How long is finally too long?

I was just reading Binwrights thread on the theory that Constantine basically had the bible constructed in the third century so he could control the people. Bare with me, this is the first time posting in this forum.

It got me thinking, how long is finally too long, will there be people in the year 8010 (that's correct the eightieth century, no typo) still trying to justify the bible? Will they still be swearing that we are in the end times, and that Jesus will return soon?

I don't know, it's been two thousand years already, that is a very long time (in human years at least).

Will there ever be some point in time where everyone will look at the bible(and all the other Korans, Torahs, ect) in some museum and tell a young person "At one time thousands of years ago humans all over the planet truly believed and lived by the words in these books".

Would we be lumped together with the Mayans, Egyptians, and other thousand year old civilizations practiced theories on "God"?

Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

I'd say its more of a question of the progress of science rather than just the time factor. I do believe that one day science will either totally prove or totally disprove the existence of God. Also science making a time travel device (or at least a time viewer) would help as people could see the relevant time themselves and ake their own decisions.
Also when dealing with older religions and stuff, the saying comes to mind "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.".

Originally posted by PersonalChoice
Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

part of the reason people believe in the bible is because of fulfilled prophecy. it simply cant be a book "made by man". man is not capable of prophesying accurately that far in the future.

if prophecy is true then man will not last that long. God himself will have to stop man from destroying himself

mark 13:[19] For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
[20] And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

Originally posted by PersonalChoice
I was just reading Binwrights thread on the theory that Constantine basically had the bible constructed in the third century so he could control the people. Bare with me, this is the first time posting in this forum.

It got me thinking, how long is finally too long, will there be people in the year 8010 (that's correct the eightieth century, no typo

) still trying to justify the bible? Will they still be swearing that we are in the end times, and that Jesus will return soon?

I don't know, it's been two thousand years already, that is a very long time (in human years at least).

Will there ever be some point in time where everyone will look at the bible(and all the other Korans, Torahs, ect) in some museum and tell a young person "At one time thousands of years ago humans all over the planet truly believed and lived by the words in these books".

Would we be lumped together with the Mayans, Egyptians, and other thousand year old civilizations practiced theories on "God"?

Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

It got me thinking, how long is finally too long, will there be people in the year 8010 (that's correct the eightieth century, no typo) still trying to justify the bible? Will they still be swearing that we are in the end times, and that Jesus will return soon?

--I DOUBT THAT TIME EXIST UM JUST SAYEN, there is a reason the Earth is at its most destructive point again. There are weapons present that were not present in recent past that can destroy everyone on Earth. 100 200 300 400 500 600 700 years ago these weapons werent present whose to say 400,000,000 years ago if simular destructive weapons were present my point is the weapons here today can eliminate this whole world and thats why the books speak so deep of the return of the LAMB because he is the one who will close this chapter of destruction and free you into the perfect existance many crave and try to create within life with flawed technology like nano med. bots for tissue regeneration use or cyborg technology for body part replacement and even worst cloning for SMMFH. SO if the world does spin in its current direction TECHNOLOGY WILL BECOME HUMANITIES GOD AND WILL CONTROLL HUMANITY ACCORDINGLY, JUST INCASE THATS THE FUTURE SOME WANT FULL OF MADE UP PERFECTIONS THAT ARE FLAWED......

Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

--Mabey one should find the source of the first documentation of the creator and see it spans back before Constintine, and you forgot the DEAD SEA SCROLLS just to add.



[edit on 3/23/10 by Ophiuchus 13]

Explanation: Usually there is a Thirty-day notice [legal: thefreedictionary.com] before eviction can occur!

And as the bible tell us that 1000yrs is as 1day for God at Psalm 90:4 [blueletterbible.org], we can be sure that we have at LEAST 28,000 more yrs [+/- 10yrs] to go IF we take Jesus's birth to be the serving of notice by the landlord!

Personal Disclosure:

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
Explanation: Usually there is a Thirty-day notice [legal: thefreedictionary.com] before eviction can occur!

And as the bible tell us that 1000yrs is as 1day for God at Psalm 90:4 [blueletterbible.org], we can be sure that we have at LEAST 28,000 more yrs [+/- 10yrs] to go IF we take Jesus's birth to be the serving of notice by the landlord!

Personal Disclosure:

lol... interesting way to look at it

Originally posted by OmegaLogos

And as the bible tell us that 1000yrs is as 1day for God at [url=http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Psa&c=90&v=4&t=KJV#top]Psalm 90:4 [blueletterbible.org][/url

The Dog and Cat bible says it's 7000 God years to one Man Day.
They simplified his long life expectancy like we do with dogs and cats

I was really hoping 2012 would bring a new concept (to some) to human thought:
Common Sense

The ones who are asking "Where is Jesus" are actually fulfilling yet another Bible prophecy:

If people would r e a d the Bible, they would have most of the answers to their questions:

As the Days of Noah
2 Peter 3: 3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour. —1 John 2:18



[edit on 23-3-2010 by nomorecruelty]

Constantine may have manipulated the construction, but the Dead sea Scrolls confirm what has been written ...especially in the OT...he had little to do with that. Also, the Book of Enoch is supposedly the oldest written text of Biblical writtings...about 4000 years old. If you get past the cool stuff there about giants and fallen angels, it confirms the Son of Man, his messianic arrival, his death and ressurection.

Prophesy has been and is being confirmed, even as noted by the previous responding posts to your thread. By asking how long and when... you are confirming what you question.

Besides, let's assume that many people's premise is correct and the Bible isn't true but a collection of nice stories...( I do believe in God and His word) stories used to "control" people...are the teachings a bad basis for a life lived? Love thy neighbor, judge not lest ye be judged, give and forgive, be peaceful, merciful, generous, loving, humble, honor your father and mother, love your wife/husband/partner... be wise and judicious, a good citizen, ...those ideals never go out of style.

Originally posted by Ophiuchus 13

Originally posted by PersonalChoice
Will they still be swearing that we are in the end times, and that Jesus will return soon?

I don't know, it's been two thousand years already, that is a very long time (in human years at least).

Would we be lumped together with the Mayans, Egyptians, and other thousand year old civilizations practiced theories on "God"?

Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

--I DOUBT THAT TIME EXIST UM JUST SAYEN, there is a reason the Earth is at its most destructive point again. There are weapons present that were not present in recent past that can destroy everyone on Earth.

--Mabey one should find the source of the first documentation of the creator and see it spans back before Constintine, and you forgot the DEAD SEA SCROLLS just to add.

I chose you response because it had several points within here that should be looked at more carefully.

Nomorecruelty, Alreadygone and OmegaLogos have made valid remarks in reply to the Topic.

Look in this one thread, and the Scoffers are clearly identified by their own commentary. That doesn't take into account the mass of those who have opted not to speak or haven't been here yet. It seems the Prophesy in this respects is being fulfilled more and more each day.

True, the Dead Seas Scroll, (Isaiah Scroll) seems to confirm the Original text is, as it has always been, since the variations are, at the most, extremely minimal.

Although if my dear friend Ms Byrd jumps into this topic, there may be a need to re-clarify the Enoch material. There are some questions about this text, which suggests it is much more recent of a work, and some suggest a mystic, trance like state was utilized to translate it. I believe what the Book of Enoch does indicate, but that is upto Personal Choice, and in no way is to suggest others must accept it.

And in respect to Time......."tick, tock........tick, tock........tick,tock"

True, the scriptures suggest a day is as a 1000 years to the LORD, but I look at this as an example, apposed to a statement of fact.

It is being used to make a point, rather than to state a fact.

A Day, could be any measure of time, since scripturally speaking a Day means any measure of time.

3117 yowm yome from an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literal (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figurative (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverb):--age, + always, + chronicals, continually(-ance), daily, ((birth-), each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever(-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (... live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year(-ly), + younger.

With that said, what is a day, an era? An Age? 12 Hours?

What is an Age? The Age of the Dinosaurs lasted how long? Pre Genesis man was on earth how long? When was the 6th Day re-creation of Mankind (Modern Man) to have occured?

You see, we speak in a seires of Hours and Minutes, and base our lives around the 24 Hour Clock. 15 Minutes of extra commuting time results in Road Rage. We are ever impatient, and Time has become a Currency, which is valued because to US, "time is fleeting", to paraphrase the Rocky Horror Picture Show.

But what does Time mean to GOD, who "In the begining" created the Heavens and the Earth 4.5 some Billions of years ago. Time is a construct of our limited imagination, and places barriers that constrict our abilities today to do great and wonderful things, as they did building the Great Pyramid, or the Sphinx, for a couple of examples.

Is 2000 Years tooooo Long, for us to await?

2000 years is NOTHING, in the grand scheme of things, and the pettiness displayed in suggesting otherwise is a reflection of the manner inwhich we have devolved into worshipers of self.

That's about all I had to say about these points, SO FAR.

As for "There are weapons present that were not present in recent past that can destroy everyone on Earth", I must question this. The Vedic Texts suggest this occured during the last 7000 Years so or. Is that not recent?

And then there is the events of Genesis 1:2 which the Original Language clear suggests, "And the Earth BECAME a Waste and a Desolation". The current translation has faults and flaws, but recognizing this allows for a clearer understanding of the Word of GOD. God does not create Nothingness or Voids. This is the realm of the Desolator, which again, his calling card is affixed to.

Ciao

Shane

Or will it take a thousand more years, will it take fifteen thousand more years of no sign of Jesus or a "God" before we finally admit to ourselves that maybe this was just a book created by man to control the masses.

I do not see any masses controlled by a book. When i see the prison population reduced through lack of crime then yeah i would think that people are being controlled by the words in the bibles. But right now i do not see anyone being controlled.

I already had put this reply in a different thread but it looks like it fits nicely here.


Well, if you want a estimated time of the Apocalypse I'll give you 2 prophesies that seem to put the end of days sometime in the 2020s. No later than spring of 2028.

First one is the Matthew 24 prophesy on the generation. That prophesy states that the generation that sees the first end time event will not pass until the events predicted are complete. And Psalms 90 puts a length of a lifetime at approximately 70 to 80 years. If you take the rebirth of Israel as a end time event then the generation is 62 years old this May. Leaving 18 years or less for the Apocalypse to finish.

Second prophesy is the 3 day prophesy of Hosea 6-2 and the curse of Malachi. Malachi 4 states that Elijah was to proceed the messiah and prepare the way. Or that God would strike the world with a curse. And looking for the curse I found one in Hosea. And it's a nasty one. And Hosea 6-2 is the time frame. And after reading up on Psalms 90 and 2nd Peter 3-8 you can draw this conclusion. Those days are a code for thousand year periods of time. The world was struck with a 2 thousand year curse on the death of John the Baptist.

Again you wind up with a possible end date of the Apocalypse in the 2020s. And then there is this one from Daniel 12 to consider as well.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Sure looks increased to me anyway.

[edit on 24-3-2010 by ntech]

Originally posted by ntech
If you take the rebirth of Israel as a end time event then the generation is 62 years old this May. Leaving 18 years or less for the Apocalypse to finish.

While I agree with you in this, the Parable of the Fig Tree, may not have started with the Re-Creation of the State of Israel.

That "Generational Countdown", may have begun in 67, when Israel reclaimed the Holy City of Jerusalem.

We truly do not know, eitherway, but we can be sure, it has started.

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by nomorecruelty
The ones who are asking "Where is Jesus" are actually fulfilling yet another Bible prophecy:

If people would r e a d the Bible, they would have most of the answers to their questions:

As the Days of Noah
2 Peter 3: 3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour. —1 John 2:18

[edit on 23-3-2010 by nomorecruelty]

Thats the great thing for religious believers, the Bible has all the answers but none of the evidence. I fear it will be a long time before people leave their delusions

Originally posted by Shane

Originally posted by ntech
If you take the rebirth of Israel as a end time event then the generation is 62 years old this May. Leaving 18 years or less for the Apocalypse to finish.

While I agree with you in this, the Parable of the Fig Tree, may not have started with the Re-Creation of the State of Israel.

That "Generational Countdown", may have begun in 67, when Israel reclaimed the Holy City of Jerusalem.

We truly do not know, eitherway, but we can be sure, it has started.

Ciao
Shane

Sure we can tell if it's started. First off take a look back at Matthew 24. End time events are depicted as fig tree leaves opening up in the warmth of spring. The first leaf is verse 14 when the gospel is preached to the world. However we can be sure that happened because of the prophecy of Ezekiel 36 and 37.

Ezekiel is predicting that eventually the children of Israel would be redeemed back to their former status as God's favorites. They would restore the nation of Israel and God would provide them with David to rule again that nation.

The revival of Israel in 1948 would appear to be a partial fulfillment of the prophecy and that would make it a fig leaf.

So at the least of it the generation is 62 years old this year.

reply to post by PersonalChoice


I think the Bible will eventually go the same way as the other myths we have set aside as just that. We will think of the God of the Bible in the same way we think of Zeus, Odin, Osiris, Krishna, etc and the world will likely be a better place for it. Rather than leaping up to defend the myths as absolute truth people will instead focus on the lessons taught by those myths. Truthfully I don't know how anyone manages to claim the Bible is absolute truth in this day and age, with knowledge just a click a way. You'd think logic would get the best of them but they seem emboldened by how truly false their own claims are as though the more they are proven false the stronger their faith grows.

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
I think the Bible will eventually go the same way as the other myths we have set aside as just that.

I do not know how that would occur, since eventually is not all that far away. And that has nothing to do with, who are we to claim, Myths are anything but truth.

We will think of the God of the Bible in the same way we think of Zeus, Odin, Osiris, Krishna, etc and the world will likely be a better place for it.

That may well be your assertion and choice to make, when I would never consider GOD as anything else but the Father of it all. Just as Zeus, Odin, Osiris, and such. All of the dieties claiming to be as gods know there Father, and none of these have escaped notice for what they did. Genesis Chapter 6 is quite clear about this. It was the removal of these dieties acting as gods, that is part of the reasons for the "Flood".

Rather than leaping up to defend the myths as absolute truth people will instead focus on the lessons taught by those myths.

But there is one of the problems. We do not focus on lessons of the Fallen and the choices humanity made during those days. Instead we glorify them, and strive to build society based yet again upon those "Values", which of course are certainly not "Values" to strive towards.

Truthfully I don't know how anyone manages to claim the Bible is absolute truth in this day and age, with knowledge just a click a way.

And what knowledge have we ever attained that suggests the Word of GOD is false or untruthful. Science each and every day points to further support the Biblical Accounts of events and occurances. Just because the gods and wizards of Science wish to overlook this, is not my problem.

You'd think logic would get the best of them but they seem emboldened by how truly false their own claims are as though the more they are proven false the stronger their faith grows.

And just what false claims are offered within the Bible?

The Earth is 6000 Years Old? That a Religious Lie. The Bible clearly shows this is not accurate.

The Flood of Noah? It was a fact to those gods and dieties you refered to earlier. They are no longer here, and the Bible is quite clear as to why.
(Note: They were no longer here, but have returned, as prophesy indicated they would. We just "THINK", in a FALSE ASSUMPTION that today they are Grey's or Reptilians, or other such ET'S. )

Whatever it is that you presume the Bible makes false claims about, I would suggest is due to your Biblical Ignorance, and the misleading teachings of the Church and her own agendas.

It's all perspective and preception of course, but ignorance of the truth is no reason to suggest it is anything other than truthful, and ignorance of Biblical Teachings is no reason you can assume they suggest anything other than what they do.

That's the problem with RELIGION. It makes false claims about what the Bible indicates. This is then reinforced when the Sheep just sit holding their Bibles rather than studying the matters for themselves. But then, that would take WORK and EFFORT and no one does this without being paid.

Ciao

Shane

I don't know how well you are versed in all this stuff but let me make it real easy for you.

We are in a a time of delay (Rev 10:6) until mankind realizes that the mystery of God is already finished. It was finished on the cross when Jesus said "It is done!"

The best way to describe this delay is to say mankind has been dumbed down spiritually. The reasons for this are many, probably more than you would want to concern yourself with and in a sense it would be a cop out for me to not clue you in somewhat. In a nutshell, a certain number of Gentiles must come into actual knowledge of the mystery of how the Christ/Messiah comes to live inside a follower/disciple.

I do not know the exact number because it doesn't state it - it just says that Israel will experience a hardening of the hearts until the full number of Gentiles comes in. This number has nothing to do with organized religion and everything to do with an elect group of people, he selects, that will build up the true body of Christ, then the mysteries of God will be revealed and the hearts of those who need to be in the know will soften and then we can get this show on the road.

As I noted in another recent thread, biblical literalism is a relatively recent event in Christianity:

"...It is, for example, crucial to note than an exclusively literal interpretation of the Bible is a recent development. Until the 19th century, very few people imagined that the first chapter of Genesis was a factual account of the origins of life. For centuries, Jews and Christians relished highly allegorical and inventive exegesis, insisting that a wholly literal reading of the bible was neither possible nor desireable."

-Karen Armstrong: "The Bible; A Biography" (book)

Christianity has a long and profound history of reading its sacred texts in a more loose, open-ended and metaphorical way. It's only rather recently that people started rigidly insisting on the literal truth of scripture. This was a reaction to the perceived threats of modernity. Once people get more comfortable with things, we can put the odious stage of biblical literalism behind us and go back to looking at scripture as a source of wisdom, not science. Christ spoke in parables; the Bible should be approached in a way that allows its timeless lessons to be absorbed without any conflict whatsoever with science. It is not only possible -- its the historical exegetical norm

reply to post by ntech


Thanks for the replies everyone.

NTech, you seem to be the only person able to even set a time frame(possibly Shane, b/c he seems to agree with you on this prediction).

Since you guys seem to partially(in a sense) answer my question, by setting a time frame, what happens for you in 2050? Do you finally wonder whats taking so long?

I knew this would be one of those unique type of "faith" questions that seem to be extremely hard if not impossible for the people it was directed at, to answer.

I didn't think it wouldn't have one person of faith take a shot at it though. It's only a simple "what if" question, not meant to somehow question ones personal faith.

For the record, I don't feel like I'm fulfilling any prophecies, nor am I trying to.

Seriously though do you(the faithful) wake up on your death bed after a hundred year life(2001-2101) of believing that you were in the end times and that Jesus should have came back in 2028, and say "maybe this whole end times, Jesus is returning thing just isn't true"?