Israel plans to build more homes in E Jerusalem

The BBC are reporting this right now

Israel plans to build more homes in E Jerusalem

How can this be justified ?

It comes on the anniversary of the Gazza conflict ?

Have we not heard Israeli leaders tell us recently that they will freeze further building ?

Why does Israel do this ?

[edit on 28-12-2009 by bigyin]

The sad part is that the western born again christian will defend thei actions because it is God's 'promised land'

Good for them!
So what
It's Their land .

reply to post by AmericanDaughter


Nahh it isnt suger plum,but not surpirsed that someone with your name would say that.

To the op-its shocking mate but not surprising.I saw a video on the BBC about 6 months ago that showed palestinian houses being knocked down because they didnt have the right papers.When an Israel politician was interviewed about this on air he said that God gave them this land!

If anyone I knew talked in that way,I would persume them to be mentaly unstable and best left alone

reply to post by noangels


And they wonder why the Palistines and others fight them

Karma will come one day in the form of a Dirty Bomb

If it's Israels land because it was there's 2000 years ago, then almost everybody in America, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand are tresspassers! After all god had clearly given the land to someone else becasuse the place wasen't unocuppied when settlers first arrived. Also the Bible speaks against theft!
But I don't agree with the above view because land was only yours, if it was yours within you're lifetime. This is simply because there are very few people who owned any land , in (at least) this time-world, before they were, acturally born!
Obviously knowing your ancestors were once rich before being wronged by theft-violence, is still going to infurate you, espically if your lifestyle, may be better of today. So there is certainly is still a moral case for modest compensation that reduces the present day, justifications, of sins crimes over a life time ago. But not much!!!!

What Israel is doing, is what we Europeans were doing to native land owners 150-300 years ago. The conquest of land by force can be called two things, (both of which are true) "Colonism" or "Violent Theft".
This is an ancient, re-ocurring, character trait, throughout mankinds known history. Obviously this is because iIt works well. It works because displacement brings others wealth, whilst actural genocide; permanently, guarentee's it, (from them!) forever. As Dr of evil Mr Stalin, once said himself: "Death solves all problems. No man, no problem" unfortunately this does hold true (a lot of the times).

Feel sorry for the poor Palestine's, but realise if it wasen't for poor people like them, then a lot of the great cities, technological discoversies, wouldn't have happend. Maybe 150 years from now the whole of the Middle East will be 1-2 countries say Israel, and... Arabstine?

It could happen, because logic dictates all obstacles to future peace & prosperity be removed. If those obstacles include people-land, then it's highly immoral, but it's also entirely fitting with mankinds nature-history.
Don't be surprised or outraged, because we have plenty of other problems affecting ourselves or our neighbours.

reply to post by Liberal1984



Appreciate your input, but personally I'm not interested in harping back into ancient history. There are folk on ATS who will find any point in time to try and justify what Israel is doing.

We all are living in the here and now. There may have been wars and conflicts in the past which resulted in one tribe getting one over another tribe.

But we are supposed to have moved on from that way of working now. Things should be worked out around a table by politicians using internationally agreed rules and laws.

Israel seems to make up its own rules and shows no respect for its neighbours or anyone else for that matter.

Its a rougue state run by criminals that should be heavily censured by the international community until it behaves appropriately.

Historically and archeologically, Israel has a right to that land. But you want to deal in the here and now...in 1967 they didn't have East Jerusalem and the West Bank. They were attacked on 3 sides by Syria, Jordan, and Egypt, and their intent was the destruction of Israel. Israel counter-attacked and took that land. Right or wrong, the situation would not be happening now if not for this attack by the Arab states.
Israel also took the Sinai Penninsula and the Golan Heights. Since the war of 1973, Israel has traded land for peace beginning in 1977...retreating from the Sanai, they have also given up the Gaza Strip. Yet, they are still threatened and attacked on a daily basis.
The Palestinians are descended from the Philistines and have also lived in the area for thousands of years... and lost this land to Israel some 5000 years ago. After the Despora, Palestine was left to the Palestinians and Arabs, no one wanted it. It was junk land, a wasteland...abandoned by it's geographical neighbors and also why the British gave it to the Jews. They took it and made the land fruitful again. The Palestinians have tried repeatedly to establish a homeland through Jordan, Syria, and Egypt...all said no. The only thing these countries disliked more than Palestinians were the Jews/Israelis. So then and even now, the Palestinains are a bargaining chip for the Arab states.
So, Israel has a legitamate claim by 1967 War to this land. They certainly have a right to use it as a bargaining chip, which they may be doing now with continued construction. They play a good hand of poker.
Lastly, let's speculate...what if israel gave up the West bank and Palestine was established? Woule israel finally live in peace? Probably not. If Israel was disbanded and the entire land was given over to the Arabs, would Jihad and Islamic Radicalism stop? Probably not.
Like it or not, Israel is like a dike against a flood of Islamic Jihad and the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Unless you want to grow a beard, were burkas, give up bathing suits at the beach, pepperoni pizzas, rock and roll, the right to express your own ideas no matter how extreme or perverse, like to criticize religion and the government....we need israel.

Originally posted by AmericanDaughter

Good for them!
So what
It's Their land .

It is this sort of mentality that will mean the conflict in the region continues indefinitely. Will Israel continue to build untill there is no more land to build on futher fanning the lames of hatred?

You statement would therefore mean that you believe that Hitler was justified to annex the Sudetenland area of Czechoslovakia, Austria and Poland as he saw it as historically German land containing Germanic people.

There will be no peace in this region until there are concessionson both sides and the one of the main obstacles at present is the eviction of Palestinians from what their land.

Originally posted by AlreadyGone
Historically and archeologically, Israel has a right to that land. But you want to deal in the here and now...in 1967 they didn't have East Jerusalem and the West Bank. They were attacked on 3 sides by Syria, Jordan, and Egypt, and their intent was the destruction of Israel. Israel counter-attacked and took that land. Right or wrong, the situation would not be happening now if not for this attack by the Arab states.
Israel also took the Sinai Penninsula and the Golan Heights. Since the war of 1973, Israel has traded land for peace beginning in 1977...retreating from the Sanai, they have also given up the Gaza Strip. Yet, they are still threatened and attacked on a daily basis.
The Palestinians are descended from the Philistines and have also lived in the area for thousands of years... and lost this land to Israel some 5000 years ago. After the Despora, Palestine was left to the Palestinians and Arabs, no one wanted it. It was junk land, a wasteland...abandoned by it's geographical neighbors and also why the British gave it to the Jews. They took it and made the land fruitful again. The Palestinians have tried repeatedly to establish a homeland through Jordan, Syria, and Egypt...all said no. The only thing these countries disliked more than Palestinians were the Jews/Israelis. So then and even now, the Palestinains are a bargaining chip for the Arab states.
So, Israel has a legitamate claim by 1967 War to this land. They certainly have a right to use it as a bargaining chip, which they may be doing now with continued construction. They play a good hand of poker.
Lastly, let's speculate...what if israel gave up the West bank and Palestine was established? Woule israel finally live in peace? Probably not. If Israel was disbanded and the entire land was given over to the Arabs, would Jihad and Islamic Radicalism stop? Probably not.
Like it or not, Israel is like a dike against a flood of Islamic Jihad and the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Unless you want to grow a beard, were burkas, give up bathing suits at the beach, pepperoni pizzas, rock and roll, the right to express your own ideas no matter how extreme or perverse, like to criticize religion and the government....we need israel.

Well I'm going to give you credit for presenting an arguement that is up to date.

Perhaps you can explain for me, why these other Arab countries do not like or care about the so called Palestinians. What have these people done to deserve the hatred of all sides. And are there not some countries who do support them, Iran I think is one.

I am in the process of reading some books on Islam with the intention of trying to find out more about the problem, but I suspect that many of the troubles in the region are tribal which is really just a human trait, not confinded to Muslims, and is found in most parts of the globe.

The jihad aspect towards the west intensified after 911, and we were told then that Osama Bin Laden carried out the attacks because of American involvement in Saudia Arabia. Whether he did do the attacks is open to question, but it give him the opportunity to highlight his complaints.

So I agree that jihads would not necessarily stop if Israel vanished, but at the same time it shows that jihads are started against infidels who transgress Islamic sacreds, and i can see where they are coming from on that.

Now to go on and say that western culture in the west justifies a jihad I don't agree. Radical muslims may try to initiate jihads in western countries but I doubt they would get very far before westerners simply chucked em all out. And the radicals would have a hard time convincing their own that they were right to impose their culture on the west. They are not stupid people.

Whereas with Israel we have a different setup. Here we have a western culture, implanted into an islamic region, which is causing trouble to local muslims. Whichever way you look at it the west will be seen as the transgressor, since we fund Israel. And since we are bombing Iraq and Afghanistan looking for OBL and AQ again we are seen as justifiable targets for jihad.

The solution therefore, thats really what I'm after, is to remove all reasons which allow jihads to be justified and that includes withdrawal from those wars and withdrawal of support for an agressive Israel.

So long as the west is seen to stand idle by while Palestinians are bombed, shot, pushed back and generally treated badly, we make ourselves a justifiable target in their eyes.

Building more settlement houses is just part of it... and is very provocative.

In my view there is no instant solution. Even if Israel handed the keys over today it would take years for the bad memories to subside and for Muslims to forgive and forget. But the process will have to start at some point otherwise we are all doomed.