Biggest ATS Problem: Running Away from Tough Questions

I've seen a very disturbing trend in threads and posts. Good rebuttles and threads are avoided like the plague. And by "good" i mean extremely hard to prove wrong, or very well argued points, and things of that nature.

I see extremely well phrased and argued posts left to rot because no one wants to challenge it and risk being wrong. This needs to stop. You should believe something, not because you support it, or because your parents believed it, or your school taught it, but because you try non stop to prove it wrong, but can't.

I noticed myself doing this one day, and i was so disturbed that i would think about ignoring evidence, i berated myself sharply and dove into the discussion. the topic does not matter, but know this, my views were changed that day, and my life is different.

So i challenge you, seek out difficult threads and posts, confront them, people who fear being wrong fear the truth.

That's not ATS biggest problem. ATS biggest problem actually.. that ATS is too apparent of a corporation. It's weird.. it's like if Wal Mart or Google try to promote democracy.
But you did bring up a good point. S&F.

reply to post by Jazzyguy


haha, thanks for the imput, but i disagree! =P

Great thread actually and I agree.

It is disappointing that people ignore the hard core threads that can really blow your mind.

Just for kicks, I dare anyone to debunk my old thread on the dangers of Tamiflu and Relenza. I doubt it's possible, honestly.

I worked very hard on it, and I kind of feel like it's bulletproof.

"WARNING AntiViral Drugs may Kill You!"
www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by muzzleflash


yes, it seems more and more that threads are ignored because the majority disagree, but can't prove it wrong.

Some of my best threads are ignored! I will dig out some of my old threads to use as examples.


www.abovetopsecret.com...
I found a document that use to be classified that shows how Pearl Harbor was rumored before the attack.I notice people star threads that are hard to argue and leave. No discussion at all.

[edit on 23-4-2010 by Phlynx]

I see this problem all the time on ATS, Bob. I've been contemplating it myself recently, because some threads I am a part of just refuse to respond to rational, and well-thought-out responses. I didn't think of actually posting a thread calling this problem to light though, so S&F for you for doing that.

I think it's important that we take your thread to heart, ATS isn't a soapbox for anything and everything that flashes through any given persons' head. It's for arguments, alternate views, and little-known things. Intellectual discussion is a vital aspect when it comes to such forums.

I only wish everyone enjoyed a good, deep-thinking discussion as much as I did.

Oh well.

Good thread though.

~ Wandering Scribe

reply to post by Phlynx


I hear you man! Me too. I have spent hours on what I consider to be a pertinent post for today's world, a valiant effort to awaken the masses, and it get mostly ignored. then I type one up on a hunch, spend a whole 30 minutes on it, and it turns out like this one did. It's a fickle world, and a strange forum. We come in here and do our best, and a great singer said it best in a little song called The Boxer.
"A man hears what he wants to hear, and disregards the rest."

reply to post by Wandering Scribe


very true! you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink. if only there were a way...

thanks for your imput

edit to add:

some of it must stem from people not winning graciously. if people are going to harrass you for being wrong, you have a greater incentive to avoid confrontation.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by Bob Sholtz]

I think this is a really good thread with great points.

And due to the obvious lack of posting in here, I have little choice but to attempt to keep the discussion relevant by posting in here again.

I must say I am disappointed that there is not a larger response to this "problem" we have.

I believe things around here at ATS would be a lot better if the hardcore threads got more attention.

It is a big deal, and I think the topic should not die off so easily.

Looking forward to future posters comments here. I'll check back in awhile.

reply to post by muzzleflash


Alright Muzzleflash,

I'll bite. Let's see if we can get something important, or worthwhile to spring up from this thread so that others come visiting. How about this...

Where have you noticed this type of intellectual dishonesty the most on ATS?

I would have to say that in my short time here it has been the Grey Area. There are all kinds of claimants making claims, many of which I am very interested in. However, being something of a paranormal dork myself, I've usually read up a lot on a whole plethora of paranormal events. That being so, I tend to come to a thread with a lot of questions to relate their experiences to similar ones I have read about, or had myself.

I find that it is only when confronted with these questions that those making the claims suddenly clam up. Somehow they find the act of asking them to elaborate on things they should have recognized to be akin to blasphemy. I mean simple questions too, like if an encounter with an alien craft left any burns on their body, or if their encounter with an extra-dimensional being left them with a sort of forgetfulness the following few days.

How about you, where do you see ATS members committing the act of intellectual dishonesty?

~ Scribe

people don't care enough for the truth, they only care that they are right. so they defend whatever they believe with every shred of evidence that can be found. no open minded discussion, just brainless factions.

even if everyone were to read this, very few would take it to heart, and even fewer would keep it up for any extended amount of time. it pisses me off its like the ultimate form of trolling.

I just discovered this thread and thought I'd resurrect it. I think Bob's point is one of the most important things not just for clowning around on the Internet, but for living.

No kidding. Knowing the truth can only be an advantage, because the last man standing is always the truth. The truth never steers you wrong, even if it's excruciatingly painful at first to chop at the weeds of self-delusion. If you have no religion, let truth be your religion, and have the courage to think and act in a manner in keeping with seeking the truth. This is no small act of courage; it requires your heart, mind, and soul to be on board. But do this and everything else will be given unto you.

If you're feeling "numb" with life, this will make you feel more alive again.

I just thought Bob's post was something we all need to be reminded of every now and again, so I'm necro'ing this thread.

reply to post by NewlyAwakened


well played. i thought it was a glitch when i saw this thread appear back at the top again.

conclusions are meaningless if they are wrong, so why reject evidence that contradicts your ideas? finding what is true should be the base goal of everyone here on ats. that means debating with humility, winning with grace, and changing ideas when evidence shows you the right path.

While I agree with what you're saying, I think alot of it has to do with personal attacks. It seems on certain topics one can't post anything to the contrary for fear of being labeled something. The trolling here can be a bit overboard sometimes and frankly being called the same thing over and over by the same characters gets a bit tiring sometimes. Nothing can be done about it, but I think it may be the cause of some of what has been brought up here...great topic s&f.

I understand and agree with what you are feeling, man.

It frustrates me when people can't back an argument and resort to critiques of punctuation or the legitimacy of sources or the level of vocabulary one uses.

I too avoid arguments... but it isn't that I am afraid of being wrong or misguided.... sometimes I am not as well read on a subject, or I am completely iggnorant of a subject. Other times, I don't have sources or references to support my argument.... And many times, I don't have the time nor the inclination to formulate a 2 page research paper/ rebuttal with bibliography, quotes, and at least 5 sources....

I came here to relax and be mentally stimulated...not pass my 11th grade English Class all over and again... Hell, I have to have the farm animals fed and be at work by 7am... and I have a wife... and not so independent grown up kids...

Its either

a) Not reading
b) Avoiding the question
c) Just posting or OP and run.
d) Lack of comprehension.

or e) The fukushima effect or putting your head in the sand.

Its easy to demonstrate, just talk with friends about the situation in Japan and they all gonna feel uncomfortable and will elude the question. Not trying to argue at all the discussion always end up flat lol. Now, I know my friends hates to talked about it and i respect that because no matter how bad the situation is, we pretty much all have bills to pay.

edit/
i forgot to mention

Its a good idea to refresh those hard to avoid questions, like the tamiflu thread that i never saw because, probably reason f) TIME

Hello All,

This IS a good thread indeed! As a poster in the Grey Area I've see several "hit 'n runs". Ones that show up slam the subject and you never see them again. Also the ones that appear out of seeming nowhere, spout off a totally unsupported and sometimes wild idea and dissappear. My term for it is "straffing". One wonders if that is the entire agenda of these folks- Break up a train of thought with some factless senario and haul ass off the thread.

Not much to do but tolerate it. Doesn't happen too often but often enough to wonder what gives. Again good thread. I can start to write down the posters I've seen and then maybe keep a log. Perhaps some time off would be beneficial to them.

The resuurection of this thread is a testament to the addage, "the more things change, the more the stay the same!"

I read the op and thought it was written today. It is timeless. It could be resurrected once per year and it would always seem timely.

I have been researching old prophecies and there are politically charged quotes and commentary from 3000 b.c. that could be on mainstream news today and you would agree with them, lol! Some things just don't change.

reply to post by getreadyalready
Well so much for this subject I guess then huh?