Muslim response to Draw Muhammad Day, Tit-for-Tat

Having claimed to be antagonized by portraits (many derogatory admittedly) submitted to Facebook and other sites across the net, I find the response of 'some' Muslims incomprehensible when I ran across this link:

www.facebook.com...

So now we have pages of Muhammad drawings facing off against the Holocaust. I find this just a little hypocritical and contradictory to the respect Islam claims to have for other religions (which, by law of the Qur'an, they don't; regardless of what any Muslim tells you, if you're not a Muslim he/she is taught to disrespect you and your beliefs).

The Muhammad day has led to Facebook being banned in Pakistan. One Muslim poster related the disrespect of Muhammed to someone painting insults of your mother on their house... which is nonsense. No living person ever met Muhammad. If he or Allah are talking to you, you're just thinking - yes in your head - it's a good thing, carry on doing it but believing it's your own thoughts and maybe you can drop this nonsense.

As an Atheist I'm in a position of not having to care about these things, but the fact is that with the western multi-culturalism it all affects our lives now. Tensions are rising and yet no one will ever be able to prove who is right or wrong so all religious waste their lives feeling bitter and angry toward someone because of their chosen denomination. Where will this stop? Nuclear war is my guess, and right now I don't think it could come sooner. Maybe the next world will be completely secular. Here's hoping anyway.

reply to post by Pr0t0

If they could bring themselves to accept that "tit-for-tat" was a sufficient response, then "tit-for-tat" would be reasonable behaviour, in my opinion.

It is the disproportionate, more violent response, which is unacceptable.

True, Disraeli, but it doesn't end with Islam. How many Palestinians have suffered at the hands of Jewish settlers disproportionately, over things as tiny and insignificant as blasphemy, or simply just being different?

It's about time all faiths said enough is enough "We're all wrong", because with 6.600 religions there is not a snowman's chance in anyone's definition of hell that ANY speak the truth 100%.

I wish we could have a bit of ambiguity in religion; there's nothing wrong with saying "I don't know, I don't have all the facts". It would save millions of lives.

There's 700 people in that group as i write this, you can hardly call that "muslims".
Besides, i think 4chan did it anyway.

reply to post by GoodFella


Who cares? Let anyone think what they want. They are allowed to respond, if some felt hurt by what a few americans did why can't they respond? Nothing to see here..

Just curious, anyone know what ATS's position on drawing Muhammad is?? If someone posted a picture in a thread of his likeness, would it be removed??

reply to post by Pr0t0


So some Muslims compare the comic illustration of a probably fictional character to the systematic slaughter of millions of European Jews, all of whom had real faces, names and families? Wow... ignorance knows no bounds.

EDIT:
Thank you for sharing this.

[edit on 21-5-2010 by dontblink]

reply to post by BeastMaster2012


I agree in the most part. Anyone can respond. I brought the link here to show others what, predominantly Muslims, have set up in direct response.

"Nothing to see here.. "

Who are you to judge what is/is not of interest to others. It's that kind of ignorance and dismissive attitude that doesn't belong here.

reply to post by stereovoyaged


I would say its fair game. There are no international, nor American (where the servers are) laws against blasphemy. Its a respect issue, but if you're posting to back up a statement relating to the draw Muhammad day with an illustration, then why not?

Besides you can post as many pictures of other prophets you like so to block one would mean to have to block all.

These unthinking folks who started this crusade to offend a religion with well over a billion people I hope are satisfied with the harm they probably will cause. They made their point but what will the results be?

Here are some real and other possibilities of harm this counterproductive activity can cause:

Many moderate Muslims who had sympathy for the cause of freedom and don’t even adhere to the conviction regarding not drawing an image of the Prophet are now being offended, as well as the ignorant fundamentalist fools who would threaten someone over this.

Harming millions in Pakistan and believe me Saudi Arabia is next to be cut off from these sites.

Face book threatened

Innocent people may be threatened and harmed by those psycho fundamentalist. Will all those brave people who offended Islam with their remote artwork defend those innocents?

These people who do this remote offending people by drawing pictures of Muhammad are really cowards since no one will come after them because no one knows where they are; therefore what they are doing doesn’t take any courage and it amounts to throwing raw meat at an animal—Islamic fundamentalists— and riling them up to threaten others because of this offensive draw Muhammad day.

The Buddhists have a principle called skillful means that implies that one should use reason and logic in things like this.

This draw Muhammad day will probably cause more harm than good

This to me is not skillful means

reply to post by GoodFella


Rules one and two please
2nd

reply to post by inforeal


I understand your point inforeal, but should we really give into this kind of bullying by fanatical Islam? This entire mess blew out of proportion when political satirists tried to express their right to free speech by depicting Mohammad in a satirical light. Immediately violence was threatened against the cartoonists and their nations... is that an example of skillfull means? They want their religion, their worldview and by extension their prophet above critique, to be the exception to the rule.

While I agree that "Draw Mohammad Day" is not a good idea in many ways, I respect the right of every man, woman and child to draw whomever and whatever they wish. We need to show that we will not be intimidated by a group who would use their supposed religious sensibilities as a smokescreen to carry out violent attacks that they would most likely carry out anyway. These zealots are nothing more than thugs who look for any excuse to lash out at anything or anyone that challenges the supreme authority of their religious doctrine and encourages freedom of thought and expression. We must rally to defend free speech, not bury our heads in the sand.

reply to post by dontblink


There is no proof that millions of Khazars died. There is no proof that everyone posting on that FB page is a Muslim. I'm waiting for you to tell me how I'm anti-Semitic (anti-Arabs, anti-Persian, anti-Palestinian, and others of the actual Semite bloodline). I guess you can't use that card since you admit the "Jews" of discussion are European. Can't have your cake and eat it to can you?

[edit on 21-5-2010 by TSawyer]

Yeah... yeah.... yeah..... religion this and religion does that.....

My personal favorite blasphemer.... heretic... witch hunt... is...

TAH DAH!!!!

The "COMMIES ARE COMIN' DUH COMMIES ARE COMING"....

I assume the polarized opposite would be something like....

The "CAPITALIST BOURGEOIS PIGS ARE COMIN'.... DUH CAPITALIST PIGS ARE COMING".

All nuts/extremists have a "cause"....

The cause doesn't have to be "religion"....

The fanatic just has to be a "true believer" in his or her "faith".

Dontblink, don’tblink when one of those fundamentalist maniacs kills someone because of this.

BTW I know these fundamentalist, I have fought them, intellectually, practically all my adult life.

You don’t throw raw meat at them, is my point. I would never concede an inch to that kind, who I think are abysmally ignorant, Islamicaly wrong, and of a thug gangster mentality. But I also know a pit bull should be skillfully dealt with, not dealt with by raising a red flag in their faces. It may be emotionally satisfying but it is dangerous.

What’s in our favor is that there are really not many of them amongst the fundamentalist who would stoop to violence, but there are enough of them to be a danger to everybody.

All fundamentalist are not terrorist, thank God. They are religiously speaking . . . primitive, nativistic, and backwards, but most are just ordinary ignorant people. The few who stoop to violence are of the same mentality of the Christian and Jewish, even Hindu religious bigoted fundamentalist murderers. Why are there more in Islam is for many reasons, I don’t have the time to go into now, but there is a reason for that.

reply to post by KOGDOG

All nuts/extremists have a "cause"....

The cause doesn't have to be "religion"....

The fanatic just has to be a "true believer" in his or her "faith".

The only other options I can think of off the top of my head are land ownership (mostly religious; see Ireland, Israel/Palestine) or political (mostly religious, economic).

I can't wait to see the scientific community take arms against religion if your theory is correct... but I sincerely doubt it.

reply to post by inforeal


inforeal, you make a very good point. I don't pretend to know the answers to everything, and I agree that any kind of wanton disrepect is dangerous when it comes to dealing with religous fundamentalists of any faith. I just don't see any way to deal with these people with logic since they clearly have none, or very little at most. I'm not saying let's engage in the systematic mockery of the Islamic faith, if I came off that way I sincerely apologize, I just don't think we should back down when the threat of violence is used to stifle free speech.

Drawing Mohammad just to do it or because it will inflame or provoke some Muslim people is no better than the response it invokes from fundamentalists. I'm not into provocation, I welcome dialoge but, I refuse to be intimidated.

Let's continue this discussion, either in this thread or on U2U. You clearly have a very good argument and I would relish the opportunity to learn from you.

Edited for typos....whoops

[edit on 21-5-2010 by dontblink]

Originally posted by Pr0t0
I can't wait to see the scientific community take arms against religion if your theory is correct... but I sincerely doubt it.

Wow.... you definitely don't live in my "university" community.

Here "they" openly write in the university paper that "we don't want Christians working on our paper".

It's OK to be "religious" at the "university" as long as you don't really believe that "superstitious nonsense".

I find this just a little hypocritical and contradictory to the respect Islam claims to have for other religions (which, by law of the Qur'an, they don't; regardless of what any Muslim tells you, if you're not a Muslim he/she is taught to disrespect you and your beliefs).

I think you give yourself away right there. I have many Muslim friends who respect me and my right to believe and worship God how I choose. Where did you gain this profound knowledge about Muslims? Oh and I have read the Quran btw

Dontblink, we all can learn from each other. I think your attitude is reasonable and clear headed. I always did, for I understand the emotion to repel these kinds.

Dealing with this is a challenge we really indeed must face, and I hope with understanding and resolve, against this kind of barbarism, humans can learn transcend and become better together.

You see in my religion, Sufism, the mystical side of Islam, my fellow Sufis have been murdered in Iran by the fundamentalist for centuries.

Years ago growing up in a liberal Muslim community when those fundamentalist [Salafi Muslims] visited us to preach that we should go back to 10 century as they live, our teacher would always say: “Just win your argument”
Though these types are so rigid in thinking it usually takes years for them to develop out of their insular ethnocentric religiosity.

Back then they weren’t violent. They became violent [ some of them] after the old Russian Afghanistan war with the creation of the Mujahhadid. The CIA and the Pakistan intelligence helped create them.

But understand that many fundamentalist, such as many in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, and Afghanistan aren’t violent. This is a recent phenomenon.

Those same fundamentalist who use to visit our mosque were never violent until after that war in Afghanistan.

I don’t know how that happened, perhaps they started smoking some of the dope they were importing [lol]

Their Islamic world view has come out of Saudi Arabia Wahhabi Islam [ a reaction to sufism] and the ideas of an Egyptian religious political Muslim who founded the Muslim Brotherhood, Syed Qutb. [All this is recent . . . 18 19 20th century]. Though most likely even he would be horrified by the tactics of these current terrorist using the Islamic banner to commit their crimes.

What people in the west don’t realize is that Muslims, since the inception of these Islamic terrorist phenomena, have been condemning them, its just that the western press doesn’t publicize it as they should.

www.jihadwatch.org...

www.allvoices.com...

www.shahbazcenter.org...

www.religioustolerance.org...

From a Muslim . . . me!
These so called Islamic terrorist are the lowest of the low, and should be condemned and destroyed because of their actions of murder, mass murder, and un-Islamic threats to innocent people.

When they cease their destructive works, only then should their destruction be halted.

Peace and justice