US file-sharer refuses donations

US file-sharer refuses donations

news.bbc.co.uk

A US student ordered to pay $675,000 (£404,000) for sharing music online has refused help paying the fine.

In a blog post Mr Tenenbaum said: "I ask no one to help me. And I ask for no one to cover what I signed up for."

"We don't want the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) to be paid when I can't afford to do it, and this money could be more valuable elsewhere," the blog post said.

The four recording labels involved in the case are subsidiaries of Universal Music, Warner Music and Sony.

(visit the link for the full news article)

I'm angry that the record companies can win such huge settlements on these cases.

I'm impressed that the guy appears to be taking responsibility for what he did.

I just don't understand how it has come to this point. The could have asked for up to $30,000 per song, and in once case they charged $80,000 per song.

I just think it's ridiculous.

Here, for example, are five banks that got fined for ripping off old folks when they were selling their crud.

The five firms that FINRA fined for deficient systems and procedures relating to VA, mutual fund or UIT sales, and the amount of their fines, are:
McDonald Investments (now KeyBanc Capital Markets, Inc.) - $425,000
IFMG Securities - $450,000
Wells Fargo Investments, LLC - $275,000
PNC Investments - $250,000
WM Financial Services, Inc. (now Chase Investment Services Corp.) - $250,000

Notice, that NONE of these BANKS, got charged anywhere NEAR as much as this sap did for sharing some songs. How can that be equitable? A case of skewed priorities. Let's keep sticking it to the little guys while the banks and cronies get off with a slap on the wrist.



news.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

Its not that he is taking responsibility, its that he doesn't want to except donations for it, because he would have to give them to the record companies.

He doesn't have the money, so they are getting it.

Our eras AL Capone. Its just like the old prohibition days. The madness needs to stop I think Nesson wants his clients to lose on purpose to create media story after media story to stir things up. How many people will fill file bankruptcy this year over 30 songs? LOL I've been using BT stuff for 4+ 24/7 years straight and everyone I know does it. Its common place as breathing. They ever come after me what will they get my unemployment benefits? These companies are doomed and they know it every time another ones these stories pops up the deeper they dig their graves.

Originally posted by xstealth
Its not that he is taking responsibility, its that he doesn't want to except donations for it, because he would have to give them to the record companies.

He doesn't have the money, so they are getting it.

From a different line in the article:

"I shared music. I was the one who wanted a say in court. This lawsuit was against me. This is my verdict," wrote Mr Tenenbaum.

Sounds to me like he IS accepting responsibility for what he, did....as much as could be expected...he admitted he did it...of course, who in the world could expect him to be responsible for the 600 grand for sharing some songs?

But yeah, I see that point too, that he also stated...he doesn't want the record goons to get a hold of it...can't say I blame him.

I buy my music, and I don't give it away. Copyright infringement is wrong, and illegal. I just think the response FAR outweighs the danger, or loss of property to the artists.

I saw him on the news this morning. He's filing bankruptcy if appeals dont work out for him.

If he takes donations then the company's get their money. If he files bankruptcy only the lawyers get any money.

Seems like an extremely expensive and overall pointless battle for the companies trying to collect.

Nice profitable age for lawyers though. Win or lose they get paid.

I agree KS

The fines are ridiculous... the people charge too much for music anyways I cant afford music cds anymore so i just listen to the Radio...

I dont know why Singers believe they need to live of several million dollars for a show when they can do it for just a million, and do 1 a month and they are wealthy millionaires... its absurd.

Its just further proof that some people "KNOW" they are better than you.

reply to post by Soulhacking


Cool so when will you be over to do my lawn for free. Do my dishes. Clean my home. Your going to work for free correct? Or are you a hypocrite? You seem to think , I ,as a professional musician should work for free. .99 cents its not to much to ask if enjoy someones work. Your argument over , everyone I know does it. Is what is wrong.

Should the fines be what they are no. but I think they are trying to make a point. I know you see these big record companies as the devil, and trust me from one who knows , they are close. BUT. There are a lot of Indi labels and artists who suffer the most.

Do you think Cold Play is worrying about this crap. No they are not because they can afford to give their album away . But for the common musician. the ones you hear on the radio once and a while, the ones that sell 100,000 copies of an album. This is a part of their income. Just as much as you getting your paycheck.. Not only is it there heart and soul, but in reality it is not tour buses and strippers for most bands you hear on the radio. (at least in the rock world) its an VAN, with 2 crew and your just making even with the price of gas, and you sell t-shirts. to get by. Its a crappy biz. But people do it for the love of their music.

When you download. Do you say Hey these guys are indi and need the money and these guy are only major label and are not getting the money any ways. ? which btw Major label acts get on ave 10% of an album sale. Is .99 cents that much to ask. ? for a persons heart and soul.

So when will you be over to mow my lawn BTW

reply to post by rjmelter

In reality, that is 1% that is 1 artist for every 100 that is making millions.
Any example.

New band (and these are facts btw , im not just naming names)
sells, 1 million copies. they are rich correct? no..

lets say they got 10% of album sales. so say the album makes 10 Mil. and

So the band makes 1 Million, between 5 guys and a manager. Ahh but wait,. How much did it cost to record. Promote, how about the web site, the merch. the record company payed for these things up front. You have to pay them back. so when all is said and done lets say you make 500K split bet 6 people. for 2 years work. And these guys are on the radio , thats the top 1% of all rock bands. look at the charts and see for one years how many different artist actually chart. Its a tough tough biz. and people who do not know the workings of it, think its all limos and what not, but it is not. its a hard business for most, and those are the people you hurt. Because people do not differentiate between Mega Star and Working musician, There are some great bands out there on the radio and everything that just make it buy and they spend 250 days on the road away from their families.

.99 cents is not that much to ask.

reply to post by ShiftTrio


you are assuming that they dont go out and do public concerts etc, Concerts are where the quick money is at. Not to mention that they get paid for talk shows and they get paid for pictures... they get paid for everything and get free food.

The real problem is the managers... They get paid to much money for such a small job, couldn't artists realistically manage themselves? Yes they could... why pay someone way to much to manage your beats. I would buy songs for 50Cents but not a dollar a song, that is 49Cents too much for a manager.. be smart... find a better manager is all im saying.

Edit to add:

Im glad the kid isnt accepting money, its time for these people to realize they shouldnt try to sue anyone for too much money. Its not realistic, and all they are doing is trying to be greedy. This whole economic downfall is really the fault of the Greedy Wealthy, not the wealthy. People live outside of their means in Millionaire ways too. WTF can bill gates really do with all that money? Well he donates some of it... at least hes doing things that really matter in society. Bill Gates pretty much brought about the computer age which drastically increased ttechnology by as much as 500 Years, and its getting even quicker still today.

So a song manager being rich and doing nothing but buying fancy cars and houses is just ignorant to me. Some may do good, but most dont and if they donate its to things that dont turn around and make the money worth it then again... its just a waste. Congress needs to sit down and work on how much Music Managers charge... pretty simple.


[edit on 4-8-2009 by rjmelter]

reply to post by rjmelter


again your talking about 1 % This is not the reality of most in the music business. I have a record deal I know the exact details.
50 cent might be rich, but most every other rapper rents the jewelry, cars and house and is in more debt then they will ever be able to pay. I am afraid that's the hip hop lifestyle. But ... for us Rock/metal guys.. it does not work like that.

Most musicians even the ones on the radio. break even at best.
On the management note, 50Cent may not need a manager, but the majority of artists do, because they need someone with the correct connections to further there careers. Most management companies work pretty hard for their 15%

If you want to know real facts and not MTV BS ask away.

People here would have given him money if he had asked for it.

One of the reasons I love this country is the way we are still able to band together to fight what we perceive as injustice.

That's why there's still hope for us.

reply to post by ShiftTrio


I agree with you, Shift. That's why I buy my songs at .99 each. The artists have a right to make money for what they do, just like anyone else. If the money won in these settlements was actually going to the artists, I guess it would be a different story. No mention of that in the article.

Fat cats make the bucks and it isn't any different for musicians. They sweat and someone else makes most of the money.

They deserve to get paid. I don't think our justice system should be about 'making an example' out of someone though. The law is the law, it should apply equally to everyone. If the crime is the same, the punishment should be as well. Using a person to set an example for everyone else is what Vlad the Impaler did. We're supposed to be better than that.

reply to post by ShiftTrio

Most of the content I download is from foreign countries its impossible to obtain or even know of the music, movies,media etc without these sharing programs. None of it I would have purchased in the first place nor would I ever come a across it in my entire life.

reply to post by KSPigpen


I do not agree with the penalty at all, I think other measures should be put in place. I have no idea what those are. But I agree the law should be the law and it should be fair. He Dled the music. Should he have to pay for that music, yes. 80K a song is BS. He should have to pay the .99 cents for each one. But so should everyone who shared it. And to be honest I am not the consumed with people DLing music for free. We offer it , just to listen to for free with out issue (not downloadable), its just the mind set that people have become accustom to, and the BS that is out there that ohh 50 cent can afford it. sure he can, but the majority of artists cant its dis information just as bad as any government conspiracy.

But what do you do?.. We try all sorts of stuff lol. actually the album coming out, if you buy the retail CD at Best Buy, we added a ton of CD only content, and access to a vault online where we do special shows, Vault only songs, Free stuff, money of tickets and shirts. After all it is a business and the model has changed dramatically.

reply to post by ShiftTrio


It was noted here at ATS a couple of days ago that the money from the case was not going to the artists, but to provide more funding for anti-piracy.

Nothing these industries do now can revert things to the pre internet days. Aside from global collapse or total government censorship. Oh they are petitioning congress now for a bailout from radio stations.
www.noperformancetax.org...

reply to post by ShiftTrio


If its such a big business you guys that arent famous should work harder i guess?! The thing about it is its who you know, not what you know. If you want to make a difference you have to stand up and do something... ATS is a transition between thinking about it and actually doing it. Good luck with that.

"So when will you be over to mow my lawn BTW"

Watching me mow your lawn is a lot more entertaining than listening to most of today's musicians. The major labels have been screwing artists out of cash since their inception. Stories like these just serve to divert the blame for artists' hardships elsewhere. The industry is finished - they're just trying to grab what they can in the final stages.

[edit on 4-8-2009 by SphinxMontreal]

Some more info the bailout. Senate hears royalty debate pitting Big Content vs Big Radio