponent makes you a better player, after all. Their culture is much, much older and wiser than ours by the simple virtue of having a long time to figure out what works and what doesn't for them.

They have seen many countries and kingdoms rise and fall, and thus feel superior to most if not all others on Earth.

Currently, rather than spending research dollars and time on new technology, they made savvy deals with industrial leaders to build, at reduced costs, top-selling cars and other goods. The outside company comes in, builds infrastructure, trains workers, builds and sells in China, and the Chinese cleverly copy what they like for their own markets. Since the government has little to no investment in these types of arrangements, they can sell the goods at a cheaper price in their own country than any trade partner could dream of. Of course, there are contracts in place as well, to limit how much time the outsiders have to build and market their wares inside China, before these factories revert back to government ownership.

So, for them, it's a clever and easy win-win. Do we doubt that they are just as brilliant in other areas?

I would consider myself a poor student of world affairs if I ever overlooked China, period, concerning any aspect of our modern existence. They are too big, too strong, and too smart to be ignored.

Again, I welcome your thoughts on what could be a sign of China's inevitable spread, possibly westward at some point in the future?

They have also been at the crest of almost every major human rights violation since the 80s. They have a 1 child policy which is draconian, so while I would respect the culture, and even the history of China, I disrespect the current government and would think to nefarious purposes for these farms. China worries me because of how smart and patient they are, slowly buying up all the resources and food and laying low, while everyone else wastes their money on wars and terrorism.

[edit on 17-6-2010 by hippomchippo]

In this free market world (well western world) if you have the money to pay up front then you can buy it. If I had the money and wanted to buy up a bunch of farms in say Poland or Ecuador you bet I could.

Then I could hire some workers, farm the land and export the food or whatever crop to any place I please since I'd be the owner.

In other news; doesn't the house of Saud/Saudi royal family own something like 13% of US real estate? I would look it up but im on a cell phone ;P

Zebra


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by hippomchippo
I disrespect the current government and would think to nefarious purposes for these farms. China worries me because of how smart and patient they are, slowly buying up all the resources and food and laying low, while everyone else wastes their money on wars and terrorism.

[edit on 17-6-2010 by hippomchippo]

Same thing was said about Japan during the 80s and 90s. They were buying up land in America. Now look at them. Same boat we are in..sinking and the captain is AWOL.

It has been announced a few weeks ago that Chinese were buying lots of farmlands in Québec. Canada, too.

I wonder what could happen if they decided to close the farms, once they are in possession of them all... Would or governments protect these "private properties" in case we were to be hungry and would want to use them?

with steven harper I wouldn't be surprised. Well okay that was more a cheap shot on my part than anything but I imagine if it came to that Canada would use the land whether the gov't allowed us to or not. If it came to using private property or starving... I dunno. It would be pretty hard to spin that one though perhaps I am giving our population too much credit.

It could be entirely feasible that some would criticize the breaking of the law in order to eat, but they probably wouldn't have the energy to keep it up for long.

Cheers

[edit on 17-6-2010 by thebulldog]

I recall reading reports about China's aging population and how many younger Chinese were leaving the farms for a life in the city.

Could this be a reason as to why Chinese are looking elsewhere for their future food supply?

Well im happy that you bring the subjet and its true. I live east of montreal and it made the headlines in here.it is known that they're about or very interested in buying at least 40 000 hectars of land....and also i work 50 hrs/week at a fruit &vegetables warehouse and we are regularly recieving offers to be bought by chinese interests,

I guess i dont have to say that food is going to be a major issue in the next years. No need for a web bot to know its going to happen, they will succeed.

Personally, being bought by chinese sucks big time

reply to post by jam321


And they might use their farming lands to build new cities perhaps? It would be a bold and dangerous move, but...

reply to post by SSimon


And then, we'll have to buy farmlands in another country... Yes, somebody's gonna suffer from hunger down the line, again...

I am near Montréal, as well.

Great informative thread on a topic the GOVT wants us to ignore.
Once it was about nationhood, you didnt sell out to the enemy, now the enemy just buys us lock stock and barrell, because all the laws protectting nationhood have been erased or circumnavigated?
Traitors are in our midst in every western nation.....they are known as capitalists.
The Chinese are plotting the settling of their citizens in every corner of the globe.
They are humans like us but they do not hold our best interests, and communism is their creed.
We should be outlawing these sales?
We should have more respect for our nationhood.

Here are another couple of links:

Chinese coalminer to buy up Aussie farms
I'm a bit surprised that anything under $320 million isn't reviewed by our Foreign Investment Review Board.

And this one from back in January:

Sugar bid sparks fears of China buying out the Aussie farm

Rather a long article but interesting. A couple of quotes that stand out for me:

Party officials in Beijing now admit they erred in investing so much of their national savings in US Government treasury securities, particularly with the savage fall in the value of the US dollar in the past year, when China should have been buying resource assets in places such as Australia.
Until two years ago, China's interest in Australia had been deliberately low key. The directive from Beijing to its corporate chiefs was to operate under the radar, to create minimal fuss. But the global financial meltdown changed everything.

Thanks for the informative responses and links, everyone.

I find it amazingly ironic that private property is still forbidden in China, yet their government is now owner of parts of capitalist countries.

Especially since it is prime farmland.

I have a hard time believing that governments would allow Chinese cities to be built outright, but give it a decade, a few outbuildings and business deals later, and you've got the beginnings of one, nonetheless.

I had no idea about the Canadian holdings. Great information. Please add any other relevant information out there, folks.

It's good to keep an eye on them. They are using capitalism and open society as their weapon against us.

reply to post by Copperflower


A couple of points I would like to add:

The Chinese have been buying up large amounts of agricultural land in Africa for quite some number of years.

There is one or two places in China you can have freehold title, but...that is neither here nor there. The reality is noone truly and arguably owns the land in somewhere like Australia anyhow - if you buy freehold, you are still effectively 'renting' off the commonwealth, and are subject to land taxes and council rates. Failure to pay these taxes, your property can be, and will be, relieved off your hands by the real owner, the government or commonwealth.

As for cities being built, impossible. Strict planning and zoning regulations on Australian rural land would quickly put stop to this notion.

Arabs, in fact, have owned huge stations and swathes of land in Aus for many many years. Farmland. I wouldn't be too spooked by the occassional Chinese buying property, as in fact many nationals the world over already own large areas of farming land.

That said I am not making excuses or being an apologist, just putting a couple of points out there.

I read once also that in times of war, or crisis, the government has the right to commandeer farmland and use its resources for the good of the country.

They arent stupid. Arable land is the single most valuable thing in the world when all the bubbles burst. No matter what happens, even if everything else comes crashing down, people will need food.

Also, its dirt cheap now in many places, no pun intended.

reply to post by cloudbreak

Thanks for that clarification, Cloud. Nice to know that there are measures in place to protect the original ownership of the land, truly the most valuable resource of all, along with the water.

China's huge population, the one-child policy, and lack of expansion room can lead to only one thing, and that's a gradual spread.

reply to post by Copperflower


Yes - as far as farmland goes though, Africa and Mongolia is a far far greater focus, because of much much cheaper costs, and the fact it is easier to get Chinese workers to these areas.

Even the Arabs who own farms in Aus, these farms are still run by Aussies, and have Aussie workers. You cannot just buy a farm then ship a whole lot of workers there. Particularly in Australia.

Any were they want exempt parts of Europe and Siberia, because Russia would need those lands. But if you have the moneys I don't see whats stopping them from buying anything they need from anywhere Canada USA Australia middle east etc. China is growing and so there appetite is growing and there coffers just keep getting bigger, and we live in a world were if you got the cash nothing is out of bounds. And yea one can only admire them, unlike most Americans and others in the world that will sell everything for a few shiny trinkets, china seems to be able to keep its eyes on whats important, and slowly and diligently working to those goals. They got there eye on the ball alright.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


Very astute, Galad, much like the Chinese themselves.

For four great years, I worked with a Taiwanese woman who ran her own business, a busy restaurant in a small college town. Only three of us ran the whole place, and we all hustled, let me tell you.

We grew to respect one another, and what can be accomplished when movers and shakers get together, especially with the specific opportunities present in America, and the South in particular.

She had lived and worked in Dallas and Boston before opening her (second) restaurant. The first had prospered in another town, but a highway moved and her business dried up. So this was her second, carefully chosen, and extremely well-placed. She and her husband bought the whole building and lived above the restaurant with their young daughter.

I learned more about non-corporate restaurant operations from this woman than any other place or class could teach me. She explained a lot about ordinary life in Taiwan, how it's different than mainland China. How she had grown up on a farm, much like myself, but moved to the largest city and gotten into waiting tables. She bought herself a cruise with some other young women and met her husband in San Francisco. He was a Vietnam vet living there, and they married. The rest of their story is above.

I should add that he was a vet from the other side, impressed into the Communist army, his family and village threatened, his own life at stake if he refused. He described things that had driven him to drink. His mother actually came from Vietnam and spent a month there, so I got to know her too. They were all just simple people. Good people. I saw the same things in his eyes that we see in our vets' eyes, if we really look.

Obviously, I grew to be very close with these people, and learned many, many things about China that made me understand what a major power they are, and how inconceivable it is to them that it should change.

As they grow, they will certainly continue to make moves that support their vast infrastructure, and cement their power ever more.

They are the largest force on the planet, nation-wise, and like a planetary body, their huge mass has a irresistible gravitational force in our world.

Like the sun, we should not fail to understand as much as possible about them, and simply respect them for what and who they are, and who they are becoming.

We want the same, after all. It's only decent and certainly wise.

Thanks to everyone for your contributions to this thread. My personal opinion is simple: if one wants to become a master chess player, observation of the current master is a crucial step, and most beneficial to the one wishing to achieve mastery. We can learn a lot by simply observing how things are working there, and how they are or aren't working out.

They are Major Chumps and will do anything to advance their goals....JMO