ATS or BTS???

I'm creating this thread to make a case to the ATS/BTS PTB (irony) that the 'Religion, Faith, And Theology' forum on BTS belongs on ATS in the 'Mysterious' section, alongside 'Conspiracies in Religion' and 'Origins and Creationism'. Here's why:

No matter which side is correct, one is intentionally, albeit unknowingly, spreading disinformation. The subjects discussed are just as relevant as those discussed in the other two forums. In fact, the threads are as equally relevant as those in the 'Origins' forum, the only difference being which sections of the Bible are being debated. Why debate Genesis on ATS, but all the other books on BTS?

I'm asking this for two reasons. The first is because I feel BTS is a place for discussing or sharing non-contraversial subjects. A place to go to get away from the fray of ATS when it gets too hot. A nice place to cool down and discuss or share things like music, tv, movies, jokes and such. A nice place for members who usually disagree to come together on at least some subject.

The second is that once a hotbed discussion concerning religion is moved to BTS, it dies a quick and quiet death instead of being debated. I'm sure that the numbers support that BTS has far less traffic than ATS. Some members are probably unaware that BTS even exists!

Anyway, that's why I believe that the 'Religion, Faith, And Theology' forum belongs on the 'Big Board'. Thank you in advance for your consideration on this matter.

And I agree with you sir...seriously..it almost is discrimination if you think about it.

Very logical....

I was surprised when I noticed it on BTS - it seems a very odd place for it.

So I agree with you and support your suggestion.

Yes I agree. The thread belongs on ATS. Why? Because it shows that there have been a lot of disinformtion about the Trinity being spread around. The conspiracy can be proven where Christians are made to believe that they are really worhsipping one god. And yes the issue is controversial.

Thanks for the plug for Below Top Secret. It's an important part of our site. I urge people to try it. You'll get hooked, trust me. All you have to do is log in/out there the same as here.

As to the Faith forum being on BTS, that's for nonconspiracy discussion.

reply to post by intrepid


I would counter that there is a plethora of 'non-conspiracy' topics discussed on ATS. For instance, there is no 'conspiracy' in the 'evolution vs. creation' debate, only opinion. One could also argue that any discrepancies in religion are 'conspiratorial' due to the disinfo intentionally being spread amongst the faithful. I see it as a 'all or nothing' issue. Either it all gets moved to ATS, or it all gets moved to BTS. I could live with either. It's the splitting of the two that seems illogical (my new catch word, LOL) to me.

I LOVE BTS, by the way! It is a great place to go when the debates on ATS get too heated and I feel my head is going to EXPLODE from the ignorance!

[edit on 31-8-2009 by JaxonRoberts]

Well I for one agree Jaxon. Good thread.

BTS is very cool, calm and un-bias. In my opinion. Good place to go after reading all the hype here and getting frustrated.

Sometimes I think people argue just to get a rise out of others.

Oh yeah and everyone thinks they are right: :bnghd:

I take that back. [sarcasm]Everyone is right.[/sarcasm]

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


Not every forum on ATS is a conspiracy forum. The Conspiracies in Religions forum specifically, is.

If you have a conspiracy based topic about religion, by all means it goes in the Conspiracies in Religion forum. Discussions about doctrine or interpretation, absent a clearly delineated conspiracy, belong in the Faith forum.

From the sticky post at the top of Conspiracies in Religions forum:

Before starting a new thread on the Conspiracies In Religion Forum please consider the following:

1. Conspiracies In Religion Forum’s description on the board home page reads like this, “Discuss the Conspiracies and Scandals in Organized Religion.”

If you are unsure if your new topic will belong in this forum also consider -

Faith & Spirituality @ BelowTopSecret.com (Discuss all things Spiritual and Share Your Own Faith-based Experiences)


2. This forum is specifically for conspiracies in religion. Make the conspiracy clear in your opening post. Name the conspiracy theory, talk about the motives, effects, and methods. Don't make the conspiracy merely implicit.

Debates on whether or not a religion is true is not an acceptable topic unless the conspiracy is made clear in the opening post.

If you have any questions please feel free to U2U a forum moderator, any staff member, or use the Complain / Suggestion feature.

Thanks, and happy investigating.

At this point, a thread about religion not involving a clearly articulated conspiracy is going to end up in the BTS Faith forum.

I can understand reasoning behind having the Religious topics in ATS. But in the meantime, if you want a religious discussion on ATS it has to be conspiracy oriented. Not because ATS is conspiracy exclusively, but that forum is.

Hope that helps.
[Edit for formatting]

[edit on 8/31/2009 by yeahright]

reply to post by yeahright


I understand the 'rules' behind the decision of what belongs or does not belong in the 'Conspiracies in Religion' forum, and I can agree with that. It's whether the 'Religion, Faith, and Theology' forum belongs on BTS when the 'Origins and Creationism', which is also not conspiratorial, is on ATS. I'm saying that all religious forums should be in one group, either on ATS or BTS. Whether it's fair or not, the BTS threads get little if no attention, thus they are not discussed. As I stated before, why debate the validity of Genesis on ATS, but send discussion of the rest of the Bible off to BTS?

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


I was replying top your post where you seem to be arguing from a position that there were other non-conspiracy topics on ATS. There's a lot of gray area and overlap amongst the forums. We try to put threads where they belong so that people looking for specific topics can find the ones that interest them easier, among other things. The BTS Faith forum is an active one and there are a lot of great discussions in there.

We'll never be able to do what we do and have everyone 100% behind all of it. There is no "all or nothing" consideration. The process isn't always that black and white.

The Origins and Creationism forum has a unique position in having both religious and scientific overtones. If one wants to debate creation from a religious perspective, very likely Genesis could be a resource they use. There's a difference between a forum specifically about religion, and a forum where people are inclined use a religious perspective to debate the topic.

We're not inclined to ban all religious references from ATS, but at this point a thread specifically about religious doctrine belongs in the Faith forum. A good thread topic will find traction and get plenty of discussion in BTS.

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


Check out the mission statement for Origins and Creationism:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

It's far from just Genesis but can be used as yeahright pointed out.

reply to post by yeahright


One could counter that many of the threads in the 'Conspiracies in Religion' forum are not anymore of a 'conspiratorial' nature than others in the 'Faith' forum. As examples, I give you the 'God commands you to kill Gays' thread or the 'Jesus was a Buddhist?' thread. Neither is any more or less conspiratorial than discussion of whether Christianity is a pagan religion. While the 'Faith' forum is active, it is not nearly as active as forums on ATS. Many members only use the 'Recent Posts' section of ATS to find threads to post on, thus these threads do not get the same 'traction' as threads that are on ATS. Shame really, as BTS is a great section of this site. Maybe a solution to this problem would be to simply list threads from both ATS and BTS on the 'Recent Posts' section. (And yes, I know that you can customize this section to include all sections your are subscribed to, but how many members do this? And how many threads that they would be interested in do they miss because they are in forums that they are not subscribed to?)

reply to post by intrepid


After reading the link, I would point out that there is no real 'conspiracy' behind the 'Evolution vs. Creation' debate, as both sides believe that their position is the truth. Conspiracy implies intentional deciet, and neither side is intentionally spreading what they know to be a lie.

So, we are back to square one.

But thanks for the input! I didn't think I would be debating Mods on Board Business when I got up today!!

[edit on 31-8-2009 by JaxonRoberts]

I'd say that suggesting that Christianity is ACTUALLY paganism re-branded to appeal to the masses and to let Kings continue practicing paganism because they didn't want to fully let go of it is conspiratorial. Why it was moved to BTS is beyond me.

Maybe if you were simply debating the Trinity itself, but your premise was that the trinity was a cover to justify worshiping 3 gods in a supposedly monotheistic religion.

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


Good thread JaxonRoberts and I agree with you 100%! The Faith forum really does belong on ATS.

We should really stop moving extremely excellent and important hemp threads away from ATS to languish in BTS-obscurity-hell too

Originally posted by intrepid
As to the Faith forum being on BTS, that's for nonconspiracy discussion.

Then why do you not move ghost stories, OOBEs, bigfoot, etc. type stuff to BTS as well. What is the conspiracy there?

Star and Flag, well not the star but I flagged it. I agree 1000%

[edit on 1-9-2009 by K J Gunderson]

reply to post by K J Gunderson


Are you seriously saying you don't think there's anything MYSTERIOUS to the topics you listed? If you read the description of the forum section they are contained in you'll have your answer...

(Mysterious Topics)

S...



[edit on 9-1-2009 by Springer]

reply to post by Springer


Yes they are, but my position in the OP still stands. Why the separation? And to the point that the traffic in the religious forum is as much or even close to that of forums of a like nature on ATS, not true. I had a thread that had two pages in less than 12 hrs. it was in the Conspiracies in Religion forum, but only two replies since it was banished off to BTS. As I predicted, it was sent off to die, which it did. It was no more or less conspiratorial than the 'God commands us to kill Gays' or the 'Jesus was a Buddhist?' threads, so why are they still there? I would really love to understand this.

Originally posted by JaxonRoberts
I had a thread that had two pages in less than 12 hrs. it was in the Conspiracies in Religion forum, but only two replies since it was banished off to BTS. As I predicted, it was sent off to die, which it did.

Yeah I know exactly what you mean JaxonRoberts, just like that one hemp thread that was educating thousands and thousands of people about the one solution to all of America's incredibly desperate economic problems that could be implemented in a totally grassroots way by the people in a very short amount of time, and stuff --- killed!!!

reply to post by JaxonRoberts




Hi There

Last night I posted a Thread in the Conspiracies in Religion forum, its a thread about my experience of living with a group called the Jesus Army for most of my childhood. Lots of people think this group is a cult so I thought it was appropriate to place it in that forum.
I had 1 page last night so far but today it has been moved to the General and shared forum in BTS? Now it has been placed in the Chitchat and General offtopic forum without me even being informed?



I got up to 2 pages and now today I have only had 1 more reply.

I feel as though my thread will now die too and I dont think that placing it in the members forum is any more appropriate than where I placed it?

Im feeling your frustration!

[edit on 2-9-2009 by Beauty_HairyBeast]

[edit on 2-9-2009 by Beauty_HairyBeast]