The Physics of Life

No matter how many cells compose an organism, all of their workings should be able to be broken down to the atomic level. What complex energy reaction makes some atoms aware of their own existence while leaving others completely inanimate? What type of energy would allow such an event?

The same material that composes the very world you observe also composes the compounds that allow you to observe it. The energy that allows existence isn't too far away from the energy that permits logic. If we could look at a human being atom by atom, what would we see going from one cell cluster to another? Would we see energy making decisions of its own accord or would we see atoms capable of managing the very energy that permits their existence? At what level does matter become aware of itself? If you have sentience at the molecular level, it only makes sense that you have sentience at the atomic level.

It also needs to be addressed that someone doesn't have complete control of themself at any given time. While your "mind" may be in the driver's seat, the brain is the end all decider. It decides what chemicals should be released into your bloodstream in response to a stimulus. "Go eat something" or "Be attracted to that person". We like to believe the brain only influences our behavior and that we actually "decide" to do what it suggests, but do we? Infact, you don't have control over any one of the trillions of cells that compose you. These cells are designed to sacrifice their own existence in the name of your survival. Why is your illusionary self of such importance to these organisms of which you cannot control? It would seem as if the energy that comprises one's consciousness is more important than the material resources required to produce said consciousness.

Can you "prove" that anything around you exists without the context of your 5 senses which are completely regulated by organisms that compose and control you? Though you see life acting as you act, is it not natural to wonder what it would be like if you had their senses to observe your existence? Would this perspective add credibility or destroy the credibility of your own senses? No theory of physics is complete unless it can close the gap between matter and life.

[edit on 14-6-2009 by Eitimzevinten]

Originally posted by Eitimzevinten No theory of physics is complete unless it can close the gap between matter and life.

[edit on 14-6-2009 by Eitimzevinten]

Yes, I totally agree. This is the same message that philosophers are saying.

reply to post by Neo__


I can say with confidence that there isn't any "consciousness particle" or "quantum of consciousness".

Does electricity have any ability to make decisions/carry information or is it simply an energy source that runs things formatted to use it? Does it tell your cells the commands from the brain or is it like a morse code that is issued by the brain and then interpretted by the cells and vice versa. There is a difference.

reply to post by Eitimzevinten


Even the most advanced scientist today still doesn't know the true nature of electricity. The fact that electricity exists is obvious, but the recognition that it may actually account for everything that can be seen and sensed in our universe may only be the first steps towards understanding what electricity truly is. We could, for all we know, be experiencing only a shadow of what electricity is in the larger and cosmic sense. There is so much to know in our future.

You can say with all the confidence in the world that there isn't any "consciousness particle" or "quantum of consciousness" but the fact is you actually don't know. Nobody, at least among us mere mortals, knows this for sure.

I personally believe the concept of hylozoism to be quite intriguing. If aggregations of matter are everywhere, from the smallest atoms, made up on sub-atomic materials, to the larger and more complex bodies of matter then why wouldn't or couldn't all the life and matter on our earth be part and parcel of something bigger? i.e. we could, as individuals, be but cells in some kind of cosmic body corporate that is our Earth. Could it ever be possible to reach such a state of elevated awareness through meditation or sacrifice where we are conscious at a global level? We would truly have to sacrifice all individuality. Could this be what our Christs and Buddhas have done in the past with their talk of heaven and nirvana?

You probably consider me to be a dreamer to even think of ideas like this, but out of the dreams of our philosophers and spiritual leaders have come some pretty profound thoughts and some the most advanced concepts our civilization lives by today, the idea of universal brotherly love for instance.

Imagine.



[edit on 15-6-2009 by Neo__]

reply to post by Neo__


Not all matter has life but it is possible that the information exchange along the atoms in a compound can become conscious given the right exchange.

Originally posted by Eitimzevinten
What complex energy reaction makes some atoms aware of their own existence?

the fallacy of your OP is that you are ascribing meanings to meta-levels of the same system that are blind to one another.

take for example, a wordprocessor. the user-interface level and the machine-language level function completely separately. although they can be mapped onto one another, the functions and meanings of each level must necessarily remain separate.

in other words: just because YOU are alive, does not mean that there is some kind of mysterious "livingness" in your body out of which the conscious YOU arises.

the proteins which carry out the cellular functions are very, very simple chemical programs. they are not capable of decision making. a self-replicating biological protein is alive, but NOT conscious. and in particular, it is not SELF-aware.

your OP assumes a bottom -> up approach.

consciousness is strictly top -> down.

reply to post by Eitimzevinten

You said :
I can say with confidence that there isn't any "consciousness particle" or "quantum of consciousness".

Does electricity have any ability to make decisions/carry information or is it simply an energy source that runs things formatted to use it?

Both electricity and light are forms of 'electromagnetic energy.'

Light happens to manifest a behavior which is nothing short of 'intelligent.'

Consider the following -

Fermat's principle of least time

The first way of thinking that made the law about the behavior of light evident was discovered by Fermat in about 1650, and it is called the principle ofleast time, or Fermat's principle. His idea is this: that out of all possible paths that it might take to get from one point to another, light takes the path which requires the shortest time.

Source : University of California at Irvine Physics Department

Light actually 'figures out,' somehow, which path takes the shortest amount of time, and that's the path it takes !

There are various quantum mechanical 'explanations' to 'explain' this behavior, but it really boils down to the fact that light can somehow 'sense' the path ( through a lens, say ) which takes the shortest amount of time to traverse ...

This is remarkable, and in my book it is 'evidence' that light behaves intelligently !

reply to post by tgidkp


Everything has the same basic components and same energy within them. The energy that allows consciousness goes all the way down to the atomic level. Life just didn't appear out of nowhere.

You're taking an already built machine as your example, life didn't start with ready-made multicellular organisms. The first single celled organism to appear in the universe wasn't "magically" just put into place with no possible trace of an origin. It came from lifeless compounds that developed an advanced electric information exchange within itself. When chemicals react, it can be broken down to the atomic level and the exchange of electricity.

Originally posted by Eitimzevinten
No matter how many cells compose an organism, all of their workings should be able to be broken down to the atomic level.

Are you saying they can't be, today? Because I'm pretty sure the atomic 'goings on' of molecules and atoms is well understood.
www.howstuffworks.com...

What complex energy reaction makes some atoms aware of their own existence while leaving others completely inanimate? What type of energy would allow such an event?

Depending on what you mean by this question, it's either an excellent one, or complete gibberish.

In physics, there's a classic experiment known as the Double Slit Experiment, which seems to show that a single particle can "be aware" of itself in the sense that it exists in two places at once and interferes with itself.

If you're talking about some mystical consciousness mumbo jumbo, psychic energy, supernaturalism, or mysterious and unknown 'energy,' whatever that is, then I have no comment, as none of that makes any sense at all. Might as well be talking about harry potter.

The same material that composes the very world you observe also composes the compounds that allow you to observe it. The energy that allows existence isn't too far away from the energy that permits logic. If we could look at a human being atom by atom, what would we see going from one cell cluster to another? Would we see energy making decisions of its own accord or would we see atoms capable of managing the very energy that permits their existence?

Energy can't "make decisions" in an intelligent way. That's complete nonsense.

At what level does matter become aware of itself?

When that matter is coded to build a fully functioning, normal, human being. I don't think we're too far off from having artificial self aware machines -- but that's purely speculation on my part

If you have sentience at the molecular level, it only makes sense that you have sentience at the atomic level.

You don't.

To sum up the rest of the post: There is no physical differentiation between the "mind" and the "brain." The mind is a manifestation of the component parts of the brain acting together with environmental influences. Otherwise known as the nature vs nurture debate.


reply to post by visible_villain

You have the premise of the theory wrong.

In optics, Fermat's principle or the principle of least time is the idea that the path taken between two points by a ray of light is the path that can be traversed in the least time.

en.wikipedia.org...

Or in other words, the theory that the shortest distance between two points is a strait line, as traversed by a photon.

I ordered MY BIG TOE to get a better prespective of my purpose

and why i exist.

Check it out under used books

reply to post by visible_villain


Intelligence and consciousness are both due to electrically exchanged information, I have the upmost belief and reason to believe in that. Star for that, I'm definitely going to have to look into that more.

Someone brought to my attention an interesting explanation of certain psychic events. The electricity that drives your consciousness and all that good stuff emanates from your brain and actually interacts with the EM around you.

In the case this explanation came from, a little girl with a certain consciousness frequency (or something of that nature) picked up on the remnants of an old man who used to live in a house for a very long time. She could identify him and a relative of his from pictures when they were brought to her (note that there were not any pictures of this man in the house when they moved in).

The idea is that he emitted an em signature and it actually embedded into the atoms/compounds etc. of the house. So throughout all the reactions the house had with the air and various other things, this energy was passed about and the girls mind actually absorbed parts of it that gave her incite into the man.

She claims to have seen him in ghost form and this gave her some of the information she retained about him. She also might have come into contact with it from light reflecting off a wall which then went through the retina and was broken down to an electric impulse that retained his information.

My current running idea is that you can leave "psychic" em imprints in your surroundings which can either leave a trace of you or cause a minimal effect (positive thinking, positive outcome). In that sense, no one can ever really die, their em signature can just be scattered throughout many energy reactions. If a big enough chunk of information is in a localized area, the information might manifested itself within an em reaction and you end up with a "ghost".

[edit on 17-6-2009 by Eitimzevinten]

reply to post by Kaytagg


First I'd like to note that that was written at about 3am so if the wording is bit unclear, there's a reason. I'm not suggesting a new type of mystic energy, I'm talking about an undiscovered exchange of information within the EM spectrum that occurs at the atomic and molecular levels.

And there is a difference between the mind and the brain. The brain is the physical thought center geared toward fake chemical emotions and electrical impulses that it both gives out and receives in response to stimuli. The mind can work with things outside of a physical prejudice.

[edit on 17-6-2009 by Eitimzevinten]

reply to post by dgtempe


I'll be sure to get that once I have some extra money. Sounds like he answers every question I brought up. I wonder how applicable his work is though. Knowing how everything works is meaningless unless you can apply it to new technology. I hope he has grounded the theoretical aspect of his work into tangible results that can be used. I'll definitely add it to my reading list which is a pretty hard list to get on. Thanks for the heads up.

I AM matter, this pile of clunky skin with some meat inside it and some bones was just unfortunate enough to make up a living being inside the womb.

There are no atoms, no particles, just energy resonating, it's all one, and everything, arising from consciousness is at some level conscious. I think it's more like a flowing river, than it is a material universe. What we think we see is born of an illusion of separation where context and framing allows us a point of reference, but it's all one thing, in reality.

We are ants walking on a TV screen, we don' hear the sound, understand the program, or language, we cant even distinguish the visuals, all this knowledge is around us, but our senses are so basic and undeveloped, all we know, is that we are walking on a smooth surface, and the fact that there is someone eight feet away trying to look at the picture, and is ready to take us out of the equation, is a fact, we are totally oblivious to.