So you still believe the official story?

posted by GoodOlDave
All right, here's one that comes to mind-

Q: Why on EARTH would anyone ever stage some insanely complex faked terrorist attack just so they could invade some worthless toilet of a country like Afghanistan?

A: You're seeing gov't conspiracies behind the 9/11 attack becuase you want to see gov't conspiracies behind the 9/11 attack, and you don't particularly care how absurd they sound.

posted by samhouston1886

Are you serious?
I can’t understand why some people are really so blind as to the fact that our leaders do not view us a humans but rather cattle.

A rancher cares about his cattle but when its time to kill them he does so without remorse.

Our leaders care even less than the rancher.

I find it personally insulting that people like you come here and say that we are absurd when thousands of hours or research would show that a layman whose knowledge of 9/11 is exclusively from television debunking 9/11 truth, is what’s really absurd.

I have more respect for people who know enough to stay out because they know that they are not informed, people like you really just make me sick because you come here to parrot what you saw on TV.

I am dying and people like you will send me to my grave never knowing what happened and why my children will go on with out a Father.

You are a disgusting human being.

Do you have a legitimate reason why this dying WTC 1st responder should not have his say Dave? He earned the right to speak out didn't he Dave?

So why are you so deathly afraid of a real 9-11 investigation Dave?

. . . . . Demolition wave running far ahead of the collapse wave and accelerating
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b817965410cc.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/63b7387179af.jpg[/atsimg]


[edit on 11/7/09 by SPreston]

There is only one Question:

Q: Why did they US Saudis as Patsies, when they wanted to attack Afghanistan and Iraq, and why didn't they plant WMDs in Iraq?

... I think goodoldave is waiting for an answer on that one too.

posted by debunky
There is only one Question:

Q: Why did they US Saudis as Patsies, when they wanted to attack Afghanistan and Iraq, and why didn't they plant WMDs in Iraq?

... I think goodoldave is waiting for an answer on that one too.

Exactly how have the Saudis been harmed as patsies?

Khalid Sheikh Mohammed the new official mastermind of the 9-11 OFFICIAL STORY fantasy tale was born in Kuwait and the Kuwaitis have not apparently suffered from his new role.

Usama bin Laden is out and KSM is in.

Apparently Valerie Plame and her CIA Nuclear DeProliferation Team blocked the planting of WMDs in Iraq by the Bush Regime, and the WMD planting team was accidentally destroyed by a US military exercise.

Source

Source

Source

Source

Source

The treason of the Bush Regime destroyed the US Nuclear De-Proliferation Team too late to successfully plant WMDs in Iraq.

Bush is out and Obama is in and far too late to plant WMDs now.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c2a89fac91af.jpg[/atsimg]

[edit on 11/7/09 by SPreston]

it's a shame we're still arguing about 911. it's too late. we lost our freedom, security, peace, and justice. it seems all we have left is to argue.

[edit on 01/01/13 by ohsnaptruth]

Of course we believe the official story!
Its much, much easier that way!
As GW himself said, 'thinking is hard work'!

Thats what we're told so it must be true! Right?
Besides we don't care bout 'other peoples' anyway.
Or our rights, or freedoms,...or the truth apparently.
The truth is what I'm told it is.

To everyone who agrees with the OS, you are just as guilty.
May God have mercy on you.

reply to post by The_Zomar

Real A: Well larry silverstein put a massive insurance policy on the world trade center the month before 9-11 specifically regarding terrorism. Did he know something was going to happen? Larry got his cash, the government got their war. Patriot act passed. We lost our freedom.

A fine example of why so many people buy into the conspiracy theories. Larry Silverstein didnt buy a policy that specified terrorism. Not to mention, he originally wanted a much smaller insurance policy. The one he ended up with, is the one HIS MONEY LENDERS required him to have. Also, he isnt exactly rolling in the dough over the towers either. Between the delays and the rent payments he was required to make to the Port Authority, it is estimated that he has less than a billion dollars left of the insurance payout....and he is still paying the "rent" on a property that is producing him NO income and will not be producing any income for several more years.

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
,it is estimated that he has less than a billion dollars left of the insurance payout....and he is still paying the "rent" on a property that is producing him NO income and will not be producing any income for several more years.

Oh god no! That poor poor man. How is he going to afford to live with less than 1 billion dollars! (which is still 300 million than he paid for the towers)

No-one has answered why 6 of the 10 commissioners said its a fraud yet.

Even if the President stood up and sent those who are guilty to prison, we would still have some ignorant people that wouldn't believe it.

My favorite part about the official fictional story is how the paper passport flew through the window of the plane in the blast and fell down onto the sidewalk and an official just happened to find it linking it to al ciada.

Whats your favorite part of the story?

Is it the part where war orders were signed on Afghanistan on september 10th?

reply to post by The_Zomar


I could be misinformed, but didn't the 19 hijackers live in the U.S.? And attend our schools/universities? I wasn't aware that we had school students here in the U.S. living in caves.

Originally posted by dalepmay
reply to post by The_Zomar

 

I could be misinformed, but didn't the 19 hijackers live in the U.S.? And attend our schools/universities? I wasn't aware that we had school students here in the U.S. living in caves.

No, it was not by accident that 4 airliners were highjacked at the same time.
The mastermind (according to the fictional story) was hiding in a cave.

You don't even know your own story you believe. Pathetic.

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999


Swampy - Why did you forget to mention some of the clauses that Lucky Larry had negotiated?...

1). In the event of a disaster that rendered the complex uninhabitable, Silverstein Properties were not liable to pay rent.

2). NYPA and the Govt. to cover the cost of removing all the debris.

Brand new buildings, no rewiring or asbestos removal costs, rent free during the rebuilding time stamps, and a billion left for good measure, only a true OS believer would twist this to bad deal status.

reply to post by ohsnaptruth


What freedom do you lack today that you had on September 10th, 2001? I would like to know. Thanks.

reply to post by jprophet420

If I may.
Only ones that are blatantly unconstitutional!

searches through which law enforcement officers search a home or business without the owner’s or the occupant’s permission or knowledge; the expanded use of National Security Letters, which allows the FBI to search telephone, e-mail, and financial records without a court order; and the expanded access of law enforcement agencies to business records, including library and financial records. Since its passage, several legal challenges have been brought against the act, and Federal courts have ruled that a number of provisions are unconstitutional

Um, gee, how about the right to be secure in our own homes!
I guess it wont much matter when we're dead from the flu anyway.
We must like it dry with no lube.
en.wikipedia.org...
Ah, the real reason:

The act also expands the definition of terrorism to include domestic terrorism, thus enlarging the number of activities to which the USA PATRIOT Act’s expanded law enforcement powers can be applied.
In a resolution passed on June 29, 2005 they stated that "Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act allows the government to secretly request and obtain library records for large numbers of individuals without any reason to believe they are involved in illegal activity

How very convenient!

Human Rights First is concerned about a particular problem raised by the Inspector General in the report which the Department of Justice has not addressed. It involves the continued reliance on the so-called “custody procedure” regulations which permit detention of any alien – regardless of whether they have been designated as a “suspected terrorist” – without charge beyond 48 hours for a “reasonable period” in the event of “emergency” or other “extraordinary circumstances.”

www.humanrightsfirst.org...
Even though it is in direct violation of the Geneva convention!
Do I need to go into the torture thing too?

The post-9/11 period has seen a dramatic expansion of government surveillance. Law enforcement has received extensive funding for this purpose. With little regulation and poor understanding of constitutional protections, the authorities have overstepped their bounds, especially in monitoring political activity. Many groups and individuals have found out that they have been spied upon; these include peace activists, demonstrators at anti-war rallies, animal-rights groups, student organizations, critics of U.S. policy toward Cuba, and opponents of the World Trade Organization.
Government agencies and their private contractors have covertly received private customer data from airlines, telephone carriers, credit card firms, and Internet service providers. Congress has begun investigating potential abuses and threats to civil liberties.

Oh, looky here, it says Congress is investigating these abuses!
Were saved!
www.trackedinamerica.org...

The Top 40 Reasons To Doubt The Official Story Of September 11th, 2001

www.911truth.org...

Unlike other losses from September 11, this loss did not happen all at once on a clear fall morning. A photograph or video camera cannot convey the damage. These changes have taken place slowly and incrementally, beneath the surface. What’s needed is an x-ray – a way to show how the very bones of U.S. law, policy and practice have shifted.

www.humanrightsfirst.org...

U.S. anti-terrorism policies not only contradict principles woven into the country’s political and legal structure, they also contradict international human rights principles...

Justice cannot exist without respect for human rights.

]
www.globalissues.org...
www.youtube.com...

a federal court found that John Ashcroft, then-attorney general, violated the rights of U.S. citizens by ordering arrests on material witness warrants when the government lacked probable cause.
The judges — all appointed by Republican presidents — found that Ashcroft could be sued for prosecutorial abuses.

latimesblogs.latimes.com...
www.ca9.uscourts.gov...

As the months unfolded after 9/11, we saw Congress passing dictatorial legislation, giving the President the kind of powers that Stalin and Hitler wielded.
"U.S. citizens suspected of terror ties might be detained indefinitely and barred from access to civilian courts under legislation proposed by the Bush administration, say legal experts reviewing an early version of the bill."

cuttingedge.org...
I could go on and on but I'm thirsty.....
and the apathy is appallingly dry in amerika.



[edit on 8-11-2009 by dodadoom]

Originally posted by Roid_Rage27
Hmm...I think he's got you there Dave.

The military and NATO have been protecting us for DECADES. This "plot" was a cakewalk to stop, but it wasn't. Hell when a Cessna goes off course they send up a couple of F-16's.

Oh, rubbish. I would like Zomar to explain how, if NATO has protected us for decades, how that loser Frank Corder was able to crash a stolen Cessna onto the south lawn of the White House lawn becuase his daddy never said he loved him, back in 1994. Just becuase Zomar sees secret gov't plots behind every tree it doesn't mean that make it so.

...and yes, F-16s (as well as F-15s) *were* scrambled to intercept the hijacked aircraft, they just didn't reach them in time (as documented in the 9/11 commission report, which was your obligation to read if you refer to yourself as someone seriously interested in learnign the truth behind the 9/11 attack). I don't recall Zoman claiming there wasn't, but if he is, then he's lying.

Come on, the way the buildings fell is an great indication that they had some kind of explosives. Don't be lame and try debate that. Only explosives can create the fine dust that littered NY that day and ravaged people's respiratory system. Don't even get me started on the collapses onto themselves. That's just rudimentary physics. I think everyone understands the path of least resistance concept.

Ahem...rudimentary physics dictate that the path of least resistance is straight down or as close to straight down as possible, which every video in existence shows is how the towers fell. So what are you arguing about?

However, if you want to discuss the physics of the collapse, I myself subscribe to the findings of MIT materials engineer Thomas Eagar. Despite all the self declared physics experts here, not a single person has been able to refute anything he says with anythign tangible. Perhaps you can be the first.

MIT engineers discuss the WTC collapse

Originally posted by samhouston1886
I find it personally insulting that people like you come here and say that we are absurd when thousands of hours or research would show that a layman whose knowledge of 9/11 is exclusively from television debunking 9/11 truth, is what’s really absurd.

I have more respect for people who know enough to stay out because they know that they are not informed, people like you really just make me sick because you come here to parrot what you saw on TV.

I am dying and people like you will send me to my grave never knowing what happened and why my children will go on with out a Father.

You are a disgusting human being.

Don't be an idiot. We both know that you've never even lifted a finger to do any real and genuine research into the events of 9/11. All you HAVE done is mindlessly swallow the rubbish those damned fool conspiracy web sites are feeding you...and all THEY do is make up stupid innuendo, take quotes deliberately out of context, and play five degrees of separation "Kevin Bacon" games, in order to get you all paranoid over shadows. How about looking at the real world for a change?

In the real world, the islamic world is so fringe whacko, they all start rioting whenever Danish Newspapers print cartoons about Mohammed. They think it pleases God for them to strap bombs on their bodies and blow themselves up in crowded markets in Kabul and Bagsdad, and they think it's proper to execute women who've been raped on the grounds of "extramarital activity". Anyone who seriously thinks islamic fundamentalists *couldn't* come up with something like the 9/11 attack is being horribly naive.

In the real world, the US gov't isn't some computer or a disembodied brain in a vat of fluid. they're hundreds of thousands of people, some ruthless, some good hearted, and some complete morons, and they're always stepping on each other's toes like a bunch of clowns in a circus. I'm not even talking whether the gov't would or would not ever pull off such a conspiracy. Anyone who thinks the gov't *could* ever pull off such a conspiracy when in the real world it can't even hand out bottles of water to hurricane victims in New Orleans, all with such sheer perfection of an act of god and without leaving any evidence or whistleblowers, is being horribly naive.

I don't know what you meant to do with this attitude copping of yours, but what you only wound up doing is PROVING what I've been saying since day one- you conspiracy people aren't approaching this like an investigation. You're approaching it with the same zealotry of a religious cult. You're so much in love with these conspiracy stories that you *want* them to be true, and you interpret any attack on them as being an attack on you personally.

I invite you or anyone else to point out how a single thing I said here is incorrect.

Originally posted by The_Zomar

Plane recorded to be flying in and out of USA:
CIA plane crashes with over 3 tons of coke

You are leaving a lot in inconvenient facts out of your innuendo dropping, here-

a) all the news reports say that the plane had been resold...TWICE...since the last time it flew to Guantanamo, before it finally wound up in the hands of buyers in Venezuela. Once it got there, noone really knows how it got inot the hands of drug smugglers. That right there shows you're trying to build a "five degrees of separation" Kevin Bacon game between Afghan opium growers, the CIA, aircraft resellers in Florida, buyers in Venezuela, and Mexican drug lords using the planes.

b) this only contrdicts your OTHER claims that "the gov't controls all the media" becuase if that were true, you wouldn't have known anythign about this, becuase it was the supposedly gov't controlled AP who reported the connection to begin with. Compare this with the deliberate suppression in China of any mention of the Tiennamen square protests.

But you know, those who believe the official story won't comment on facts so my post was probably worthless.

Well, you're half right.

After a measly $4.5 billion insurance settlement, poor Mr. Larry Silverstein is requesting financial aid from the government

online.wsj.com...

According to the following article, the claims on the WTC were settled on May 23, 2007

www.reuters.com...

So, only 5 1/2 years after the occurrence, the entire case was settled. I must say, this must be record time for a $4.5 billion settlement. This seems quite odd since there are $1 million cases which drag on for ten years or longer.

Did the insurance companies involved even bother to investigate 911 for coverage (actual terrorism or inside job/fraud)? Or, did they just rely on the official Government investigation, which would make it rather odd, since it wasn't the Government which was on the hook for all that money. A thorough and complete investigation would have taken several years to say the least.

And after the investigation to determine coverage, one would have expected a long drawn out court case. You know, insurance companies employ some of the best attorneys in the land as defense counsel because, as we all know, they do not like to pay.

Looks like another first during 911. Insurance companies writing checks for billions without even bothering to go through the normal claimshandling procedures. If this case was handled like all other questionable big money insurance cases, the claimant (Larry) and the carriers would still be fighting over the issue of coverage.

Originally posted by dodadoom
reply to post by jprophet420

 

If I may.
Only ones that are blatantly unconstitutional!

searches through which law enforcement officers search a home or business without the owner’s or the occupant’s permission or knowledge; the expanded use of National Security Letters, which allows the FBI to search telephone, e-mail, and financial records without a court order; and the expanded access of law enforcement agencies to business records, including library and financial records. Since its passage, several legal challenges have been brought against the act, and Federal courts have ruled that a number of provisions are unconstitutional

Um, gee, how about the right to be secure in our own homes!

I guess it wont much matter when we're dead from the flu anyway.

We must like it dry with no lube.
en.wikipedia.org...
Ah, the real reason:

The act also expands the definition of terrorism to include domestic terrorism, thus enlarging the number of activities to which the USA PATRIOT Act’s expanded law enforcement powers can be applied.
In a resolution passed on June 29, 2005 they stated that "Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act allows the government to secretly request and obtain library records for large numbers of individuals without any reason to believe they are involved in illegal activity

How very convenient!

Human Rights First is concerned about a particular problem raised by the Inspector General in the report which the Department of Justice has not addressed. It involves the continued reliance on the so-called “custody procedure” regulations which permit detention of any alien – regardless of whether they have been designated as a “suspected terrorist” – without charge beyond 48 hours for a “reasonable period” in the event of “emergency” or other “extraordinary circumstances.”

www.humanrightsfirst.org...
Even though it is in direct violation of the Geneva convention!
Do I need to go into the torture thing too?

The post-9/11 period has seen a dramatic expansion of government surveillance. Law enforcement has received extensive funding for this purpose. With little regulation and poor understanding of constitutional protections, the authorities have overstepped their bounds, especially in monitoring political activity. Many groups and individuals have found out that they have been spied upon; these include peace activists, demonstrators at anti-war rallies, animal-rights groups, student organizations, critics of U.S. policy toward Cuba, and opponents of the World Trade Organization.
Government agencies and their private contractors have covertly received private customer data from airlines, telephone carriers, credit card firms, and Internet service providers. Congress has begun investigating potential abuses and threats to civil liberties.

Oh, looky here, it says Congress is investigating these abuses!
Were saved!

www.trackedinamerica.org...

The Top 40 Reasons To Doubt The Official Story Of September 11th, 2001

www.911truth.org...

Unlike other losses from September 11, this loss did not happen all at once on a clear fall morning. A photograph or video camera cannot convey the damage. These changes have taken place slowly and incrementally, beneath the surface. What’s needed is an x-ray – a way to show how the very bones of U.S. law, policy and practice have shifted.

www.humanrightsfirst.org...

U.S. anti-terrorism policies not only contradict principles woven into the country’s political and legal structure, they also contradict international human rights principles...

Justice cannot exist without respect for human rights.

]
www.globalissues.org...
www.youtube.com...

a federal court found that John Ashcroft, then-attorney general, violated the rights of U.S. citizens by ordering arrests on material witness warrants when the government lacked probable cause.
The judges — all appointed by Republican presidents — found that Ashcroft could be sued for prosecutorial abuses.

latimesblogs.latimes.com...
www.ca9.uscourts.gov...

As the months unfolded after 9/11, we saw Congress passing dictatorial legislation, giving the President the kind of powers that Stalin and Hitler wielded.
"U.S. citizens suspected of terror ties might be detained indefinitely and barred from access to civilian courts under legislation proposed by the Bush administration, say legal experts reviewing an early version of the bill."

cuttingedge.org...
I could go on and on but I'm thirsty.....
and the apathy is appallingly dry in amerika.



[edit on 8-11-2009 by dodadoom]

You answered the question "What did Americans lose in theory" and I asked what right you actually lost. I eagerly await your response.

reply to post by jprophet420

In theory? Really? That's it?
Not a thanks or anything?
Obviously whatever I post will not suffice. In theory...

If you dont even want to thank me for trying to answer your question,
forget it mr p.
Play mind games with someone else.
Your pretty good!

In theory.

Originally posted by The_Zomar


You don't even know your own story you believe. Pathetic.

You realise that this is a rather illogical statement?


You characterised the people who carried out 9/11 as "cave dwellers", presumably to imply that they lacked the sophistication required to carry out the attacks.

I suggest a fun game. We'll take the educational achievements of these men and hold them up against yours, and those of, I don't know, let's say Spreston, impressme and any of the other truthers on this thread. Then we'll add up your net wealth and compare it to that of Osama bin Laden. The results might be instructive.

Originally posted by The_Zomar
Q: "How could something of such magnitude be kept so secret? Someone would SURELY leak information!"
A: Easily. The hydrogen bomb was conceived in complete secrecy at Las Alamos. Research the Manhattan project. It took over a thousand people and it never leaked.

The Manhattan Project was the ATOMIC bomb not the Hydrogen bomb. It was only fission not fusion.

But believing that an airliner weighing less than 200 tons could totally destroy a building weighing more than 400,000 tons in less than 2 hours without demanding to know the distribution of steel in the building is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS.

Duh, what's the Conservation of Momentum.

www.youtube.com...

psik